Jane Harman's AIPAC connections

[burythehatchet]

Anyone here still support her for a committee chair in the NEW Democratic congress?

By Michael Isikoff and Mark Hosenball
Newsweek
Updated: 7:03 p.m. ET Oct 25, 2006
Oct. 25, 2006 - While reportedly under investigation for her ties to an influential pro-Israel lobbying organization, California Rep. Jane Harman last month hosted a private dinner for the group that was attended by two top Bush administration officials—Director of National Intelligence John Negroponte and Secretary of Homeland Security Michael Chertoff.

The Sept. 13 dinner took place at the home of Harman, the ranking Democrat on the House Select Committee on Intelligence, and was attended by over 120 top financial backers of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC). The highlight of the evening was a panel discussion in which Harman played the host, questioning Negroponte and Chertoff about Mideast developments, international terrorism and homeland-security issues, according to an AIPAC official.
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/15419753/site/newsweek/

[Kagemusha]

1. And what do you suggest be done about it?

This is the Democratic Party in the House that we have, not the Party we may wish we might have. People have seniority. And Congresswomen engaging in politics is protected by the 1st Amendment. So what's to be done?

[Tom Joad]

10. Promising to help people avoid prosecution in exchange for political favors

is protected by the first amendment?
You must have a different version than the rest of us.

[Kagemusha]

14. I wasn't referring to things beyond the original post.

If there's some kind of provable corruption there, then let's have at it. However, I fail to see what a minority congresswoman could've offered to be worth any kind of favor, political or not, anyway. Where's the power? Or where was the power, at the time? I don't see it.

[KharmaTrain]

15. AIPAC Is Always All Evil On DU

Doesn't matter what the story is or whose involved, just put in AIPAC in your post and it's like saying the person is a murderer and corrupt politician...no matter who it is. While there are hundreds of other special interest groups that shower money on politicians, only AIPAC has the power to turn a Democrat into some kinda pro-Israel zombie. Guilt by association is enough on DU to convict.

Thank you for stating the obvious that will be ignored here, because it doesn't fit the feel-good memes around here. And, be assured, any vote that helps Israel...a country that both parties claim to be supporting and protecting...will be looked on here as some massive AIPAC conspiracy. Many of our new legislators were elected on their pro-Israel stands...now are they going to be castigated as well?

Harmon's got a lot of conflicts...and Israel is one of her lesser problems. But she also was throttled by this regime in divulging information about this regime's wrong doings...she was forced to, just like Jay Rockefeller was. She's expressed a desire to investigate the intelligence mess and could help open up the Pandorra's box of cooked intel and lies this regime used to invade Iraq...and if she does this, she'll not only be doing the Democrats, but the entire world, a major service.

[Kagemusha]

17. Yeah, I have plenty of problems with Israel's govt policies but there are US Jews.

And they have a right to a lobby group like any other Americans. Just gotta deal and work on things that are good for everyone wherever possible.

[eridani]

25. Any evidence that AIPAC really represents most US Jews?

I've noticed that Jewish people who criticize it have to deal with huge rations of shit.

[Behind the Aegis]

29. Look at that post again.

Kagemusha didn't say AIPAC represented "most" US Jews. What was said was that AIPAC is made up of US Jews who have the right to lobby like any other group of Americans.

[Kagemusha]

32. Thanks, that's what I meant, yes.

And I certainly don't agree with all of their positions but I wouldn't expect others to agree with all of mine, either.

But it's still part of the political process.

[Tom Joad]

33. We have the right to oppose it like any other lobby.

And you can expect that while cheney can give a speech to the annual aipac conference and get several standing ovations, you can expect this lobby will not get many ovations here in a progressive forum.

You are right, it does not represent Jewish people. No single organization speaks for Jewish people as no single organization can speak for any ethnic group.

So to conflate opposing the politics of aipac with anti-semitism is just not logical.

It would be like saying opposing AARP's support for Bush's Medicare bill means one is against old people, for example.

[Behind the Aegis]

35. Not one post here said you didn't have the right to oppose AIPAC.

Not one post here said opposition to AIPAC is interlinked with anti-Semitism, though, there are times it is anti-Semitic. But many posters here have made AIPAC to be the "Karl Rove" of PACs. AIPAC has become some mythical 'beast' capable of pulling the strings of the US government with the blink of an eye. You can protest AIPAC all you want, that is your right and no one is saying any different. However, there are more powerful PACs out there, so ask yourself, do they receive the same amount of scorn and disdain that you have for AIPAC?

[Tom Joad]

40. Hey, i have protested many of these other lobbies too.

From the antichoicers to the military hardware purveyors to the WTO economic plunderers in corporate suits. This one is no different, no better and no worse. I have the same scorn for them as i do for aipac. They hate me as much as you hate me.

I simply believe that aipac works against the interest of those who support peace/human rights.

[Behind the Aegis]

43. Good to know.

As I haven't seen those posts, I was unaware of your other activities regarding disdain for those PACs. As far as hating you, I do not hate you. I don't like you, any more than you like me, but I don't hate you. There is only one person in my life that has earned my hate, and you ain't him.

[Name removed]

46. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Behind the Aegis]

47. Well, I will comment.

Do not be surprised if this part of the thread goes "bye-bye." So, hopefully, you will see this post before it does.

You are a "public figure" as Tom Joad, to my knowledge your real name has not been used, and that is "who" the comments are directed at. And, while there is venom and hate posted at DU, in general, that is called "freedom of speech." Our site has not chosen to delete those posts, unlike DU that does delete attacks on our site and members, a choice I don't feel is done out of respect, but for other reasons, IMO.

You have, in fact, come to the wrong conclusion on two things: I don't hate you and I am a hands-on moderator, we just have a different set of rules. I respect the rules here and I respect the ones we have established at our site.

[Behind the Aegis]

20. Good points.

AIPAC = the "Karl Rove" of PACs.

[KharmaTrain]

22. Hang Tough...I Appreciate Your Posts...

I followed your threads during the Israel-Hamas war and applaud your sense of proportion, history and rational thinking in the face of a lot of emotionally charged posters.

Cheers & L'Chaim from a fellow Yid.

:toast:

[Behind the Aegis]

37. Thanks!

Of course, you have now "marked" yourself! :)

:toast:

[KharmaTrain]

41. Too Late...

I'm a fool...I believe you discuss on a Discussion forum...not grandstand. That's gotten me in my share of flames around here. So be it. I'm not here for a popularity contest, just learn and grow if I can.

Cheers...

:toast: :toast:

[texpatriot2004]

2. I am against AIPAC nm

[jonnyblitz]

3. If we are going to go after people for their AIPAC connections

why stop at Jane Harman if we are going to go that route? just saying...:shrug:

<snip>
Nancy Pelosi Gives a Pep Talk to AIPAC
The Democratic leader in her own words
by Mark Gaffney


Rep. Nancy Pelosi’s recent speech to the Israeli-American lobby (AIPAC) ought to be a clarion call for peace activists. Her address did not contain any big surprises. But it is, nonetheless, remarkable for its transparency. The speech (see below for the text) affords a up-close look at what Pelosi thinks about Israel, the Palestinians, the Mideast, and nukes.

It’s worth a look too because Pelosi’s beliefs on these matters are not a departure. Most of the Democratic Party leadership espouse similar ideas. The bipartisan voting record of Congress in recent years on Mideast issues proves this to be the case. Remember, this is the party that’s supposed to represent the grassroots, i.e., we the people. So what is the Democratic leader of the House doing, anyway, giving a pep talk to the second largest lobby in Washington? Indeed, to the lobby of a foreign power? It’s a question more Americans ought to be asking.
<snip>

more...

http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0527-23.htm

[H2O Man]

6. It's not her

AIPAC connection. It's the possibility that she violated laws that concerns people. If we take AIPAC out of the picture, and simple consider the possibility that someone from the legislative branch might have attempted to influence a case being heard in the judicial branch, it should concern everyone. More, if the person did it as part of a deal involving campaign contributions, it is pretty serious.

[Tom Joad]

7. That's exactly the point. The story is that she is getting a chair because

she has promised to help aipac in its legal woes. That is illegal.

[Me.]

4. NO!

And the article supposts the case against her that she has been too cosy with pubs and those she should be providing oversight on. I guess she didn't think the dems were going to win and the chairmanship would be open.

[H2O Man]

5. I found that

and related articles in Time and the New York Times troubling.

I am also concerned about the part of the Newsweek article that hints that some republicans, such as Rep. Peter Hoekstra, may be looking to divide democrats.

[Jcrowley]

11. This is not good

A congressional source tells TIME that the lobbbying for Harman has included a phone call several months ago from entertainment industry billionaire and major Democratic party contributor Haim Saban. A Saban spokeswoman said he could not be reached for comment. A phone call pushing for a particular member's committee assignment might be unwelcome, but it would not normally be illegal on its own. And it is unclear whether Saban — who made much of his fortune with the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers children's franchise — knew that lobbying Pelosi might be viewed by others as part of a larger alleged plan.

Saban has donated at least $3,000 to Harman's campaign, according to Federal Election Commission records, and the Saban Center for Middle East Policy, which he sponsors at the prestigious Brookings Institution, boasts Harman among its biggest fans. "When the Saban Center talks, I listen," Harman said at a Saban Center briefing in February on U.S. strategy in Iraq. Harman quipped that, in order to attend the session at Brookings, she had to "blow off" a senior intelligence official's appearance before a House committee.

http://www.time.com/time/nation/printout/0,8816,1549069,00.html

[Ignacio Upton]

8. The alternative is Alcee Hastings

He was impeached as a federal judge during the '80s (Pelosi also voted for his impeachment, BTW.)

[The Stranger]

12. Sign him up.

At least he isn't currently being investigated, like Harman is.

Besides, someone else we all know and respect was impeached.

[The Magistrate]

49. No Comparison, Sir

While a judge, Rep. Hastings was charged with selling verdicts. He was acquitted at trial, but an essential element in the acquital was the refusal of an accomplice to testify, even at the cost of serving time in jail. Had the complete case been presented, the likelihood a conviction would have been had is great. The Congress which impeached and convicted him was controlled by Democrats, and there is no shadow of suspicion the process was tainted.

The voters of this gentleman's district have a perfect right to elect anyone they please to sit in the House, but he is not a man who should have charge of vetting and overseeing the intelligence services.

[williesgirl]

13. Why is he the only alternative? Can't someone new be proposed?

[Me.]

16. I Understand That Is No Longer So

As far as I know Silvestre Reyes, D-El Paso is now slated to take the chair.

[Tom Joad]

9. It can give ammo to the Republicans, talking about a Dem "culture

of corruption" If she made a promise to aipac in exchange for its help in getting the chair, then its a crime.

[KoKo]

18. Michael Isikoff and Mark Hosenball....??????

Ummm... is this the Jews vs. the Jews, here? :eyes:

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[everythingsxen]

23. Gosh..

a comment that is derogatory about Israel, from you? How unlike you... :eyes:

[Wiley50]

27. I'm sorry if you think I'm being derogatory. Not my intent at all

It's just a descriptive term I hear among my Jewish friends.
It tends to come up when they disagree with each other.
Maybe I don't understand all the meanings.
Again. Didn't mean to offend

[Wiley50]

28. As an afterthought

Can I recommend the website of my best friend

http://site.www.umb.edu/faculty/salzman_g/

He's a retired Professor of Physics from UMAS Boston

Matter of fact, he is a Professor Emeritus

Our family situations are kinda similar

I have a brother who is a right wing Repuke Bush supporter,
of course, I am a flaming librul

George's brother lives in Israel and supports the current government
George lives in Oaxaca and we work together to support the People's Revolution there.

I think I heard that term from him
when he was quoting his brother

[Behind the Aegis]

31. I think you missed the point of Xen's post.

It wasn't the comment about 'self-loathing Jews,' it was the comment: "from the Israel's Always Right crowd." Being 'pro-Israel' doesn't mean we always think Israel is right, we just don't choose to view it as the "evil Zionist regime" slated to disappear from the pages of time.

[Wiley50]

38. Well, There You Are My Friend!

I'm kinda getting to know your friends after the other night.
Kinda strange our entire conversation ( about 50 posts) disappeared
by the following night.

As I told you before, I'm not one of those crazies you go after
and now that you had me read that post, I do understand why you keep sentry.
In fact, religon is such a non- issue to me, I don't think about it.

But I'm starting to feel like I'm being gone after
which is starting to build a bit of the friction of resentment
because I really don't deserve it.

As I told you before, my thing is sympathy for oppressed indigenous people
that's why I'm working so hard to help the people of Oaxaca Mexico
The Israel thing is a fight I have no dog in, if I come upon it
I say my piece. There appear to be poor indigenous people being hurt
by a repressive police state government. But it's not my area of primary concern.
Others can fight that battle with you. not me

So, if you please, could you try to understand that and leave me be.
Feeling that I am misjudged and watched, is the only thing causing me
any resentment
Thankyou my Friend

[Behind the Aegis]

42. Hello to you. Seems we both keep odd hours.

I was a little surprised to see all those posts axed. Some of the more obnoxious ones I could understand, but toward the end, it was becoming more civil, so to speak. However, it is not unusual for the mods to axe an entire stream like that because they feel to leave a few posts up in a string of deleted posts may encourage others to "get in on the act."

I am glad you were able to read that post, which is also now gone. Just as you are not one of the "crazies," you can see why I do what I do. I don't think everyone who posts something that is "anti-Israel" is anti-Semitic. However, I will not allow anti-Semitism to creep on to this board. It has no place in a progressive forum any more than any other type of bigotry. Also, just because I challenge someone on an Israeli, Jewish, or similar comment, doesn't mean I am calling him/her an anti-Semite. I grew up victimized by anti-Semitism and I am quite aware of what it is and isn't.

You are "being gone" after because you chose to post in this thread. You made a snide remark and it was addressed. The only reason I interjected was because I felt you were mistaken as to which comment was the insult. And, whereas you feel you have no "dog in the fight" about Israel, if you come and say your peace, then the possibility exists that someone may comment on your assertion. You have as much said you don't know much about the situation, therefore, if you make a comment that is incorrect or "off-colored," then it may result in comments, some may even be harsh.

As for being "watched," that is your issue. To date, I don't ever recall commenting to you about anything involving Israel. But, if you choose to "pop into a thread" about Israel, then you stand the chance of having a comment directed at you by me. The thing is, despite my well-known protection of Israel, I do not comment in all threads concerning Israel, Jews, AIPAC, or Jewish politicians. I may watch them, but I don't always comment. However, to put your mind to rest, I don't "follow you around" the board, nor do I feel the need to do anything of the sort. You made comments I felt were offensive and I responded. That is the nature of a discussion board.

Be well.

[Wiley50]

45. For The Record, I came into this thread because I saw it as a

news item regarding possible government corruption involving our Dems.
At these sensitive transition times, I'm concerned if there is a
possibility
that we are about to give powerful positions to people whose
possibly illegal activities could become an embarrassment to us now.

I posted because the poster I responded to had made the comment that the
article was written by jewish writers, who do seem to have more flexibility
when writing on these topics, for understandable reasons.

My comment simply acknowledged a fact that those jews on the pro-Israel side
often refer to those who do not support that current Government as "self=hating Jews"
The "Israel's Always Right crowd" comment was simply meant to put
the colloquialism into context. Nothing more

No Harm Meant

[Behind the Aegis]

48. For the record, you don't have to explain why you post, it is a discussion board.

However, since you have chosen to express your concern, I will address it. I agree that any possible wrong-doing on part of Dem would be "blood in the water." Right now, in my district, we will get to vote in a run-off between William Jefferson (the incumbent Dem under a cloud of suspicion for a variety of things) and Karen Carter. Carter made a strong showing, and I am hoping it will be enough to remove Jefferson from office. Though he has not been found guilty, it isn't looking good for him. As for Harman, we are just finding out about the suspicions. Things are too nebulous. If that changes, then I hope she will do the right thing. While we should always go with 'innocent until proved guilty," in politics, we aren't always afforded that luxury.

As for your comment, let me explain why it is offensive and incorrect. First, being 'pro-Israeli' doesn't mean that we support or endorse all of the policies of Israel. Second, being pro-Israeli is not the same as thinking "Israel's always right." Third, the moniker, "Israel's always right," is an insult to the intelligence of many pro-Israeli posters. And, finally, the pro-Israeli group, for the most part, I cannot speak for everyone, do not always think that Jews who question/don't support Israeli policy or actions are self-loathing Jews. The fact is that many of us have many issues with Israel and her policies, politicians, and actions; however, many of us feel we cannot discuss those concerns here because the level of hatred directed at Israel is more pressing, and therefore requires our attention first and foremost. We feel obligated to point out when the line is crossed between anti-Israeli and anti-Semitic. For many, that is very confusing.

[Wiley50]

39. Oh and,

I don't think it's an Evil Zionist thingy
any more than I think the US gov is either

But I think, at this time
and this both govts share
the people currently in power
aren't doing a great job for everyone
and in both cases
I think that should change

[Behind the Aegis]

44. And here we agree.

I don't like our current government. I don't like many of the things done in the name of the United States. There are also many things done in the name of Israel that I find objectionable and irresponsible. However, the US and Israel are in different boats, so to speak, and that must be taken into consideration when discussing those issues. Think of it this way: homophobia is a bad thing, racism is a bad thing; however, the experiences that gays and African Americans have, while having certain similarities, are different and should be discussed with the parameters of the community under attack.

[KoKo]

19. Jane Harmon wasn't a Dem until she got that she might be "moved out"

after the "Lebanon Fiasco." She knew she was running for her Position and she turned to appear Pro-Dem when, many of us, know she carried "water" for Repugs for years!

She suddenly "got her act together" to "appear" more Moderate in the last few months of Dem Campaign to TAKE IT ALL BACK!

I don't trust her...and can very well imagine her working with AIPAC because she supported the Bushies for YEARS.

[Jim Sagle]

24. AIPAC RRRRRAWWWWWWXXXXX!!!!!!

[burythehatchet]

26. they do have the most awesome spies.

I wonder how many have escaped being discovered.

[Behind the Aegis]

30. Probably as many as other groups who are also spies, but haven't been caught.

[burythehatchet]

34. perfect

as always, your learned observations enrich the discourse and elevate understanding.

[Behind the Aegis]

36. As it should.