Fingerprint scanners at the SUPERMARKET.

[benburch]

My local Jewel supermarket (owned by Albertsons) now has a program where they can store both the information from your customer loyalty card and from your payment method and key it to your fingerprint such that you can pay without the need for any ID at all other than your finger.

The privacy implications here are staggering. Who else (in these days of PATRIOT acts) has access to that information? Does the fingerprint get compared to the IAFIS database?

Just another sign of Things To Come.

[MercutioATC]

1. So?

They only have access to the information you give them (which is the same information you gave them if you have one of their savings cards).

This technophobe stuff is getting ridiculous.

[benburch]

4. It's the fingerprint that is interesting.

Because that keys to so much law enforcement information.

[MercutioATC]

19. So do driver's licences....

...but we use them as a form of ID all of the time.

Unless the databases cross-reference (and they don't) there's no difference between the two.

[400Years]

32. that fingerprint will probably end up in a choicepoint database

and be used for things you cannot control.

[MercutioATC]

34. Like what?

And how is that different from using a savings card?

[400Years]

37. We don't know. That is the point. and as far as...

the difference b/t this and a savings card is that you can throw a savings card in the trash and thus end your business relationship then and there but they will have your fingerprint on record and you cannot get it back.

[Matariki]

11. hmm, i was thinking the same thing

it might be cool to bike to the store without a wallet. the problem is how info is used, not the technology.

i stay away from those 'customer loyalty' cards like the plague.

[katmondoo]

16. I used my Aunt's name for my card at the grocery

She passed away many years ago.

[RaleighNCDUer]

24. TIA. Total Information Awareness.

Includes a fingerprint database for everyone in the country. To be accessed by law enforcement, Homeland Security and the military.

What next? Microchip implants so you don't have to even stop at a checkout? It just scans you and everything you buy as you pass through the door, automatically deducts it from your bank account and sends an automated warning to your physician that you bought cigarettes and Twinkies.

It's not about technophobes. It's about information and who has it, and who can access it.

Who is the corporate master of Albertsons?

[MercutioATC]

31. I agree, but people are railing against an application that doesn't exist.

Or that DOES exist, but in an acceptable way.

An example from my local news a couple of days ago:

A vehicle was broken into and an AMEX card stolen. The thief went to a local grocery store and purchased cigarettes (lots of cigarettes). He then used his store savings card to get "points" from his purchase. When the police investigated, it wasn't difficult to figure out the identity of the thief.

That represents an acceptable use of store-held information to me. I don't see a circumstance where the store-held information from a fingerprint could be abused in ways that the store-held information on a card couldn't.

[Missy M]

2. I don't know why any customer would agree to this......

just pay by the usual means, no need for fingerprints. I would never agree to that.

[Saturday]

3. I also was made aware of

the Jewel finger program the other day. The clerk told me if I paid my bills online I probably would like this program. I don't think so.

[lvx35]

5. Yeah, biometrics are a big thing.

They are supposedly going to be pretty ubiquitous, if you believe the tech journals. I am just wondering if the Iris scan things will work with those colored contacts.

[Cassandra]

13. Since I have colored contacts in 2 different colors...

I've been wondering about that myself.

[Atman]

6. You're only giving them one print

When you go rob a bank or murder your spouse, be sure to put one of those little finger-condoms on that digit. Problem solved.

[rpgamerd00d]

7. The day I give a retarded supermarket clerk custody of my fingerprint...

... is the day hell freezes over.

[Toucano]

12. "retard supermarket clerk"?

Is that really necessary?

Seems a bit harsh to me. They are working people, you know. People with families, just trying to make a living.

All labor needs to be respected.

[benburch]

14. I Agree.

More to the point, many of the workers at this store are from an assisted living program for adults with developmental problems. They work hard. They have a Union. They get benefits. Good people.

It is the implications of the DATABASE that worry me, not the nice people at the store.

[rpgamerd00d]

26. No, no, no , no. I literally mean retarded. Mentally handicapped.

Im not using it as an insult, I ACTUALLY mean retarded.

I accidentally left of "ed". Retarded, not retard, that was a typo.

[benburch]

28. That's even worse!

:wow:

[rpgamerd00d]

35. I will not give out my biodata to an unsecured source, and worse,

a source that does not possess the level of intelligence required to protect my biodata properly.

HOW IS THAT BAD ?!

[Toucano]

8. It's not compulsory is it?

These have been used in Europe for a number of years.

As long as it's voluntary, I don't have a problem with it.

[Mr Rabble]

9. Nothing like a single point of failure!

How stupid do you have to be think that this will be anything other than an unmitigated disaster?

One database holding my personal identifiers as well as my financial information?

Are these people out of their minds?

[kurth]

10. "Loyalty" program data for sale

See http://www.nocards.org/

Loyalty cards don't mean low prices, just more profits for the parent corporations.

[Matariki]

20. good link. thanks

i'm glad to hear that stores with card, like qfc, are suffering financially. qfc advising disgruntled customers to use a fake phone number only holds water if the person *always* pays with cash only.

[CoffeeCat]

15. I stumbled upon this the other day...

I am an avid couponer and I was doing some research on Catalina Coupons.

I read this on the company's Web site... http://www.catmktg.com/about_us/index.html

"In the retail industry, Catalina Marketing retrieves about 250 million transactions per week, across more than 21,000 grocery stores. On behalf of our grocery retail clients, we manage one of the six largest databases in the world, containing the purchase histories of over 100 million household IDs."

They're also in the health field:

"In the pharmaceutical industry we print over one billion condition-specific informational PatientLinksT to almost 100 million patients each year. To you, this means unparalleled access to your consumers and unique insights about their preferences and buying behavior."

I just thought it was interesting...

[Protagoras]

17. Albertsons in Oregon has had these for about a year

if you want to sign up. I don't. And I've had my fingerprints given and taken for a varity of background checks and clearances. But frankly I think this "convenience" has too many potential misapplications.

[HereSince1628]

18. Federal reserve notes, still good for debts public or private

If you want to protect your biometrics, it's gonna get harder and harder. Fingerprints and facial scans are both in service.

Will using paper money get you around the ID issue?

[benburch]

21. Yes... But you also pay more.

The sales in such stores are always keyed to having a customer loyalty card.

[Matariki]

22. read the articles in the link above

http://www.nocards.org/news/archive1.shtml#survey

it's good to know that stores are losing customers over this, and stores that don't have these stupid cards are doing best. on the other hand there is also an article on the page about the government wanting the data from the cards...

[HereSince1628]

23. I understand, freedom isn't free.

Here in Tosa and Elmbrook the loyalty card thing is starting to disappear. And where the loyalty cards are present, most cashiers use a store card if you ask, sometimes even if you don't.

[Lars39]

25. Remember when the news came out about the supermarket chains,

that immediately after 9/11 voluntarily gave all of their customers' information to Homeland Security?

[kurth]

27. It's well known that terrorists shop for supplies in grocery stores

Bread, soda, toilet paper, etc.

[Kerrytravelers]

29. Yes, I have a computer, the internet, a cell phone...

... but I'm not a huge fan of technology. And it seems like everyday there is some new gadget to play with... and to distract us from what is really going on in the world.

[converted_democrat]

30. We bought season passes at that popular amusement park, and they

wanted our hand prints.. We did it, but I don't know how happy I am about it.. It bugged me all day, and I've thought about it on several occasions since.

[demgurl]

33. I am not paranoid but I do not like this idea.

I have several cards for my local supermarket since they like to limit you on items. This would put a stop to some of my multiple shopping trips. I hope this idea does not spread.

[BushOut06]

36. Just wait till the Fundies get ahold of this

They're paranoid about anything that involves scanners and the hand or forehead. Maybe this is one area where they can work to our advantage ;)