Investigation Reopened into Cheney Shooting

[kpete]

Investigation Reopened into Cheney Shooting

The Dallas Morning News on the Cheney hunting accident: "Kenedy County sheriff's deputies have redoubled their efforts to investigate the case after criticism of their decision not to interview witnesses until a day after the shooting."

"Ms. Armstrong said she faxed a detailed account to deputies on Wednesday at the sheriff's request. She said she would have done so sooner if she'd been asked and added that everyone at the ranch has been encouraged to tell the truth about the shooting."

http://politicalwire.com/archives/2006/02/16/investigation_reopened_into_cheney_shooting.html

[livetohike]

1. Apparently the rich and powerful in TX do not have to follow

the same rules as others. It's ridiculous that the investigation was not done promptly.

Faxing an account of the incident on Wednesday!! Four days after this happened? Guess they had plenty of time to get their story straight.

[Harald Ragnarsson]

50. Not just Texas

The Rich and Powerful don't have to follow the same rules as others anywhere. They just make the rules.

That's why if you are a 21 year old in the service, you get kicked out for getting a DUI, but if you are Bush or Cheney you can have DUIS(plural)and be President and Vice-President.

[FreedomAngel82]

54. Remember the local sheriff did try

but they kept him away.

[jedicord]

2. Everyone is being encouraged to tell the truth?

Well, isn't that special.

[Roland99]

42. They had to be encouraged? As if there was some doubt they would?

LOL!

[Blue Belle]

44. Encourage to tell the truth...

the truth that has been dictated to them by Cheney's hinchmen. Yeah... I'm sure that the Sherrif's department is going to no stone go unturned in that investigation. :eyes:

[TexasLady]

56. yup that was the sentence that strruck my eye

and now it hurts Ow...:(

[Burried News]

3. Yeah Dallas is great at investigating shootings ...

[Harald Ragnarsson]

62. That pictures looks so staged, IMO

Either that or Jack Ruby was the Fastest Gun in the West.

[mikeytherat]

64. Now THERE'S a stringent security network!

"Hey, boss. The guy who owns the local titty bar is here with a handgun - should we let him in?"
Yeah. Let him in."

mikey_the_rat

[CrazyOrangeCat]

4. !

:puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke:

[txindy]

5. "...everyone at the ranch has been encouraged to tell the truth..."

Is that why her story changed and she went from being an 'eyewitness' to simply following the security detail running to the scene, wondering if Darth was having a heart attack? Too bad, then. Darth said on TV yesterday that, "First of all, she was an eye-witness. She'd seen the whole thing." They are losing their touch when it comes to coordinating their fairy tales.

[Arkansas Granny]

14. Geesh! Even a 14 hour delay doesn't give them enought time

to get their stories straight. Maybe it took too long to sober up.

[maxrandb]

52. They Don't Have to Coordinate Their Fairy Tales

They have Faux News, CNN, MSGOP, Rush, Insanity, and O'Really to sprinkle "pixy dust" for them.

Don't you know if you point out the inconsistencies in their story, it's just because you're part of the "looney left", or "liberal media"???

Why do you hate Murika?

[myrna minx]

6. This is great news, even thought I doubt that anything will come of it. n/

[BR_Parkway]

7. Honey, the police want to talk to you - "just tell them to fax their

questions, I'll respond"

Glad to see no one ever gets treated differently in the US

[Ganja Ninja]

15. Exactly! And the media whines on about why ...

they weren't informed. The answer to that is :spray:! Who gives a fuck about them. I want to know where the hell Cheney gets off telling the cops to 'come back tomorrow'?!!! Who else can do that?

[KansDem]

24. The Ramseys of Boulder County, Colorado

December 26, 1996--Jon Benet Ramsey find murdered.

April 30, 1997--the Ramseys were interviewed by police.

[Ganja Ninja]

33. But they at least had to talk to the police when they reported her

missing. They weren't considered suspects at the time of her disappearance. They didn't have a friend report her missing and then tell the cops to go away and come back tomorrow. That's the difference. Cheney didn't have any direct contact with the police until the next day.

[Peace Patriot]

47. Good catch! Here's another one:

May 1, 2001: Congressman Gary Condit's mistress, young Chandra Levy, disappears from her apartment without a trace. His schedule that day, released in June, has one big hole in it, from 12 noon to 3 pm--the timeframe of her disappearance--with only one witness to Condit's whereabouts during that time--Dick Cheney (a meeting with Cheney at noon on Capitol Hill).

June 2001: No one--not FBI, not DC police, no reporter--question Cheney or his staff about that meeting, not even to ask if it took place.

July 2001: Ditto.

August 2001: Ditto. Cheney staff plant Cheney's version of the meeting in a Newsweek story (short meeting, 20 minutes, 2 staff present, and state that no one had questioned Cheney or his staff).

May 2002: (nine months later, post 9/11) Chandra Levy's bones found in Rock Creek Park, not far off a path.

---------

Another twist to this story: The timeframe for Levy's disappearance was initially mid-morning (10 am to noon). The FBI ostensibly took three months to discover from her computer that she was still using her computer in the early afternoon, and had done a MapQuest search for Rock Creek Park. The new disappearance time-frame was announced publicly--revealing (to those bothering to notice) that Cheney was Condit's only alibi during that time--and was highlighted by the DC police conducting a high profile photo op of police recruits searching Rock Creek Park (a second search of the Park). Only then did the Cheney version of his meeting with Condit appear in Newsweek. (Suspicion: that the FBI and maybe the DC police knew all along that the disappearance time coincided with Condit's meeting with Cheney, but withheld that information from the public until Cheney had decided what his version of the meeting was going to be, and how that information would reach the public.)

Yet another twist: Levy disappeared on May 1. On May 3, Condit cast one of only 10 Democratic votes in favor of Bush's first tax cut for the rich (a very close vote, that Bush won).

Other things occurring at the time: Cheney secret energy meetings/Rome meeting of Ladeen, Italian intelligence and Ghorbanifar (planning for post 9/11 invasion of Iraq); Enron scandal/meltdown--$9 billion stolen from Calif (Condit a Calif Congressman). Events that summer: the Bush junta ignoring all pre-9/11 intelligence on Al Qaeda/OBL's activities; Bush/Cheney approval numbers plummeting; Tom Delay and Bob Ney engineered a $4 billion boondoggle "election reform" bill (following 2000 "hanging chad" scandal) which permitted rightwing Bushite electronic voting firms to gain control of the nation's election system using "trade secret," proprietary programming code with virtually no audit/recount controls; the FBI was under investigation by the House Intelligence Committee, on which Condit sat; the war profiteering corporate news monopolies were consumed all summer with tales of Condit's mistresses and the Levy disappearance.

[FreedomAngel82]

57. I wonder how many other Levy's there are and we just don't know it

I'm tired of them getting away with murder!

[jobycom]

8. In case anyone is wondering about political bias in Kenedy County

Here's a link of the 2004 election returns:
http://elections.sos.state.tx.us/elchist.exe

Notice that Kerry beat Bush in Kenedy County. Out of 169 votes! :rofl:

[Junkdrawer]

21. You may want to read this thread. Kenedy County is a private fiefdom...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x438964

[jobycom]

23. LOL! Yeah, but they still voted for Kerry!

I love southern rural politics!

[Junkdrawer]

25. Tells me that servants out number the masters and that the county...

was too small for election fraud...

In Western PA, we have a similar place: Ligonier (Andrew Carnegie and company's private little town)

[havocmom]

9. CYA or CCA?

Little late to collect any materials which would discern whether Cheney had alcohol in his system at time of shooting. That would seem to be important.

Amrstrong, coached by former Cheney aid Matalin, giving her story again?

Hey, if she was an eye wittiness, why did she say she thought Cheney was injured or ill at first? She saw the SS detail moving and thought something was wrong with Cheney. So, just how well does this eye witness see if she didn't notice the guy with all the blood was Whittington?

Eye wittness? Halliburton Board Member, supported Cheney for CEO... didn't see enough to see who the victim was? :wtf:

[Stephanie]

16. and considering Whittington was supposed to be 30 yards away!

How does she think they are running to Cheney if he is 30 yards from Whittington?

[havocmom]

19. Reliable tendency of shot to scatter wider in proportion to distance

from muzzle... That's a pretty tight pattern Mr. Whettington is sporting...

'30 yards my ass' says a bunch of good ol Montana boys who have been shooting since they were tall enough to hold a shotgun.

And about her judgment at the time of the incident... What did she wash her lunch down with? And what was she amusing herself with at the car while the boys were blasting?

And does Mary Matalin have a fax? ;)

[oneighty]

10. Does living on a RANCH

convey special privileges to the inhabitants that they must be encouraged to tell the truth? Are they inferring that without that encouragement to tell the truth that they would be expected to lie?

Seems like a lot of bullshit of several kinds emanates from ranches.

180

[mtnsnake]

11. They should start out with lie detector tests monitored by members of DU

[WI_DEM]

12. well, if Ms. Armstrong stated the facts--then case closed!

[Ganja Ninja]

Why don't we just put Dead Eye Dick on a box and wire him up!

Get to the bottom of things fast.

[Blue Belle]

45. Wiring him up would probably screw with his pace maker.

Besides, he never has to swear to tell the truth in Congressional Hearings... what makes you think that the truth would get told to Andy and Barney at the Sherrif's office?? :eyes:

[warrens]

13. Dayum, I'm movin' to Texas

Apparently, you can shoot someone, have a friend fax the cops that you didn't do nothin' wrong, and the cops just go away. I foresee a lucrative career in robbing banks.

[w8liftinglady]

26. ..well as long as your last name is Armstrong,or King,or Bush,or Cheney

[Cleita]

66. That's only if you're white. Blacks and Mexicans better

follow the law and often, even if they do follow it, sometimes they run afoul of the law anyway just for being whom they are.

[stop the bleeding]

17. kpete, the link inside your link to the paper does not mention anything

about the Kenedy SO redoubling their effort, could this be another version of the MSNCB scrubbing?

on edit: I found them - very cool!!!

[Richard Steele]

18. So, the woman who didn't see anything has faxed a detailed account?

Gee, I'll bet that is really useful stuff!:sarcasm:

Never forget: this person ADMITTED she was not a witness!!!
She first claimed that, when she saw the SS rush toward the area,
she thought perhaps Cheney was having heart trouble.
SHE CLEARLY DID NOT SEE THE SHOOTING!

Some REAL cops need to tell her where to stick her FAXES,
and sit her down in an interrogation room for a few hours
to discuss her blatant OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.
She is obviously LYING, and everyone knows it.

[berni_mccoy]

20. My guess: pure show... pay no attention to the man behind the curtains...

[FreedomAngel82]

59. So true

Nothing will come of this.

[stop the bleeding]

22. Am I the only one who went to the Dallas Morning News link and found

no mention of these statements?????

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/021606dntexcheney.1515da40.html

[janx]

27. They are there.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/021606dntexcheney.1515da40.html


Scroll down a bit, and you'll find them.

[stop the bleeding]

28. Jeez I must be blind I read the article 3 times and missed it every time

found them on this last try - Thank you :blush::blush::blush::blush::blush:

[janx]

32. Well it's not a huge part of the article.

Don't worry--I have the same problem sometimes. :pals:

[rumpel]

65. His argument of his primary concern for the wellbeing of his friend does

not hold water.

"My first reaction ... was not to think: I need to call the press," he said. "My first reaction is, 'My friend Harry has been shot, and we've got to take care of him.' "

Mr. Cheney said he returned to the ranch after the accident and did not go to the hospital with Mr. Whittington. An ambulance and a physician's assistant were stationed at the ranch, and the vice president said he asked the assistant to accompany his friend to the hospital.

If one would be so concerned about the wellbeing of someone, especially when you are the one causing harm to him/her, you simply go along!

[buckfush1979]

29. Who Let the Dogs Out

Does anyone else find it funny that not one recount of this story has mentioned the fact that there were hunting dogs present? These are old guys, they are going to be using hunting dogs. However, if they were using dogs then Mr.Whittington wouldn't have had to go retrieve the bird he shot and he would be with the group. Not only the rest of the group wouldn't have continued on without all of the dogs in the group.

Has anyone heard any of the recounts mention dogs being present?

[stop the bleeding]

30. Welcome to DU buckfush1979!!! You are right about the dog's, but I

have heard that the real dog's(Lynne Cheney) were in DC

:toast::toast::toast::toast:

[buckfush1979]

34. That's not funny

Why must you criticize someone's looks? That doesn't help anyone and it makes you look pathetic. Thanks for the welcome though.

[jsamuel]

35. you are right

but it is a public forum and people end up typing things as they think them and often inappropriate things come out.

WELCOME TO DU!!!

:party: :toast: :bounce: :beer: :headbang: :yourock: :woohoo: :applause: :patriot:

[stop the bleeding]

37. ouch! - key words" I have heard" not the same as here is my opinion

Also I think the people making the original jokes about her - were making fun of the fact that she is a real b**ch(like a dog) as opposed to saying she looks like a dog. I could be wrong but that was my take anyway.


:toast::toast::toast:

[hwmnbn]

36. I had thought about that .....

but since I'm not a hunter, I didn't know exactly how that worked.

Welcome to DU. :hi:

[uncle ray]

41. it was mentioned a few days ago that the dogs...

used in Quail hunting would have been pointers, not retrievers. basically used to find and flush the birds.

[northofdenali]

72. Exactly what I thought, too.

Woof woof, Mr. Whittington? Also, Whittington was approaching Cheney from the direction of the CAR. What's Dickless doing aiming anywhere toward a car, regardless of where the fucking bird is flying?

Welcome to DU, buckfush :hi:

[FSogol]

31. Encouraged to tell the truth? A new right wing policy?

Or just another lie?

[fknobbit]

38. All part of the plan

The crime scene has not been secured and combed. Any Lawyer with enough brains to stay outta the front of a shotgun could get a dismissal here. Evidence could be easily planted at the new crime scene (see bloody black leather glove) there are no witnesses.... and Austin attorney Harry "quail" Whittington will stay with party line. We are playing right into their hands dwelling on this.

[marions ghost]

40. catch 22

we play into their hands by ignoring it.

[bluedog]

39. Sheriffs daughters boyfriend at Ranch!

...........

Meanwhile, law enforcement experts questioned the decision by sheriff's deputies to not interview Cheney or other hunters the day the shooting occurred.

"It is unusual," said James Stinebaugh, who retired as chief of law enforcement for Texas Parks and Wildlife last year. "Anytime you don't get an investigation done as quickly as possible, and talk to people on the scene, you give up some of the authenticity of the investigation."


snip

Stinebaugh and others said they were not questioning the outcome of the investigation, just the decision by investigators to wait a day before querying witnesses.

snip


Kenedy County Sheriff Ramon Salinas III, whose department investigated the shooting, has said he talked by phone to employees of Armstrong Ranch, including the boyfriend of his daughter, who assured him the shooting was accidental.

"They told me what happened," Salinas said. "I decided (to) let them sleep on it. I said we'll go in the morning."

On Sunday morning, Salinas' investigators talked to Cheney and questioned Katharine Armstrong, his host and fellow hunter, and Whittington at the hospital.

snip




And Ramiro Medellin, a county constable who also works at the ranch, said he had no doubts it was an accident.

But it did not surprise him that Salinas did not question anyone the evening of the shooting. Secret Service agents told the sheriff that it was an accident, and he trusted their word.

"This is the federal government, and they run the show," Medellin said Tuesday. "They say who comes and goes. They are in charge. I know from experience."

A spokesman for the Secret Service declined to comment about the sheriff's investigation. But he said federal agents acted properly by informing the sheriff of the shooting within an hour of its occurrence.

"It was at the sheriff's request that somebody come out the following morning, which we facilitated and passed through to the vice president's office," said Eric Zahren, a spokesman for the Secret Service.

And Cheney spokeswoman Jennifer Mayfield said "the vice president was available immediately after the incident for questioning."

"Our Secret Service (detail) reached out to the sheriff's office," she said. "The sheriff's office suggested 10 a.m. (Sunday). The vice president wanted to do it sooner and the meeting happened at 8 a.m. He was always available for questioning,"
snip


But Ronald R. Scott, a retired Massachusetts state trooper who now consults in ballistics cases, said the investigators erred by not going to the ranch on Saturday night. Investigators probably lost their chance to recreate the scene of the shooting, he said.

"I think that is improper to be quite honest," Scott said. "Even if there was no wrongdoing, it is still improper not to do it."


http://www.bradenton.com/mld/bradenton/news/nation/13872544.htm

[FreedomAngel82]

61. So why was the sherrif's daughters boyfriend there??

[BringEmOn]

63. In other words, the SS made them an offer they couldn't refuse???

[reality based]

43. The failure to allow sheriff's deputies onto the scene that night,

the cruelly misguided attempts to blame the victim, the ballistics uncertainties, the cryptic references to alcohol consumption, and the suppressed guest list will forever put the official accounts into question. The burden has shifted to the "alibiers" (rhymes with liars).

[Skidmore]

46. Failure = obstruction--interferring with an investigation

Something you or I would go to prison for.

[reality based]

48. We still don't have a clear account of what happened at the gate

when the deputies came that night. The NYTimes says that a Border Patrol member was on guard but didn't know there had been a shooting. I guess he hadn't seen the ambulance pass by. The sheriff's office doesn't appear to want to talk about it either. Reporter's don't appear to be any more diligent. Reminds me more of an empire than a republic. Communication down at the ranch seems to have been painfully difficult also. Some sort of Bermuda Triangle effect on cell phones I guess.

[kayice]

49. And Cheney having a 'cocktail' at dinner (to calm down or whatever)

is something a drunk will do after the fact, so they can say, "Well, I had a drink cause I was shook up." There goes the alcohol test. Was Cheney worried the Sheriff's office might change their minds and come out to the ranch before morning?

[leftofthedial]

51. you don't seriously expect "justice," do you?

there is ZERO justice in Murca, especially in Texas

there is just rich and not rich--have and have not

If you "have" you are above the law--look at EVERY action by the bush crime gang and their cronies for their entire lives

If you "have not" you will feel the full force of the powerful class's enforcers (sheriffs and cops)

[FreedomAngel82]

53. And I bet they're a new set of details huh?

[Vinca]

55. The sheriff must be a magician.

I don't know how else he'll come up with a blood alcohol test on Cheney right after the shooting.

[Sydnie]

58. Want to bet Scotty knew about this before his press briefing today?

He basically dismissed the whole thing as something that the "Americian people" understand was just an accident and the press is spinning it into more than the people think it is.

Scotty, put the shovel down dude. Cheney shoots low, remember?

[pitohui]

60. a bit late isn't it?

what good is it to investigate now? of course everybody is going to back up the veep and his powerful friends

the investigation should have been immediate and involved the use of testing for alcohol impairment

unless someone gets an attack of conscience -- and this is republicans we're talking abt, so that can't happen -- investigating now is just a whitewash

[marions ghost]

67. yeah a bit late

but an investigation even now could still turn up something. The police need to be given a chance.

[dogday]

68. Let me see if I get this right

I live in Texas, so I can accidentally shoot someone and not call 911 because he is hurt and not speak with the authorities until I am good and ready at least 12 hours.. Texas, what a state!!!!!

[lpbk2713]

69. "Redoubled" ?

Does that mean quadrupled?


DU grammar nazis, please pick up the white courtesy phone. Thank you.

[Nothing Without Hope]

70. Maybe they were embarrassed by reporting like Keith Olbermann's (LINK)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x447244
thread title (2-16-06 GD): VIDEO- KO Covers the Hunting Discrepancies (Brand-Booze)
Comment/excerpt: Liveoaktx VIDEO clip from Keith Olbermann shoots the hell out of Cheney's story. Shows the discrepancies between Cheney's Fox interview and other testimony, then brings on attorney Brand for some more questions.

And the late-night comedy shows have had a field day. IMO the funniest of all was Jon Stewart's the first night:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x410214
thread title (2-13-06 GD): VIDEO- The Daily Show-Cheney ....; SHOT
Comment/excerpt: Possibly the funniest Jon Stewart show EVER. And absolutely devastating to the WH.

But there have been many others too. David Letterman has covered it for THREE NIGHTS, and the latest was quite pointed:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=437384
thread title (2-16-06 GD): VIDEO- Letterman on Cheney Night 3
Comment/excerpt: Quail are rumored to be hiding in the mountains near Pakistan. Strong statement on the drinking aspect – was Cheney drinking before we invaded Iraq? “Heart attack!!? says Cheney, “Don’t steal MY act, bitch, or I’ll take you out!”

COMPILATION of threads, including video clips from Can-o-Fun, have been collected in threads in GD and in the Research Forum:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=358x3133
thread title (2-14-06 RESEARCH FORUM): Compilation of threads on 2/06 Cheney shooting incident, including videos

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x411916
thread title (2-14-06 GD): Thread COMPILATION on Cheney shooting/Fuddgate - including VIDEOS:

I'll add the current thread to the Compilation.

Bottom line: the evidence is old now, there never was an alcohol test, and the witnesses have had plenty of time to make up and coordinate their cover stories. Re-opening the investigation is not going to accomplish much except possibly a censure of the police who so bungled it in the beginning.

[crispini]

71. Is this true? I can't find the original quote in the OP.

I followed the link and then the link to the DMN story from there and that quote is not in the DMN story, as far as I can tell.

Are there any other sources for this? I would think it would be big, if true.

[Nothing Without Hope]

73. From the Feb 15 Dallas Morning News article:

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/021606dntexcheney.1515da40.html

"Kenedy County sheriff's deputies have redoubled their efforts to investigate the case after criticism of their decision not to interview witnesses until a day after the shooting."

Hi, Crispi! :hi: How's the pink fuzzy handcuffs? KO's been in good form on Fuddgate, especially here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x447244
thread title (2-16-06 GD): VIDEO- KO Covers the Hunting Discrepancies (Brand-Booze)
Comment/excerpt: Liveoaktx VIDEO clip from Keith Olbermann shoots the hell out of Cheney's story. Shows the discrepancies between Cheney's Fox interview and other testimony, then brings on attorney Brand for some more questions.

[Nothing Without Hope]

74. ***Is this investigation STILL open? This site says it was closed Feb 16,

the day AFTER the Dallas paper's article was dated, the 15th:

http://infowars.com/articles/us/cheney_shooting_scientific_proof.htm
"In Conclusion the Kenedy County Sheriffs department closed its investigation on Thursday February 16th, without ever even being allowed to conduct one."

[Citrene]

75. Who here really gives a S and why should we? What's new with

this crew? We are all really going to pretend outrage over this?

I'm tired and I don't give a s anymore.

May they all eat cake.

"See you guys, I'm going home!"

[kevinbgoode]

76. This is getting curiouser and curiouser

and what the f*ck is up with this?:

"everyone at the ranch has been encouraged to tell the truth about the shooting."


Why would any public official have to be "encouraged" to "tell the truth?" Oh yeah...they are Republicans.