Chapaquiddick

[Robb]

Can someone point me to a reputable story about Ted Kennedy's supposed hit-and-run? My (freeperish) dad is driving me nuts with his dittoheading.

[cynatnite]

1. Here you go...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Kennedy#Chappaquiddick

On July 18, 1969, after a party on Chappaquiddick Island near the island of Martha's Vineyard, Massachusetts, Kennedy, allegedly intoxicated, a claim which he denies, drove away with Mary Jo Kopechne as a passenger in his 1967 Oldsmobile Delmont 88. According to Kennedy, he made a wrong turn onto an unlit road that led to Dike Bridge (also spelled Dyke Bridge), a wooden bridge that was angled obliquely to the road, and drove over its side, which had no guardrail. The car plunged into tide-swept Poucha Pond (at that location a channel) and landed upside down under the water. Kopechne died, but as no autopsy was performed, precise cause of death is unknown. Kennedy claims he tried several times to swim down to reach her, then rested on the bank for several minutes before returning on foot to the Lawrence Cottage, where the party attended by Kopechne and other "boiler room girls" had occurred.

Joseph Gargan (Kennedy's cousin) and party co-host Paul Markham then returned to the pond with Kennedy to try to rescue Kopechne. Though there was a telephone at the Lawrence Cottage, nobody called for help. When their efforts to rescue Kopechne failed, Kennedy decided to return to his hotel on the mainland. As the ferry had shut down for the night, Kennedy swam the short distance back to Edgartown.

Kennedy discussed the accident with several people, including his lawyer, before he contacted the police.

The next morning (July 19, 1969) the police recovered Kennedy's car. Kopechne's body was discovered by diver John Farrar, who observed that a large amount of air was released from the car when it was righted in the water, and that the trunk, when opened, was remarkably dry. These observations and others have led some to believe that Kopechne had not drowned, but suffocated in an air pocket within the car.

[Captain Hilts]

4. Wikepedia isn't reliable for anything controversial.

A freeper will modify it the next day.

[FreedomAngel82]

34. Was it really on July 18th?

That's my birthday. :)

[InsultComicDog]

38. One thing many people forget

is that the only thing in the news people were paying attention to at the time was the voyage of Apollo 11 and Neil Armstrong to the moon.

Being one of the biggest events in history, it virtually knocked Ted Kennedy off the front page.

[Warpy]

2. Laura Bush did the hit (and run?) after she ran a stop sign

Kennedy went off a poorly marked, unlighted bridge that had no guard rails. A passenger in his car was killed. He was probably drunk, but it was ruled an accidental death at the inquest.

[Captain Hilts]

5. That is one weird bridge. nt

[NYCGirl]

19. She hit — she didn't run.

http://www.snopes.com/politics/bush/laura.asp

[Kolesar]

3. you mean you could not google it up yourself?

[Robb]

7. Only if I wanted the RW version of things

I don't know if you noticed, but as a search term it's a great way to find freeper blogs. :eyes:

[Burning Water]

12. There isn't any

doubt about the facts of the matter.

Interpretation might be a different story.

[stepnw1f]

6. and Dick Cheney Murdered Over 100,000 people

with the help of Bush and his supporters.

[Batgirl]

8. the most important thing about Chappaquidick

is that it happened 40 years ago and the right has to keep dredging it up, because it's all they got.



edit for numerical accuracy

[radio4progressives]

30. The other Most Important Thing About Chappaquidick was that it was

quite possibly a set up by the same thugs who assasinated Ted's brothers just a few years prior, and by the same thugs who are in power today.

The other thing to remember, even if Ted Kennedy fucked up...

he wasn't the president or the vice president of the United States of America - Pricky Dick Cheney is the President of the United States, under of the office of Vice President - the Iraq War is HIS FUCKING War and Halliburton is ALL THE FUCKING PROOF ANYONE NEEDS.

Pricky Dick Cheney has the lives and the blood of Hundreds of thousands on his hands - so go tell your Dad or whoever to get a fucking grip.

[Carni]

40. I have also wondered if that wasn't a set up

For all we know he was slipped some type of drug in his drinks--

Wasn't he in a plane crash about three years later that broke his back and almost killed him?

Kennedy curse my ass...most of the family was systematically assassinated IMO

[burythehatchet]

45. Ain't it the truth

meanwhile their side just assassinates democratic and civil rights leaders.

[Fredda Weinberg]

9. The issue wasn't the accident, it was the time before the report

Sound familiar?

I remember the event - the scandal grew because Kennedy took time to confer with advisors before notifying the authorities.

It was also widely speculated at the time that Kennedy was having an affair with Kopechne, though nothing substantiated the rumors. Still, it added to the pain the family felt and without their support, Kennedy was vulnerable.

[BlueEyedSon]

10. This was 40 fucking years ago..... so will it be OK to hound Cheney

til the end of his days with this shooting?

[havocmom]

14. And don't forget those OLD DUIs of Cheney's the RW says are too old

to matter now ;)

[Roon]

36. Yep

The freepers in yahoo are already declaring the story "old news" and want to drop the topic.As long as the freepers scream Ted Kennedy or Clinton's cock, we can bring up this incident.

[mwb970]

48. Yes!

He shot a man in the face! No bio of Cheney with more than 3 sentences will ever leave out this fact. And it's a much better answer to the RW bleats of "Chapaquiddick" than the Laura Bush thing, which is equally old.

[GrantDem]

11. On Ed Schultz the other day

he did a great job of baiting a "conservative" caller. The caller was harping on about "how long liberals were going to talk about the Cheney shooting incident". Ed then asked how long they were going to talk about Chapaquiddick. Ed stated that it was over 30 some years ago and they should get over it. The conserative then said that the girl's family probably hasn't gotten over it. Ed then told him "surely you can empathize with Cindy Sheehan losing a child"?

The conservative stuttered around his response. It was great.

[No Exit]

13. Well, I can tell you what I remember

We were in a hotel in Florida, in the summer of 1969. I was surprised to see my father, who liked to stay on the beach, hovering in front of the black-and-white TV (which had only about 3 channels, as did most cities' TV back then.) On the TV was Sen. Ted Kennedy, wearing a neck brace, giving a statement.

Unlike Vice President Dick Cheney, who wore no neck brace and gave no face-to-face statement right after the incident.

I later found out that a cousin of Kennedy's, Joe Gargan, worked with others to prevent manslaughter charges from being filed. When this was accomplished, they said, "As long as we could keep him from being charged with manslaughter, we knew we'd make it." (Paraphrase) As with the Cheney incident, the local police jurisdiction was a tiny one, inexperienced with high-profile or serious cases. So--easily manipulable local officials.

I also later found out that Ted didn't report the accident for many hours. Why? Well, the consensus is that he had to wait till the alcohol had been metabolized out of his system.

Cheney did something similar vis-a-vis his keeping the incident from the national news for about the same length of time--overnight.

Notably, I think Ted's method was to sleep it off, whereas Cheney's method was to get drunker--so that "they" wouldn't know if he'd gotten drunk before, or after, the incident.

Similarity: The Kopechne parents never spoke out against Ted; in fact, they showed support for him at all times. Cheney's victim, a textbook case of the Stockholm Syndrome, is singing Cheney's praises.

Similarity: Married man doing leisure activities with woman who was not his wife.

Difference: Ted Kennedy has paid for his tragedy over and over and over. He could never be president (or vice president) after the tragedy, and everyone knew it. Cheney continues to be vice president even after his criminal negligence, and will continue to be VP, and already the critics are shutting up.

Bumper sticker: Ever seen the one that says, "Nuclear energy is safer than Ted Kennedy's car"? How about, "Iran's nuclear program is safer than going hunting with Dick Cheney"?

Bill Clinton supposedly said of Kennedy, "He couldn't get a whore across a bridge." Will Bill now say of Cheney, "He couldn't ice a lawyer at 15 feet"?

[omega minimo]

28. "broadcast nationally from Joseph P. Kennedy's home on 25 July 1969"

http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/tedkennedychappaquiddick.htm
Edward M. Kennedy: "Chappaquiddick"
broadcast nationally from Joseph P. Kennedy's home on 25 July 1969
Audio mp3 of Address



My fellow citizens:

I have requested this opportunity to talk to the people of Massachusetts about the tragedy which happened last Friday evening. This morning I entered a plea of guilty to the charge of leaving the scene of an accident. Prior to my appearance in court it would have been improper for me to comment on these matters. But tonight I am free to tell you what happened and to say what it means to me.

On the weekend of July 18, I was on Martha's Vineyard Island participating with my nephew, Joe Kennedy -- as for thirty years my family has participated -- in the annual Edgartown Sailing Regatta. Only reasons of health prevented my wife from accompanying me.

On Chappaquiddick Island, off Martha's Vineyard, I attended, on Friday evening, July 18, a cook-out, I had encouraged and helped sponsor for devoted group of Kennedy campaign secretaries. When I left the party, around 11:15 P.M., I was accompanied by one of these girls, Miss Mary Jo Kopechne. Mary J was one of the most devoted members of the staff of Senator Robert Kennedy. She worked for him for four years and was broken up over his death. For this reason, and because she was such a gentle, kind, and idealistic person, all of us tried to help her feel that she still had a home with the Kennedy family.

Mary Jo Kopechne

There is not truth, not truth whatever, to the widely circulated suspicions of immoral conduct that have been leveled at my behavior and hers regarding that evening. There has never been a private relationship between us of any kind. I know of nothing in Mary Jo's conduct on that or nay other occasion -- the same is true of the other girls at that party -- that would lend any substance to such ugly speculation about their character.

Nor was I driving under the influence of liquor.

Little over one mile away, the car that I was driving on the unlit road went of a narrow bridge which had no guard rails and was built on a left angle to the road. The car overturned in a deep pond and immediately filled with water. I remember thinking as the cold water rushed in around my head that I was for certain drowning. Then water entered my lungs and I actual felt the sensation of drowning. But somehow I struggled to the surface alive.

I made immediate and repeated efforts to save Mary Jo be diving into strong and murky current, but succeeded only in increasing my state of utter exhaustion and alarm. My conduct and conversations during the next several hours, to the extent that I can remember them, make no sense to me at all.

Although my doctors informed me that I suffered a cerebral concussion, as well as shock, I do not seek to escape responsibility for my actions by placing the blame either in the physical, emotional trauma brought on by the accident, or on anyone else. I regard as indefensible the fact that I did not report the accident to the policy immediately.

Instead of looking directly for a telephone after lying exhausted in the grass for an undetermined time, I walked back to the cottage where the party was being held and requested the help of two friends, my cousin, Joseph Gargan and Phil Markham, and directed them to return immediately to the scene with me -- this was sometime after midnight -- in order to undertake a new effort to dive down and locate Miss Kopechne. Their strenuous efforts, undertaken at some risk to their own lives also proved futile.

All kinds of scrambled thoughts -- all of them confused, some of them irrational, many of them which I cannot recall, and some of which I would not have seriously entertained under normal circumstances -- went through my mind during this period. They were reflected in the various inexplicable, inconsistent, and inconclusive things I said and did, including such questions as whether the girl might still be alive somewhere out of that immediate area, whether some awful curse did actually hang over all the Kennedys, whether there was some justifiable reason for me to doubt what has happened and to delay my report, whether somehow the awful weight of this incredible incident might, in some way, pass from my shoulders. I was overcome, I'm frank to say, by a jumble of emotions, grief, fear, doubt, exhaustion, panic, confusion and shock.

Instructing Gargan and Markham not to alarm Mary Jo's friends that night, I had them take me to the ferry crossing. The ferry having shut down for the night, I suddenly jumped into the water and impulsively swam across, nearly drowning once again in the effort, and returned to my hotel about 2 A.M. and collapsed in my room.

I remember going out at one point and saying something to the room clerk.

In the morning, with my mind somewhat more lucid, I made an effort to call a family legal advisor, Burke Marshall, from a public telephone on the Chappaquiddick side of the ferry and belatedly reported the accident to the Martha's Vineyard police.


Today, as I mentioned, I felt morally obligated to plead guilty to the charge of leaving the scene of an accident. No words on my part can possibly express the terrible pain and suffering I feel over this tragic incident. This last week has been an agonizing one for me and for the members of my family, and the grief we feel over the loss of a wonderful friend will remain with us the rest of our lives.

These events, the publicity, innuendo, and whispers which have surrounded them and my admission of guilt this morning raises the question in my mind of whether my standing among the people of my state has been so impaired that I should resign my seat in the United States Senate. If at any time the citizens of Massachusetts should lack confidence in their Senator's character or his ability, with or without justification, he could not in my opinion adequately perform his duty and should not continue in office.

The people of this State, the State which sent John Quincy Adams, and Daniel Webster, and Charles Sumner, and Henry Cabot Lodge, and John Kennedy to the United States Senate are entitled to representation in that body by men who inspire their utmost confidence. For this reason, I would understand full well why some might think it right for me to resign. For me this will be a difficult decision to make.

It has been seven years since my first election to the Senate. You and I share many memories -- some of them have been glorious, some have been very sad. The opportunity to work with you and serve Massachusetts has made my life worthwhile.

And so I ask you tonight, the people of Massachusetts, to think this through with me. In facing this decision, I seek your advice and opinion. In making it, I seek your prayers -- for this is a decision that I will have finally to make on my own.

It has been written a man does what he must in spite of personal consequences, in spite of obstacles, and dangers, and pressures, and that is the basis of human morality. Whatever may be the sacrifices he faces, if he follows his conscience -- the loss of his friends, his fortune, his contentment, even the esteem of his fellow man -- each man must decide for himself the course he will follow. The stories of the past courage cannot supply courage itself. For this, each man must look into his own soul.

I pray that I can have the courage to make the right decision. Whatever is decided and whatever the future holds for me, I hope that I shall have been able to put this most recent tragedy behind me and make some further contribution to our state and mankind, whether it be in public or private life.

Thank you and good night.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Research Note: Published version of this speech appeared in the New York times, July 26, 1969, p.10. This version was taken from Halford Ross Ryan (Ed.), American Rhetoric from Roosevelt to Reagan, published in 1987 by Waveland Press: Prospect Heights, IL.

 
Top 100 American Speeches

Online Speech Bank

© Copyright 2001-2006. 
American Rhetoric.
HTML transcription by Michael E. Eidenmuller.
All rights reserved.

[hedgehog]

29. Call me a total idiot, but maybe Ted was telling the truth?

Remember, a lot of people back then didn't consider a couple of drinks "driving under the influence". Whatever Ted's reputation then or since as a womanizer doesn't necessarily apply to Mary Jo Kopechne. She had been on Robert Kennedy's staff, not his. I can't testify about the staff personally, but I do know that those of us campaigning for Bobby seem to have been a whole lot more serious about politics than people now. I tend to think that Mary Joe was an idealist, not Monica Lewinsky v1.0. It's entirely possible that Ted was giving her a ride home from the party, drove off the side of a poorly designed bridge, hit his head and then tried and failed to rescue her. (I doubt anyone was wearing a seat belt.) Obviously, he wasn't thinking clearly. Driving down to the ferry crossing and swimming across are not reasonable actions. The people who should have protected him by calling the police (Gargan & Markham) weren't used to disobeying orders. Once Ted had a night's sleep and realized he'd left the scene of an accident, he called his lawyer for advice and then called the cops. End of story except for 40 years of innuendo.

[omega minimo]

31. Has the ring of plausibility and more humanity than Bushco. ever show

Cheney and Chertoff both came out this week and publicized how terrible the Texas shooting and Katrina were-- FOR THEM !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WORST DAY OF THEIR LIVES :puke: :puke: :puke:

"I do know that those of us campaigning for Bobby seem to have been a whole lot more serious about politics than people now. I tend to think that Mary Joe was an idealist, not Monica Lewinsky v1.0."

The change in the level or quality of American political participation was impacted by the assassinations. Something in American died with them. (So maybe that's the answer to the question I will ask one last time............)

The younger "idealists" of that time don't know how the older "idealists" disappeared and let go and let the SAME SHIT happen all over again. The time b/w Viet Nam and Watergate and Iraq Nam and Plamegate are treated like they are different centuries rather than PART OF THE SAME LIFETIMES OF MOST MIDDLE AGED AND OLDER ADULTS. We watched all the disassemblement of our nation in that timespan. Some here think it happened "in the past 5 years." :eyes: (I don't expect the same potential awareness from those born too late and infected with Reagan's Big Lie).

DU won't ever really address or answer or ever ACKNOWLEDGE this. Are people afraid to pay attention?

Thank you for the contributions you have made.

[hedgehog]

35. I think things jumped the shark when Senator Inouye of Hawaii

insisted on holding the Iraq Gate hearings before the court cases could be heard. I don't know if he was trying to be a star or what, but because he granted immunity to everyone who testified, all the convictions were thrown out and people who should have been jailed went on to long and lustrous careers. (Oliver North for one) People never understood just what was wrong about Iraq Gate and neither Reagan nor Bush I were ever tied to it.

[H2O Man]

39. It is possible

that you believe that there are greater differences between "then" and "now" than there were, with a few exceptions. The Civil Rights movement was in a different phase. Also, there was a draft and a war that was killing a heck of a lot more Americans each week than Iraq and Afghanistan combined. And there was a youth movement fueled by the combination of those two things.

I've noticed a couple of times that you seem focused on this issue. You stand out as an intelligent person on DU, and I'm interested in you expanding on this issue, rather than saying that "DU won't ever really address or answer or ever ACKNOWLEDGE this." You are DU, too. Please explain. Be detailed.

This is intended in a good spirit. I look forward to your response.

[omega minimo]

43. Since there are so many here who remember the 60/70's, they might have

continued awareness and diligence from that time to this, but there is an apparent disconnect. And on DU that manifests as a big blank, or a gigantic SKIP from those days to these...........

It's not clear what you mean by: "It is possible that you believe that there are greater differences between "then" and "now" than there were, with a few exceptions." I am talking about the similarities, the continuation of the same process and the attentiveness (or lack of it) of the individuals who lived thru both. And I ask/ed this on a personal level of experience, not a clinical/analytical perspective of abstraction.

"The younger "idealists" of that time don't know how the older "idealists" disappeared and let go and let the SAME SHIT happen all over again. The time b/w Viet Nam and Watergate and Iraq Nam and Plamegate are treated like they are different centuries rather than PART OF THE SAME LIFETIMES OF MOST MIDDLE AGED AND OLDER ADULTS. We watched all the disassemblement of our nation in that timespan."

That seems pretty specific. :hi: The reason for focus on this is the responsibility we have for what has occurred, which is possibly why no one likes to think or talk about it. Or do it.

[H2O Man]

44. Okay, take the one example

of Watergate. Saying "Watergate" is specific only in mentioning a specific group of crimes committed by the Nixon adminstration, and a legal process that resulted. But there is nothing specific in terms of the "young idealists" you mention in geeneral terms. Many watched the Watergate hearings on tv. But beyond watching it on tv, could you be specific about: {a} what role you believe the young idealists played? and {b} how that differs from idealists being spectators to, say, the Plame scandal today.

[omega minimo]

46. Tell us about your transition from then to now

You are separating it out: "what role you believe the young idealists played? and {b} how that differs from idealists being spectators to, say, the Plame scandal today." I tried to say before, that clinical, classroom POV is not the question.

Different idealists? or the same ones?

I asked about the continuity of an individuals experience (how did those older "idealists" register the intervening decades' events) from those times to these.

How does an individual --or a society -- come through those times and not gain experience, learn lessons and develop skills to NOT LET IT HAPPEN AGAIN?

[H2O Man]

47. In the exact same

manner that Red Sox fans have gone through watching their team win one championship, and then go back to watching them lose. Because they are spectators.

You mentioned Watergate, but want to avoid a "clinical, classroom POV" that "is not the question." I will wait patiently to see if you can come up with a better way to approach it ..... although the idea of turning it into a myth that "the people" played any significant role in Watergate -- beyond the role that Red Sox fans play, year in and year out (no clinic needed) -- seems more fantasy directed than reality grounded.

My transition? Obviously the big difference is that I've become much older. As a result of that aging process, I'm not out hanging with "the boys" these days. But I still write LTTE, call and write elected representatives, go to rallies, participate in demonstrations, financially support the organizations that best represent and promote my values. I've always believed in gras-roots activism, and I suppose the main difference is that today, more people in my area listen to me. The "local party" used to want to use my talents "behind the scenes" in organizng door-to-door campaigns .... even local republicans wanted to quietly hire me to produce their campaign material. 35 years ago, I had to figure out how to access the local media -- not a problem today. I have good connections at every area newspaper and tv station, as well as most radio stations. When I attend events, I am now more likely to be one of the presenters, or speakers, rather than sitting in the audience. So I guess those are the difference between being a young man, and being an old man.

Yet they do not change the essence -- I have noted on other threads that I headed a 20+ year effort to get a large toxic waste dump site cleaned. I started out with two local families and four other young men working together. Being told, year after year, that there was nothing I could do. State officials ignored me. But eventually, by keeping at it, I was able to get two science teachers at a local school to help me, and improved my presentation of facts. That got a couple of officials who were trying to do what is right within a system dedicated to bureaucracy rather than change, to help. I could tell you some stories that are funny and even exciting, but most of it was rather dull. I finally found a "missing" document .... literally page 100,556 of the EPA's report on the site was missing. You can do the math -- I took the time to review well over 100,000 pages of reports. With age comes patience. And by putting together responses to the missing page, I was able to get others interested. FOIA lead to my getting the missing page. That lead to my being able to get Pace University to help me get two big grants, and to get two fantastic environmental groups, including Disposal Safety Inc, to help with the scientific end. I was able to get people who would never have talked before to go for a ride to Washington DC on a weekend, and to go to the Dept of Justice, and give statements to their lawyers. Became friends with a cuple EPA attorneys, too. And the military-defense industry was ordered -- and agreed -- to spend about $25 million to address the site.

That is a transformation.

[omega minimo]

49. A transformation indeed. Well done,

And you provided a clue to the answer. Although you have misinterpreted somehow the question.

"You mentioned Watergate, but want to avoid a "clinical, classroom POV" that "is not the question." I will wait patiently to see if you can come up with a better way to approach it ..... although the idea of turning it into a myth that "the people" played any significant role in Watergate -- beyond the role that Red Sox fans play, year in and year out (no clinic needed) -- seems more fantasy directed than reality grounded."

It's not worth untangling.

As for the clue:

"In the exact same manner that Red Sox fans have gone through watching their team win one championship, and then go back to watching them lose. Because they are spectators."

The answer is not to be spectators, but participants, as in the story you shared.

:thumbsup:

[Carni]

42. Everyone was driving drunk back then by today's standards

I think if you could drive without closing one eye, hitting anything, or throwing up on yourself -- you weren't considered legally drunk.

Six years before Ted drove off of that bridge, Big Dick managed to get his license suspended for drunk driving for thirty days...Dick must have been pretty drunk to even get the court systems to take action against him because losing your license for drinking back then was not the norm.

I think typically they told you to walk home (or they drove you) and to sleep it off.

[sasha031]

15. are RWers so pure they never got drunk

dear god this story happened 4 decades ago. A man gets drunk has an affair and has a fatal car accident!

people drink and do foolish terrible things, the first thing that happens when you drink is your judgment disappears. Kennedy is well aware of this as anyone who has had an accident or has been impaired. If you are a person of conscience you never forget your mistakes, a good person will try to make amends.

Why have people never talked about how ted must of felt having his two beloved brothers slaughtered! He has also had to live with that at each waking moment!

The puritanical Rowers have more skeletons in their closet than 100 graveyards, but I have NEVER EVER have heard any of them say I made a mistake, I am sorry! Their MO IS ALWAYS BLAME SOMEONE ELSE!

It purely political and ideology reason the power brokers hate Ted, he is for the underdog, a true beautiful liberal, as were his brothers(you see what happened to them)

The greasy oil oligarchs and RW think tanks know how dumb the public are, they market them to dispose everything that is good for the masses, it's simple. The aristocracy relay doesn't give a damn what Kennedy has done in his personal life. He is a threat to their empires, so they just market the uninformed and ignorant, so they will focus on (in the big picure)trivial matters instead of listening to the real message.

[bleedingheart]

17. The problem is that the Kennedy family is so beloved that it

drives Right Wingers nuts.

The accident was a tragedy and it was wrong of Ted and those who were involved not to get help (going to back to the car but not calling for help was pretty dumb)...if it had been a unknown person this had happened to...the event would have faded from memory...but it was a Kennedy and the right wingers hate the Kennedys.

There is no Right Wing family that comes close the Kennedys. The Bush family thinks it is them but they are just wrong...from the drunken twins to the Savings and Loan scandals...they just don't have the class and the link with the common people that the Kennedys have and they are jealous.

Ted Kennedy in spite of both his family and personal tragedies has been a person who has fought for the common person and it drives the repukes nuts that people have forgiven him and still respect him.

[bobbieinok]

37. heard sermon comparing Kennedy and Bush families

and surprise! surprise! it turns out that Bush family has been blessed by god and Kennedys, well they're basically cursed and die (JFK, Bobbie, John Jr, cousin who died skiing, etc) b/c they're just bad people

[Gormy Cuss]

20. Well if we use W's defense as a standard,

Ted Kennedy was only 37 at the time of the Chappaquiddick accident so we should write it off as a youthful indiscretion.

It is sad that this gets hauled out to defend Cheney. What happened in each case was similar. Both of them screwed up, both tried to cover it up. Cheney got lucky because Whittington didn't die.

[bleedingheart]

16. It was an accident but Ted Kennedy did one thing wrong

he didn't call for help and notify the authorities immediately...

If he had only done that...it would have been a tragedy but not the conspiratorial story it is today...

Ted most likely was drunk and probably the girl as well but at the time, drunk driving wasn't the same issue it is today (which was wrong). He got into an accident. He tried to help her but he didn't get the authorities involved until the next day and that was really stupid. I like Ted, but this was profoundly stupid on his part and it has haunted him and his family every since.


It was a tragedy.

[Neil Lisst]

18. best case, Kennedy didn't know she was in the car, but ...

if you want to know what happened, it's a safe surmise he knew she was in the car, and he knew she drowned in it. Otherwise, no need for him to get to the hotel and create that weak alibi.

I love Teddy, but come on, he was probably gettin' a BJ and drove off the bridge. She never surfaced, he panicked, and decided on a course of action that would spell cover up.

[Onlooker]

21. Ted handled it like a fool, and righties have been spinning it ever since.

I've been to Chappaquidik (a most beautiful place to rent a house with some friends and just spend time on miles of quiet beach). Even today, the area is almost desolate. The bridge where the accident occurred has since been rebuilt, but it's not much safer than the original:



(This is the only photo I could find.)

Kennedy obviously was out for a liaison, was a little drunk, drove off the bridge, tried to rescue her a few times, and then handled matters like an idiot. It's actually very similar to how Cheney handled the shooting of his friend.

[Neil Lisst]

23. I still would have supported him for president.

I thought for a decade who would make it, but NO.

[zippy890]

27. that was the end of any presidential hopes for TK

It was bad business on his part, no question.

But he has been the best senator for his state that anyone could hope for, and more.

[johnnie]

22. There is no doubt that how Kennedy handled this was wrong

But why do they try to equate this with cheney shooting someone in the face with a shotgun? Chappaquiddick happened almost 40 years ago and Kennedy was *not* the vice president of the United States.

Tell your dad that if he feels that strongly about what happened 40 years ago then he should feel just as strong about what happened a week ago. If he doesn't want to , then tell him that he is obviously uneasy with what the vice president did and is using Kennedy to make excuses for cheney.

Or you can use my new response that I came up with here last week and when he mentions Chappaquiddick just respond with "So?".

[shance]

24. Chappaquiddick as a set up for Teddy? Many things still don't add up.

Considering both of his brothers had been assassinated by intelligence ops, I wouldnt consider that that too far off the mark.

John Dean summed it up when he said to Richard Nixon as recorded on the White House tapes in 1973: "If Teddy knew the bear trap he was walking into at Chappaquiddick. . . ."<5>



http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/ToA/ToAchp7.html

[newportdadde]

25. I know the rumor Mary Jo was pregnant was always floating around.

That tin foil take is much more sinister.

[misternormal]

26. Rumor had it that...

... Mary Jo was more than just a secretary. It was said that she involved herself in pillow-talk with quite a few of the high and mighty of the day. Perhaps she was supposed to be with Teddy as the start of a scandal to insure that another Kennedy would NEVER inhabit the white house... (al la Clinton in some fashion.)

The speculation goes that the "Men in Black" decided that they could kill two birds with one stone perhaps in a sparsely populated area, on a seldom used road in the middle of the night.

We all know that if there is an accident involving a vehicle leaving the road, it is a difficult thing to prove if another vehicle was at the scene or not.

This was no more than a continuation of "War On the Kennedys" that permeated Washington at the time.

All of this is mere speculation on my part.

[maveric]

32. I love Ted, but he fucked up royally.

And probably should have been prosecuted for that fuck-up. IMHO!

[FreedomAngel82]

33. Just mention Laura Bush

When she was younger she was on her way home with a friend from a party and ran a stop sign and killed a guy...the guy ended up being her boyfriend. She didn't go to jail nor had to do any type of community service. She basically got away with murder. Same with George. Before he met Laura he had a girlfriend (a black girl) who got pregnant and Poppy Bush used his influence to have her get an abortion which was illegal in Texas. She didn't want one but they forced her to. She started talking in 2002 and she was found dead in her home. Don't forget Bush's grandfather was a Nazi and Karl Rove's and Arnold's father's were both SS Nazi men.

[mtnsnake]

41. Tell him that Chapaquidick is a real cheap way of diverting attention from

the real corruption that's happening now at the hands of Bush and Cheney. Tell him to stop coming up with excuses such as Chapaquiddick and Bill Clinton...and face the reality that his boys (Bush & Cheney) are corrupt lying fuckers who belong in prison.