Revote in Ohio After Diebold Touch-Screens Record More Votes Than Voters!

[BradBlog]

Revote in Ohio After More Votes Than Voters Recorded on Diebold Touch-Screen Voting Machines!
Court Orders Special Re-Vote Tomorrow After 'Failure' of Montgomery County, OH's New AccuVote TSX Machines!
County one of forty-four to implement new touch-screen machines for last November's election resulting in inexplicable results...

Diebold Inc., one of America's largest voting machine companies, likes to claim that there's never been any substantial problem with their touch-screen machines in any election in America.

You may not be surprised to hear that claim is patently untrue.

As reported in yesterday's Middletown Journal, a special "re-vote" will be held tomorrow in Montgomery county, OH on an issue where last November's election results were set aside due to more votes being cast on Diebold's AccuVote TSX touch-screen voting machines than there were actually registered voters who voted!...

FULL STORY: http://www.bradblog.com/archives/00002379.htm

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[phoebe]

1. kick - please update as news comes in - thank you for this post

n/t

[mikelewis]

2. K & R

[mod mom]

3. Thanks Brad, glad to hear there are some paying attention to the world

outside of the NSA surveillance hearing!

:yourock:

[Rainscents]

4. If I were seating judge, I would had ordered to throw out the machines

and vote on paper ballots!

[jazzjunkysue]

28. Drop 'em off the roof!!!!

bouncy, bouncy, bouncy.....

[AndyTiedye]

50. I Was Hoping Somebody Would Leave a Window Open

in the voting machine warehouse when all those hurricanes went through.

"Aw, gee, our voting machinez got destroyed in the storm, we'll have to use paper ballots"

Repub pols: "Oh No!"

[GreenPartyVoter]

5. Thanks for that. I wish more people would wake up to the issue of

election reform: http://www.hostdiva.com/liberalchristians/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=116&Itemid=29

[blm]

6. When more info comes through on this, I will send to local papers.

Not enough in there now to push.

[Fredda Weinberg]

7. Whoah ... that's not what the Middletown Journal said

http://www.middletownjournal.com/hp/content/news/stories/2006/02/MJ020606monroevotes.html

Monroe voters go to polls tomorrow


MONROE — Tuesday is election day for Monroe voters who will head to the polls to decide the fate of a half percent income tax increase.

In fact

http://www.middletownjournal.com/search/content/news/stories/2006/01/23/mj012306newelexmachines.html

Punch cards out, scan voting in

...
On the Montgomery County side of Carlisle, preparations are also under way for the special election.

Steve Harsman, Montgomery County’s elections director, said his office is preparing the electronic touch-screen voting machines, setting up the database and preparing the voter access cards that will be used to activate the machines.
...

[Fredda Weinberg]

8. See above ... this is bogus e/m

[Wilms]

13. FWIW, the article cited by Brad says...

"But those election results were set aside due to voting irregularities from the new electronic touch screen voting machines."

The one you cite says much the same.

Due to some irregularities using new touch-screen electronic voting machines during the November 2005 general election on the Montgomery County side of Carlisle, a judge in December ordered a new election to decide the fate of a continuing, 3.8-mill replacement levy for the expansion of the Carlisle Fire Department.

I think that Fredda Weinberg Is Wrong about this one...too.

For What It's Worth.

[BradBlog]

27. Yes...it IS what Middletown Journal said...

Here's what I quoted specifically in my report. This is from the Middletown Journal yesterday:

http://www.middletownjournal.com/news/content/news/stories/2006/02/05/MJ020506CARLISLE.html

CARLISLE — Voters will have another opportunity Tuesday in a special election to decide whether the city should have a combined fire and emergency medical services department with 24-hour staffing or continue as a volunteer fire department.

This is the second time in three months this levy has been before voters. Last November, the levy was narrowly defeated.

But those election results were set aside due to voting irregularities from the new electronic touch screen voting machines.

More votes were cast than there were registered voters in the city’s Montgomery County precinct. The city contested the results, and the Montgomery County Common Pleas Court ordered Tuesday’s special election at Montgomery County’s cost.

The reports you linked to, do not seem to contradict the above in any way that I can see.

[Wilms]

30. .

:)

[Junkdrawer]

38. Ah, yes, Fredda's back...

Joy

[RazzleDazzle]

53. Care to introduce her to the group?

I'm sure there are many, many people here who haven't a clue who she is, but would love to know. Fredda's probably too modest to introduce herself.

[Time for change]

36. This isn't very helpful

You say "That's not what Middletown Journal said", and then you post a couple of links to the journal. What specifically are you saying is misquoted in the OP?

[Wilms]

43. FWIW, this is Freeda's MO

At times, she provides links that show Freeda Weinberg Is Wrong.

Odd. But it's a big world. :crazy:

[renate]

9. Montgomery County gets a revote but do other Diebold Ohio counties?

Guess that'd be a pretty gigantic can of worms. Still, it's excellent that a precedent will now have been set.

On edit: I hadn't seen Fredda's post... that'll teach me to get excited about good election reform news.
Fool me once... you can't get fooled again, or something like that.
:banghead:

[smartvoter]

34. Only when you can see the problem is it there. Don't you get it? nt

[John Q. Citizen]

10. Imagine that! More proof of the unreliability of our elections process.

Thanks for passing that along.

[understandinglife]

11. K&R.

Peace.

[Fredda Weinberg]

12. Dude, look it up - it's a bogus report

you're kicking bullshit

[Wilms]

14. .

:eyes:

[Name removed]

15. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[kster]

16. -

:thumbsup:

[Name removed]

17. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mod mom]

18. not bogus-here is another link regarding the problems w '05

election in Montgomery Co.:

Election Day got off to a rough start Tuesday in some precincts in Montgomery County, where new touch-screen voting machines are being used for the first time. The machines, which officials said are more accurate and are expected to speed up the vote-counting process, are being used in about half of Ohio’s 88 counties, including Greene and Miami.

Sporatic problems were reported throughout Montgomery County, including Miamisburg, Washington Twp. and Dayton. Mike Petkus, 47, of Dayton said that when he went to cast his ballot at Kiser Middle School in north Dayton, he had the Northridge school board candidates on his touch screen rather than the Dayton school board. As he was leaving the polling place to get to work, he said, “another guy was raising that same red flag.” “I think there was some very poor checking,” he said.

Montgomery County Board of Elections Director Steve Harsman acknowledged there were some expected and unexpected problems, though he was pleased overall with the way things were running. “We had some minor issues, some expected situations this morning rolling out a new voting system of this magnitude,” he said.

His office received 30 to 40 calls from precincts reporting a “low paper error” on some of the machines even though each contained a new roll of paper. Harsman believes the machines got jostled while moved to the polling locations, shaking a bracket and causing a sensor to go off. Voters should have been able to use other machines while roving trouble shooters remedied the problem, he said.

http://www.votersunite.org/article.asp?id=6275

[Rainscents]

19. You're using middletownjournal??? Oh, give me a break!

http://www.middletownjournal.com/hp/content/news/stories/2006/02/MJ020606monroevotes.html

:crazy: :crazy: :crazy:

[EFerrari]

21. You always show up in these threads and post misinformation.

That's just weird. :eyes:

[liam_laddie]

47. Fredda is absolutely bogus...

:nuke:
Upthread, FW is very mixed up, and mixing up a couple different elections.
There are at least two "special elections" on Feb 7.
One is in Monroe (Butler County) for a half-cent sales tax. Another is the Carlisle
election re-vote on whether or not to continue a volunteer fire dep't. or have a
paid EMT-fire service.
For those who want to locate these two towns...both are just west of I-75 between
Cincinnati and Dayton, and are about 13 miles apart. Monroe is adjacent to
Middletown, south side, entirely within Butler Cty.
Carlisle's limits happen to straddle Warren and Montgomery Counties. The
Montgomery Cty. part is two small areas totalling about one-sixth of a sq. mi.;
Carlisle is south of Miamisburg, in a "thumb" projecting from the NW corner
of Warren County.
Heh, heh, nice to see a red zone with a screwed-up election. Wonder if they'll
shut down the counting while the manipulation goes on, like in 2004.
And FW, take your meds and go home to Freeperville, okay?

[understandinglife]

57. I'm not a "dude." And, whomever you are, you're wrong.

[mdmc]

33. k/r

peace

[Awsi Dooger]

20. As always, just please let me bet against this

I'll bet against election results being set aside. I'll bet against the existence of a special re-vote. I'll bet against more votes tallied than actual votes. You name it.

Whenever there's Diebold hysteria, you guys can scream into the sky and post one desperate thread after another. All I want is the opportunity to profit by wagering no, it didn't happen.

[BradBlog]

26. I'll take those bets!

What the hell are you talking about? All reports concerning Diebold, at least that I have written, are sourced, and have never needed retraction.

If you are simply hoping to insert doubt about such reports, well...then you ought to apply for a job as Diebold spokeseman. They do quitet a bit of that.

I'll stick to reality, thanks.

[Wilms]

31. Then pay up, Awsi. You lost.

Read the article.

[OnTheOtherHand]

40. we may need a special ruling on this

Judging from an earlier Middletown Journal article archived on BBv, and the Montgomery County SOVC report, it looks like --

(1) The two Montgomery County precincts in Carlisle were German Twp C (that's Township) and Miami Twp T
(2) A total of 225 votes were cast on the levy in these precincts (per the Journal story) http://www.bbvforums.org/forums/messages/8/13131.html?1131817515
(3) 73 of them were in Miami T (per the SOVC report, p. 831) which leaves 152 from German C
(4) Overall, 402 valid votes were cast in German C (SOVC p. 31)
(5) However, in the SOVC, although German C is listed as voting on the levy, it has no valid votes. (The SOVC is dated 11/29/05.)

NB: SOVC URL is http://www.mcboe.org/ElectionResults/final_sovc.pdf -- note that this is a 4.8Meg file.

Speculative inference: part of German C was eligible to vote on the levy, but accidentally everyone -- or way too many people -- were allowed to vote on it.

Alternative speculative inference: people in some other precinct entirely were allowed to vote on it.

Second alternative speculative inference: (this space available!!)

Apparently contradicted by the available evidence: more votes cast "than there were actually registered voters who voted!"

Stretch: relating this event to the 2005 Reform Ohio Now results.

Query: does anyone here know anything about this story beyond what has been reported in the Middletown Journal?

(EDIT: Awsi, looks to me like you lose on at least the first two bets, so on your terms, I guess you do have to pay up. You might have won on the third -- I dunno, that requires too much concentration.)

[EFerrari]

22. Good catch, Brad.

:kick:

[rumpel]

23. K&R

[EFerrari]

24. Kick

[King Coal]

25. Actually, this just proves how good the machines are.

They actually record the votes of people unable to go to the polls. How do they know how the people would vote if they were able to go to the polls? Modern technology is wonderful.

:crazy:

[Ian David]

32. Didn't Isaac Asimov do a story something like that?

A computer selected the most average person in the whole country, and then that person got to decide who would be president.

[Wilms]

35. Gee. That's messed up.

We have nine people that decide. :D

[johnaries]

46. Yep, except that person didn't actually "vote".

They basically "polled" him or her. The premise was that they had gotten stastics down to such an art that they no longer did "random samplings", but could actually pinpoint an "average" individual that would represent the majority. Then, they would ask that individual a series of questions about the candidate's issues and be to extrapolate what the prevailing attitudes and opinions were, based on how that individual's opinions were "influenced" by his/her peers.

I think that they basic "message' of the story was that very few of us have individual, independent opinions. Most ofour opinions are based on the opinions of our peers.

Although, to be fair, the main character of the story could never actually make up his mind about who he wanted to vote for.

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

56. I never thought of it that way. Thank you for putting my concerns to rest.

[Wilms]

29. Thhhhooooooop!

I mean, KICK!

[rpgamerd00d]

37. Fuck, look at this :

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x340348

[Patsy Stone]

39. That's great news!

K&R!

[Extend a Hand]

41. I live in Montgomery County

and this is the first I've heard about any re-vote????!!!!


Ahh, I see ... looks like it is a city election for Carlisle.

But I still bet they screwed us on issues 2-5 -- the statewide election issues that were on the ballots.

[Kukesa]

59. I, too, live in Montgomery County

and haven't heard anything about a re-vote.

[AngryOldDem]

66. That's because it's no big deal

Just how much of Carlisle is in Montgomery County? A couple of blocks? This is just a bookkeeping procedure, not a major event.

[Awsi Dooger]

42. Here's a working link; I was dead wrong

I checked the Montgomery County elections website hours ago and it had no mention of the special election so that led to my skepticism. But I found the story on the Middletown Journal website so this is legit. I'm still betting against Diebold hysteria every time but this time I lose bigtime.

http://www.middletownjournal.com/local/content/news/stories/2006/02/05/MJ020506CARLISLE.html

[EFerrari]

48. I really like this gesture. 'Way to go.

:)

[AngryOldDem]

63. The reason why you couldn't find a mention is because....

...this is only a small sliver of Montgomery County we're talking about, and it's a fire and operating levy. Nobody is in danger of losing a seat or anything. I live in Montgomery County and this has not been played up at all in the media. School issues 50 miles north of here are getting more coverage.

While it may be somewhat significant that Diebold is being challenged, at the end of the day this is really small potatoes and much ado about nothing, in my opinion, which I'm sure I'll be duly chastised for.

[DemReadingDU]

68. True, it concerns a fire/EMS levy in Carlisle

The problem was that the voting machines counted more ballots than were people registered to vote on the issue! At that time, there were articles in the Dayton Daily News. Maybe the DDN will have an update Wednesday about the final outcome?

[AngryOldDem]

70. Doubt it

There were widespread problems in Warren County (where most of Carlisle is) on Election Night, which have been reported. (The DDN's coverage, in fact, is cited extensively in the Conyers "What Went Wrong" investigation.)

But as I said, this story about Carlisle caught everyone who lives in Montgomery County by surprise. I even cross-linked it on the Ohio board, asking for input, because I had not heard of this.

There are some issues on the ballot today, mainly north of Dayton. I'm sure the Carlisle revote will be included in a general wrap-up. But I'm not expecting much coverage, given that this didn't get much in the way of media play to begin with.

The only hope -- and it is very small -- is that this may start people wondering how this could have happened, which could snowball into an investigation into these machines. But I imagine I'll see pigs fly first.

[Just Me]

44. I am sick of this crap!

No proprietary machine should be used for election purposes, anyway!!! That's just freakin' insane.

Go away, Diebold. You serve only your interests. GO AWAY!!! :grr:

[Name removed]

45. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[EFerrari]

49. Welcome to DU, Lars

:hi:

[Sydnie]

51. Well, Lars didn't last long, did he?

:rofl:

[EFerrari]

52. Is he gone already?

What a surprise. :)

[guidoo]

54. I'm shocked....shocked I tell you....

does this really surprise any of us ??
:rant:

[JudyM]

55. Hello: Ohio progressives... n/t

[ClintonTyree]

58. Somewhere in Montgomery County........

there's a Republican operative in deep, DEEP doo-doo because he screwed this up. Illegally tampering with the vote count is nothing new for Diebold Republicans, but when you screw up and record more votes than voters if draws attention to their "perfect" little scam. They certainly don't want that, they want it to go unnoticed, to blend in even though the results are usually the opposite of what is expected, the voting machines don't lie, correct? :shrug: It seems that they DO LIE, or at least the smarmy little shit manipulating the vote count does.
I hope this blows the lid right off the Diebold scandal, scam. That would depend upon the media reporting it though........never mind, we're screwed. Again. :cry:

[DUBYASCREWEDUS]

60. WELL NO SHIT!

[Dragonbreathp9d]

61. And yet people still believe the Bushies

[nolabels]

62. Nice

Why steal votes when you can just make your own.

Makes one even wonder about the record turn out in the elections :shrug:

[malaise]

64. Oh Yes!! n/t

[lonestarnot]

65. Bushitler cheated! It's in my kitchen window on a bumper sticker!

[MindPilot]

67. You have a bumper in your kitchen window?

Did the driver have insurance?

[lonestarnot]

73. Yes, no room for it on my cars. Won't have a back window to see out of

with one more. So any place that I have a window I put stuff!

[lonestarnot]

74. Also bushitler surfing on a flag-draped casket on a postcard.

[Rex]

69. The asshole BFEE let the BBV genie out of the bottle.

I expect the 2006 elections to be a total mockery of democracy.

[NobleCynic]

71. Nobody here is surprised

The challenge is getting it out to the public. Handing out flyers and information in person. It seems the media can't be trusted to do this, so we must go around it or accept or inevitable defeat. Grassroots organization may be our only available option left. And that means canvassing red states and counties.

[AngryOldDem]

72. 10 p.m. news in Dayton

Reported the outcome of the Carlisle levy (it failed) but gave no reason why the vote was held today.

This is a nonstory.