Graphic warning-is this a child in Abu ghraib photos?

[w8liftinglady]

No torture is justifiable-but if we are torturing children,then we have crossed the line and become an evil nation along the lines of Amin's Uganda.
http://smh.com.au/ffximage/2006/02/15/abughraib9,0.jpg

[Xithras]

1. I don't think so.

Leg, pit, and pube hair indicates it's not a kid. That doesn't make the situation any more acceptable, but we apparently haven't stooped that low yet.

[Clark2008]

2. The one on the right is a child.

I have a half-Arabic child and that one appears to be about 11ish or so.

If he was any older, chances are he'd have some chest hair. This little fella doesn't.

:cry:

[w8liftinglady]

3. That was my impression-10 or 11

[demosincebirth]

27. I don't think so, He has more hair on his legs than do.

[blm]

12. It looks like a child BEHIND the adult on the left. He's kneeling with his

back up against the man. He's barely noticeable, but look at the tiny feet compared to the man on the right.

[Warpy]

4. Not a kid this time, but apparently there are photos with kids in them

They do abuse kids to make their fathers talk. Whether or not the abuse rises to the level of torture, I don't know. However, they threaten the children in front of their parents.

That's been reported several times in the MSM, usually buried.

[madeline_con]

16. There's a pic here of a guy with his kid ...

sent to me from my son in the M.E.

The story is, it's to get the guys to talk. There's also rumors of raping daughters in front of Dads...



http://itsacrime.us/mideast_more.html

[w8liftinglady]

28. OMG-I remember that picture.

[helderheid]

5. The one on the right has to be about 10 or 11.

[trof]

6. "Im a rapeist."

I guess it figures.
:-(

Not to be confused with "rapist" or "rappist".

[seabeyond]

7. i here (teasing) ya

[LittleClarkie]

10. I saw that. Morans. And yeah, that does look like a kid

or at least a teen.

[Cocoa]

13. you're such an elitist

these men are the heart and soul of America. Maybe if they could have afforded to go to all the fancy colleges the liberals go to, with all the leftist professors, they would have spelled the word right on the prisoner's ass.

[trof]

24. I know. I'm so ashamed.

Me...born with a golden spoon in my nose and the greased skids to Andover, Yale, and S&B.
(Sorry, I have to use the initials.)

Putting down some poor ignorant yobbo for his lack of education and ability to spell words correctly.
Shame on me.
*hangs head*

[madeline_con]

17. Typical RW freeper speeling. n/t

[rumpel]

29. embarrassing

[KansDem]

8. At first I didn't see a child in this photo, until I scrolled to the right

I see now...

It sure looks like a boy about 10 or so...

Does DU have a emoticon that shows complete numbness or emptiness?

[Mr_Spock]

9. No

C'mon, let's not get all crazy here and imagine things!

[MrSlayer]

11. I don't see anyone who looks like a child in that photo.

They all look like mature men to me. No child is that hairy.

[Tulum_Moon]

15. It looks like a child

The way he is standing.

[blm]

25. Look behind the left adult prisoner. A child is kneeling with his back up

against that prisoner.

[MrSlayer]

32. I'm looking but I can't see a child.

The person kneeling behind the one prisoner is too obscured to make out. I can't say that it is a child. I guess you can call it a maybe as you can't really tell. The people you can clearly see are definitely not children.

[blm]

38. Look how tiny the feet and the body frame. No way is the kneeling figure

an adult. Way too delicate a frame.

[SmokingJacket]

14. I'd say about 14.

He looks about halfway to manhood, but not quite there yet.

:cry:

[tnlefty]

22. I was thinking in the range of 13 to 16 based on the appearance of

my boys. The 16 yr. old is hairier and is starting to trim in at the waist, expand in the chest and shoulders. The 13 yr. old has a bit of hair (like the person on the right) has hair starting on the lower abdomen and in the armpits, but not as much as the other man in the photo and he is still appearing fairly 'straight up' through the torso.

I just hate thinking about it.

[SmokingJacket]

34. I have boys too. Can't even think about it. nt

[w8liftinglady]

35. That's what I was comparing him to...my 10 and 15 year olds

He appears less developed than my 15 year-old.

[tnlefty]

36. Mine have turned 16 and 13 this month and the youngest will be 11.

The one who will turn 11 isn't anywhere near that stage of development. The male in question in the photo looks between the older 2 and they are just barely their ages. Just makes my blood run cold. And it truly disgusts me that anyone would think that torturing anyone is OK, but children??!!!

Oh yeah, George, there's another ol' sayin' that I've heard all of my life for people who commit or overlook really heinous acts: There's a special place in hell, but Dear Leader, I'm certain that you forgot that ol' sayin'.

[NNN0LHI]

18. Its probably the 15 year old kid described in the Taguba Report here

http://news.findlaw.com/nytimes/docs/iraq/tagubarpt.html

The "Taguba Report" On Treatment
Of Abu Ghraib Prisoners In Iraq



ARTICLE 15-6 INVESTIGATION
OF THE
800th MILITARY POLICE BRIGADE


SECRET / NO FOREIGN DISSEMINATION1



<snip> (S) Writing "I am a Rapest" (sic) on the leg of a
detainee alleged to have forcibly raped a 15-year old
fellow detainee, and then photographing him naked;

(S) Videotaping and photographing naked male and
female detainees;

(S) Forcibly arranging detainees in various
sexually explicit positions for photographing;

(S) A male MP guard having sex with a female
detainee;

(U) Sodomizing a detainee with a chemical light and
perhaps a broom stick.

[w8liftinglady]

23. thank you

[countryjake]

19. No body hair, no chest development, looks like a child to me.

The senators reported that some of the videos and photos depicted violent rapes, which totally sickened them.

I would guess that this young boy was in the process of being raped, thus the Iraqi man on the floor with the slogan written on his leg.

It's also been reported that children have been tortured in front of their parents, in order to get statements.

It makes my imagination hurt to think of what was actually going down in that photo!

[Kansas Wyatt]

20. Do the idiots who set up this photo-op scene of 'Murikan' pride

Not know how to spell?

Writing on the man's leg in the bottom of the photo: "IM A RAPEIST"

If the glory hounds are proud enough to take photos of their tough guy persona, one would think that they would at least NOT make themselves look like total morons.

[Just Me]

21. Has this cabal crossed the line? Yes.

They did the minute they prioritized their power over a democratic nation.

They are fucked-up. How much evidence does it take to demonstrate just how fucked-up they truly are? When will people GET just how far these "crazies" will go?

:shrug:

This nation is screwed. It's gonna' get worse,...a LOT worse,...because the domineering bullies are in charge and NO ONE is brave enough to throw the f*ckers OFF the playground.

[w8liftinglady]

37. you're right-just look at the past few weeks

[Catrina]

26. OMG!! How low has this country sunk ~

Sy Hersch said there were children being abused. He was frightened, he said, to report on it. That was over a year ago.

This country is being run by a bunch of total psychopaths and the silence and lack of outrage is unbelievable. Lindsey Graham SAW the pictures. He expressed horror. During the hearings when Dick Cheney was trying to hide all this and stop the hearings (his reason for telling Leahy to go f#$k himself) Lindsey Graham said to Cheney 'Let us do our job, Mr. Vice President, we are talking about rape and murder here!'

What happened to that Lindsey Graham?? That was after he and other Senators saw the videos and were trying to make the decision about releasing them. He was horrified, you could see it in his face, and disturbed enough to take on Cheney over it.

So, what happened?? Those hearings were supposed to resume but they didn't ~ the UN has now called for the closing of Guantanamo Bay. There's enough evidence now that torture is going on there also. Gen (treat-the-Iraqis-like-dogs) Miller was in Guantanamo Bay and then sent to Abu Ghraib ~

This country, under this administration, has sunk into hell, and the American people are silent about all this, as are their representatives, for the most part.

And we're supposed to have sympathy for one of the orchestrators of all this horror, who claims he 'had a bad day' when he shot his friend himself, this time, instead of hiring others, as he usually does, to do his torture and killing for him. And they profit from all this?? How on earth do they sleep at night?

[rumpel]

30. In any event, I have not heard the "insurgents" strip their captives naked

[w8liftinglady]

31. article by our own Will Pitt

http://www.pww.org/article/articleview/5540/1/144/
-snip-
The biggest story of the Iraq war is about the torture of Iraqi children.

A German TV magazine called Report Mainz recently aired accusations from the International Red Cross, to the effect that over 100 children are imprisoned in U.S.-controlled detention centers, including Abu Ghraib. “Between January and May of this year, we’ve registered 107 children, during 19 visits in 6 different detention locations,” said Red Cross representative Florian Westphal in the report.

The report also outlined eyewitness testimony of the abuse of these children. Staff Sergeant Samuel Provance, who was stationed at Abu Ghraib, said that interrogating officers had gotten their hands on a 15- or 16-year-old girl. Military police only stopped the interrogation when the girl was half undressed. A separate incident described a 16-year-old being soaked with water, driven through the cold, smeared with mud, and then presented before his weeping father, who was also a prisoner.

[HeeBGBz]

33. A child or small person

This is sick. Has this creep been charged with anything yet? Its the same guy in almost all the pix.

[Clara T]

39. Beyond Appalling

[myrna minx]

40. Oh---I can't believe that this was done in our name.

:cry:

[w8liftinglady]

41. The point of this is-why is America silent?

Why do Americans condone this through their silence?The pundits say that everyone responsible has been brought to trial.Why is it,then,that we have refused to allow the International Red Cross into our detainment camps?Is it because we are still torturing and killing?We are still using children as a weapon against their parents?We are still detaining children as criminals?This disgusts me,yet I feel impotent.

[NorthernSpy]

42. those are not the shoulders of a grown man

No suggestion of chest hair on the person furthest to the right. That, and the small wrists and light shoulders, and the general conformation of the body point to one conclusion:

That person at the right edge of the photo is not just a fully grown man of short stature. That's a kid.


I can scarcely believe what I'm seeing... THAT is what we're doing over there?

[w8liftinglady]

43. I know-that was my conclusion

I was a pediatric nurse for a few years,and have seen kids in all developmental stages-and I can tell you that is no adult.For some reason,this particular picture bothers me.It bothered me all night.I couldn't help but see my goofy 15-year-old's face on that kid's body.I know my 15 year-old.they can't be THAT different.How scared and vulnerable that poor kid must have felt.I can't help but wonder if he is still alive,does his mother worry about him?

[GreenPartyVoter]

44. I see a man with no chest hair sitting against another man? Maybe a teen

[w8liftinglady]

45. Information re:Child Detainees-as current as possible

since there is reluctance to allow any media or aid organizations into these detention centers,this is the best information out there:

http://www.irinnews.org/report.asp?ReportID=42192&SelectRegion=Iraq_Crisis&SelectCountry=IRAQ
-snip-
Access to child detainees is difficult and human rights groups are concerned about their welfare, particularly following the release of photos in late April showing US troops apparently forcing prisoners to simulate sex acts and abusing prisoners.

Amnesty International (AI) complained that it had been "refused access" to enter Coalition detention centres, except for a brief visit to one in Mosul, in northern Iraq. A researcher at the international watchdog Human Rights Watch (HRW) also said workers did not have access to detained children. Clarisa Bencomo, the researcher, wondered if the children were being kept in poor or unsafe conditions.

In addition, earlier this year the United Nations Children's Fund (UNICEF) issued a statement raising concern over child detainees: "UNICEF is profoundly disturbed by news reports alleging that children may have been among those abused in detention centres and prisons in Iraq. Although the news reports have not been independently substantiated, they are alarming nonetheless," the statement said.

http://www.antiwar.com/orig/croke.php?articleid=3286
Despite sworn testimony from eyewitnesses, a "highly placed source in the Pentagon" told the Sunday Herald that investigations have found no evidence that children interned in Iraq have been mistreated. This directly contradicted sworn statements from witnesses given to Army investigators in January, as well as the recent statements of investigative journalist Seymour Hersh.




http://www.truthout.org/cgi-bin/artman/exec/view.cgi/37/9565
-snip-
Karpinski, who was in charge of Abu Ghraib from July to November 2003, said she often visited the prison's youngest inmates. One boy "looked like he was 8-years-old," Karpinski said.

"He told me he was almost 12," Karpinski said. "He told me his brother was there with him, but he really wanted to see his mother, could he please call his mother. He was crying."

Military officials have acknowledged that some juvenile prisoners had been held at Abu Ghraib, a massive prison built by Saddam Hussein's government outside Baghdad. But the transcript is the first documented evidence of a child no older than 11 being held prisoner.

http://web.takebackthemedia.com/geeklog/public_html/article.php?story=20040710043957788
-snip-
In July of 2003, UNICEF requested to visit this prison, but access was denied.”

Since December there have been no independent observers at all in the children’s jail, according to UNICEF. Admittedly, the U.S. army opened the scandalous Abu Ghraib prison to journalists for a tour. But an exemplary prison was presented to the reporters. The press didn’t get to see imprisoned children.

-snip-
O-Ton, Barbara Lochbihler, General Secretary of Amnesty International:

The U.S. government must of course say something about this report. They must give concrete information: how old the children are, what the prison conditions are like, and under what circumstances the children were detained. And if the children were exposed to torture and abuse. And here we don’t even know the children’s names and how many children there are. Independent inspections are not desired. That’s scandalous.”

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article6492.htm
-snip-
Seymour Hersh : The US government has videotapes of boys being sodomized at Abu Ghraib prison.

"The worst is the soundtrack of the boys shrieking," the reporter told an ACLU convention last week. Hersh says there was "a massive amount of criminal wrongdoing that was covered up at the highest command out there, and higher."

http://www.iht.com/articles/2005/06/29/opinion/edchild.php
-snip-
Children, too, are abused in U.S. prisons

http://www.arcticbeacon.com/27-Jan-2006.html
Although the U.S. government is in possession of video tapes of boys being sodomized at Abu Ghraib and other detention centers, the evidence and public clamor to end the torture and killing has done little to change the mindset of the Bush administration.

Lawyers for President Bush, including U.S. Attorney Gen. Alberto Gonzales, have tried to neatly package and justify skirting international law regarding the illegal detention of prisoners.



Are you outraged yet?