Are Abramoff and Swiftboaters connected in any way? n/t

[cantstandbush]

[liberalnurse]

1. Oh, wouldn't that be sweet?

I sure do hope so.....:bounce:

[TallahasseeGrannie]

2. I have never read of a connection

[Warpy]

3. We'd know for sure if Kerry hadn't been a fucking wimp

something he continues to be to this day.

He should have sued those punks the day their book came out, gaining subpoena power over both them and Regenery Publishing. Think of what a good law team could have uncovered OVER A YEAR AGO with the kind of power a subpoena can bring.

The point is not to win the libel case. The point is to uncover all the dirty money conduits, all the connections to the RNC and the Bush crime family, and to tie up opposition resources fighting every subpoena every step of the way.

THAT is how the country could have WON!!!!

And yes, they're all interconnected to the point you can barely tell where one gang of money laundering thieves leaves off and the next begins.

[MH1]

5. Wow, you have all the answers. 6 fig salary, too, I guess? n/t

[Warpy]

8. The point is that we'd ALL have the answers

if Kerry had asked the questions in a meaningful way.

[MH1]

11. How do you know? How do you know he didn't?

Are you a lawyer? (That is what my previous post is getting at).

See my post below. The campaign responded. They got effed over by the media just the same as Gore did, and THAT is what we need to solve before 2008, no matter who runs.

As for filing a lawsuit, the Swift Liars' attacks smeared other veterans, too. Did anybody file a lawsuit? If they did, what happened? If they didn't then was that perhaps because it wouldn't have even enough basis (due to our weak libel laws) to even have the result you seem to think it would?

[Warpy]

12. Easy. No libel suit. No lawyers. No subpoenas.

Those were the things he needed to do to get those questions out, and he STILL hasn't done it.

[MH1]

13. Once again - are you a lawyer?

How do you know that any lawsuit would even get that far?

AND why wouldn't other vets be suing if that would work? Hell, they libeled Rassman, and the guy who wrote the op-ed in the Chicago Tribune (don't recall his name), and a bunch of other people by calling them liars. Not to mention calling into question every single Purple Heart that was awarded during that time frame in Vietnam.

Heck, if I was a person in any of those classes and I had a viable suit, I would file it. But I'm not a lawyer and I'm not going to believe that it would have achieved anything, if NO ONE has done it.

[saskatoon]

6. Kerry

|You are right. I was never so disappointed in all my life in someone whom i rooted for and sent money to out of my $630.00 a month SS. He was such a goddamn gentleman---that's ideal in certain situations but not when you are dealing with a bunch of thugs and crooks. he should have come out fighting and we could have won. |You fight fire with fire if you have any sense of how to win against crooks

[MH1]

7. The Kerry campaign responded. That they didn't is a myth.

http://www.gwu.edu/~action/2004/ads04/swiftadresponse.html

SBVT had a press conference on May 4. It got little traction then. Then they started ads in early August. The info at the link is not very well organized, but it details Kerry campaign response to each event of the SBVT campaign.

1) when the media is playing the other guys' attack and not covering your response, you're screwed.
2) it didn't make much difference anyway. Polls that fall showed that the public believed Kerry's story on Vietnam. The SBVT convinced only those who were already inclined to vote for Bush. The ads didn't work well for swing voters because they were so negative. SBVT was given more credit than they actually earned.

Still, it would be very, very nice to tie SBVT to Abramoff. I'm sure that if there was good rationale for a lawsuit, Kerry (or some other vets who were incidentally smeared by the Swift Liars' attacks) would have done it.

[MH1]

4. Not sure, but here's a start.

Do any of the people on this chart have ties to Abramoff?



excerpted from:
http://www.gwu.edu/%7Eaction/2004/kerry/cahill082604ltr.html

August 26, 2004 letter from Mary Beth Cahill to Ken Mehlman


Dear Mr. Mehlman:

For three weeks now, your campaign has been saying there are no ties between the Bush campaign and “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth.” But the web of connections grows wider and wider every day. Yesterday we saw confirmation of another connection when your general counsel, Benjamin Ginsberg, was forced to resign for providing legal advice for this group.

Enclosed you will find a chart that makes clear the web of connections between President Bush and the “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth.” Now that you have this chart and the accompanying fact sheet to back it up, I wanted to ask you several specific questions that deserve your prompt response.

1. Ken Cordier served on the Bush Veterans Steering Committee and also stars in the latest “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth” smear ad. As a member of the steering committee presumably he was involved in policy development. What information about the Bush campaign’s veterans policy did he share with the “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth?” Did he ever discuss his activities with this smear group with anyone in the Bush campaign? How many times did “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth” activities come up at Bush Veterans Steering Committee meetings?

2. Yesterday on Fox News Karl Rove confirmed that he and Bob Perry are longtime friends. Bob Perry is the largest contributor to the Texas Republican Party and a longtime supporter of President Bush. When was the last time Karl Rove and Bob Perry spoke, and did they discuss the “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth?”

3. Based on newspaper accounts, we know Merrie Spaeth was involved in the underhanded shadow campaign against John McCain in 2000. She also helped organize the “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth” and did the debate prep for President H. W. Bush. She has also admitted that she advised Bush Administration officials in the White House as recently as last year. Was Merrie Spaeth ever contacted by anyone from the Bush campaign, including you, about “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth?”

4. John O’Neill’s law firm, Clements, O’Neill, Pierce, Wilson & Fulkerson, has many connections to President Bush. In fact, Margaret Wilson, Mr. O’Neill’s law partner, served as General Counsel to Governor Bush and followed him to Washington, where she worked as Deputy Counsel for the Department of Commerce. Did she ever discuss “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth” with President Bush, members of his administration or any Bush-Cheney campaign officials?

5. If you say there’s no connection, why did the Bush-Cheney campaign office in Florida pass out “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth” flyers to promote a joint anti-John Kerry rally in Gainsville, Florida last weekend?

6. According to news reports, you have worked with “Progress for America,” a newly formed 527 group that has announced it’s going to spend $35 million to attack John Kerry and whose executive director is a top advisor to the “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth.” Have you had any additional contact with this group? Have Karl Rove or other Bush officials – either in the White House or on the Bush-Cheney campaign – had contacts with this group?

7. How many times did Karl Rove and Benjamin Ginsberg meet? Did they ever discuss the “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth?”

These questions go to the heart of why so many people now believe that “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth” is nothing more than a front group for the Bush-Cheney campaign. The longer President Bush waits to specifically condemn this smear, the more it looks like he’s behind it.

It’s time for the President to stand up and specifically condemn “Swift Boat Veterans for Truth.” Not only is this a smear on John Kerry’s distinguished military service; it’s an insult to all veterans who’ve served their country.

The American people want to hear an honest discussion of the issues. They’re concerned about the economy and the troubling situation in Iraq. Today, as we enter week four of this smear campaign, I’m asking you to talk to the President and ask him to heed Senator McCain’s call and condemn this smear. The American people deserve better.

Sincerely,

Mary Beth Cahill

[galloglas]

15. I'm sure on this one!

Try this link.

http://rawstory.com/exclusives/map_conservative_ties_raw_story_415.htm

This is the map of "Thor" Hearne II. If it were less current it would show connections to America's Torture Czar, ex.-AG John Ashcroft.

Both are Missouri boys, both are tied at the hip to the Blunt family (both Rep. Roy Blunt and his pinheaded son and Missouri's governor-Select, Matt Blunt).

And, to answer the question, both have ties to Abramoff.

[cantstandbush]

17. Thanks, great work. n/t

[Lerkfish]

9. IF there is, it would be in the form of a funnel through Delay, I think.

but I have nothing to base that on except that Delay seems to have been involved in all sorts of money laundering and the swiftboat liars sure seemed well-funded.

[DoYouEverWonder]

10. Probably, Roger Stone

He's heavy into Indian gambling, was in the middle of the CBS forgeries, coordinated the Miami Riot in 2000 and the Elian protests before that.

[BrotherBuzz]

14. Tangential Swiftboat Liars question

Is there any connection between the Swiftboat Liars and that crappy fake Move America Forward astroturf movement created by Sal Russo of Russo, Marsh and Rogers? Inquiring minds want to know.

[cantstandbush]

16. OK, this is what needs to be kept up in the air with the MSM.

Kick, recommend and keep asking the question until some courageous journalists puts the pieces together. It's a great job for someone like Dan Rather....ya think?

[0007]

18. Who knows? The undercurrent of Abramoff goes deep into the dark.

Jack Abramoff had the wherewithal to control the media and do what he pretty much wanted. So why wouldn't he use the Swiftboaters to gain his end for his friend in the White House?

Was Jack Abramoff connected in the mysterious deaths of Cliff Baxter or David Kelly? Kenny Boy and his gang and Bush friends would sure look silly if this Enron Chief could testify today, huh? Same with David Kelly and the U.K. gang.

Even Paul Wellstone would have been a burr of the Republicans ass if he were still alive.

[peacebaby3]

19. Someone needs to write a book about all of the Swiftboaters!

We know John O'Neil told Nixon that he was in Cambodia because there is a recording. Yet, he and the Swifties (that's an oxymoron if I have ever seen one)claimed Kerry could have never been in Cambodia because nobody ever crossed into Cambodia.

Someone should do to each of them what they did to John Kerry. I bet if you dug into their closets, it is no telling what you would find.

[0007]

20. bttft