I just couldn't take my family's racist crap and left before dinner

[freeplessinseattle]

before anyone jumps all over me about what a bad person I am for leaving early on a sacred special occasion, let me share some choice quotes with you (from my mom's boyfriend and my grandfather):


"They were brought over here to work the fields, you know, and now they want special rights and all of us to kiss their ass"

<...such as OJ Simpson>"The day of the OJ verdict I was in the bank and saw a white woman with a black child that was having a tantrum. I couldn't help but think to myself 'better watch out, when he grows up he'll slit your throat and get away with it'"

"I see them all over the place now, and can't even get away from them when watching tv. We should pile 'em up like cords of firewood, then skin them and make lampshades. hahahaha!"

"I'm not racist, I just didn't grow up around Niggers so don't like them"


This kind of talk goes on every single time I visit, even on Thanksgiving and my birthday. My mom's bf will refer to anything black or dark as "Nigger", such as chocolate cake, my cat, the night sky. On Thanksgiving he talked about what a swell guy he is bc sometimes he makes my mom buckwheat for breakfast, and said "we call them 'Nigger cakes', heheheheh"

ok, my dad is pretty racist, too, but he knew it bothered me and had the decency to at least not say shit around me, especially on special occasions, and he was never anywhere as obnoxious and obsessed with hating. I'm not excusing my dad at all, and I think it's a good thing my parents finally got divorced after 30 years, but it makes me physically ill to think of my mom sharing a bed with this hateful freak. Sure, my grandfather was in Hitler Youth (seriously, but he says it was like the boy scouts, and he didn't volunteer, he had to join and later became a soldier during WWII). He wasn't a Nazi, but sure was exposed to some messed up values. To have those same values all these years later though...I don't know, I try to accept the cultural differences and all that but I know of people who also fought as German soldiers and changed their tune over time.

He is still my grandfather and I can't help but care about him, and am obligated to act like family, even if I can't respect him. My mom's boyfriend, on the other hand, is not someone I feel obligated to be around, especially since he knows very well that his racist shit bothers me. Which is probably one reason he insists on spewing every single time I visit. I am so freaking tired of being expected to sit there quietly and be tolerant of their intolerance, and if they think I am more rude for leaving before dinner than they are for talking about how much hate they have in their hearts when they know it bothers me, well, fuck 'em. I was there last night for the main gift opening and dinner event (our tradition) and today is just a light dinner and more hate talk. I couldn't respect myself or keep down my food if I stayed a minute longer.

I just know my mom's going to call me later and chew me out, but I am not going to let myself be a doormat like she has been in both relationships. Someone has to have backbone and a heart in this family and I did my duty enough this holiday as far as I'm concerned. If they can't respect me enough to cut out the crap for one goddamn day why should I stick around just to be there in body but not spirit?

Thanks for letting me rant, I feel much better now!


on edit: This stuff might sound so over the top and exaggerated, but believe me it all too true!

[donco6]

1. No jumping all over you from me . . .

Why would anyone want to spend a "sacred" day wallowing in that cesspool?

[goddess40]

104. I wish more people behave like you

and either stood up to these jerks or did what you did and left. This type of person shows no compassion, empathy or even the the slightest bit of consideration to those that don't share their beliefs and we shouldn't put up with it. How would they react if you started to rant about bigots?

[tinfoil tiaras]

2. I feel for you.

Having racist relatives must really suck. Ugh, that's just so wrong to think that every black child is gonna grow up to "slit your throat". :puke:

[Sherman A1]

3. It happens to be YOUR holiday as much as anyone else's

if the situation makes YOU uncomfortable, choosing to leave is a very good course of action. There is absolutely no reason to be in any situation that makes you uncomfortable if you can avoid doing so. I think you acted wisely and in everyone's best interst. If your Mom cannot accept that, Well that is too, too bad....

Good Going!

[PDJane]

4. been there, done that.......

And you get no chastizement from me.

Sooner or later, you have to act on what you believe.......and you're there.

Congratulations!

[Blue_In_AK]

5. I respect you for that. n/t

[jody]

6. Assuming you're from Washington, thanks for posting. It shows that bigotry is not just

a Southern commodity.

[WatchWhatISay]

7. I dont blame you at all

After reading what you wrote, you showed more tolerance than most of us would be able to muster.

I worry about your mother, as I am sure you do too.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[pnwmom]

29. What is that supposed to mean?

[Raine]

31. Huh???

:shrug:

[MrSlayer]

33. Are you saying he has bad genes?

Or that he's wrong for being against the racists? Either way that is a fucked up thing to say to someone.

[freeplessinseattle]

43. Thank you, I would think I could raise children to be kind

I mean, look at how I turned out. not to sound immodest, but somehow I overcame any "bad genes" I might have.

(tho I am a couple years past healthy child bearing age-as a female, btw, which doesn't matter as far as being a poster, just clarifying;)

[MrSlayer]

54. You're welcome.

I have family that are unabashed racists as well and my kids and I are perfectly fine. I think it's ridiculous to suggest in some way that racist behavior is genetic or that what has been learned cannot be unlearned.

[Pab Sungenis]

107. It's not genes.

It's nurture. You have to be taught hate and racism. That you managed to overcome it is a good sign.

[Warren DeMontague]

49. What the hell kind of a response is that?

Good grief.

[EST]

9. Good job and perfectly proper.

I do hope you explained to them, gently and specifically, why it was that you felt compelled to leave.

[Quantess]

10. Are they freeps as well?

What do you think would have happened if you had changed the subject, and started complaining about our Worthless idiot president?

[freeplessinseattle]

16. based on past experience, just told me I'm young and naive

even though I'm 34 years old. oh, and last time I tried that they agreed that * has disappointed them bc he isn't doing anything about the immigrant situation.

[Quantess]

19. Oh, no. They sound hopeless.

Good thing you left.

[Name removed]

11. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[poiuytsister]

12. Way to Go!

To remain silent in the name of diplomacy does more long term harm than not. It drives your blood pressure thru the roof, builds resentment and worst of all implies agreement with racism. I have stopped keeping my mouth shut when anyone starts spewing such hatred. And if I end up offending anyone well...I'm over it.

[wryter2000]

102. Welcome to DU

:hi:

[Texifornia]

13. That is exactly why...

I didn't visit my family this year.

If they will not show that small level of respect to tone down the bigotry for on day you have three choices:

1) Fight fire with fire: Include profanity as appropriate and use the terms "fascist", "Nazi", "inbred hillbilly", and "pig-fucking rednecks" liberally.

2) Leave. (your choice)

3) Do not go in the first place. (my choice)

None are very appealing although #1 is potentially the most fun, but you'd better be prepared for a fist fight just in case.

[pnwmom]

35. There's a fourth choice. Fight fire with water.

Holy water.

When freepers, who usually profess Christianity, start freeping, then start quoting the Bible. Remind them about the Sermon on the Mount. Or the parable of the Good Samaritan. If it helps, bring Bible passages written on notecards in your pocket, and whip them out as needed. Watch those jaws drop.

[rebel with a cause]

44. Number 5

Start singing Christmas carols or hymns, especially ones that are about peace on earth and love for all. "Everybody's Beautiful" might throw your mother's bf into a rage/seizure. Hopefully the later.

I can't give you much advise, because I haven't had anything to do with most of my family for twenty years.(my parents are deceased) A mutual agreement in a way(they were just too troublesome), and I am sadly happier without them.

[freeplessinseattle]

14. Thank you all so much for being so supportive!

I was actually hesitant to post because I know that many people believe that family ties supercede anything else, especially on holidays, but this is not just about al differences, this is sick and disturbing. Not to mention passive aggressive behavior since they all know very well how much that kind of talk bothers me (funny, I didn't grow up around black people either but am not full of hate. muct be those darn liberal schools filling my head with pc nonsense).

I'll go back and visit, of course, but leave when it starts getting ridiculous again, without an ounce of guilt. I'm almost 35 years old and have to be true to myself and do what I think a real adult should do. I feel they are the ones putting a taint on a holiday based on peace and love, and if they want to demonize me for being absent at their hate fest so be it, I can deal with that but not being around such vile feelings, it really has a toxic effect on me.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

17. Next year, put together your own Christmas dinner with

people you actually like and limit your time with your family to a short drop-in visit, saying that you can't stay because you're having dinner with good friends.

[kath]

56. I second this suggestion! Spend the day with people you like.

Perhaps send your mom a present in the mail, or drop in for a BRIEF visit, if you feel you must.

[China_cat]

18. I'm so sorry that your mother chooses bigotry

over your company. That must hurt a lot.

[freeplessinseattle]

25. well, she's always stifled herself to please the men in her life

and expected me to do the same, I wish I could help be a good example for her but she won't see it that way. It doesn't really hurt since I know her mindset, and she thinks I hould be the bigger person by putting up with abuse (when I was in a physically abusive relationship when I was 20 she had a talk with me about how to not anger my man to prevent his tirades). She's just been raised in a messed up environment.

[Irishonly]

96. Don't feel badly

Many years ago I was told that families were genetic accidents and your real family was one you made. The first two years my husband and I were married I would come home on Christmas Eve and cry. The situation is different than yours as they didn't make racist comments but the favoritism displayed was something like you would see on a soap opera. Many years ago we decided we could go to my in-laws and be miserable or make our own holiday memories. Our own holiday memories won. The last time we went to my in-laws I discovered my husband's step father was a freeper and the hate that frothed out of his mouth was shocking. I asked him a couple of questions but didn't want to be the cause of a stroke and I stopped. There hasn't been a family gathering since. Yesterday, my sister in law and niece came for dinner and it was wonderful. Other family (adopted) stopped in and we had a wonderful day. I am such a traditionalist it is almost sickening but I learned that when your genetic family makes you feel so bad and it's a struggle being there, find another family. Holidays are to be enjoyed and if that means having hot dogs with friends, that's what you do.

[cui bono]

97. I think you did the right thing. And you're not past child bearing age!!!

:)

I would've *d out that word in your post though. And why bother with them anymore? Are you getting anything positive out of maintaining your family relations?

[Pab Sungenis]

108. Don't hide the word.

Let it out in the open. Expose it for what it is.

[bluedeminredstate]

15. You have no obligation to listen to

the hate-filled verbal vomitus coming out of your Mom's BF's mouth or anyone else's for that matter. If you made your feelings clear and the hate spech continued, than THEY are the ones who should apologize to YOU for ruining your holiday.
Self-respect comes at a price at times, and unfortunately you had to do something you didn't want to do in order to keep it.
I feel bad for your mom, but everyone makes choices and it seems she's made hers.
You should be proud of yourself.
No recriminations here, my friend.

:)

[freeplessinseattle]

20. Thank you, I appreciate your words.

I did hesitate to leave only bc of my mom and grandmother, but can come back and visit just them sometime. It is only 1 1/2 drive. It might be enlightening for my mom, too, since both my grandfather and her bf (and my dad) are dominating people, and she does have a kind soul, but stifles herself to please the men in her life.

[bluedeminredstate]

28. I feel for you

I had my own family drama over Thanksgiving that involved me and hubby and kids leaving my dad's house a couple days early. It caused a big family airing out which turned out to be a good thing in the end, but in the thick of it I felt like I was being attacked for standing my ground.
Nothing like a little drama to get the kinks out...
:)

[Frances]

21. I think you have every right to spend each holiday the way

that it makes you feel good about yourself. That said, I know how difficult it is to have relatives that are doing or saying things that are ethically wrong. I know intellectually that not having contact with a particular relative this Christmas was the absolutely right thing to do, but I have still been very stressed out.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

22. Are you a character in a Twilight Zone episode?

Don't you feel Rod Serling is going to come from behind a bush and start talking to an invisible audience about the time portal you go through every holiday season? One that sends you 60 years into the past?

[BlueIris]

60. Yeah, no kidding.

You took the post right off my keyboard.

GOOD LORD. I think it's good the OP fled. Hopefully, s/he won't ever have to return to that insanity.

[KarenS]

23. You did the right thing!!

and,,,,, I would support you in not taking any telephone calls from your Mom if she's going to "chew you out". Sounds like you are establishing some very appropriate boundaries here and I support you in continuing!!

Perhaps you will find some Friends & Family-of-Choice folks to spend time with the next set of holidays!! Good Luck to you.

[roody]

24. Good for you!

[Warpy]

26. No one is obligated to be some bigot's sounding board

I'd be tempted to cut into the middle of the chewing out and say, "Let me know when you get a civil boy friend and I'll be back."

She might as well know what the problem is.

[The Straight Story]

27. Good on ya bro - a well deserved kick! (nt)

[NYC]

30. You did the right thing.

Don't feel the slightest bit guilty for walking out. Make your own plans for future holidays, and spend them with enjoyable companions.

[pnwmom]

32. Who here would blame you?

Something you might try saying next year . . .

"That's funny, I thought we were here to celebrate the birth of Jesus. You know, the one who said we're supposed to all love each other? Even the Samaritan? Even prisoners? Even the poor? So can we celebrate Jesus, and loving each other, since that's what we're here for?"

[Infinite Hope]

34. I'd have never gone...

I wouldn't consider such people part of my family. I'd instantly disown them.

[tblue]

36. I am so grateful the racist gene wasn't passed on to you

and that you will end the cycle of hate in your family. What a couple of ignoramuses! You have the patience of a saint, my friend. I would have walked out at the first sign of blatant racism, and I'm sure I would have muttered (or screamed) some kind of insult before hitting the door. But you probably have better manners than me. I decided long ago to avoid negative people. Life is way too short. But you are a gift to your entire family because you embody what is truly good and righteous. I don't mean to sound religious, but it's true. Keep in mind there is something psycholigically very wrong deep within those two men, and your mother for choosing that man as her lover. For whatever reason, they have a need to feel and express superiority over other people, and a largely disenfranchised people to boot. To keep bringing it up, they must really have profound insecurities. You might try something that I think could make them stop and think, without losing your grace and dignity: When they make one of those heinous remarks, try saying something like, "Gee, I thought the Bible said we're all children of God." Or "I tend to judge people by the way they treat others, not based on their skin color." Or "I have a friend who is black and she's the smartest/most generous/most accomplished person I know." You're the bigger person, and they need to see how small they are in comparison. It will be good for them. It probably won't change their behavior, but it'll shut their ugly faces up by infusing some sanity and humanity into the conversation. Of course, that's if you want to maintain the high ground. Me, I'd probably tell them to get the fuck out of my life, they probably have tiny dicks, and it's idiots like them who give white people a bad name. I wouldn't spend 5 minutes breathing their air. But again, that's me. And you probably have a whole lot more class. Keep going, girlfriend! You rock!

[durtee librul]

45. I am an AF brat and my

dad was stationed at Maxwell AFB in the early and mid 60's. I won't go into any detail other than to say he lost a stripe and was transferred to a 'white state' (Truax AFB in WI) where he could freely be a 'n' lover.

All this becuase he had a black family over for dinner IN BASE HOUSING (gasp!). We had a cross burned on our yard (again in base housing) and a lot of other unpleasant things done to us.

Racism is ugly and I can still hear my base 4th grade teacher telling me she couldn't teach 'n's' because "after all, just look at their hair, with all those tight curls, nothing can sink in." Her name, btw, was Mrs. Flowers. I will never forget her or her stinking racist remarks to a bunch of 4th graders.

Fortunately my parents took me aside when I asked about all this and explained in a very basic way that we are all pink inside.

I have many memories of AL in the 60's and none of them are good. I about flipped when I saw some 'well meaning' southern socialite wanted to remove all the signs which say "Colored only" from a historical exhibit becuase it cast the south in a bad way. Well, honey, if the shoe fits, wear it.

I am so lucky to have my Dad yet (Mom's gone) and he still preaches equality to me and he's 86 and in the Soldier's HOme in DC...or what's left of it (another thread someday thanks to Bushie)

[diamidue]

93. You're dad sounds like a decent guy.

You are lucky to have him alright. My father also had a cross burned on his yard once. He's been dead for 30 years now and I don't think he ever told me exactly why this happened. I'm guessing it was because his dad was a jazz musician and probably hung out with more than a few black musicians. I grew up in segregated Texas and when my family moved to Colorado in the early 1960's, I thought I had died and gone to Heaven.

[oldlady]

135. *heheh* all white Truax

just wanted to let you know that I live next to Truax now & this is probably the most racially diverse side of town. My own apartment complex (built to house AF base families about the time yours came to town)is 60% Black, 30% Southeast Asian and 10% White, with all but two of those families being Latino/a. Thanks for the laugh-- I'm glad the times have changed! Most of the newest neighbors are from Africa: Sudan, Togo, Nigeria, Gambia, Cameroon, Ghana.

[Straight Shooter]

37. ""The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men (and women) to do nothing."

Famous quote by Edmund Burke, 18th century.

Good for you, freepless. By getting up and walking out, you did something. You let them know that you will not tolerate racism in your presence, that it dehumanizes you to sit there quietly and complacently while fellow human beings are denigrated as worthless.

If your mother is a Christian, please give her a message for me: "We are all children of God." And from the Bible itself: "Judge not, lest ye be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you." (Matthew 7:1-5)

Normally I don't preach at people, but racism gets my hackles up. Racism is the most vile form of judging others, because it's based on an undeserved sense of smug superiority.

Peace be to you, freepless. Your conscience is clear. :hug:

[mahatmakanejeeves]

38. You did the right thing by leaving.

I was raised in a totally Rethuglican, totally white supremacist household, but your family is much worse than mine was. At tonight's Christmas dinner, I arrived too late to hear my brother tell his wife's brother that he thought * was honest.

[undeterred]

39. I wouldn't last 3 minutes and I wouldn't go back

People who need to spew their bigotry make me sick, even if they're family.

[MockSwede]

100. Yep

ESPECIALLY if they are family!

[MountainLaurel]

40. To stay would have been to give approval, family or not

You definitely did the right thing by leaving.

[freeplessinseattle]

79. Exactly what I was thinking, thank you n/t

[Cleita]

41. You know what?

I would prefer a Swanson's Turkey Dinner shared with my cat than have to listen to that vitriol. Remember rule number one in dealing with relatives, you must be true to yourself and your principles. I'm not saying that you impose your views on them, but they shouldn't do that to you either. Maybe you need to get together with friends instead the next Christmas, ones that you have more in common with. I have known many people who have done this. It turns out there are people with no families and those with toxic families, like yours, who do form friend families for holidays. Look into it.

[NJCher]

42. just the sheer ignorance level alone

would keep me away from these people, family or no family!



Cher

and p.s. I have plenty of ignorant people in my own family. Maybe not with racism but with other types of things--just as stupid.

[illinoisprogressive]

61. I love your Gardeners sign

don't mean to change subject but, love the Gardeners against bush. I am an avid gardeners and was lead perennial person at a garden center. Loved it. Just had to tell you how much I loved that.

[Yavin4]

46. The Most Important Fact Is That You Recognize Their Biggotry

and you won't pass those values onto your children. My guess is that your mom's BF is a complete loser in life, and he needs to denigrate African Americans in order to make himself feel superior even though he's completely insignificant.

[spacelady]

47. Do these people really sit around & have these ridiculous conversations all the time

or are they just trying to goad you? I totally agree they are racist assholes, but are they really that into it & concentrate on being this obnoxious 24/7? It must be very exhausting for them not to be able to sic the dogs on black people & lynch them at will. No blood is thick enough to waste your holiday on that rubbish. So what if your Mom chews you out - chew her out for condoning it!

[freeplessinseattle]

78. I've wondered the same thing, is it worse or better when I'm not

around? according to my mom tho they are actually holding back, trying to be somewhat respectful (!?)
so while I'm sure on some level they enjoy my discomfort and putting me in my place, it is just a natural part of their daily life. that does really make me sad, what a miserable way to live, walking around finding hate in everything.

[silverojo]

48. You had every right to walk out

That's some messed up sh*t those people are saying. There's no need for you to put up with it.

[Warren DeMontague]

50. Oh god, that's disgusting. I'm so sorry that's your family.

:puke:

You did the right thing in a tough situation. :patriot:

[Beausoir]

51. NEVER go near those people again. That is as toxic as it gets.

There is nothing those people can offer to you that will in any way enhance your life.

Get away from them. Do not grace them with your presence.

Just because you are related by blood doesn't mean they are family.

[Lipton64]

52. So many older Americans are racist.....

many of them you should just take it with stride. I have a racist uncle who I love to death but just don't have the nerve to blast him for old time's sake. Racists of the old variety are a dying breed.

[Evoman]

53. Your a better person that I. I would have punched him in the throat, and then kicked in his knee.

And then dropped him on in a immigrant neighborhood wearing a KKK uniform. But maybe thats just me.

[Gold Metal Flake]

55. I applaud your strength.

Breaking the chain requires that the Chain Be Broken. That means walking out and away if needed.

As for the BF, he likes making people uncomfortable. It's how he gains power over others. If he can make someone uncomfortable and put them on the spot so that they either have to sit and take it or get up and leave, he wins. He's pathological. He needs a hammer between the eyes.

It has been my experience that people like that are also abusive in private. Consider that possibility, but don't allow yourself to be emotionally blackmailed over it later. You have drawn a line. Always hold it. Advance it, never retreat.

[mitchtv]

57. Glad you left

Your family sounds worse than mine, if that's possible. I am afraid partner will punch out my brother( who hates Mexicans) partner is a Chicano with lots of loving nephews. We stayed home.

[illinoisprogressive]

58. You sound like my mom did many years ago

I was a kid and my dad's family was visiting us. I was in bed. They were talking about blacks and this was ages ago. My mom exploded. She is from France and did not grow up hearing racism. She lit into all of them and told them she did not want that in her house ever again. Do not talk like that in her house.
It made the impression on me, overhearing it, that it was very very wrong to be racist. I grew up with that thought and as an adult I've had black friends, bosses and co workers. Because of her stand, I was able to work and be friend with black people without the usual white guilt or racist thinking. I thank her for taking the stand she did.
I hope this helps you and stands you in good steed.
Bravo for taking a stand and making it known you felt it wrong.
Stay brave and fight the good fight.

[deadmessengers]

59. My own story

(I originally posted this on another message board, but I went back and copied it here because it applies so very well)


I have dealt with a similar situation in my past.

I have an uncle who is a serious, died-in-the-wool bigot. Think Archie Bunker - an old-time, blue collar Irishman from New York City. The kind of guy that wouldn't burn a cross on your lawn, but if he were to walk by when one was burning, he might toast a marshmallow on it. (quote shamelessly stolen from an old episode of All In The Family, incidentally.)

Rewind to 13 years ago, when my sweetie and I first got together. My uncle was visiting my mother (I still lived with her at the time), and the N word was flowing freely from his lips, as it usually did whenever he had a beer or 2 in him. I was watching the Knicks game on TV, which meant that he had PLENTY of opportunity to use that word.

When he referred to basketball as "N----r handball", I had had enough. I got up, went to my room, and returned with a picture of me, with my sweetie, who is a beautiful black woman.

I said "Hey, Uncle Tom" (no shortage of irony there) "Check this out", and I handed him the photograph. He took one look, and just about dropped his beer.

Then, I said - "yep, she's a N----r all right, and if I ever hear you use that word around me again, I'll put you through a fucking wall, you tired old racist bastard."

And he never did. In fact, 13 years later, he's one of the very few of my relatives that still sends my sweetie and I Christmas cards.

My point here (and this is how it applies to your grandmother) is that most racists just have to be called out once. Once they've been exposed in a particularly humiliating manner, they tend to STFU pretty damn quick.

[illinoisprogressive]

62. Sometimes they re assess

My dad was the Archie type when this episode happened with my mom.
Today he is pro choice who hates the anti choice people, pro woman and not a bigot. Times and sometimes people change. it sometimes takes pointing the awful behavior out and that it isn't okay.

[Trajan]

63. Bully for you ....

GREAT for you to stand up like that ... Im sure it made for a suspenseful moment or two ...

You are right ... These kinds of armchair racists are weak, perhaps because it is weakness and self doubt that drive that kind of racism ....

I am shocked to still hear of these kinds of racists still flourishing .... I thought society had moved farther than that ....

[freeplessinseattle]

82. Good to hear. I'm bisexual and have thought of bringing a

black female friend over to introduce as my lover, but am afraid I'd give my grandfather a heart attack.

[eleny]

64. You have a healthy degree of self respect

And you sound like the adult in the family.

[peacetalksforall]

65. I would tell your mother you want to change the scene at

Christmas by coming early, having a dinner with her alone. Do the same with your father. (separately). A group of more than one facilitates feeding off each other because of the audience they give each other. Being alone with her gives you more control. Then, spend Christmas with friends as others have recommended. Working it to avoid looking at the lined up shotguns would be worth it.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

66. I Would Refuse To Tolerate Or Allow Myself To Listen To Such Hatred As Well.

If this actually happened the way you said, than that was beyond joking or ignorant distaste. It was pure dehumanizing hatred. To be honest, I wouldn't ever even go back there while they were there.

Thing is, I'm usually a stickler about some of these 'family battle' threads and often find them to be amazingly petty and melodramatic. I had thought this was going to be similar; but not this time. If this story is true, than I'm with ya 100%.

[Kurovski]

67. You made a stand and you have your self-respect intact.

Are they less openly racist when not all together in a pack? I hope so for the sake of family relations.

I was speaking with a Friend today who just moved to Los Angeles and she was relaying how openly racist folks are toward the Mexican population. She was shocked, and the girl ain't easily shocked. She always says something--kindly--about how she feels about it.

[Dan]

68. personal thoughts...

I'm sure that you have thought of this, but my thoughts...

Your mother's boyfriend - his actions might in fact be used as a control mechanism. It is unfortunate that your mother has allowed herself to be in two relationships of this type (your words), but the boyfriend is not married to your mother. But by his actions, he has an adverse influence on you & your mother's relationship.

While you should not allow yourself to be subjected to his behavior, I would be concerned that your walking away - tends to leave your mother more dependent on this ass wipe - and more under his control.

As a child I discovered that were love is concerned people can be blind - and as an adult, I realized that allowing these types of people to separate you from your family, plays into their game. Maybe as one person posted - confrontation might be the answer - but I am not sure. That whole love thing confuses the issue. Maybe the smart thing is to have a relationship with your mother without her significant, but whatever you do - be there for your mother; one day she might discover that which is important, her children. Oh, one other thing, do the right thing by yourself.

Merry Xmas.

[freeplessinseattle]

75. I appreciate your words, but to the contrary,

my mom and I have started to spend time hanging out just the two of us a couple years ago. she realized I was coming around less bc of him and made an effort to make time for just the two of us, and even has driven down to Seattle to visit me (an 1 1/2 hour drive) so now we are having more quality time together. she knows in her heart that this dude is obnoxious, but it is what she is used to, and unfortunately on her income she was greatly struggling on her own after her divorce (in which she let my dad get away with shafting her) so I don't see her ever leaving this guy. or adbandoning me, her only child. What may happen is that she might start speaking up when he is obnoxious, but he will never be able to come between us.

[Dan]

88. Good

[G Hawes]

69. It's tough having racist relatives

especially when they are people who seem to be otherwise decent people. It's tough trying to understand how such "decent" people can come out with such racist and ugly words. Been there, done that, and it's no fun.

But it's proper and just for you to stand up to them and their racist views, even if it puts a crimp in a family gathering. Sometimes, that's what it takes to make them realize that their views are not accepted by everyone around them, as they might otherwise think. I walked out of a family gathering in similar circumstances several years ago, and although at the time, the others may have thought I was out of line, they have since reconsidered and it was the very act of my walking out on such a gathering that made them see how important the issue was, and that led them to reconsider their ingrained views.

Of course, with some people, their age and background may make it impossible to change their views (my father in law and mother in law were too old and far too set in their ways to ever change deep down, for instance) but even still, it made them think about their views and, at the very least, it got them to shut the fuck up with their racist crap in the presence of others, and even that is a victory of sorts.

So, good on you. Every step along the road to equality is a step worth taking.

[Catherine Vincent]

70. Thank you.

For having the courage to walk out like that, even though it was family. It's hard to believe. They are supposed to be enjoying each other's company. I just returned home from my parents and there were about twenty of us there most times and a few friends and other family dropped by for a visit. And all that time, we basically enjoyed all the conversations, played a game, watched everyone open their presents and of course, had dinner. And this is the usual scene in my family during holidays and some sundays. Bigot talk like that never happens. I feel so sorry for you that you have to put up with that but you did a good thing. :hi:

[rucky]

71. Next year, get them Santa hats that fit over their faces.

jazz up the next Klan meeting!

[NotGivingUp]

72. there's no way on earth i'd sit around and listen to that crap

[jgraz]

73. Make your life a lot easier and don't go back

You've long ago fulfilled any obligation you may feel to your family. The fact that they continue to spew their toxic bile around you shows that they have absolutely no respect for your feelings -- and they never will.

Several people I know (myself included) have had to make the difficult choice to cut ties with an immediate family member who was just too toxic to be part of our lives. I'm not saying you HAVE to do this, but certainly don't keep going back out of some false obligation if all you're getting is pain from this relationship.

Whatever you decide, I'm sorry your Christmas kinda sucked this year. Go do something nice for yourself and try to shake off their crap. Best holiday wishes to you from one of your DU family. :hi:

[IdaBriggs]

74. I'm going to take a different tact -- I'm pissed off at your Mother (& Grandmother).

You were there as an adult guest of your mother, and she allowed HER BOYFRIEND to behave in an OFFENSIVE, ABUSIVE way TO HER CHILD. What the hell kind of woman doesn't pick HER CHILD (even if you are an adult) over A BOYFRIEND?

Let us assume the "boyfriend" is a live in, so its his house, too. That doesn't change the fact ITS YOUR MOTHER'S HOUSE, TOO, and YOU have been made to feel UNCOMFORTABLE in HER HOME.

If, as you say, it is common knowledge amongst your "family" that you find the "N" word offensive, as well as blatant displays of "racism" as you quoted OFFENSIVE, then you were being ATTACKED ON PURPOSE. It wasn't "a joke" because you weren't laughing. It was "on purpose" and you were being chased out -- and your MOTHER / Grandmother ALLOWED IT TO HAPPEN.

They are obviously doing it because they want to think of themselves as "weak" and "helpless" to change the behavior of their "chosen ones," but that is a lie -- I have yet to meet a woman who can't make her spouse's life a living hell when something actually matters to her --

Like having her OWN CHILD FEEL WELCOME IN HER HOME.

When your mother calls to scold you, hit her upside the head with the reality brick. You are owed an apology FROM HER. SHE *ALLOWED* someone (her father or her boyfriend) to behave in a rude, disrespectful manner, and you would be AN IDIOT to tolerate that kind of behavior in the future.

If she wants to spend the holidays with you, then invite her (and your grandmother) over to your home in the future, with a clear boundary that her latest loser isn't welcome. Your grandfather has no incentive to change his views, unless he's got something to lose -- and one hopes that a relationship with you, and/or your love/respect, might be some incentive. If it isn't, then you are better off knowing it now so you an accept it, and move on with your life.

Don't expect an apology from The Racists unless you confront THEM yourself. Quit making them a part of the "power triangle" because they aren't. Deal with your issues with your Mother and Grandmother ("you allowed people to be rude and obnoxious to me!"), and then deal with your issues with them ("you have been rude and obnoxious to me!") and provide clear boundaries for future behavior. "I will not be around you when you behave this way; I will not be silent when you are being offensive to me."

Oh, and if that doesn't fix things, ask a Large Male Black Friend to be your escort to the next family function. If that doesn't shut them up, nothing will.

The lack of character displayed by your maternal relatives is your real problem. Be prepared for them to choose keeping their men happy over you; frankly, that's what they've been doing for years, isn't it? Because no matter how bad things get, you will still keep coming around....until you decide not to.

Good luck!

[freeplessinseattle]

77. Thank you, you've helped me formulate a response I've been

mulling. I keep on feeling sorry for my mom, bc I can see how she was raised in such a domineering family, and while she and my grandmother can be passive aggressive towards their men those feeble reactions amount to nothing more than repressed resentment and lead to even more domineering behavior towards them.

I thought that after the divorce my mom would be enlightened but she fell right back in at a vulnerable time and now the situation is 10x worse than it ever was with my dad. She thinks she owes a debt of gratitude to her bf for financial security, but I have tried to explain to her that he should be as grateful to her for her financial contribution. she says, "oh, my income does help us to take vacations and pay the visa bill, but..." I tell her, come on, you work nearly 40/hrs a week, and he is retired, living on his mother's land in a house that was bought with your good credit bc he has declared bankrupty in the past. she just does not get it so, yes, I agree, I have to keep giving her reality checks. Thank you!!!

[yardwork]

113. It's sad that your mom feels dependent on this bigot

So many women are in your mother's position. They allow themselves to feel dependent on men for economic security and social status. My New Year's wish for your mom is that she will recognize that she doesn't need to be dependent on anybody. She can support herself and she has the right to choose partners and friends who are respectful, kind people who are decent to her, her family, and others. She doesn't need to put up with bigots.

It is a help to your mom that you model independence and stand up for ethical, kind behavior by choosing not to stay in the presence of bigots.

[rpgamerd00d]

76. You should have kicked his ass and tossed him out of your house.

[freeplessinseattle]

81. well, it wasn't my house, & on T-day we were at a restaurant

on Thanksgiving the bf was glaring at the two Mexican familie he saw, and said "I'm looking around and not liking what I see." (wtf, they had as much right tp be there as anyone else) when I sighed, my mom did whisper something about me being bothered and he loudly said, "I can say what I want I don't care who it bothers" so at least she did try to keep that dinner civil, but he effectively dismissed it. I can only imagine what else he says in public!

[sasha031]

80. I spent Xmas day with my brother and sister-in-law

My father won't allow her in his house, my parents are both full of hate and racism.

For years I have bought my mother xmas gifts that she hates and always wanted to know the cost, and I don't even want to go into how bad my father is.

The usual thing is she gives me a check for $100 and give her a check for $100, what fun.

Well yesterday I walked out with bags of gifts for my brother and his family and gave mom an empty card.
I went back and forth on th guilt thing for awhile, but common sense and who deserves what won over.

50 yrs of miserable holidays with dysfunctional people is enough for me.

will be moving 2000 miles away in about 6months, bad families are not good for you, I have said after this move I probably will never see them again, and I mean it. To many memories and pain.

We don't have to take it, if it hurts get rid of it.

sure took me a long tme to wake up.

[progressoid]

83. Good for you but...

lets hope your mother sees the problem as well. Perhaps your walking out will be a wake-up call for her and she'll see her bf in a new light.

[CrispyQ]

84. These people have forgotten what it means to be a good host.

You did the right thing. Life is too short to spend with people you don't like, even if they are family.

[TexasLady]

85. My folks are pretty messed up- sometimes avoiding insanity is best..

Dad likes to tell everyone that I am an immoral slut, my sister is fat and lazy, my brother is a no account worthless druggie, and cant even say something nice about my dead brother.

Mom is the lovely creature who sits around letting it all happen. They are both fundies. We call him Jesus -----(insert last name)I told him at 18 that if paradise meant being around people like him, Ill gladly go to hell. SHE liked to joke that my sister as a kid acted out of spite, and myself out of fright. She sure thinks thats funny. On account of it rhymes. :puke:

Strangely, neither are racists. They are kind to their church brethren, and never hesitate to brag to us about the latest baby being born in the congregation, or whatever else is going on. My mother hasnt called me in literally YEARS. Yet, my father will chew me out for not calling her, if i decide im sufficiently drunk enough to actually call and be sure they arent dead. On one occasion, I called, talked to dad a spell about their grandkids, then ask how mom is. "oh she died'...no kidding. He thinks hes being funny with a touch of meanness being done on purpose.

Apparently, its just us "loser" kids that deserve the'truth' as they see it. They wouldnt even go to my son's wedding because a woman(my sis) officiated.

I enjoy my holidays with my kids, and good friends. That way all is peaceful. Ive decided that my last call to the folks was about four months ago. I havent been to their house since 2003. How very good it feels!

[mirandapriestly]

86. My Inlaws are racist

but they try to hide it in front of us. My daughter had an Italian friend and one of them called him a "wop" in front of her and they have that stupid cartoon on theri fridge of Bill Clinton saying that Foley is a pervert while Clinton is holding a cigar (like sex between consenting adults is equal to emailing underage pages) so they are also ignorant freepers. I fantasize about telling them off, but never do.

I feel for you, though, your own flesh and blood! I would have left too.

[jeffrey_X]

87. Wow...You certainly did the right thing. I applaud you for leaving.

As someone who's white and married to an African Americna woman, I appreciate this very much....there needs to be more of this.

I've cut ties with some of my family, who are racist, and will probably only see them a few more times in my life (funerals and weddings).

[NancyG]

89. k and r nt

[Sapphire Blue]

90. You knew this would happen. Why did you go? Why are you posting their nasty racist comments here?

Why don't you grow a spine, and tell your racist relatives what you think, instead of whining here after the fact, after you stayed there & implied acceptance of their racism?

Why do you feel "obligated to act like family"? Your initial involvement w/them was determined by birth; your continued involvement w/them is your choice. You decide what kind of people you want to be involved with, blood family or not.

And your posting that :puke: word several here times is highly offensive. You'll get no pat on the back from me.

[freeplessinseattle]

91. Am I being insensitive for spelling out the offensive word?

I received a pm from someone who is hesitant to their opinion for fear of inflaming freepers, but wanted me to know that s/he finds the complete spelling out to be inappropiate on a board of this nature.

While I would never intend to intentionally insult anyone, I personally feel the sting drives home the point more, and my black friends I have talked to agree, they said that by softening it with N***** people might feel less outraged, but that is only the opinion of a few people. I'd like to hear from others?

[bliss_eternal]

116. Yes.

It is insensitive.

I for one, appreciate your asking. If your "black friends" aren't members of this board, I don't see that their opinion on this is issue is relevant. Are they members of this board? Are they seeing the context of which the word was used in? ;)As such, is it fair to state that your black friends thought this would be ok? While you didn't bother to ask any black community members--those that would be affected by seeing your post and these words, surrounded by derogatory statements about black people.

If members of this community are saying they don't appreciate seeing your writing out the full word, no less than three times in your post--it's offensive...here.

I appreciate your understanding. :)

[Lost-in-FL]

118. Yes, I find the comments offensive

and hurtful even knowing that your intentions are good. I know you are ashamed for that. I am sorry but you asked for opinions. It is hurtful to find out that people sit down during the holidays to talk such garbage. Posting the comments just add to the pain.

[Sapphire Blue]

120. Yes. You didn't think those racist comments would insult anyone?!?!? You want 'sting'?

Feel this: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2797271

fyi, it wasn't only the word that was offensive; it was your needing to post all of those vile racist comments along w/the word. Imagine, for a moment, that these comments were said about your people, and someone posted them here; how would you feel?

See post #90, too.

Edited to add: If you are so concerned w/outrage, why (asking again) are you whining here instead of taking your supposed outrage & directing it against your relatives, instead of implying acceptance of their racism by even going there in the first place & staying long enough to listen to their racist insults?

What exactly do you want, a 'heckuva job, brownie?' award?

[freeplessinseattle]

128. I'm sorry you are so upset

and obviously I triggered some rage in you, but I think most people here know better than to think I intentionally was trying to hurt anyone or was "whining". venting when feeling very alone and agitated, and admittedly should have asked people here rather than my friends about my wording. It is interesting though that not one person spoke up about feeling offended until I asked, well past the time to edit. well, live and learn.

Now if you could use that outrage I had hoped to elicit towards the real racists that might be more cathartic.

[Sapphire Blue]

131. SEE POST # 90

Don't bother saying you're sorry that I'm upset about your posting vile racist comments; that's a rather empty apology.

Your "real racists" didn't post here; you did. You are the one who chose to post their racism, in all its vile detail, here.

[freeplessinseattle]

133. well, there's nothing I can do then

You will choose to believe what you want based on your own misjudgements. That is a shame but I realize that you must have been hurt very badly by others so will give you the smae leewya as I do my mom.

[Sapphire Blue]

139. Nothing more you can do... what a martyr!

My replies are to you about what you posted; it's a shame that you felt you had to post these comments.

Honey, you don't realize a damn thing about me; save your patronizing attitude for someone else.

And perhaps deal w/those racist relatives of yours.

[Forrest Greene]

140. You're The One Who Chose To Read It

...& then whine about it.

If it offends you, use your page down button.

[Sapphire Blue]

141. Indeed, I did. My mistake; it was disgusting. I should have known better than to click on it.

I've learned from my mistake and won't repeat it.

[Forrest Greene]

143. And Save Your Wit

...for someone who'll be impressed by it.

[Sapphire Blue]

144. I wasn't intending to be witty, nor was I trying to impress you.

[bliss_eternal]

152. freeplessinseattle...

Is this supposed to be an apology?

It's hard to tell, as apologies generally consist of, "I'm sorry for_________(the behavior)____" and perhaps a bit about why, etc. An apology tends to be negated when one defends their behavior in the process of saying they are sorry.

It's ok if you aren't sorry. But one should be clear regarding intent. Just fyi. :)

[Sapphocrat]

123. Well, you're not now.

Since you asked, you obviously got it that yes, it's offensive.

It's not offensive to talk about it, but it's not necessary to keep spelling it out. There are some words so charged, all you'd have to do is mention that someone used a slur against (take your pick) black people, Asian people, gay people, whoever -- and everyone would have a very good idea exactly which word you were talking about.

I am a bit disturbed that you say "but that is only the opinion of a few people". So what? If even one person is offended, then the word is offensive, period. It's not a majority-rules deal; it's a matter of respect and deference, because you don't want to offend anyone... right?

[freeplessinseattle]

126. Thanks for your input

and let me clarify, as you didn't seem to digest the post, the "only teh opinion of a few people" was referring to my friends, which is why I asked the people here. I also wonder why no one expressed offense until I asked??

[Sapphire Blue]

129. I'm left to conclude that you have me on ignore, as I expressed offense in post #90....

... then again in post #120, and you have not acknowledged my posts. I wish someone would forward them to you.

[Sapphocrat]

130. And I ask you...

Why bother to ask a message board full of strangers, when you already got the answer from your friends -- whose opinions, I would expect, carry more weight?

Maybe no one expressed offense until you asked because that wasn't the point of your OP.

[freeplessinseattle]

136. gee, I don't know, why do we bother posting at all?

I really don't know what else to say to calm you down but as long as I know what my intent was and now that I know that some find my post inappropiate that is what matters. I do not know you and you do not know me so I am not going to judge you for your lashing out. If that helps you feel better in some way then that is a good thing.

[bliss_eternal]

151. So....

you ask if your comments are offensive. People answered you. You apparently don't like the answers.

Perhaps you should cease asking questions,if you aren't prepared for what the answers may be.

The people answering the questions really aren't responsible for your reaction (or lack of). That's ultimately on you, freepless.

Frankly, I thought that one that had the courage to ask such a question would be prepared to handle the consequences. I, and the others that mistakenly responded to you were obviously wrong.

[MsKandice01]

147. Maybe I'm just not offended very easily...

But I don't find your post offensive in any way (and I'm black). Had you just said that you left over some racist comments, I know I would've wondered exactly what was said. I'm also one of those people that thinks that referring to it as "the n-word" (in contexts such as these) or "n*****" is just plain silly, just as I think people typing stuff like sh*t or f*ck is silly (unless they're trying to get around some kind of profanity filter). We all know what word was being said, spelling it out doesn't change the context.

[bliss_eternal]

150. I see...

so you speak for all black people. You're not offended, so no one else should be.

Maybe you aren't saying that directly, but by your stating that you are black and are not offended is dismissive of those that are.

Not trying to flame you--just letting you know. It's really not cool to label other's feelings as silly. We are all different.

Is it too much to ask to not undermine one another's efforts and feelings? You of course are entitled to feel however you do about this, and I'm not trying to take that from you. But maybe you could be respectful of those that have stated they do find the word offensive.

Respectfully submitted,
bliss :)

[MsKandice01]

156. I wasn't trying to speak for ALL black people...

To speak for all of us would be to insinuate that we aren't capable of independent thought. In fact, one of my main pet peeves is when people asked me how "black people feel" about any particular issue because we don't all have the same feelings or thoughts about anything. I just thought I would put it in there that I am black so people didn't accuse me of not understanding the issue or being insensitive to other people's cultures.

And by the way, I wasn't dismissing anyone's feelings as silly. I was just saying that in my OWN OPINION, the idea that actually spelling the word out somehow makes it more offensive is silly. People have a right to be offended by it but I personally am not.

[bliss_eternal]

157. Perhaps...

if you re-read what you wrote, you will see how others might see what I did. Maybe not.

You state you are black. Then you go on to say what you find silly and what you aren't offended by. Nothing more.

Again, respectfully submitted but something to think about all the same. Especially when other posters found the courage to say that they have found something offensive, in the context of what was obviously a difficult encounter for the original poster. Maybe your "intent" was not to "dismiss" but your statements could have that affect.

I do however appreciate that in this reply you've allowed for the fact that others may be offended and that ALL black people don't share the same thoughts or feelings. Thank you for that.

[EstimatedProphet]

92. Believe me, I know how you feel

I saw my family in an entirely new light this year.

[Nothing Without Hope]

94. Of course you did the right thing, but you already know that.

We can't make the truth about some people in your family any easier to bear, the worst of it being that on some level you know they will never be any better and you will always be the outsider. But we can remind you that in addition to the family you are born into, there is the family that you make, with people whose affection and companionship nurtures and builds rather than hurts and destroys. For many of us, finding the members of that second, chosen family over the years is one of life's most important challenges, since we are not built to be truly alone.

One of the things I have never gotten over is the guilt from staying away from the poisonous people and the hurtful atmosphere, even though I realize that it's the wise choice for me. They're my family only by blood, not in any other way. But it will always hurt on some level, some times more than others.

[jaksavage]

95. It is not all obvious racism

I still occasionally bump into openly racist people, to whom I correct by saying I am not a racist and won't hang around with them if that is what they want to talk about. It generally shuts them up one at a time.

I recently ceased doing business with a supplier of 6 yrs, because of the racist views the manager expressed to me.

Don't participate.

Your Mom's BF is riding you to keep you away. Dominant male competition stuff.

Small mindedness

My families racism is far more subtle. No words are spoken about skin color. It is all about personal responsability. Some people, they say, just don't want to work as hard as we do... Of course they live in complete segregation and the legacy that got them where they are today is invisable to them. They cruise to Alaska and assure me they didn't kill any whales. They invite me on extravagant vacations which I never have "time" for. Although I have howled about the environment since the mid 80's, they are still in complete denial.
They are the original anglo-saxons.
Lovely, Christian freepers of the worst sort.

My wifes family are the opposite.

[freeplessinseattle]

99. It's some of both

that is how he was long before he met me, and how my grandfather was long before I was born. and he doesn't want to keep me away.

[MockSwede]

98. Relations versus caring relations

You could have checked out after whatever the first comment was, as far asn I'm concerned. Just spend 10 days with mother-in-law at my house. Ten days of her trying to 'stir things up' about various and sundry piddleshit little things - nothing like your 'conversations' with relations, for sure. But, still, God, it reall wears you down. Don't want to rip her a new ahole or rip off her head, but sometimes.... So, f&*^ the holiday and the traditions - they certainly are NOT treating you like good family (respecting your views/attitudes/belief, etc) - save your willpower and eat Chinese takeout with (respectful and considerate)friends!

[wryter2000]

101. You did the right thing

I wouldn't go anywhere near that house. Next year, you should make other plans.

[Critters2]

103. Wow. My family is dysfunctional, but in personal, more mildly annoying ways

At least I grew up in a home where the stuff you quote would NOT have been tolerated.

Thanks for making me appreciate my family more.

But my sister's efforts to outspend everyone on gifts, and in general turn life into a competition, STILL pisses me off.

[GOPFighter]

105. Family or not, those kind of comments should not be tolerated.

There are things most of us won't tolerate, even from family, and the comments you posted cross that line in my opinion. Those comments are so repugnant, so vile that they must be repudiated. People who say things like this have some serious issues (it's obvious the boyfriend's doing it to provoke you). You have every right to tell them you won't tolerate that kind of talk in your presence. You also have every right to tell your mother that unless her boyfriend stops showing what a disturbed ass he is you will only spend time with her alone. (BTW, any man that treats the daughter of his girlfriend like he does you is sending a big red flag to your mother that he lacks respect for her and her family. Also, it sounds like he's trying to get rid of competition for your mother's attention by making it impossible for you to stand being around them as a couple. That's what little insecure boys do.)

Good luck!

[democrank]

106. Good for you, freepless.

Sometimes you just have to take a stand. Glad to see your self-respect won this time.

[WinkyDink]

109. Do what you need to. Friend of "Blood" doesn't mean it's all worthy of your time.

[2bfree]

110. Wow.

And I thought my family was bad. That is just terrible, I am so sorry.

[hedgehog]

111. I always wonder about how some people can make racism a hobby.

Other people talk about cars or gardening or cooking, and all these people talk about is how threatened they are by the other races. I vote with those who said to visit your mother another time. The Christmas season lasts until January 6 with the Feast of Three Kings; visit her sometime before then and have enjoy a peaceful Christmas Day.

[Vinca]

112. Do you stand to inherit or something? Why else would you

even show up to spend a holiday with people like that? Family or not, they're assholes. Sorry.

[depakid]

114. Not only would I have left, I might not have gone in the 1st place

I have someone like that in my family- and I seriously limit my dealings with him. Used to be, I set some ground rules for that type of behavior. They got crossed one too many times, and that was that.

Good for you for being assertive! Perhaps next time around, it won't be that way... although don't count on it. Racists aren't know for high degrees of empathy.

[Mad_Dem_X]

115. I actually think you're brave for leaving

No flames here. I think you did the right thing. You didn't just sit there and let him go on and on without speaking up. :thumbsup:

[Darth_Kitten]

117. That's terrible!!!

You don't have to put up with that shit. If your mother phones you to chew you out, speak your mind.

[SoyCat]

119. It is just that kind of behavior that has kept me away from my husband's family for years. --

Amazingly enough, they have started to behave a lot better. My husband thinks it might be because of my absence. It might have taught them a lesson.

[smoogatz]

121. I grew up around idiots like your Mom's BF

Next year, around the middle of October them you'd like to bring your friend Tyrone to Thanksgiving dinner. Oh, and by the way--Tyrone is black. And 6'4", 240 lbs. Then sit back and watch Mom's BF crap his drawers for a couple of weeks.

[Sapphocrat]

122. Before reading all the replies:

Far be it from me to jump on you for leaving early; my only question is: If "this kind of talk goes on every single time (you) visit," then why do you continue to attend these hatefests in the first place?

Sorry, friend, but the "blood is thicker than water"/"respect one's elders" mindset just doesn't wash with me. Standing on (sound) principle might get you written out of a few wills, or bring the Wrath of Mom down on your head -- but so what? Don't you feel downright crappy for betraying yourself?

I wrote off the repuke assholes in my extended family, and I've been effectively cut off from whatever crumbs they might have tossed my way -- and my mother, bless her ultra-liberal self, is extremely dismayed that I refuse to be in the same city with those idiots, let alone at the same "family" gatherings. Among the top three things that pain me most, hurting my mother is definitely one of them. But there is an absolute limit to what I will tolerate, and what I will not, and I am more than willing to deal with the guilt every bloody holiday.

You don't owe anyone anything, just because you happen to share some of the same DNA. I hope you can learn to shake off the guilt, stop being afraid of making your mom mad, and just stop associating with these racists. You'll feel better.

And if you can't do that, then I hope you learn to bring such "conversation" to a screeching halt.

[freeplessinseattle]

127. geez, you have no clue do ya?

for one thing, my family has nearly nothing to leave me in a will, and it is extremely inappropiate for you to imply that. I am not afraid of my mom's wrath, but of her hurt feelings-if you ahd read any of my replies you would see that it is a pattern of her to let herself be dominated by men and I refuse to adbandon her. Furthermore, my grandparents are in their 80's and won't be around much longer, most especially my grandmother who doesn't understand a heck of a lot of what is going on because of a stroke some years back. I firmly believe that people can change, that is why I spent so much time and money working on a counseling degree (which I am putting off for now bc for one thing, I do have a hard time dealing with mean mental people and have been trying to put my emotions aside. for another, I am impatient and want results sooner than they tend to come)

[Sapphocrat]

132. Oh, calm down.

I wasn't implying you were doing it because you were literally worried about being written out of somebody's will. I guess I have to speak to you without using any hyperbole, figures of speech, analogies, etc.

What I was doing was trying to show you that you don't HAVE to take that kind of shit from anyone, family or not. It actually pained me to see someone else going through the same sort of garbage I've gone through with my own family.

The only way in which I'm clueless is that I never seem to learn to stop giving a damn when I see somebody else hurting. But, believe me, you're helping me to stop.

In the end, whatever your issues, they're yours alone to deal with. Good luck.

[diamidue]

134. Well, "I" understood what you were saying.

And you were right on the money. God bless you for trying.

[freeplessinseattle]

138. Thank you, I'm just guilty of being ignorant,. not mean!

while I considered leaving out the quotes from the delightful evening I wanted to share how truly unbearable and twilight zone like (as one respondent so aptly described) the scene was. In one way I was anticipating being chatised for leaving so I wanted to show why I needed to get the heck out of dodge, for another, people do need to realize that there are plenty of people who still think this way and there is a lot of work to still be done. In that vein, I was hoping for some advice on how to help change their way of thinking or if it is even possible, they seem so far gone. I really felt sick being there and feel even more ill that I myself was causing more harm by sharing so vividly. I should have expected that those who were offended might be unable to separate my intent from the content, so I responded defensively, a vicious cycle indeed.

[pacalo]

148. I don't know if you could change the thinking of your mom's boyfriend,

but I do think you've already thought of a way that may cause your mom to rethink: Excuse yourself, but calmly, every time a racial remark is being made. She'll get the message.

It disgusts me that your mom's boyfriend continues to make these remarks, knowing how you feel about it.

Don't be too hard on those here who feel you have a right to preserve your well-being by staying away from those who abuse your feelings. I felt the same way until I read your post explaining your loyalty to your mom & grandfather. I admire you so much for that, while having the character to distance yourself mentally from their bad habits. You sound like a wonderful person.

[bliss_eternal]

153. That's a matter of opinion.

I feel that your need to relieve yourself the way you did was mean and inconsiderate of your fellow community members.

What's more, some have answered your question and responded that they found what you shared offensive. Instead of accepting what they've said and taking responsibility for it, you seem to be rebuffing them and punishing them for answering your question. I don't understand why you bothered to ask--if you weren't ready and willing to accept that you may get some responses you didn't like.

Calling others names (like mean) seems further "punishment" because you dislike the response you've received.

[freeplessinseattle]

137. well, if you call your posts "helping"

then it is probably more helpful to stop. I have no ill will against you, and while I can respond in kind when being attacked, I do understand that it is a sensitive subject and I hit a nerve, so you responded by trying to hurt me, too. It is ok, I understand, maybe go for a walk, pet your cat or dog, that helps me. and no, I am not being sarcastic, and won't feed into a pointless attack that has nothing to do with either of us individually.

[Forrest Greene]

142. Maybe

"I wasn't implying you were doing it because you were literally worried about being written out of somebody's will. I guess I have to speak to you without using any hyperbole, figures of speech, analogies, etc."

Maybe you ought to learn to write more clearly.

[Generic Brad]

124. I walked out on my relatives over eerily similar circumstances

For me the most unbelievable part is the denial that bigots use to justify their words. You absolutely did the right and honorable thing, and yet you know your mother well enough to strongly suspect she is going to chew you out as if you did something wrong. You did nothing wrong.

Don't give in or apologize. Long term, this can be the hardest thing you may ever do. But if you continue to stand up to your family on this, it will be easier to do the same with people who you are not related to.

[gregflynn]

125. It's all relative

Relatives or not it has been my experience that when some people are under the impression that they are among "friends" their biases start to show as they let their guard down and start making derogatory comments and complaining how the ERA (meaning the Civil Rights Act, not the unratified Equal Rights Amendment thus confirming their ignorance) was the worst thing that ever happened to this country.

[Divine Discontent]

145. low intelligence

I feel for you. this behave comes from fear and ignorance, as you know. we all have some fear of what we don't know, but those with a heart and a brave streak eventually can't take too much of this crap.

good on you!



www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable

[Ilsa]

146. Sometimes leaving like you did is the best thing. They need to know

that you will stand up for what you believe in, and you did -- against their nasty rascism. You did a good thing. MAybe one of the kids around there learned something from it (if there were any there). You never know.

[woodsgirl]

149. I admire your

trying to have a relationship with your mom, even though it is difficult. Can relate to your mom. Don't give up on her. As long as there is life, people can change. I came from a racist, religious background in the south. My children were subjected to all that from their father grandparents aunts and uncles. You know what changed the whole scenario for me? Going to college and leaving my husband after 22 years. The change was slow but it did happen. My older son is 47 and finally met the love of his life. He is white and she is black. He was going to take her to visit his grand mother without warning her about the racism. I did. Felt badly interfering..So they both finally went..out of state. Mercifully, the grand mother had just died. Things have a way of working out....

[donheld]

154. You stuck it out longer than I would have

You did good.

[connecticut yankee]

155. I put my foot down

with my family.

My father was also an intolerable bigot (though not as bad as what you have to endure). I simply told my parents that this behavior was unacceptable. If they wanted me to be with them, they would have to cut out all such talk.

It was more important to my mother to have me with them, so my father stopped.