Notice the many DU threads bashing Cindy? Wonder why?

[ConsAreLiars]

Everyone knows that the corporate political apparatus has vast resources dedicated to shaping and influencing public opinion. It is just good business practice, and they have long ago established the organizations and operations to do this. And we saw them at work tonight. First all the corporate media whores are fed, and swallow, and dutifully report a complete lie about some banner being unfurled. Same thing happens with Michael Moore or Chavez or anyone who challenges corporate rule.

And once the lie is "reported," the sycophants add their voices to a chorus of denunciations. They see that they have a chance to bash someone who speaks truth to power and they leap into action. It is their duty to do so, as defenders of the status quo. They take the lie and shout it out.

They denounce the truthteller as a fool, a liar, an egoist, a tool, "makes us look bad" is a favorite, whatever. The specific accusations never matter. The point is to isolate and defame anyone who challenges corporatism. They usually are more subtle -- chameleon-like cons who try to appear "like us." But tonight we had the opportunity to see them at work in a more blatant form than usual. Something to learn from.

(edit typo and omitted word)

[LiberalAndProud]

1. I noticed that there are tons of people spouting

stuff I usually hear on the radio when Rush is ranting.

[seabeyond]

8. what, that cindy knew and went in there with the intent to be arrested

and for me to suggest not to act surprised that she was arrested. that is what she wanted. again her right. she made the statement loud and clear. as another poster put out, she took the talk away from bush speech. is my post full of rush talk. or is there only one side to this issue. your side. everyone else is to toe the line. cause that isnt going to happen. not if i dont follow your line

[earth mom]

2. You hit the nail on the head! Cindy ROCKS!

Recommended! :applause:

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[seabeyond]

5. and is that what i am. posting #4

[FarLeftRage]

10. T'is a FUCKING SHAME that the ignore feature is gone

:mad: :mad: :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

[chookie]

46. Hear Hear!

While I allow that some of the opinions expressed are from "Big Tent" Democrats, I believe we are experiencing a coordinated attack from freepers. Freep sites are linking to the discussions here this evening, with the comment "Go respond." Some of them have 1000+ after being in DU just a few days, amazing huh?

I am very sorry the IGNORE feature is unavailable -- but they may have been part of their plan to disrupt us after this "major speech."

[seabeyond]

49. so, am i big tent now. cant be that maybe there is anther perspective

here

[seabeyond]

4. is a legitimate concern bashing. i was on one thread woolsey

is the rep that gave her the ticket. woolsey has a race coming, and it is a tough race from what someone says. what if woolsey assume sheehan would behave. what if woolsey was being kind giving cindy the ticket and got a knife in the back

are we allowed to think about sheehans consequences to the party. or is that ..... too corporate.

i will say again so it is clear i am not bashing. cindy has one goal. to end the war. she will go after, use whatever means to meet that goal. she is not a democrat. she has proven that. she has no problem hurting the democratic party, again, she has been consistant on that too. support her for the war and all she is doing and accomplishing, but i dont htink it is a good idea to think she has any responsibility to the deoocratic party. and btw, moore is in the same position. he is nto a dem. i thank him and appreciate the work he does, but he is not friend to democrats. these people are seperate from the dem cause. they have their own cause. and that is totally fine. but a reality

[chookie]

9. Woolsey commended Cindy

"I'm proud that Cindy's my guest tonight," Woolsey said in an interview before the speech. "She has made a difference in the debate to bring our troops home from Iraq."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060201/ap_on_go_pr_wh/state_of_the_union_sheehan

[seabeyond]

14. thank you for that article. i appreciate it. was that after or before

she was arrested. it is not clear in the report. nor is it clear in woolsey's statement. i imagine and am sure prior to the arrest she was proud of having cindy as a guest. (and my guess, she expected sheehan to act like a guest. i dont know) if this is after the arrest then good for woolsey, i am impressed and pat her on the back. i still want clarification.

[chookie]

42. agreed

ambiguous. We shall see...

[ConsAreLiars]

29. Well, cowardice is another reason to refuse to fight and

to denounce those who do. There are well-intentioned (I presume) Democrats who believe that rocking the boat is a bad tactic, but they have let fascism triumph almost every case. Look at what has been happening. This is what the compromisers and conciliators have brought us. The "go along, get along," approach has done nothing to defend or preserve the people's basic human rights and simple survival needs, much less extend them.

[seabeyond]

48. no one is talking about that. this has nothing to do with

what we are talking about with sheehan. you bring a totally different argument into what i am talking about. cool that sheehan did it. bummer that it reflects poorly on woolsey. sheehan is not friend to democrats. now, whatever is made up in all this i am not fighting or battling it. i am just injecting some reality

cindy can behave and do whatever she wants, but she is not gong to be worried about taking dems down

you may not be concerned with that, i am. i want to win 2006. i want to win 2008. i want bush out. and not just baout the war. about health care, education, rights so much more.

[tatertop]

6. The fucktards will have their day

[meisje]

7. I didn't like her tactic - got a problem with that?

[Floogeldy]

12. No problem with you not liking her tactic.

Why didn't you like her tactic?

[meisje]

18. she should have waited until bush started before uncovering the shirt

[Lars39]

24. Monday morning quarterbacking.

[Floogeldy]

25. Who did you vote for in the last presidential election?

:)

[meisje]

28. The bumper sticker on my car says "Don't blame me I voted for Kerry"

is that ehough for ya

[Floogeldy]

33. Okay

But for whom did you vote?

:)

[meisje]

36. go troll for freepers somewhere else, your bait will not work here

[Floogeldy]

38. That's debatable.

[Name removed]

41. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lars39]

43. Watch your manners; wouldn't want to give the other side ammo.

[TInCanCommunications]

11. Who's bashing Sheehan?

I'm not.

I'm bashing her so-called "followers" who rip anybody who strays from groupthink.

Cindy did her part for the anti-war movement. She played a pivitol role and helped change the way some Americans thought about the war.

But the media has made her look like a freak job and frankly, she's not doing enough to guard against that.

She's not helping change minds anymore.
And given what the media is able to do with her, she's probably hurting the cause.

We don't need Cindy Sheehan to be the face of the movement. This isn't about one person.

Move on.

[femrap]

31. To Cindy, it is about ONE PERSON.....her son.

What are you? A robot?

[TInCanCommunications]

34. A robot?

Look, I don't claim to know what Cindy Sheehan has gone through.

But Cindy has willingly entered the realm of politics, with the help of some in the Democratic Party.

Perception is everything in politics.
And Cindy and her camp don't seem to get that.

As a movement, we have to find ways to change people's minds.

Cindy Sheehan no longer does that.

You know. I know it.

[file83]

39. "But Cindy has willingly entered the realm of politics," -- true, but....

She entered the realm of politics in a Democracy. In the U.S.A. where we are supposed to have this little thing called freedom of speech. Or did you forget that minor detail?

[TInCanCommunications]

50. What are you? !2 years old?

Freedom of speech?

Nobody's saying she shouldn't speak.

The question is, do we on the left really want to amplify everything she says?

For me, the answer is no.

It's not about the person. It's about the message.

And when Cindy talks, the message gets lost in the person.

[file83]

35. You're right: "This isn't about one person" - it's about 2,245 DEAD ones.

No one is claiming Cindy Sheehan is the face or the leader of the Dems. So why are you setting up that straw man? And you missed the point of why this should upset you:

Cindy's son died in Iraq. Bush sent those boys over to Iraq to die. For a lie. She protested this summer - she's a national icon of the anti-war movement. So she get's invited to the SOTU and wears a T-Shirt (predictably) with a simple message of how many dead U.S. Soldiers have fallen with her son. She get's REMOVED from the AUDIENCE. That doesn't bother you? That doesn't make you feel sick to your stomach? You need to wake up my friend.

[radio4progressives]

13. Martin Luther King, Nelson Mandela, Ghandi, and on and on

The same freaking kool Aid drinking Brown Shirt mind set.

it a fucking amazes me that any critically THINKING individual would REACT lockstep in perfect sync with that Reich-Bot mantra.

THAT IS PURE INDOCTRINATED TRIPE -AND IT IS THE DLC MANTRA.

FUCK THEM.

[seabeyond]

20. bullshit. your post is exactly what you are accusing of

i dont htink there is a single person on this board that reads any of my posts that would suggest i lockstep with shit. but...... if i disagree you tell me to shut up, i am a koolaide drinking brownshirt. bullshit

[Individualist]

26. Hear, hear!

The only thing worse than a neocon is a neocon enabler posing as a dem.

[still_one]

15. because it will be used as propaganda against us

you can be as idealistic as you want, but perception is everything

If cindy had just attended the SOTU, that in itself would have had a huge impact, now that impact will be lost

[Lars39]

21. She's being interviewed on talk shows tomorrow morning.

She'll probably get more air time now, than if she hadn't been arrested.

[still_one]

32. I hear you, but I think it will NOT come to the purpose you believe

What should be discussed tomorrow is the LIES that * presented in his SOTU, especially the wire tap distortion, and how 9/11 could have been prevented if they had them, along with loads of other stuff

Now we will be exposed to a media circus, centered around a disruption, and NOT the lies, and accountability that should be exposed

[ConsAreLiars]

37. I guess you are still one. Too bad.

Trying to act in a way that the fascists will approve of, well, recommend that "strategy" all you want, but the only people who will applaud and benefit from that advice are those who like the way things are going. Fear of fascism is legitimate. Cowering and trying avoid criticism or unwanted attention is just the reaction they want, and what you advocate. I disagree. I think we need a leadership that has the courage to stand and fight.

[Blue_In_AK]

47. I respectfully disagree...

I think a lot of people will find it disturbing that she was escorted out in handcuffs when she HADN'T DONE ANYTHING except wear a T-shirt. IF she had stood up during the speech and actually disrupted anything, then they could have escorted her out. There's a precedent being set here. They arrested a woman for what they THOUGHT she might do. This is very dangerous -- what's to keep them from thinking that the rest of us are plotting to overthrow the country or something. It's not such a leap...

[helderheid]

16. I don't wonder why.

:thumbsup:

[tyedyeto]

17. Can you say freepers?

A woman wearing a t-shirt is such a threat to National Security that she has to be arrested. And what do some members of DU say? She deserved it!

If it looks like a Freep, talks like a Freep, methinks it might be a Freep!

Catch the trolls today!

[seabeyond]

you are calling me a freeper. i havent said, nor heard she deserved it

i have said she expected and planned being pulled out of there. no surprise. wasnt unexpected. and now the whole banner thing is back. i want to know. told my husband there wasnt a banner i like facts. she had the rigt to wear the shirt and make the statement and arrest was over the line. way over the line. it will pull from bush speech. and.... how does it effect woolsey. she ok with it. my point is, sheehan is not a democrat. she will admit it. she has her battle, i respect that. i support it. i appreciate it. she is not a dem. she has no qualms in hurting dem party. she isnt about the dem party. she is about her project, as it should be

now where is there not critical thinking. where is there bashing of cindy. i do have the right to not agree with you

[still_one]

44. yesterday I critisized Cindy meeting with Chavez

saying it would be used against us, and I was flamed as a freeper, a DINO, and a hateful person

I am getting a little tired of people who throw those words out because you don't think lock and step the way they do. Not only is it against the DU rules, but it shows the lack of their ability to engage in an intelligent conversation, and to try and persuade them to a point of view

[seabeyond]

51. if i can respect, embrace, understand, support, rally behind cindy

position, and this is understanding this woman doesnt give a shit about my concerns, yet still i am able to offer her all of that. then surely, the ones on here yelling can be open enough to maybe someone jsut sees it a bit different than they are seeing it. the very least.

[TInCanCommunications]

27. Where ?????? ???????????? ????????? ???????

Who thinks she deserved to get arrested?
I haven't seen that. It certainly isn't resprentative of the remarks I've seen tonight.

What people are saying is that it's time to stop using her as the symbol of the anti-war movement.


There's a HUGE difference. If you can't see that, I can't help you.

[samhsarah]

19. Well I'm a fairly new DUer, and I have heard some people make

mention of the fact that this happens before, but haven't experienced it full force until today. At first I thought maybe people were just being a little paranoid about that faction on DU, but whoa was I wrong!

[Name removed]

22. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lars39]

30. Per DU rules, not supposed to "call someone out"

even though it does give some personal satisfaction. :)

[Orangepeel]

23. possibly, in response to the many threads praising her

It is a common DU occurrence that somebody thinks their opinion is too important, novel or interesting to go in an existing thread about a subject. So, they post their own, whether it is "Cindy makes us look bad," "Cindy is a hero," "that was an ugly t-shirt" or whatever.

The more threads on a subject, the more threads get spawned. That's just the way DU is.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

40. The same folks who considered MLK and Gandhi "impolite".

And, gosh, what kind of silly fashion statement was the Mahatma making when he overthrew the Brits? Hardly something from Rodeo Drive. Or, Martin wearing those VERY unVersace overalls. Not to mention Cesar Chavez!

[chookie]

45. It's like the 20th century didn't happen

I can well see Condi Rice, growing up in Alabama, reassuring her white friends that Dr King did not speak for her....

[still_one]

52. but it was those folks that needed to be engaged in the dialog

[Moderator]

53. Locking

Group attack and calling out.