I had a sad thought as I was rushing to finish things at work before Christmas...

[Critters2]

It just occurred to me that there are almost certainly going to be soldiers killed in Iraq on Christmas. And that Christmas will never be a joyous time for their families, ever again.

And that Bush will have a perfectly nice holiday with his family.

First, I was really sad.

Then, I was really angry.

Now, I'm sad again.

[Az]

1. It doesn't matter whether they die on xmas or any other day

Its always a tradgedy. Made ever worse by the immorality of the war they are fighting. They did not choose the war. They chose to serve their country and their country failed them by sending them into harms way at the whim of foolish old men.

[Critters2]

2. Yeah, but as a pastor, I know that deaths on holidays have this

ability to hang on through the years. Every Christmas is the anniversary of the death, in a deeper way than when it happens on an "ordinary" day. I've seen this.

But what's most upsetting is that Bush will be "celebrating".

[Az]

8. True enough

I may play for the opposing team (team atheist) but I have spent a bit of time studying the human psyche and I agree that celebratory times such as this can carry an extra burden in times of tradgedy. And in the case of religious association it can definately provide the impetus for a crisis of faith. And even though that would seem to constitute a swing to my team (aka the loyal opposition) it carries with it a heavy burden that does not warrant pressing for it.

[Critters2]

11. I wish it would cause some crisis in political terms

that people would ask the hard questions about why service members are being asked to give their lives!

[Az]

16. That is happening right now to an extent I suspect

As Bush loses his Stay The Course attitude due to the basic strategic facts facing him and the political support falls away the people begin losing what their sense of purpose for this war is. As this happens our troops just sitting over there are big targets will weigh more and more on the people's mind. Its fine staying the course for something you believe in but when that crumbles away... as I suggested a crisis of faith is a terrible thing and not just when it comes to religious belief.

[Captain Hilts]

3. I don't think he will have a nice holiday with his family. I think it follows him...

everywhere he goes.

It eats at him. It must.

AND the fall in polling numbers.

[Critters2]

4. I don't think it has any impact on him at all. The poll numbers do,

but not the deaths of human beings. From what I can tell.

[babylonsister]

14. I think you're right. Have you seen him lately? He looks like he's

rotting away before our eyes. Or maybe that's just my perception but I did see a pitiful pic of him today.

[hatrack]

27. Well, when you sell your soul, and the demons come to eat you from within . . .

You should have read the fine print on that contract, President Chimp.

[havocmom]

5. One of the best MASH episodes dealt with the issue

Docs worked through Christmas to keep a guy alive so the family wouldn't have a death certificate with Christmas on it. It was a great one.

It is sad. And it makes one madder than hell to know it happens in a pointless war.

A sad Col. Potter to the exhausted doctors and nurses who missed the party to prevent the fallen soldiers kids from having their dad die on Christmas: 'Santa knows you have been very good'

[Critters2]

6. I still remember the first funeral I did on a Christmas Eve

I've had three of 'em in 20 years. And I know Christmas will never be the same for those families.

And yeah, the pointlessness makes it that much worse.

[Booster]

10. I agree. My only brother died on New Year's Eve and I got the

call straight up at Midnight. It's been 15 years and every New Year's Eve since, I go to bed around 10pm on purpose because if I stay up and watch that damn ball fall in Times Square, I cry my eyes out. God, I miss him.

[Critters2]

12. I'm so sorry spenbax.

Truly sorry. :hug:

[Booster]

24. Thank you. You'd think after 15 yrs it would be ok, but it never is.

Really, I never much liked New Year's Eve anyway; everybody getting drunk and trying so hard to have a good time no matter what. So that part of it wasn't a big deal for me; I just find it easier to handle if I just go to bed and not think about it.

[grasswire]

29. my father died on New Years Day

He was alone. The rest of the family was a thousand miles away. He sat in his car outside a restaurant and died. It was many years ago. Some things in life are so heartbreaking.

[Booster]

32. Wow, that's even worse, him being alone. My brother was with

his entire family and they were watching tv. Everybody thought he just fell asleep and they didn't think anything about that. Needless to say, everyone who was with him blames themselves for letting him rest and not trying to wake him. Guess it doesn't matter if you're alone or with a room full of people; I'm just glad he went peacefully and didn't suffer - sounds like your Dad did the same. We can give thanks they didn't suffer. Sorry for your loss also.

[laylah]

17. oh spen...

:hug: I am so sorry for your loss and the constant holiday reminder!

Our mom died on my oldest sister's birthday 5 years ago...it will never be the same for her either.

Losing ANYONE at ANY time is horrific and painful; however, to lose one on a "special" day, is especially excruciating.

Jenn

[Booster]

25. Thank you for your thoughts - I just remembered that JFK was

assassinated on my 21st birthday too. Damn, maybe Karma has bitten me in the butt more times that I thought.

[nadinbrzezinski]

30. I am sorry for your loss

[Booster]

31. Thanks, nadin. I'm glad it didn't happen at Christmas; that would

have ruined Christmas for my family for the rest of our lives.

[Monkeyman]

7. Not only death Brain Injury lost of a arm or leg

You will hear people say your lucky to be alive. Some don't think so end up taken their lives pain live on

[Critters2]

9. And Bush is sipping egg nog

:mad:

[Monkeyman]

13. With some Beam or Jack in it

[Critters2]

15. A hot rum totty while Rome burns! nt

[libnnc]

18. I've been thinking about the soldiers too

And those laid up in the VA hospitals recovering from serious injuries.

This Christmas just sucks. I'm angry, sad, furious, depressed, ...crap. I hate this time of year and I hate this fucking war.

[Critters2]

19. I usually love this time of year.

I can see why our ancestors felt the need to party as the days get shorter--and slowly longer again. I usually appreciate it. But this year I find myself thinking about those families.

[Monkeyman]

20. I was at one today

It is getting worse more and more coming in. Missing part of their body and mind.

[Critters2]

21. It makes me so mad. nt

[libnnc]

22. I know you spend a lot of time in those hospitals

I always try to read your posts. You're a great man.

[Monkeyman]

23. Just a Vet taken care of my Sisters and Brothers

[northofdenali]

26. I've been so grateful that our "local" troops are finally home.

I hate to think about the families and friends of those who didn't come back, and won't come back. :cry:

Bush, your time in Hell is coming, guaranteed. And I hope it's worse than 3,000 Iraqs.

[nadinbrzezinski]

28. I used to work that shift Christmas Night

I am Jewish and always wanted to send someobdy home.

It is not only soldiers... One time I remember clearly, the patient passed on one minute before midnight on the 24th... well the doc looked up at the wall and said, two more minutes of CPR will not hurt anybody. So we kept going, not for two, but for ten. Why? He didn't want the death certificate to read December 24th.

So yes, we did things like that, becuase I know and you know how this affects families... and quite personally I doubt that day and night will be quiet