I'm one of the REALLY FUCKING DENSE PEOPLE, so please help:

[tgnyc]

Regarding the Cheney shooting:

1. How many here do NOT think the shooting was an accident?
2. Which is the most noteworthy part of the incident:
a) he accidentally (or not, if that's what you believe) shot someone
b) he shot someone who is 78 years old
c) he shot someone who is 78 years old in the face
d) he didn't stay with the victim in the hospital
e) he didn't speak personally with the police until the next day
f) he didn't tell the media about it for 22 hours
g) he hasn't spoken with us, the American people, about it yet
h) it is rumored that alcohol was involved
i) he blamed the victim for being in the wrong place
j) other

Sincerely, I'm not sure what the crime is here. Is it 'e'? If not, what we are left with is

I. The VP is a secretive asshole -- something that has been well-documented by us
II. He's involved in covering-up a very unseemly, non-criminal event. The last president found himself in a similar situation, and we howled about the media's behavior at the time.

Perhaps, without insults, someone can explain why exactly this event warrants so much attention -- more than, say, the fact that the GOP in Congress is about to drop the whole warrantless wiretapping issue permanently.

[warrens]

1. i. Other

He didn't keep his motherfucking finger off the motherfucking trigger of a shotgun while swinging it 90 degrees and firing without seeing a motherfucking target. That's the one.

[sharp_stick]

3. Well said

What's Samuel L. Jackson doing posting here?

[Sugar Smack]

21. LOL!

:spray:

I second the "Well said".

[Binka]

23. My God I Love You

What a beautiful motherfucking rant. I loves me a man who can cuss! :loveya:

[Lochloosa]

34. I can cuss like a fucking sailor....

love me long time?:evilgrin:

Edit to add "fucking"

[Binka]

36. Sure thing sailor!

[Lochloosa]

39. ...

[Ron Mexico]

2. I seriously doubt

that it was anything but an accident - I would never expect a tiny weasel with a weak heart to do his own dirty work.

The coverup and failure to address the nation is what concerns me. If Gore had done this as VP, just imagine what the reaction from the Freetards would have been.

[Pharaoh]

9. what if it was'nt an accident

perhaps cheney had a few in him and the old guy pissed him off, a short fuse of a temper cheney has and before he even realizes it( cause he's an unconcious reptilian creature)

he shoots the guys...............

then you would get the kind of clumsy coverup we are seeing here..

[Ron Mexico]

14. Entirely possible, but what crossed my mind is that

if Cheney got angry enough to shoot a guy, one of two things would happen: either he'd keel over from a heart attack, or the guy would be dead. I can't imagine both people surviving the incident if he got that riled up.

[Pirate Smile]

4. Daily Kos: It's the Metaphor, Stupid!: Cheney story bigger than you think

It's the Metaphor, Stupid!: Cheney story bigger than you think

by thereisnospoon
Mon Feb 13, 2006 at 11:43:38 PM PDT
(From the diaries -- kos)

The Cheney shooting story isn't about to die down. I predict that the press is going to run with this story for days, if not weeks--and it has very little to do with the possibility of Cheney's being drunk, or with the 18 hour delay, or anything else. And this story is going to be much bigger than what we've seen so far in the White House Press Briefings.

It's because this story is a perfect metaphor for this administration's foreign and domestic policy. It says everything you need to know about Dick Cheney personally, and the way this entire administration operates.

And the press does this all the time: they run with little things that display flaws in character: Al Gore's "Internet" quote to highlight his weakness for exaggeration; Kerry's "Voted for it before I voted against it" to highlight his weakness for equivocation.

In this case, we have Cheney and the entire Bush Administration foreign and domestic policy in a nutshell. Especially in Iraq and Katrina.

In this case, Cheney and friends were killing innocent creatures who were trapped in a pen with no hope of escape.

Overeager, Cheney hunted with a shoot first, ask questions later mentality, and managed to strike his own partner, and send his friend to intensive care.

It later appears that Bush and his situation room (or so they said) had no idea what was going on on the ground there. They waited an entire day to even report the story, even though they obviously knew what happened. Hell, someone else had to force them to report the story, because they sure weren't going to unless they had to.

The official story then has Cheney blaming the victim, saying it was the victim's fault he got in Cheney's way.

It starts to become clear there was a pretty big hush-hush coverup job about it, but that the truth couldn't help but get leaked, despite the Administration's best wishes. There is even speculation that Cheney was possibly intoxicated, and not using his best intelligence before he started shooting.

And, of course, they couldn't afford to admit the truth, because the truth would probably be an impeachable offense.

---------------------------------------------------------

It's a perfect analogy for the way they have conducted their entire administration--and all the biggest flaws of this presidency are on display in one little vividly portrayed story.

A little story that has tremendous sway because, let's face it: THE VICE PRESIDENT JUST ACTUALLY SHOT ANOTHER HUMAN BEING. The imagery is clear and potent--and not subject to the typical political "he said, she said."

There is no way to play the usual equivocating politics with a story about the vice-president ACTUALLY SHOOTING SOMEONE.

And that's why I guarantee you this story isn't going away: It's a perfect way for the press to indict the entire Administration through the perfect metaphor.

And they'll be able to do it without retribution, or accusations that both sides aren't being fairly presented.

And it's going to haunt these assholes for a long, long time, if my hunch is correct.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/2/13/23432/4110

There are many links in the Diary - go to the link if you want to see any of them.

Maybe this will help, maybe not.

:)

edit to add - By request, I posted this in its own thread. Here is the link http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x427514

[tgnyc]

7. I understand all of that. But unlike, say, the Lewinsky mess, there is

apparently no actual crime to be covered up. All we are going after here is the shame of such unseemly, undignified, in Vice Presidential behavior in a POST-SHAME ERA. More thoughts here: http://intelligencesquad.blogspot.com/2006/02/on-cheney-shooting.html

[rurallib]

12. Isn't it illegal to drink while hunting?

And in response to the original question, is it an accident if a hunter is drunk?
But the Cheney admin always lies. We should acceot it and move on.

[Silverhair]

31. Do you have proof that he was intoxicated?

Otherwise it is just specualtion. You can't convict on specualtion, although many here are completely ready to do just that.

[oneighty]

15. Oh my

Are you saying getting an alleged BJ is a crime?

180

[tgnyc]

19. No. refering to the lying under oath about it.

[oneighty]

27. I do not think Clinton was

ever asked; "Did Monica do a blow job on you?"

Why bring Clinton in BTW?

180

[tgnyc]

29. to contrast our reaction to that "coverup" of a non-crime with our

reaction to this "cover-up" of a non-crime

[oneighty]

35. Crime

Guess it depends on where one lives. Here accidently shooting someone is considered a crime.

180

[Libby2]

22. Oh, now I understand.

It's all about sex.

We don't give a rat's ass about death or injury.

[Matariki]

37. I'd guess there are more people in jail for reckless endangerment

than for getting consensual blowjobs

[Skittles]

11. this needs to be posted in its own thread so we can rate it greatest!

it is the absolute TRUTH

[Pirate Smile]

17. I'll post it. It was front paged on Kos on Monday before the heart

attack.

[Pirate Smile]

20. Here you go - I posted it and here is the link.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x427514

[napi21]

16. Very well presented! I have to admit, I didn't put it all together that

way until I read this analysis.

I wish they could get a couple of talking heads to make that presentation on National TV!

[Marr]

26. Hey that's neat.

I hadn't even read that article but that was my take on the situation as well.

[Deep13]

5. Accidents just happen, this was reckless.

If someone gets shot, it is the shooter's fault, period. Now, that alone does not equal criminal liability, but negligence or recklessness with a firearm is usually a crime.

He was hunting in bad light. He shot without knowing his target and surroundings. He may not have had a valid license. He obstructed the police from investigating, apparently telling them to come back later. Then his goons made it look like it was the victim's fault. He may have been drunk based on one witness' statement.

This may not be nearly as bad as starting a war on a lie and then making money on it. Still, unlike most of his wrong doing which seems a bit esoteric, especially in the corporate media spin cycle, everyone knows what "he shot someone" means.

[Beetwasher]

6. Who Says It Deserves MORE Attention Than NSA Spying?

Where did anyone say that?

1. I have no clue, neither do you.

2. All of the above.

Who said there HAS to be a crime for it to be a big story?

"He's involved in covering-up a very unseemly, non-criminal event."

How do you know there was no crime? Seriously, how the fuck do you know?

I don't know that there definitely was a crime, but there's obviously covering up going on.

It's a big fucking story, deal with it.

[MadMaddie]

8. It's the cover up and the delay in reporting the accident...

This continues to follow the pattern that this administration uses.

It should have been a simple accidental shooting..All they had to do was tell the truth and get the story out as soon as possible.

They waited to report the incident to the local police...22 hours
When the story was reported it was by the land owner to a local newspaper...There should have been an official White House press release
The investigation was closed after 72 hours finding Cheney not at fault...

Every situation this group has their hands on they manage to fuck it up..
They lied about their response to Katrina...the new reports have shown that
They lied about the reasons to go to war...I don't even remember which excuse we are on now....

It shows a pattern of deceit and lies.....

Incompetence at every level....If they can't make sound decisions in an event like this...this leads me to believe that they are incapable of makeing decisions on a grander scale..

Just my two cents..:hi:

[slor]

10. It is not so much the shooting as it is the lack...

of understanding of the events that followed the shooting. In line with that, is the apparent disregard for the rule of law that this administration appears to take for granted. I will not argue with you that there are more pressing issues, but this one perfectly encapsulates this administration, for all the country to see. As I said last night, with all the other lies, it will be weird that a trigger happy drunkfest brings them all down, but I will take it.

[mdmc]

13. thank you for your post

wiretapping is much more troubeling. treason is much more troubeling. iraq lies...

[stop the bleeding]

18. e - i n/t

[Marr]

24. "F" and "I". They both speak to character.

One is an attempt to cover up, the other an attempt to deny responsibility. I think it strikes a chord with people because it just encapsulates the Bush Administration attitude toward the public.

[MrBenchley]

25. You mean you think unless it was deliberate attempted murder

It's hunky dory for the vice president of the US, with a history of drinking problems, to go to a lobbyist's ranch for a weekend hunting trip with a woman not his wife, shoot a 78 year old campaign contributor in the face and chest, obstruct local law enforcement, and then attempt to cover the incident up?

Wow.

Add to that the pResident was not informed immediately (and seemed utterly uninterested in who got shot) and that the only White House official to get involved in the shooting is the spin doctor who is involved in the CIA leak case, the person the pResident once promised to fire but did not?

[oldcoot]

28. Other

Every article I have read after the incident stated that the incident was an "accident" and each of those articles quoted one woman, Katharine Armstrong. It did not take too long for me to question Armstrong's credibility when she started describing how she had been shot in the past by careless hunters. Honestly, I thought that she was probably lying and if our beloved media and the police have decided that this shooting was an accident simply based on her statements then we have problems.

[ProfessorGAC]

30. Um. One Flaw I See

Covering up a shooting, accidental or not, is a criminal act. I can't accidently shoot you and then wait to notify the cops for a half-day. My butt would be in the sling if i did that, and so should Cheney's. And, on top of that, this idiot is accountable to the american people, not the other way around, so holding back the information because it would be inconvenient to report it is just tough cookies. If you can't stand the heat. . .
The Professor

[Silverhair]

32. Law enforcement was notified instantly. They were on the scene.

The SS guys ARE federal law enforcement officers.

[ProfessorGAC]

33. Not Their Jurisdiction

Sorry, but they aren't the secret police with dominion over any place they are. That was a local law enforcement issue, and unless the VP himself was the one who was shot, then the Secret Service doesn't have the authority to hold off the local police. Seriously; look it up. Their roles, responsibilities and jurisdiction is extremely tightly defined.
The Professor

[giant_robot]

38. The cover-up is raising questions, as it should.

First, this was not a minor hunting accident: this was bad. It's the hunters responsibility to make sure he has a clear shot, and in order to hit somebody with over 100 birdshot in the head, neck and chest you have to either have piss-poor judgment, absolutely no regard for the safety of your fellow hunters, or a rip-roaring beer buzz (or any combination of those three). Just how negligent Cheney was is still open for debate, but not notifying the authorities for 22 hours suggests he was concealing something. If it were just a bad accident, and Cheney owned up to it and got things in the open right away, then I'm sure this would have blown over in a week or so, after all the late night shows did their jokes. But he didn't own up, and this stinks of something worse.