Help a student teacher out with a dilemma...

[LostInAnomie]

... I have been nominated to lead the high school I am student-teaching at in saying the Pledge of Allegiance and I am not sure what to do. If I agree to say the pledge I will be expected to say the "under God" portion and as an atheist I find that to be offensive.

This is a small school in a religious part of the country and I know If I refuse to say the full pledge it will not go over well at all. I hope to find a job in this community after I graduate but I know if I don't say "under God" there would be little chance of that happening.

I love my community and the school I am teaching at but at the same time I don't want to sell out and do something that I find offensive. What should I do?

[WinkyDink]

1. As a former teacher, I'd advise you to regard it as a bit

of literature to recite, and do so.
Your job is your job, especially if you want one.
Otherwise, you'd be like the pharmacists who want to dispense only those pills they "believe in".

After you get tenure, heck with'em! LOL!

[dufrenne]

4. winky dink is right

at the end of the day, whether you find it offensive or not, it's two words versus a job. I'll put it this way...since you don't believe in hell, you shouldn't worry about going there for saying those two words....lol. ok - bad joke. I say - job is more important. You don't need to become a CNN headline...unless that's what you want ;)

[Canuckistanian]

2. Ask the school board

That's the easy way.

The hard way is to leave it out, but then explain that the original author did not pen the words "under God"

[Reader Rabbit]

3. Who has nominated you?

Is there anyone on your staff with whom you can discuss this? If not the principal, then perhaps a mentor teacher? Explain your dilemma to someone at your school who might understand, and see if an agreement cannot be reached.

Sorry, this is passing the buck, but I don't know what to do. I never say "under God" when we say the pledge at my school, and my students haven't ever noticed!

[LostInAnomie]

11. I've been nominated by my students to say it over the intercom...

... at the beginning of the day. The students in nominate people in the school to say the pledge and whoever gets the most nominations has to do it.

[SharonAnn]

5. Say "Under God". After all, it currently is in the Pledge of Allegiance

You would be altering the Pledge of Allegiance if you dropped a few words. There's no reason for you to be a martyr to something like that.

If you were narrating for a Holiday pageant, you might be asked to to read the Christmas Story. You might be asked to read the Hannukah story. If you were narrating the Passover story you might be asked to read it. That wouldn't mean you personally believe any of them.

[roguevalley]

6. do it. you are just beginning. don't get yourself blackballed before

you start. I taught for 27 years. I said it every day. I didn't agree either but it was a point not worth dueling over.

[Rex]

7. Do yourself a favor and say the full pledge.

Even you call it the full pledge. It is an oath that people say by tradition, you don't have to read any more into it than that.

[Mz Pip]

8. I guess there really

isn't too much of an alternative. You pretty much answered your own question. You want to teach in this district and you know what will be expected of you. I personally never had much of a problem saying the pledge when I was a teacher. I'd been saying it decades and never really gave it much thought.

I guess you have to pick your battles. If you really want to jeopardize your chances of getting a teaching job then take the risk and leave out "under God." But be prepared for the backlash. IT's kind of like civil disobedience. If you engage in it you can't really be too surprised if you get busted.

Good luck.

Mz Pip
:dem:

[W_HAMILTON]

9. Maybe I don't understand the problem...

What do you mean you are nominated to lead the school? Do you have to recite it over a loud speaker that goes into all the classes? Or do you mean you just have to recite it for your own class?

Back when I was in elementary school or so, our teachers would just begin the the pledge for us, and then the students reciting it would pretty much drowned her out, so it's not like anyone could make out what anyone said. Heck, most of the time I just mouthed the words anyway, instead of actually speaking them out loud. Also, back then (of course, it was only .... maybe 15 years ago or so), it was pretty much customary to skip over the "under God" part anyway. We'd just say, "one nation ... <pause> ... indivisible..."

I'm sure you could get around the problem, unless it's something where you have to lead the entire school over the loud speaker or something.

[LostInAnomie]

14. Yeah, I have to say it over the school intercom.

No way to get around it.

[John Grevstad]

10. Don't take the sword for this one

I don't know if it is all that important especially if you are in a religious part of the country.
Kids say the Pledge every day which means that it means nothing. I teach and when we recite it, I say it, but I am just mumbling incoherently, thinking about how ridiculous it is.

Also, you should move to a non-religious part of the country. We're fun. The Religious Right doesn't even impact our lives where we live. They try, but they fail. They are outnumbered by all of us heathens.

[Caoimhe]

12. I agree with everyone but it still pisses me off when

I have to conform with the Reichwing. It's like blackmail. Fear is what keeps people from speaking up. Needing our jobs is what keeps us from speaking up. It's why sexual harassment in the workplace goes unreported, why molestations go unreported.. many things. Sometimes it's easier to just go with the flow than to make yourself a target by exposing the ridiculousness (and hypocrisy) of the Reichwing. I feel for you. I've had similar dilemmas. My work puts an ad in the local newspapers "area guide" every year when it comes out, and it says this gobbledy gook about our product being "god's gift". I've wanted to say it's offensive, as we are a public utility, but I also think I am the only one who even notices, and it's not worth fighting or losing my job over. Sad.

[Carni]

13. I think I would develop bronchitis

Or SOMETHING...

[politicat]

15. Are you going to be amplified or do you just start them all out?

If you're saying it over a PA system, that's different than saying it with a microphone (when you should ask the tech who is running the board to cut the mike temporarily after everyone's saying it (basically at Of the United States of America), otherwise you'll get feedback or static) or not being amplified at all.

If you're not amplified at all, then no one is going to hear you if drop the under god or substitute Under law. For that matter, you could slur under law over a PA or miked system and most people would never hear it.

Now, if you have a philosophical objection to the pledge itself (which, I, as an atheist, have - I could care less about the ceremonial deism but I despise the practice of forced jingoism to a symbol) you respectfully decline on that basis. Lots of very conservative christian groups have this objection.

[Swamp Rat]

16. Say it, but cross your fingers behind your back.

:D

[sandnsea]

17. Add a quote of the day

Shows initiative and creativity. Don't start with anything controversial, just some good Jefferson and Lincoln and FDR. Work up to some Chomsky. Hehe. Good luck and everyone has to do something they don't like.

[thinkingwoman]

18. you're a student teacher, right?

Which means this is a temporary school/work assignment (a year or so), right?

If I'm remembering correctly, student teaching is done before you receive your degree, so technically this makes you a student, as well as an employee.

You should have the right, therefore, not to say it.

But I ask you, is this a fight you want to wage right now?

Only you can answer that question. I don't know if you have children or not, but one thing I learned when my kids were small was to "pick my battles." My grandparents were the ones who really taught me this concept, and, frankly, for a lot of years I thought they were crazy. Now that I'm older, I do pick and choose which battles to wage and which to ignore.

In your shoes, although I do find the insertion of the words "Under God" offensive (I'm pagan), I would probably lead the pledge and get it over with, although, following the lead of something posted on this site years ago, I would probably switch "under God" to "under Guard" because it makes me giggle but isn't easily detected by others when I mumble.

In the end, you must do what you think is best for you. If you feel uncomfortable to the point that you feel you must make a stand, do so, and hold your ground.

Good luck.

[alcuno]

19. I'm a teacher and rarely think about it.

You are not saying that you believe in God, you are simply reciting some words strung together.

Now, if the pledge is ever made mandatory for teachers, I'm not saying it on principle. But since it's not mandatory, no problem.

[Lars39]

20. You *could* not say it, but explain that you firmly believe in

separation of church and state, and that it protects the church as much as it does the state.
I don't know if it would be wise to tell anyone that you are an atheist, though.

[JuniperLea]

21. I vote the literature mode

If you don't believe in God, then saying "God" shouldn't hurt much. I mean, if you only believed in Buddha and you were forced to say Allah, that might be different.

I'm just saying. I could be wrong. I don't know you.


Still, without dissecting the history of this little piece of literature, it has the word in it. Call me Ishmael.

[ingac70]

22. Pass. Don't say it.

Tell them to find someone else.

[OffWithTheirHeads]

23. I agree

If you think it's bullshit, as do I, just pass. Let some sheeple mouth the words. Stand by your beliefs and don't let the pigs compromise you.

[applegrove]

24. Right. If you don't happen to be religious - regard it as fiction.

Agnostics don't have problem with concept of "a god". So - seeing as how you don't believe - it should be a breeze to go ahead and say it.

Especially since you likely teach history without mentioning the genocide against indians - until the kids are in grade 4 at least.

At this time in their lives - kids should have the whole world opened to them - including the religious teachings of their families. The kids tend to make the decision for themselves when they are young adults and late teens.

For those who it really means something too - it will enliven their lives to believe their country is under god.

And for the rest of the world - we hope America is under the rule of something else too.