Hysterectomy: An 8 BILLION dollar a year "industry"

[SoCalDem]

If you have not seen this yet, please try to catch it. This is a fantastic documentary, and even if you are a guy, you probably have a Mom or a wife.. Women have been conned into having hysterectomies for AGES, and in most cases it's not necessary, and is even dangerous.


http://rcsf.ca/hot/news/archive.html

What's Hot - Women's Health News and Issues Archives
... SEX, LIES & SECRECY: Assessing Hysterectomy Telecast - Thursday, September 16, 2004,
7 PM EST) This is an extraordinary modern day story of women being ...
rcsf.ca/hot/news/archive.html - 101k - Supplemental Result - Cached - Similar pages





Replaying on FSTV..set your tivo :)

9:00 am 02/02

Sex, Lies and Secrecy: Assessing Hysterectomy TVPG
This is an extraordinary modern day story of women being experimented on, mutilated and irrevocably changed through unnecessary hysterectomies.

[bliss_eternal]

1. I'll watch--I've been outraged by the frequency of this

for many years now.

Thank you for letting us know! :hi:

[NVMojo]

2. they want to keep us from yanking anything out of it so they can yank it

OUT!

[HysteryDiagnosis]

3. Same goes for many heart surgeries... (bypass) 10 billion a

year industry that should probably be perhaps 1 billion if that.

[pitohui]

10. sheesh

since bypass surgery has saved the life of both of my parents and not getting bypass surgery killed a couple of my friends who were only in their 50s then i am got to conclude that we don't do enough bypass surgery

too often younger men don't get screened even if they have the $$$ and insurance as my two friends did

we need more awareness of heart disease, not less awareness, all women over 60 no matter how slim and active and nonsmoking, all men over 50, get screened, be aware, i almost lost my mother over this, a fit slim nonsmoker who doctors just assumed couldn't possibly have heart disease -- and she almost died as a result

i am not talking abt something that happened way back in the 20th century either!

if you don't want bypass surgery, don't get it, but i think you're going to find that much of it is actually on an emergency basis and it's get the bypass or die, both of my parents fell in that category, as i think many people who take care of themselves will, because they just don't know there is a problem if they're slim and active until it's too late or almost too late

don't for the love of god try to discourage this life-saving surgery, insurers will be happy to jump on any reason to take it away because it costs $$$

[HysteryDiagnosis]

17. Bypass surgery is equivalent to removing someone's lungs when

they have pneumonia.

http://www.heartprotect.com/about.shtml
For the past 22 years The Noninvasive Heart Center of San Diego has been protecting patients with coronary artery disease from unnecessary bypass surgery and angioplasty. Approximately 3000 patients undergo these procedures every day. Rarely is the patient told that he or she has other options for diagnosis and treatment, that medical treatment with drugs is highly effective, and that invasive, interventional treatment is only of temporary benefit. Nor is the patient told that such treatment is often worse than their disease, is associated with high incidence of complications, does not prevent heart attacks, heart failure or premature death, does not relieve the patient of the need to take medication post operatively, and has become popular merely because the doctor makes a great deal of money by recommending invasive treatment.

Even worse, the patient is led to believe that unless he or she undergoes immediate angiograms followed by angioplasty or bypass surgery, they will have a massive heart attack and die! Such scare tactics by these medical terrorists are widely utilized in order to frighten the patient into agreeing to have these procedures. The patient is never told that surgery is more for the benefit of the doctor than the patient, and that the cardiologist has a quota to fill in order to maintain his skills and hospital privileges!

The Noninvasive Heart Center has been diagnosing and treating patients with coronary artery disease medically for over 30 years. Early diagnosis is the cornerstone of treatment and can be accomplished with a variety of noninvasive tests which Dr. Wayne describes in his books (see below). Medication, when the proper drugs are given, and in the right amount, is almost 100% effective in minimizing or relieving symptoms. More importantly, experience has shown that medication will usually slow down or prevent the long term complications of coronary artery disease such as heart attacks, congestive failure, and premature death.

Not only is noninvasive diagnosis highly successful in detecting coronary artery disease, but the tests used will often uncover other conditions such as hypertension (high blood pressure), that will produce chest pain that is very similar to coronary artery disease. Typically, hypertension will remain hidden for years with a seemingly normal pressure at rest, but becomes transiently elevated during stress, and is often accompanied by chest pain. These patients are usually made to undergo angioplasty or surgery when all they really need are blood pressure pills.

[Name removed]

18. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[HysteryDiagnosis]

20. Don't believe in it..... never will. You body knows how to fail, it

also knows how to heal. Cholesterol plaque doesn't require a knife to remove it.


Carrington receives patent

Irving-based Carrington Laboratories Inc. (Nasdaq: CARN) has been granted a patent by the European Union for the use of its proprietary complex carbohydrates (acetylated mannans) in lowering and regulating cholesterol levels and removing plaque from blood vessels. Raw materials protected by this patent are "products by process" obtained from the inner leaf gel of the Aloe Vera L. plant. Manapol(R) powder, the company's lead nutraceutical raw material, is a "product by process" covered by this patent.

Then there is L-Arginine, coenzyme Q10, Pycnogenol, Omega Threes, and several other items that affect circulatory health in a positive manner, however if it is knives you want to play with, play through.

[sinkingfeeling]

4. Sure there are unnecessary hysterectomies. I finally found a

female surgeon and had my at age 39! Greatest thing since sliced bread to me!

[pitohui]

6. same for someone close to me

made all the difference in her energy and quality of life

god's a piss-poor engineer and nature planned for us to be grandmothers and dead at age 45, menopause is not a natural process and is not something most women would have lived long enough to experience in pre-historical times, so i think we have to be real, evolution shapes our dna to make us strong for child-bearing and rearing but then it don't care and is happy to toss us away

rather than just giving up and growing old too soon i'm going to take advantage of the technology we have

ob/gyn don't recommend surgery for the fun of it, their insurance rates are amazing as it is, i have a great ob/gyn who is working w. me to see if i can have a natural rather than a surgical menopause but if it don't work i should be damn glad to have the surgical option

[Catshrink]

9. Same for me...

I am a totally different person. I had no idea how much pain I went through until it was gone. I just lived with cramps, headaches, crankiness. Now it's gone. I had a fibroid that was intertwined with other organs. Best thing that ever happened to me physically.

[pitohui]

11. uterine fibroids are insanely common

men have no idea nor do younger women

[Stephanie]

22. my dr told me very little research is done because it's only women

I found an amazing doctor who did laser myomectomy - hysterectomy is so common because many doctors are too lazy or unskilled.

[foreverdem]

13. I had mine last summer

I live a completely different life now. I had six fibroids, and lived with excrutiating cramps, nausea and headache for many years. For me, this was the only real option. My gyno (a woman) went through every procedure available to me, the pro's and con's and what was involved in each. But for me, the surgery was the only long term solution.

[bliss_eternal]

21. Catshrink--

may I ask what was going on with you prior to the procedure--and how it improved after?

[knitter4democracy]

15. Not all surgeries are bad.

Not all medicine is bad, either. Yes, it's a business, but there's a lot of good out there. My hubby's an internist, and he's seen both good and bad.

I'm hoping my surgery won't end up being a hysterectomy, but if it does, I trust the specialist to know what he's doing. I won't be looking down the scope with him, so I won't know for sure if he absolutely made the right decision, but I trust him to know what he's doing. I did my research, found a specialist worth the trip and trust, and I'm leaving it in his hands.

[bliss_eternal]

19. This is rather personal of me--

and I do apologize for that, but I'm wondering if you wouldn't mind sharing why you got a hysterectomy at 39? What was going on and what did it improve for you?

I ask as several women in my family had them fairly young as well...

[sendero]

5. ANY surgery....

... should not be taken lightly. Just because a "doctor" says that surgery is the best solution, DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH. There is now this thing called the INTERNET(s), you can go online and search through all kinds of medical studies and anecdotal information.

Health care is a business. Anyone who hasn't noticed that one hand scratches the other and that not every recommended procedure will actually benefit you is not paying attention.

Get a second opinion at the very least. But even better - learn about your condition and think for yourself!

[pitohui]

8. next time i'm in the middle of a heart attack

i'll be sure and get on the internet and do my research first

:-)

seriously, not to be mean, but we can't go thru life assuming that every doctor is a fraud and that a few minutes of research on internet is a replacement for decades of study and experience as a doctor

when you are ill or injured, you don't necessarily have time to do your own research, and when you do have the time, a lot of what is aimed at the public is absolute garbage meant to sell you worthless supplements or questionable fad diets

anyway, there is no diet or supplement that can do what a hysterectomy does when it comes to removing uterine fibroids, even the internet even pop culture even witchcraft have admitted that this one area where nothing non-medical (diet, exercise, etc.) has the slightest bit of effect

[sendero]

12. There is the acute..

... situation, I'm not talking about that. 90% of medical care is not in acute mode.

It's not just a matter of trust, it is a matter of competence. Not all doctors are really all that good, just like every profession there are some who aren't. And since they tend to protect each other, the bad ones just go on practicing. Most doctors are good and provide the best medicine they can. But how do you know if your doctor has made a bad diagnosis, or is recommending an extreme treatment that is not justified. Unless you do some research of your own, you don't.

When I talk about research, I'm not talking about vitamin/supplement based cures. I agree with you, most of them are just someone trying to sell something.

I realize my outlook sounds cynical. Trust me, it is based on hard experience. My wife has a lot of health problems (she will be on the kidney transplant list soon) and I could tell you some stories. Medicine is a business. And frankly, it is an out-of-control business that the country will eventually have to do something about.

[knitter4democracy]

14. You have to be your own advocate.

In my case, I had to ask the doctor for surgery, as none of the medical options have been working, which pretty much only leaves surgery. I've done lots of research, as has my internist hubby, and we both came to that conclusion. My specialist agreed that our argument made sense, and I'm getting surgery March 1st.

There are bad doctors, yes, too damn many, if you ask me. They are usually known within the medical community, so asking a unit or floor nurse her opinion on a doctor is a good place to start. Find out where the doctors send their spouses, and you have your answer.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

7. I'd be interested to see if they make the delineation between

"full" and "partial".

For years now, they have been doing full hysterectomies for things like endemetriosis, and it's completely unnecessary.

[gkhouston]

25. agreed. And I suspect that many hysterectomies are done

when a myomectomy would suffice. If my fibroids get to the point where they're intolerable, I'm going to pull out all the stops to get a myomectomy rather than a hysterectomy; I get migraine headaches and surgical menopause would probably make them much worse.

[foreverdem]

35. That doesn't always work

I had a myomectomy a few years back, only to find that in place of the one fibroid they took out six grew back and I ended up having a hysterectomy (I kept my ovaries, thus I will not go into menopause until later in life). My dr told me that there is about a 60% chance that if you have fibroids removed, they will eventually grow back. I am not saying that this is the case every time, but it's a very real possibility.

[gkhouston]

37. true. OTOH, keeping your ovaries doesn't mean they'll keep

functioning. Both of my sisters had "female" surgery 10 years ago. One had a hysterectomy, the other, a myomectomy. The sister who had a hysterectomy experienced ovarian failure within a year of the surgery even though she kept her ovaries. The other, five years her senior, is now in her early fifties, has not yet reached menopause, and hasn't had any more problems with fibroids. Seems like no matter what you do, maybe it'll work for you and maybe it won't. It's enough to make you :crazy:.

[raccoon]

16. Some women really need it, but I'm sure there are a great many

done in the US that aren't necessary.

Too many doctors think if a woman's not going to be having any more children, might as well take it all out.

Surgeries don't always go well as expected. Sometimes a person ends up with a problem they didn't have to begin with.

[Ksec]

23. So what did they do way back?

They seemed fine. Of course I didnt live back in the old days , but I dont remember ever reading that women had so many female problems as they do today (which tells me theres a lot of unnecessary stuff goin on.

[gkhouston]

26. They had pain, I guess.

Maybe that's what laudanum was really for. :shrug:

[Maine-ah]

34. I would say that there are more of us that are willing to talk

about "female problems". Many women wouldn't talk to their doc's about their problems, talking about your menstrual cycle was as taboo as sex. It also didn't help that most doc's were men. A good friend of mine was having all sorts of abdominal pain, and her doc (a male) kept telling her it was "all in her head". She decided to finally get a second opinion from a female doc and she had a cyst and endometriosis. Woke up one night drenched in blood from knees to chest. Scared the hell out of her.

Personally, right now, I would mind getting everything ripped out of me, the pain is unbearable. All of the women in my family started going through meno at 34/35 years of age. I am now 31, and have some major symptoms of this.

I'm sure there is some unnecessary "stuff" going on, but I think with all the info that we have today, that we didn't have then, is why we're hearing more about it.

[foreverdem]

36. It's all in your head

They were told it was all in their heads, go home, take some aspirin and try to get something to occupy your time so you don't dream up all these symptoms.

[we can do it]

24. I Lost My Mom Because of These Greedy Bastards

[FM Arouet666]

27. Unnecessary hysterectomies?

I will probably be jumped on, go for it.

I am not an OB-GYN, but I am a surgeon. My experience with the field of OB suggests that most docs will try to avoid hysterectomy but have a very low threshold for doing one if there is any risk. Why? How about 150k to 200k a year in malpractice insurance. That is money you have to earn on top of all the money you have to earn to pay overhead, rent, employee pay, office equipment etc. Real lucrative money making process run by greedy OBs? Hogwash.

If a kid has any ailment, regardless of the mother's actions during pregnancy or if the ailment has been shown to be unrelated to birth, cerebral palsy for example, the doc can be sued. Mom drinks a pint a day, smokes like a chimney and the kid looks like a squash, sue the evil doc. The field of OB is under attack, my town has ZERO high risk pregnancy obstetricians. If you are high risk, you go to another city. The insurance is too high. Hand surgery and trauma surgery are hanging by a thread, the docs almost lost insurance coverage last year. Injure your hand in a car accident. Oops, your shit out of luck, hope you get to a specialist in time to save your piano playing.

You want to cut down on unnecessary procedures, cut down on unnecessary lawsuits. My own experience forces me to order loads of tests, studies etc that are probably not needed, but I have to constantly think "how will this look in court if I don't work it up completely." However, to be fair, lawsuits are only part of the problem. And despite what the trial lawyers say, it is a big problem. Insurance reform is also needed. I have seen docs absolutely screwed by insurance companies when a lawsuit is brought, regardless of the fact that the suit was subsequently tossed.

If you think for a minute that the evil OBs are doing these procedures out of laziness, out of greed, lacking compassion for the patient, my experience suggests that you are way off the mark.

[sandnsea]

28. Ahem

"I have seen docs absolutely screwed by insurance companies when a lawsuit is brought, regardless of the fact that the suit was subsequently tossed."

Yes.

And changing the law so people can get all their records so if they have any questions they don't have to sue, also increasing your malpractice rates.

From the patient's end, it's next to impossible to sue a doctor. I know far more people who got lousy diagnoses and treatment than got malpractice settlements. In fact, I've never known anybody who got a malpractice settlement. It just isn't that easy to go from reasonable mistake to negligent malpractice.

[FM Arouet666]

30. Next to impossible to sue a doctor?

Where do you live, Mars? You can sue for anything, the doc looked at you wrong, you didn't like his cologne, sue sue sue. Just about every doc in my town has been sued, most for nonsense. Reasonable mistake to negligent malpractice? Clearly you are not a trial lawyer. From a surgical perspective, if you have a procedure and things do not go as expected there may have been no mistake. You take risks, outcomes from surgery are not predicted based on a mathematical equation. Sometimes the procedure was done perfectly, and the patient does poorly. Who is to blame? If you go to a lawyer, it is the docs fault. Who cares if that is the truth, lawyers are in the business of lawsuits, the truth is of little concern.

I could type all night long about suits that have no merit yet were bought by lawyers. The doc is screwed by the insurance company, the lawyer takes a hefty fee, the patient had a bad outcome, but a wrong was not committed.

As for the reasonable mistake, yes they occur and I have made them, I am not god, how should the system deal with them? The legal system benefits the trial lawyers not the patient, the insurance companies are free to exploit the doc, the doc suffers.

A system has to be created that protects a patient's right to redress serious harm at the hands of a negligent physician, but the system must also protect the doc from ridiculous lawsuits, and the insurance industry must be regulated, both in the area of malpractice and in physician reimbursement.

Tort reform and insurance reform with an unhampered means for those seriously hurt to seek compensation.

[sandnsea]

31. Next to impossible

Husband misdiagnosed and given so many varieties of medications that he ended up overdosed in the hospital.

Son with a big patch out of his head because of the fetal monitor.

Another son with his two front teeth crooked because the dentist said there'd be no problem with them after he fell on a table and knocked them both out before the new ones were even developed to come in.

A misdiagnosis of a "tummy ache" when a young man had ripped the inside of his stomach lining.

My son again, some supposed back deformity when he had a herniated disc.

An 80 year old woman who fell on her face at the hospital and blackened the entire left side of her face, was NOT admitted for observation, and had headaches and hearing loss afterwards.

My son again, as a baby, ER missed heart failure and he almost died.

Another friend, ER missed his heart problems twice, with EKG's, and he almost died.

You want to talk about stories? We can all tell you story after story after story of near-misses with doctors and no malpractice suits. It is NOT easy to sue.

I can also tell you the lawyers stories because I worked for lawyers. A doctor who missed some sort of uterine infection and left a woman in agonizing pain for months. Turns out he had other lawsuits against him, and had in the previous two states he had practiced in too. A drunk doctor, who everybody knew was a drunk, who botched a delivery. Most lawyers do not take frivilous law suits. There are no greater number of bad lawyers than there are bad doctors. It would be great if we could put them all on the same island and let them practice against each other.

[FM Arouet666]

32. BULLSHIT

Most lawyers take any damn suit that comes their way. I know, I worked for a two different lawyers in high school and college.

You want to go the route of emotional case history. Very one sided. Based on your account malpractice is rampant.

Husband misdiagnosed? By what measure do you establish this fact? Doctors are not god, misdiagnosis does not always translate into error on the part of the doctor. When faced with a difficult diagnosis a doc may be guided in the wrong direction, medicine is an art, not a science.

Patch out of his head for the fetal monitor. But I guess you wouldn't sue if the kid had a complication because the monitor wasn't placed?

Did you think that the new teeth came in crooked because that is how they developed? How do you know that the act of knocking out premature teeth caused his mature teeth to come in crooked? Sorry, didn't catch your dentistry credentials.

Tummy ache vs ripped the inside lining out of the stomach? What do you mean, he had gastritis? Lets see, he came into the ER with a tummy ache and received some antacids and pepcid, didn't work, the doc was wrong about the tummy ache. Later a GI doc performed an EGD and saw gastritis. Oops, never mind that the majority of patients that the ED doc sees don't need an EGD, he is now at fault for not immediately diagnosing the patient with gastritis.

Your children seem to have a lot of ailments.

80 year old women hit her face? Not admitted, oh my god what incompetence. What is the incidence of hearing loss and headache after a fall? How would admitting her have changed this? Sitting in the hospital bed eating hospital food, she would have been free from these terrible symptoms.

Again, your kids seem to have many ailments. Heart failure in a new born, a rare occurrence. What was the final determination?

Heart problems with a NORMAL EKG, oh shit the ED doc didn't have on his mind reading hat. On the other hand, perhaps the EKG was abnormal and the doc missed a serious problem. Errors occur, and the ED is on the front lines, but I disagree with you about lawsuits. Any one of the above could have lead to a lawsuit.

In fact if you want, you could sue me for posting such a heinous response.

See you in court.............

[sandnsea]

33. Thank you so much

You just proved my point. People have to live with bad medicine all the time. These weren't all family members, btw, perhaps you missed that. Even if they were, congenital heart condition, two teeth knocked out and torn stomach lining is "a lot of ailments"??? Wow. Charming bedside manner there. Oh yeah, you're a surgeon, I forgot. A surgeon had to deliver my first born because the OB doc miscalculated the delivery times. He was NOT happy. My stitches got infected and dissolved before my episiotomy healed too. Laid wide open for about ten days. Joy. Did not sue.

At what point does any one of these misdiagnoses, or otherwise not taking normal medical precautions, become malpractice to you? At death?

Not easy to sue a doctor. Just not.

[FM Arouet666]

38. Sorry to not live up to your estimations

Again medicine is an art not a science, things do not always go as expected. Perhaps I was a bit confrontational. Yes, nice shot at surgeons, and yes, for the most part, it is deserved.

I wonder, your posts include a number of issues which raise questions in my mind.

The OB doc miscalculated delivery times? How so, delivery times are estimated, there is no formula that says on this day at this time the kid will be born. Perhaps the OB estimated the time, and reality was something different. Was the OB in error? As for the surgeon delivering the child, where do you live? I would never deliver a child, except in remarkable circumstances, I have not done so since residency.

Stitches got infected and dissolved before the episiotomy healed? Stitches are not typically the source of infection for an episiotomy. The incision is in an area which is notorious for getting infected, how is the doc responsible for your infection? I tell patients that wound infections are common with colon surgery, especially emergent colon surgery. If the wound gets infected despite every prophylactic effort on my part how is that my fault? Taking normal medical precautions, what are these in your mind?

Perhaps your anger is directed out of a lack of communication with your doctor. When complications occur I try to explain why they occur, understanding is the key to avoiding the anger you hold toward the medical profession. I know a few docs in town which could generate the same anger you hold if I was forced to be under their care.

You did not sue, but others in the same situation might, and the legal profession makes the process very easy. Your doctor, despite what s/he might think, is not god, and if s/he presents such an image you should seek a professional which explains procedures and possible complications more clearly.

[Zinfandel]

29. First knows this...

[BlueIris]

39. Thanks, hormones! Thanks, assholes! Thanks, misogyny!

Thanks, anti-choice, pig-fucking, ignorant so-called health"care" professionals. Thanks, environmental contamination!

AND THANKS TO ALL WHO KNOW GODDAMN WELL THIS SHIT HAS BEEN GOING ON AND DON'T GIVE A RAT'S ASS (which is why it continues). Fellas? I'm looking at you.

I'm glad it doesn't appear that this travesty is really news to that many people here. Been happening for decades, ruining women's lives.