JUDGE RULES PART OF BUSH ANTI-TERROR ORDER UNCONSTITUTIONAL

[kpete]

JUDGE RULES PART OF BUSH ANTI-TERROR ORDER UNCONSTITUTIONAL

"The court's decision confirms that even in fighting terror, unchecked executive authority and trampling on fundamental freedoms is not a permissible option,"

Judge strikes down part of Bush anti-terror order
Tue Nov 28, 2006 9:09pm ET

LOS ANGELES (Reuters) - A federal judge in Los Angeles, who previously struck down sections of the Patriot Act, has ruled that provisions of an anti-terrorism order issued by President George W. Bush after September 11 are unconstitutional.

U.S. District Judge Audrey Collins found that part of the law, signed by Bush on September 23, 2001 and used to freeze the assets of terrorist organizations, violated the Constitution because it put no apparent limit on the president's powers to place groups on that list.

Ruling in a lawsuit brought against the Treasury Department in 2005 by the Center for Constitutional Rights, Collins also threw out a portion of Bush's order which applied the law to those who associate with the designated organizations.

"This law gave the president unfettered authority to create blacklists, an authority president Bush then used to empower the Secretary of the Treasury to impose guilt by association," said David Cole of the Washington-based Center for Constitutional Rights.


http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=newsOne&storyID=2006-11-29T021821Z_01_N28295799_RTRUKOC_0_US-USA-JUDGE-BUSH.xml&WTmodLoc=Home-C2-TopNews-newsOne-2

[Minnesota_Lib]

1. Kicking a very important story

[ShockediSay]

2. Likewise - the "laws" passed allow some CIA torture freaks

to take innocent persons and disappear them for "life," torturing them all the way for confessions that can be used in some military "trial" to sentence them to death.

Is this the "American Way" of freedom?

[Deb]

3. Does anyone know, will this go to a higher court

or does the ruling apply to bush immediately? thanks

[BlooInBloo]

4. Does anyone know this judge's rate of being overturned on at the appellate level?

[Hepburn]

8. This is a federal trial court...

...in the 9th Cir Ct of Ap. Even if it does go up, IMO, with the reasoning expressed by the trial court, it appears that it most likely should not be over-turned in the 9th cir. That is just my opinion and based only on what the judge said. I have not read the full opinion. But if the ruling as cited is supported by the law and the facts, IMO, it would be hard to over-turn in the 9th.

[BlooInBloo]

9. I'd rather have what I asked for than your haven't-even- read-the-opinion...

... surety, but thanks.

[Hepburn]

12. I had planned to read the opinion and come back and post.

Since I posted here, I have been looking for a link. I went to the website for the Central District's Clerk's office and it is not up on the yet. I am not where I can get to Westlaw at this time of night except for a 40 min. drive to Los Angeles so I can pull a slip opinion. Sorry.

If anyone can find a link ~~ I would appreciate it if they posted it. TIA

[BlooInBloo]

13. No worries - easy-come-easy-go. :)

[symbolman]

38. Just wanted to thank you for all you do

I'm making a list and checking it twice, and there'll be no Coal for YOU in your Xmas stocking :)

Thanks!

[kerstin]

5. Little by little

we are re-possessing our inheritance.

Thank you for doing your job, Judge Collins!:applause:

[ThomCat]

6. This is Awesome.

One ruling at a time the Bush decisions are going to come crumbling down. Not only do I hope that Bush's imperial powers get taken away, I hope it becomes much harder for anyone else to ever try to doing it again.

[Land Shark]

7. It's wrong that these laws are to any extent presumed constitutional

until a "case or controversy" that is properly funded and with proper issues comes before the courts. In the mean time a lot of damage is done to our Constitution and our freedoms and a lot of uncertainty and fear created.

[kpete]

11. The future is an infinite succession of presents...

An optimist isn't necessarily a blithe, slightly sappy whistler in the dark of our time. To be hopeful in bad times is not just foolishly romantic. It is based on the fact that human history is a history not only of cruelty but also of compassion, sacrifice, courage, kindness. What we choose to emphasize in this complex history will determine our lives. If we see only the worst, it destroys our capacity to do something. If we remember those times and places--and there are so many--where people have behaved magnificently, this gives us the energy to act, and at least the possibility of sending this spinning top of a world in a different direction. And if we do act, in however small a way, we don't have to wait for some grand utopian future. The future is an infinite succession of presents, and to live now as we think human beings should live, in defiance of all that is bad around us, is itself a marvelous victory.

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20040920/zinn

[bonito]

23. Great thoughts

I had to read more of that, and what did I find, Howard Zinn, Great man.:-)

[Freedom_from_Chains]

24. While all you have said may be true

That's our system of justice and so far no one has been able to come up with a better system.

[jelly]

25. That's it, this calls for a new paradigm!

Hey, it worked for the neocons. But seriously, I share your frustration but think it's a shame that we have reached a point where we look for an exception to a presumption which seemed to work just fine until recent history. There is a value in presuming the validity of laws until proven otherwise pursuant to a challenge brought by one with standing to contest it; the presumption is an expression of our country's dedication to the rule of law. Rather than abrogate the presumption perhaps we need to be more careful that we start electing representatives who are, well, dedicated to the rule of law or even understand what that means or why it's important to the preservation of our democracy, and impeaching those who breach the promise made to the people that they will do their best to uphold it.

[ninkasi]

10. Thank you, Judge Collins

We need more and more citizens like you who are willing to stand up to the gutting of our Constitutional rights by the monkey squatting in the people's White House. Our Founding Fathers went to great lengths to be sure that a weak, corrupt man like Dubya would NOT be able to seize so much power for himself, and so blatantly ignore the Constitution.

You are a better judge, and a better human, than so many now sitting on the SCOTUS, and the current AG, who is a smarmy, ass-kissing weasel, cozying himself up to those in power, and willing to completely destroy the Constitution in order to stay close to the incompetents now in power.

I admire any in positions of authority who are able to help roll back the past six years of abuses. Thank you, ma'am.
Maybe others will take courage, and follow your lead.

[alfredo]

14. Little by little, the little king's crown is tarnishing.

[SydneyBristow]

15. yeahhh!!

i hope this sticks, maybe then the emperor will slowly realize he has no clothes...and no base for denying the constitutional freedoms to every American...

[newyawker99]

30. Hi SydneyBristow!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[stevedeshazer]

16. Activist Judge

Channeling Limbaugh and Hannity and all the 'B' and 'C' conservofreep mouth-breathers on hate radio and television....

Activist Judge Audrey Collins will be smeared all day tomorrow. California Liberal.

Fear, smears, queers. Oh My!

Why does Judge Collins hate America?

[Yukari Yakumo]

19. Freepers are already going through the usual talking points.

The usual lobbing of "Advocate Judge" and "Clinton appointee".

Expect Faux News to do the same thing.

[cui bono]

17. Good thing women aren't afraid to stand up to that ****. n/t

[Joe Chi Minh]

31. Is it my faulty memory, or haven't they been the first to do so?

I seem to remember another female judge putting the boot into neocon over-reaches fairly recently.

[northofdenali]

18. It's the 9th Ciruit Court - according to * and his minions

the most "liberal" federal court in the nation.

They've upheld some specifically NON-liberal rulings, but that doesn't deter the Shrub factor.

The 9th governs California, Alaska, Washington, Oregon & Hawaii, IIRC.

[Pachamama]

20. Anyone have a picture of Judge Collins? I believe I know her...

Seriously....I think she is the relative of a friend of mine....If she is a Black American woman and has a daughter who is an actress and dancer, then I know her....She is a great lady and very smart.

[Swagman]

22. I like your taste in relatives !

:toast:

[malaise]

21. Great news n/t

[JacksonWest]

26. More info is needed

Any links to the 45 page ruling? This was a mixed ruling, according to this seattle paper:
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/1110AP_Terrorist_Designation.html

I'd like to see the ruling. If the problem was designation-who does have the right to designate a group as a terrorist group and what is the process?

Also- I support freezing the funds of terrorists. It's one of the few things in this "war" that we are doing that makes sense and isn't killing innocent people. We should be doing that anyway, irrespective of a "war".

I'm just curious how this ruling came about. The article(above) says it was based on first amendment rights and due process. That's fine, if it's applicable to US citizens. If they are referring to the constitutional rights of non-citizen terrorist designees-it will get thrown out. IMHO.

If anyone can get the link to the ruling, let me know. Thanks.

[damnyanks123]

27. These groups kill people

I agree that he has gone too far in his powers but the two groups that are going to get their money back ARE terrorist organizations. Not freedom fighters.
The two organizations are:
1. Liberation Tigers of Tamil Elam- (From Wiki)- The LTTE is sometimes labelled "terrorist" as part of a broader allegation that it does not have respect for human rights, and does not adhere to the standards of conduct expected of a resistance movement or what might be called "freedom fighters".
The accusation of terrorism is based in part on claims that the LTTE recruits child soldiers, has been responsible for targeted assassination of political figures and non-military officials, and uses suicide bombers. They pioneered the use of concealed suicide bomb vests, which are now used by many other organizations worldwide.
2. Partiya Karkeran Kurdistan- (From Wiki)- The PKK is listed as a terrorist organization internationally by a number of states and organizations, including the USA and the EU, and Turkey blames it for the death of more than 30,000 people. The PKK has conducted suicide bombing on government and police installations, as well as at local tourist sites. Kidnapping and assassination against government officials and Kurdish tribal leaders who were named as puppets of the state were performed as well.

[eggplant]

28. And your point is...

Did you even read the article? Or are you just trolling?

"The judge allowed to stand part of the order that would penalize those providing services to groups on the list.

"The lawsuit was brought on behalf of five organizations, including the Liberation Tigers of Tamil Elam, which wants to create a separate state for the Tamil people in Sri Lanka, and Partiya Karkeran Kurdistan, which represents Kurds in Turkey.

"Both groups had been designated by the United States as foreign terrorist organizations.

[JacksonWest]

29. The question is what is the appropriate way to designate these

groups. I don't think Bush should be allowed to sit in a room, write down "Democratic Underground", and declare it a terrorist group. Who is it that declares any group a terrorist group up until the Patriot act? Who are these groups? How do you get added or removed from the list?

The big question that the article doesn't even come close to answering:

Who had George Bush added to this list?

That would be interesting to see. Had Bush used this power? Does it apply to foreign groups only? Or can he make "Democratic Underground" a terrorist group?

My interpretation of the Patriot Act and recent legislation is that due process is lost once you are declared a terrorist or enemy combatant-but only if you are a non citizen or resident alien.

[Sapere aude]

33. I do not want to give up my freedom to protect myself against these groups.

What kind of country will we have if we give up on our Constitution? No, we will not cower to terrorists and we will not cower to a President who wants to be a dictator. We will honor the 200 years of freedoms I fought for in Vietnam and our troops are fighting for today. The greatest threat to our freedoms comes from within our country not from outside it.

You may be willing to live like people in Communist countries so you can feel safe but not me.

[Joe Chi Minh]

34. I don't think you appreciate that freedom-fighters/terrorists would never

have come into existence had they been forced to rely on the "bien pensants", such as your good self. But their refusal to be oppressed out of existence is ultimately the guarantee of man's survival; that there should always be some people who will say, ENOUGH! We can't fight them on their terms, so they must begin to fight us on OUR terms. Often including suicide bombings, it appears.
Also, suicide bombers must be the most sincere and courageous of all freedom-fighters/terrorists. In view of this, the degree of oppression, exploitation, etc, must have led to extraordinary desperation. Desperate situations require desperate measures. Geopolitics and wars are not about the Queensbury Rules.

The whole point about successful terrorist organisations is that they enjoy the support of the indigenous population they operate in; which in itself is very remarkable, because most "ordinary" working people are extraordinarily long-suffering.

In this regard, I don't believe that Hezbollah in Lebanon are regular freedom-fighters, but rather surrogates for at least one neighbouring Arab state. I believe it is only fear which prompts people whose habitations have been bombed to rubble, because of the "macho" attacks of Hezbollah using them as a shield - as their surrogates - on a nation, Israel, with the power to respond with overwhelming force, and the record of consistently doing so. It's not rocket science.

I read it was the Iranias behind it all. If so, they should be ashamed of themselves. It could easily have been THEIR families left with virtually the clothes they wear. If they are recompensing them financially, it must be an awful lot of money to enable them to return to a normal working life in a functioning and respected community. But this a digression.

The worst scenario seems to be when multiculturalism leads to a relative equivalence between the size of two or more populations of different religions or sects, and hence cultures.

Racism on the basis of different cultures, is a form of racism far more intractable, more difficult to temper and suppress than racism on the basis of the colour of a person's skin, because, highly regrettable though it is, it is natural without being reptilian and unthinking, like the latter.

[jazzjunkysue]

32. Uber-K &Uber-R. Makes my whole day. The "N" word.

Something the chimp will have to get used to hearing.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

35. From freedom to fear back to freedom

This does my heart good.

[dmilton]

36. Off Topic But Related

Information concerning the NSA spying program was just released to a bipartisan governmental group formed by congress to protect civil liberties.

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2006/11/28/oversight_board_briefed_on_nsa_spy_program/

Too little too late to change public opinion me thinks.

The most interesting part is the quotes from a member of Clinton's administration praising the Bush Administrations efforts. Perhaps there is a bit of over zealousness in those who accuse Bush of violating our civil liberties. At least in this instance.

[lonestarnot]

37. Thank you honorable Audrey Collins!

:patriot: