What Democrats need to do to win: Go to church

[yurbud]

Preferably the biggest fundamentalist or charismatic church nearby.


NOT to pander or appear pious, but to listen to HOW the preacher talks to his flock.



The fundamental mistake Democrats make is being inoffensive. You simply can't hold people's attention with bland platitudes.

The DLC obviously lusts for peeling off some of the religious right base. Well, if they want to do that, they should go to an evangelical or charismatic church and see how a pastor talks to his flock. He doesn't speak like a college professor, insurance salesman, or accountant--he talks like it's a matter of life or death. He pounds the podium, throws down the guantlet, and makes sure he has your attention.

Most people don't hear the words, they hear the music of what you say. Howard Dean at least sounded sincere, and looked irritated when others lied, and actually called them on it. Bill Clinton connected with the people because he at least seemed sincere when he spoke even though the content was essentially the same as the current DLCs.

Most of the other guys sound like they are trying to sell mutual funds a at a retirement home. When you hear this dull, inoffensive, contentless approach, people simply switch the channel without giving them a chance.

[sable302]

1. That's why I like Obama

He sounds like a preacher, but says things that actually make sense.

[alfred e bush]

2. u got it

the bully pulpit...the rethugs learned well from the fundy preachers

[KyuzoGator]

3. Better still, watch video of Martin Luther King, Jr.'s speeches.

I always have thought of MLK as the antithesis of Adolf Hitler...both were able to captivate and inspire audiences with their incredible speaking power, but one used it for good and the other for evil.

[yurbud]

29. I assign a paper on war propaganda with choice of Hitler, Bush or FDR

The funny thing is, they all use the same methods, it's just a matter of how far the truth was from what they said. Even FDR shaded the facts a bit, saying the nazis would take over South America and threaten us directly. There was a fascist threat, but it was from within, just like the communist threat. FDR was correctly worried that if fascism succeeded, the wealthy would want to imitate it here. It failed, but they are still trying to imitate it anyway. That was our fear of communism too, not that Russian or Chinese soldiers would invade, but that Americans or citizens of our allies countries would think it looked attractive.

[Nikki Stone 1]

4. This is actually a good idea.

Recommend.

[bluestateguy]

5. I agree

though our challenge is that about 20% of our party's base is atheist, agnostic and/or hostile to religion all together. Doing what you said, will piss these people off.

What I'd like to see would be for Democrats to start using evangelical appeals and religious rhetoric linked to a liberal issue agenda and liberal issue positions. MLK did that with civil rights.

[CornField]

6. Sure... fire & brimstone speaking... that's why they vote for Bush

Not buying it.

[Luke21]

11. Bush ain't faire and brimstone

The guy couldn't pronounce either word correctly. And I doubt he could communicate his middle name.

[guruoo]

18. Bush is the designated 'good cop' in the GOP's game

[yurbud]

30. He is more of a smug scold--like an oily car salesman

[Yollam]

7. *IF* they are Christian.

I would not do democrats any good in a church, since I think religion is destructive to the mind. I want no part of it, except to maybe liberate people from it's shackles.

Still think we should all go?

[meganmonkey]

9. You may want to reread the post

past the thread title.

Peace.

[Yollam]

12. I get where you're coming from.

But I hated church the two times I went there as a kid, and I found the pastor's dronings to be unbelievably boring.

Martin Luther King, sure he could talk, but most of these guys are not worth emulating.

I just don't think I could endure an hour in such a hellish place.

[meganmonkey]

I feel the same way about church

My parents never took me there, but I went with friends once in a while to check it out. It never appealed to me. But I can see the poster's point, to an extent - there is a real passion missing from our politics, and I believe that the desire to do what is Good and right does come from a spiritual place, in a certain way.

[flashdebadge]

22. I think it's a good idea...

Remember that according to statistics, about 90% of the US population believe in God. Of that 90% about 80% claim to subscribe to Christianity. If the perceived image of the democratic party is one of being hostile toward faith then were in trouble. It's no secret that the repugs think that we are hostile toward it, but if the undecided voter thinks that too than were in deep trouble. If we don't define our party then the repugs will. Over the past few years and with some success, they have defined our party. Although this country as a whole does not really exhibit what I believe are true "christian" values, to be to vocal in opposition of those values is like being against baseball and grandma's apple pie to the undecided swing voter. my 2 cents.

[yurbud]

31. I strictly meant to learn their rhetorical tricks and cadence

[BlueEyedSon]

8. The instant I hear that "preacher-voice", I assume the message is BS.

[Southsideirish]

19. I turn the dial or press the remote so fast I get a blister! n/t

[flashdebadge]

24. I don't like that "rhythmic" preacher voice either. Drives me bananas! ..

I go to church most Sundays but when we were looking for a church, we avoided those with this style of delivery. I don't want to be shouted at first thing on Sunday morning. It's like watching a used car commercial live! Our pastor comes out, sits on a stool delivers the message in a calm thoughtful manner. No Shouting, sweating or mouth wiping is necessary.

[donco6]

27. Passion is one thing - "preacher voice" makes me crazy.

Especially when they repeat the same stupid phrase over and over and OVER.

Can you reach god through pray-y-y-ah?

AMENAMEND

I said, Canuh youuh REACH GAWD through PRAY-UH!?

AMENAMENAMEN

CAN ANYBODY REACH GAWD THROUGH PRAY-UH?

And then the Doors start playing.

[yurbud]

34. I agree when I used to go to church, if the pastor started to yell...

It was always time for me to go to the bathroom and not come back.

Smart people resent the preacher voice, but stupid people see it as a sign of sincerity and authority.

Smart people want to be talked to as a peer, stupid want to be talked down to.

Smart people want to be asked a question, the stupid want to be told the answer.

Smart people think some things are so obvious they go without saying. Stupid people like to hear the obvious over and over again.

And so on.

The classic example of this was the OJ trial closing arguments. The prosecutor sat on the edge of his table and said sorrowfully, "I'm sorry we have to be here. Like a lot of you, I admired this man as an athlete and a public figure, but he has broken the law..." Johnny Cochrane did not nuance his message at all. He shouted "Stop this cover up! If it does not fit, you must acquit!" He also made a caricature of the other side--they were a bunch of racist cops trying to frame a successful black man. If the only thing you saw or heard of the trial was his performance, you'd be certain OJ was falsely accused without a shred of evidence.

[Luke21]

10. I dunno about more emotion being needed

Conservative people use the left side of their brain to process information. So that means more emotion laden content often won't work. Any political movement has to engage and convert others.

Dr. King had it all. But there was a grand message behind what he said. And there was a great mission to be embarked on. Listen to the speeches of John and Bobby Kennedy, not ferocious, just good. Challenging..melodic...beautiful. FDR and Bill Clinton and even Ronald Reagan did the same thing. It was style, not ferocity, but a good message has to be part and parcel of what is said.

I'm not at all sure sitting through some of those church services will do anything but make you run away...fast.

[seabeyond]

13. i was in a private funding school with boys for 6 years

i watched and listened to how the fundies did all htis. i was the one amongst many. i continually, as did boys, challenge them to declare i and family were NOT good christians. they could not. ever. but i agree, it is a phenomonon. that is why i say, these people that believe their leaders are told, jesus will look at 2004 election and decide if you go to heaven or hell..... is pretty strong in belief of salvation. i mean, heaven or hell. these people believe. and their choice is heaven or hell. from men they follow, like sheep. i know this sheep thing, was expected of me, lo llol. again not that i was ever challenge since i never do sheep

[fujiyama]

14. Interesting idea

I remember reading a great aarticle by Brad Carson in the New Republic aftere he lost his Senaate race in OK. He said that he once wennt to a church and he heard tthe sermon basically urging the people to vote their beliefs - ie it was mostly about abortion and gaay marriage.

It's near impossible to make much heaedway witht fundamentalist fanatics. They don't want to reeason in any way. And Tom Coburn was aabso fuckin luteely nuts, and he still won over a very conservativee Democrat.

[radio4progressives]

15. Couldn't disagree with this idea more.. pandering to the christo fascists

is not the direction this party should be going...to encourage it, is not merely bizarre, it is dangerous. This is propping the Theocratic State, like Saudi Arabi, Iran and what looks like Iraq is developing into.

I recommend reading a bit of the preface to Sam Harris's End of Faith book here:http://samharris.org/

[sandnsea]

16. Write for Radio - Paint a Picture

Young males are visual creatures, particularly. Democrats always want to build an intellectual case. Republicans paint a visual picture with words. All the best hatemongers come out of radio. Write for radio.

[Arugula Latte]

17. I don't have the stomach to go into any church

Even the smell of churches makes me feel queasy -- you know, that musty-mold-mixed-with-disinfectant smell? Bleah. But, it's a good idea for those who can do it!

[raysr]

21. That sticky smell of hypocracy!

[raysr]

20. Church, LOL!

Church, oh my god, church, ROFLMAO! Yes, by all means, let's go to church so we can get back in power and start winning elections! GREAT idea.

[KyuzoGator]

23. Didn't read the post, did ya?

Hmm.

[gatorboy]

25. Are you suggesting Democrats do not attend church?

Thanks for buying into the right wing propoganda...

[Pastiche423]

26. I am confused

Are you trying to infer that Howard Dean speaks like a preacher and that more of the left need to hear preacher-like speeches?

:wtf:

[yurbud]

38. what is MOW? Howard is like a preacher only in conviction

Some of those who are supposedly up and coming leaders of the Democratic party seem to be diffident when they should be passionate, especially during those times they have a chance to speak to the public unfiltered like debates, live interviews, etc.

[SmokingJacket]

28. All the great speakers are on our side already.

Who does the right have? Mumblemouth Cheeney? Peeance-freeance Bush?

Seems that the silver tongues haven't done us much good, even though they certainly inspire me.

[EvolveOrConvolve]

32. The minute a Dem started pontificating like a preacher

the MSM would label him some kind of nut case. Remember the Dean Scream? If an R had done the same thing, the MSM would have written glowingly about his "passion" and "zeal".

I agree that we need more leaders with passion, just not the sort of passionate bullshit you get from a sermon.

[yurbud]

35. I would discourage anyone from doing tarzan yells at rallies, but...

a couple of ways Dean could have diffused that in media interviews:

• " You're right, that was pretty lame, but I wasn't a cheerleader in college like George Bush, so what do you expect?"
  
  
• " You're right, that was pretty lame, could you do it the right way for me?"

[Catchawave]

33. Dem's need to respect "choice"

Where the F***k does this message keep getting lost on DU :shrug:

Sidebar: I'm an animal rights activist, and I DU draw the line on bestiality.

[yurbud]

36. read original post--it has nothing to do with false piety and pandering

to the far right.

[yurbud]

37. does that mean bestiality is inside the line or out?