Did Jesus exist? Italian court to decide

[NNN0LHI]

http://www.swissinfo.org/sen/swissinfo.html?siteSect=143&sid=6360846&cKey=1136397046000

ROME (Reuters) - Forget the U.S. debate over intelligent design versus evolution.

An Italian court is tackling Jesus -- and whether the Roman Catholic Church may be breaking the law by teaching that he existed 2,000 years ago.

The case pits against each other two men in their 70s, who are from the same central Italian town and even went to the same seminary school in their teenage years. snip

Cascioli says Righi, and by extension the whole Church, broke two Italian laws. The first is "Abuso di Credulita Popolare" (Abuse of Popular Belief) meant to protect people against being swindled or conned. The second crime, he says, is "Sostituzione di Persona", or impersonation.

[bryant69]

1. Be interesting to see how that plays out

Bryant
check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[NNN0LHI]

4. 'Miracle on 34th Street' came to mind as I read this n/t

[TallahasseeGrannie]

2. So do they also have to prove

Aristotle, Ceasar, etc., etc. Because hey, there were no videotapes!

What a waste of time!

[papau]

8. The appeals court also wants proof of God.

Should an interesting trial.

[stopbush]

9. No, they don't.

1. The question of their (Aristotle, Caesar) existence isn't on trial

2. The historical evidence for their existence far outweighs any for Jesus (which is to say, there is none around for JC).

3. Videotapes can be doctored...

4. No more a waste of time than people praying to a non-existent deity (whoever that deity may happen to be).

On edit: the Church's nightmare - they prove that Jesus existed but it comes out that he looked a lot more like Jerry Stiller than he did Jeffrey Hunter...

[bryant69]

10. Hmmm

Is it correct to say there is no evidence for the existance of Jesus Christ? Or is it more accurate to say you do not find the evidence for the existence of Jesus Christ conclusive?

Bryant

[stopbush]

11. I'd say there's no more evidence that Jesus existed in corporeal

form than there's evidence that Paul Bunyan existed.

I'm not doubting the very potent power of myth, but a corporeal Jesus is a myth, pure and simple.

[bryant69]

15. OK.

Everybody is entitled to their religious beliefs.

Bryant

[seriousstan]

12. Tacitus, Josephus,Pliny, Lucian and perhaps Thallus.

In turn...

"But not all the relief that could come from man, not all the bounties that the prince could bestow, nor all the atonements which could be presented to the gods, availed to relieve Nero from the infamy of being believed to have ordered the conflagration, the fire of Rome. Hence to suppress the rumor, he falsely charged with the guilt, and punished Christians, who were hated for their enormities. Christus, the founder of the name, was put to death by Pontius Pilate, procurator of Judea in the reign of Tiberius: but the pernicious superstition, repressed for a time broke out again, not only through Judea, where the mischief originated, but through the city of Rome also, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their center and become popular. Accordingly, an arrest was first made of all who pleaded guilty; then, upon their information, an immense multitude was convicted, not so much of the crime of firing the city, as of hatred against mankind."

"Antiquities 20.9.1 But the younger Ananus who, as we said, received the high priesthood, was of a bold disposition and exceptionally daring; he followed the party of the Sadducees, who are severe in judgment above all the Jews, as we have already shown. As therefore Ananus was of such a disposition, he thought he had now a good opportunity, as Festus was now dead, and Albinus was still on the road; so he assembled a council of judges, and brought before it the brother of Jesus the so-called Christ, whose name was James, together with some others, and having accused them as law-breakers, he delivered them over to be stoned. "


"They affirmed, however, that the whole of their guilt, or their error, was, that they were in the habit of meeting on a certain fixed day before it was light, when they sang in alternate verse a hymn to Christ as to a god, and bound themselves to a solemn oath, not to any wicked deeds, but never to commit any fraud, theft, adultery, never to falsify their word, not to deny a trust when they should be called upon to deliver it up."

[stopbush]

13. None of those you mention were *contemporaries* of the

supposed Jesus...and the supposed mentions of Jesus by Josephus have long been thought (proved?) to be spurious additions made long after Josephus was dead.

Give me a contemporaneous source, if you please.

[seriousstan]

14. You have a contemporary of Homer? Pilate?

[stopbush]

16. ?????

Deflecting much? Let's stick to the people mentioned, starting with Caesar whose contemporaries included Cicero, Virgil, Ovid and Sallust. Cicero was an eyewitness to Caesar's murder...correspondence between the two exists.

Or am I misinformed?

[TallahasseeGrannie]

17. My statement

"now they have to prove" was a generic statement, not meant to apply to the actual trial. Obviously that isn't part of it.

You know, I'll bet Jesus did look alot like Ben Stiller. Maybe Jerry when he was younger. He never got that old.

Last point: in my opinion, prayer wouldn't be a waste of time even if the deity didn't exist. (Not going to attempt to prove what no one can prove either exists or does not exist) Prayer is meditation and it lowers the blood pressure and other cool stuff.

[BushOut06]

3. So what happens if the priest can't prove it?

Is this judge going to close down all Christian churches in his district? After all, these churches would then be guilty of swindling the public.

[KamaAina]

5. The People wish to introduce into evidence...

Exhibit A, this somewhat corky but still quite drinkable wine; Exhibit B, a number of not-yet-stale loaves and remarkably fresh fishes,...

:-)

[BushOut06]

6. If they could just find that damned Holy Grail...

Where is that thing when you need it? Damned Templars...

[rkc3]

7. Isn't it in the Castle AAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaggh?