it's time for Islam to check itself - 'Iraqis in fear after bomb sparks...

[bridgit]

'...sectarian anger ~ In the bloodiest apparent reprisal for the bombing of the Golden Mosque in Samarra, men in police uniform seized a dozen Sunni rebel suspects, including two Egyptians, from a prison in the mainly Shi'ite city of Basra and killed 11 of them. Gunmen fired on dozens of Sunni mosques in Baghdad and elsewhere.' http://www.thanhniennews.com/worlds/?catid=9&newsid=12924

[radwriter0555]

1. That's assuming that the Mossad doesn't have a huge hand in

making sure that iraq remains unstable and violent.

The whole pattern of violence there has Mossad written all over it. It makes no sense.

[Behind the Aegis]

2. Oh good grief!

yes...that is exactly what Israel wants...an unstable Iraq, ripe for the plucking by Islamic militants! :eyes: Why not the CIA, MI6, The Romulan Empire? Hey, here's a thought, maybe it was done by extremists hell-bent on plunging their country into further chaos so they can take charge?! Of course that last statement is just fantasy because no Islamic group would ever resort to violence to get its way. :sarcasm:

[JCMach1]

4. This is about the internal power struggle...

not CIA (this time anyway)... The Mossad has no interest in further destabilizing Iraq.

This is about secular power struggles between two groups that happen to be religious. Religion bleeds over into everything in the Middle-East. It is sometimes hard for Westerners to realize that.

[Behind the Aegis]

11. I agree with you...perhaps you should post this...

...to the person I posted to!

[bridgit]

16. straight forward...

:thumbsup:

[radwriter0555]

5. Tell me, who's funding those nutty islamic extremists? Who's housing them,

feeding them, arming them?

And how does bombing a mosque put them in charge?

The only thing the chaos can achieve is more reasons for the US to "stay the course..." since apparently, in the opinion of the oh-so-informed Uhmurrikkkans, the Iraqi people (you know, one of the oldest civilizations on the planet) are so infantile and unevolved, they're incapable of taking care of themselves, forming their own government and managing their own oil business.

It's a miracle they've survived this long without the benevolence and kindness of dubyuh bush, now isn't it?

And don't tell me that the SAS, Mossad and MI6 don't operate in Iraq, I know better, anyone with a brain knows better and you should pay more attention.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/9400104/
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,7374-1788054,00.html
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0510/S00242.htm

Those little fukcers were busted with a car filled with explosives, ready to launch into some populated place. That's not the first incident and hardly the last. MOST of the suicide bombings and car bombings are not insurgents, but US lead covert ops stirring up the hornets to keep the US troops in Iraq as long as possible.

[rman]

10. Not just the Mossad, that's for sure

Don't tell me the CIA and DIA are not involved.

[Behind the Aegis]

13. Let me check the tinfoil ball!

I see...I see...funding from various Arab nations who see Iraq ready for the taking, ready to be carved up like a Thanksgiving turkey.

I didn't say that foreign agents weren't in Iraq, they are everywhere apparently.

Oh, and those little fuckers busted with car bomb were British...not Israeli! So, why single out Mossad?

[radwriter0555]

14. Single out the mossad because the mossad via israel is the nation MOST

interested in destroying Iraq and anything not israeli.

I don't believe the fukcers were british. They were rescued by the british, but why were they arrested by the Iraqi police to begin with? If they were SAS all they had to do was flash their IDs and they would have been cleared to go anywhere and do anything they wanted. You see, the SAS are supposed to be operating in conjunction with the Iraqi police, on the same terms as the Americans.

So, if they were arrested BY the iraqi police and the british man investigating the incident later died of under undisclosed circumstances, that rules out any brits OR americans, which leaves the mossad.

And other than israel, what middle eastern nation wants to take over iraq? All speculation aside, can you give any concrete evidence that any other nation wants to take over iraq? And what for? And if that were so, wouldn't that then mean the USA is then protecting the Iraqis from a hostile takeover from another nation? Why would that be a secret?

Bit of a pickle, isn't it?

[Behind the Aegis]

17. All I can say to your post...

:eyes:

Anything else would be wasted print. I love how you speculate all over the place, but when it comes to my hypothetical, I am supposed to provide concrete evidence.

No, I see this for what it is.

[radwriter0555]

24. Evidence? You want evidence like bush used to declare saddam a menace

to the USA? Yeah, evidence. I got your evidence.

The bush regime isn't big on evidence. The idiotic brainwashed US media isn't real big on evidence; they're just belching subjective hyberbole based on lies and rhetoric pumped out by liars, crooks and thieves within the absolute most corrupt regime to ever rule the USA.

It's up to "We the People" to determine the truth as defined by the actual events; the players involved in the events and the knowledge of who those players are and how their histories have defined them by their actions and words.

All you need to do is view the events with a critical eye that casts off the bullshit and lies of the bush regime and morons in the US media.

All you have to do is form your own opinion with the evidence at hand once you've gotten past the usual mindless stream of the conditioned and programmed US "thought process" and I use that term losely.

It's a hard thing for people conditioned to relying on a teevee and magic tawking box for 'news' and 'information' to actually produce a critical thought, isn't it?

There used to be a world where we could rely on our lawfully elected leaders for the truth. This world is a different place now.

[Behind the Aegis]

25. So basically...you got squat!

Because the Bush regime doesn't produce evidence and make war based on innuendo and lies, you feel justified in doing the same? (Not waging war, but making wild assertions without proof.)

All you need to do is realize that propaganda works in both directions. Do not be so quick to attribute to a conspiracy theory to that which can be a simplicity.

I see many interesting things here...but I also see crap here. Sometimes a cigar is a cigar. However, if you can only see through "tinfoil," then...well...the possibilities are endless.

You start of with "Yeah, evidence. I got your evidence." Yet, you don't provide one shred of evidence, only speculation, much like the Bush regime, you claim to hate.

So, turn your critical eye on yourself. Perhaps, you have been so conditioned to hating Bush that you really can't see the forest for the trees.

[radwriter0555]

35. So then explain why the iraqi police arrested SAS agents? Why would they

do that when the SAS is allowed to operate in iraq?

[Behind the Aegis]

36. And yet this still isn't evidence of the Mossad.

[radwriter0555]

42. Then who was it? You're a reasonably intelligent person. Who were those

guys? They were so out of left field in that "filled with explosives" car of theirs in civilian disguise that they were arrested by the Iraqi police -- you know, the fellas that "we" (and I use that term loosely) are supposedly on the same side as;

If not CIA, SAS or M16 -- as in Iraqi allies -- then who, if not the Mossad? Who would the British risk everything in broad daylight to rescue, going so far as to break down a prison wall with a fukcing TANK and then -- THEN -- make sure the dude investigating the whole affair gets dead?

Just take a guess. A wild guess... who's left?

It's OKAY FOR IT TO BE THE MOSSAD. It really is. Anyone who's been paying attention to world covert affairs and who doesn't believe the headlines in crap gop controlled media knows that Mossad has been operating below the radar in covert operations around the globe for decades.

You aren't a traitor to anyone for just knowing the truth. You aren't a jew hater or an anti-semite. You just happen to know what the truth is. Denying it doesn't make it less real.

This is what the world under bush has brought us to bear. It's a pretty evil and horrific place. It's okay to think for yourself.

[sabra]

40. how about Iran?

remember that little war Iraq/Iran had?

[NNN0LHI]

30. I am with you on this one rad. The whole thing is one big black-op

No one is kidding me either.

Islam had better check itself? Pffffft.

Don

[rman]

9. How about all the above, and then some

(except for the Romulan empire)

It should be noted though that any involvment of "Israel" doesn't go any further then involvment of "the US". That is to say that a significant part of the population does not support these policies and operations, and that most of the bad things that happen are done by "bad apples" - it's just that there are a lot of bad apples in high places, and they do have a lot of power.

[genie_weenie]

28. Those Damn Romulans!

Only the Romulans violate the Neutral Zone more often than the Bears Defensive Line...

[bridgit]

3. not seeing that one...

:shrug:

[Yupster]

6. Blame the Jews

Never thought of that before.

[wuushew]

8. flawed tinfoil logic

Assuming nation states act in their own best interests, why would Israel or the United States increase disorder in Iraq when doing so places at risk the military assets needed to attack and or occupy Iran?

The Neocon playbook is crystal clear on the Iran objective, which continued Iraqi violence works against.

[rman]

12. Except that at the highest levels, nation states are irrelevant

The most powerful corporations are transnational; they know no boundaries. Politicians are their foot soldiers (for the most part). Government agencies are the guards of their wealth (also for the most part).

[phusion]

38. The US did this to provoke a reaction from Iranian Shi'ites!

Who are a majority in the country...Because by provoking a violent reaction from Iran, they have justification to react back!

http://www.antiwar.com/lobe/?articleid=2282

From 2004:

Neo-conservatives close to the administration of President George W Bush are pushing for retribution against Iran for, they say, sponsoring this week's Shiite uprising in Iraq led by radical cleric Moqtada al-Sadr.

Despite the growing number of reports that depict the fighting as a spontaneous and indigenous revolt against the U.S.-led occupation, the influential neo-cons are calling on Bush to warn Tehran to cease its alleged backing for al-Sadr and other Shia militias or face retaliation, ranging from an attack on Iranian nuclear facilities to covert action designed to overthrow the government.

[QC]

19. It was the Joooos, I tells ya! The Jooooooos! n/t

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

26. Why don't you just come out and say it?

It's the Jews, right? It's all about the Jews. Because nobody else in this world would ever contemplate violence. Hell, I'm not even Jewish and despise Israel's foreign policy, and I'm offended by the constant barrage of idiotic vitriol being directed at people for who's involvement there is absolutely no evidence whatsoever.

And as of yet, nobody - NOBODY - has been able to explain to me how a violent civil war that could possibly engulf the entire Middle East and result in the formation of new Islamist states benefits Israel.

[Dutch]

39. Yawn

:eyes:

[RDU Socialist]

41. so does Tehran normally give you information?

or do you also get some from people like Nick Griffin of the BNP?

[Malikshah]

7. Disco Inferno!!! It's time some folks should check themselves...

Watch those flames rise!!!!

Baaoooooggga Baaaoooooogaa

Stop the insanity.

What a broad brushstroke being painted here. Just frikking lovely.

[bridgit]

15. disagreed...

[genie_weenie]

18. This is clearly the work of the Society of Assassians!

http://www.skewsme.com/assassin.html

[WilliamPitt]

20. Was it time for Christianity to "check itself"

during the worst of the violence in Ireland?

[bridgit]

21. apples & oranges, i don't recall sinn fein's murderous rage across...

continental divides at the behest of a cartoonist and his ignorance; to then turn on a dime and bewail the destruction of their favorite pub at the hands of a yet wholly other brigade of 'orange men' marauding the cobblestone streets in the name of christianity :eyes: you're a real smart guy on this stuff, where was the destruction of a holy shrine, or an alter of god ever sanctioned

http://sinnfein.org

i am a separatist of church AND state = separate it ALL...beyond cleanliness being next to godliness, i have little, or less, use for religion in the mechanics of a civil republic.

they are all but men these 'people of the book', as such, they are all subject to lapse & fallen grace.
oh yes, put them ALL in check...

[Malikshah]

22. Apples and oranges--sorry, that ruse won't work

Blatant generalization doesn't work.

Some folks need to check themselves.

Here's a suggestion.

Breathe.
Count to 10.
Find one's happy place.
Breathe again.
Realize that generalizing about 1.3 billion people is ass-backwards and counterproductive.
Breathe.
Chill.
Have some dip.

:)

[bridgit]

23. again disagreed, let me just point out here, that i had not suggested...

any such after, as a mere for instance, palestinian gunmen had run into the holy sepulchre and hold up within (someone else's holy site albeit) from the israeli army knowing rather full well the outcry that would have arisen from the scenes of an israeli army storming the sepulchre; to have been extracted some many, many days later leaving behind piles of dead corpse, shit, piss, and scenes & bits of internalized & personal miseries. there were no calls for revenge. there was only a great & studied cleansing was to take place; and it did.

i remain unconvinced that you are referring to the islam of peace. but make no mistake. being men, their imams are as capable of being entrenched in their own verbiage & stylized behavior as are any other holy men.

in the end, holy men may only be little more than shepard's. as such, it would seem they do their various flocks ill-will when it is they council the blind rage in others. where that is the case they should stop & check themselves, that is true enough for anyone to understand.

that is of course imo...you, i understand, may not feel the same.

god bless america

breathing sir, breathing; while it is i say it you sir, "i do not want to see you double dipping the chip" :rofl:

[Malikshah]

27. Wow-- lot's of thought on the issue, but still, the original

post makes a blanked anti-Islam statement...

One can try and gussy it up as much as one wants, but hey, it's still generalized clap-trap, tinged with anti-Arab (i.e. Palestinian mention) anti-Muslim bigotry.

No silk purse here.

[bridgit]

33. my sense is that you are not able to admit internally, that sometimes...

even muslims get it completely wrong within an environment such as "Realize that generalizing about 1.3 billion people (fill in the blank)" oooh, 1.3 billion people. zowie.

there's an equally impressive number of catholics. hm, well, understanding for a moment that between those two numbers, more than half the human race has been left unaccounted for; you can't possibly be suggesting that by sheer numbers one has then a lock on the truth? not in this world where it took the pope 600 years to apologize for the rape of the natural world. and please...don't take it down that road too. just tell me...

when will islam apologize for offering vast tracts of it's pilgrims; as have other great religions, myopic rage & derision in place of a peace in hand.

you will need to go elsewhere for the haggling/purchase, tinker/twixt a silk purse from even a sows ear it befalls me to inform however.

[Malikshah]

34. This statement alone says so very much

when will islam apologize for offering vast tracts of it's pilgrims; as have other great religions, myopic rage & derision in place of a peace in hand.

There is no single voice of Islam. The world's Muslims are as diverse a group of peoples as one could find--and yet, the same old "when will Islam" do this (a la "Islam needs to check itself") generalizations.

There's a point when one needs to stop digging. The hole is quite deep enough, thank you very much.

[bridgit]

37. "The hole is quite deep enough, thank you very much."

:thumbsup:

[Spider Jerusalem]

29. The actions of a relative few violent extremists...

can't be taken as representative of all of Islam, any more than the actions of, say, abortion clinic bombers can be taken as representative of all of Christianity, or the actions of a lunatic like Baruch Goldstein can be taken as representative of Judaism; anyone who thinks otherwise is as much an ignorant fool as the extremists they condemn.

Part of the problem, on both sides, is the apparent inability or unwillingness to make distinctions; blanket condemnations and thoughtless generalisations don't really help matters.

[JCMach1]

31. event the article uses the term sectarian violence

This has little to do with Islam and everything to do with power struggle.

[Spider Jerusalem]

32. Of course...

differences in religious doctrine are always exploited by political leaders where possible in order to further enflame their followers; it's worked for centuries in Ireland, and setting Sunnis against Shi'ites in Iraq isn't much different. I know that; I( was responding to the title of the OP, not to the article.