Student sues after being arrested with fake drugs at airport

[Tesha]

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2005/12/29/state/n111305S34.DTL&type=bondage

Student who was headed to
Los Angeles sues over airport arrest

When college freshman Janet Lee packed her bags for a Christmas
trip home two years ago, her luggage contained three condoms filled
with flour — devices that she and some friends made as a joke.

Philadelphia International Airport screeners found the condoms,
and their initial tests showed they contained drugs. The Bryn
Mawr College student was arrested for alleged drug trafficking
and jailed. Three weeks later, she was released after a lab test
backed her story, The Philadelphia Inquirer reported Thursday.

Lee filed a federal lawsuit last week against city police, seeking
damages for pain and suffering, financial loss, and emotional distress.
She was arrested on Dec. 21, 2003, and was held on $500,000 bail and
faced up to 20 years in prison had she been convicted of the drug
charges.

"I haven't let myself be angry about what happened, because it
would tear me apart," Lee said. "I'm not sure I can bear to face
it. I'm amazed at how naive I was."

<more>

[Tesha]

1. The part I find most interesting (and scary)...

The part I find most interesting (and scary) is the initially-
positive drug tests. You don't suppose that the police testing
labs just *ASSUME* the result, do you? Or have tested so much
cocaine that there's cocaine dust everywhere?

Tesha

[shraby]

12. What kind of test would show flour up

as cocaine?? It was a bogus arrest to make someone feel good. She may have been stupid in what she did, but what the people who tested it at the airport did was inexcusable and needs answers for. If sueing is the only way to get answers so be it.

[Selteri]

15. The same test that makes hemp show up as having coke in it.

At least, that's my guess.

Seems to me that they test positive for coke a whole lot lately.

[Tesha]

16. A test that was not well-conducted.

> What kind of test would show flour up as cocaine??

A test that was not well-conducted. You know, the
kind that's done in a workroom where there's
enough cocaine dust floating around (from previous
tests) that a good whiff will get you high. I'd bet
that represents the conditions in lots of the
places where makeshift tests are conducted.

Tesha

[oneoftheboys]

22. A field test as opposed to a lab test.

[Ready4Change]

36. My understanding...

Is that cocaine and flour have very different appearances, viewed in person. That cocaine is more granular, fine crystals somewhere inbetween confectioners and table sugar.

And that an officer would have to be a moron to not see the difference, much less a testing lab.

Nice going, guys.

[haydukelives]

64. Of course they look diffrent

A child could tell the difference

[oneoftheboys]

Well, you nailed it

<<an officer would have to be a moron to not see the difference>>

Still, at worst, this individual should have spent no more than one night in jail.

[mattclearing]

146. Good call.

And welcome to DU! :hi:

[MissMillie]

80. spermicide on the condom....

If the flour was in a condom, it's likely that some spermicide may be mixed in with the flour. Whatever rudimentary field test they used may only detect that some drug is present, but may not be able to identify what drug was detected.

[pitohui]

38. cocaine contaminants are everywhere

hell, years ago ronald siegal and others confirmed that over 90 percent of usa currency is contaminated w. traces of cocaine

a field test is meaningless

nonetheless, the police clearly had probable cause for an arrest, i'm surprised they didn't adjust the charge to intent to sell a drug counterfeit when they discovered the condoms contained flour

if she had not been a rich bryn mawr lady, she'd still be in prison for that in my state

selling fake drugs is in a way worse than selling real drugs, because it's usually your friends you're trying to rip off, it can lead to violence just as selling real drugs & getting effed up can lead to violence, fraud is crime for a reason

no pity here

[High Plains]

209. What a bizarre comment--the "fake drugs" stuff

There is no indication whatsoever that she was going to sell the flour.

[FreedomAngel82]

133. It is scary

And I wonder how many are in prison now from a test that didn't work and their lives ruined.

[DS1]

2. You can sue for being a fucking moron now?

Wow

[ret5hd]

3. well, last i heard being a moron is not illegal...

but false arrest is.

[DS1]

6. Even if the results came back negative I'd support an arrest

to make double-sure.

[meegbear]

8. Damn right!

Lucky I'm not on the jury - I want her to pay the airport $500,000 for that "stunt".

[ret5hd]

82. hell yeah damn right!!!

better for ten innocent (albeit immature and mentally challenged) people to be arrested than even one guilty to go free!

Damn right, i say!

(do i really need that little sarcasm thingie down here?)

[Tesha]

86. (Sarcasm thingy: Nowadays, it would seem so. :-( (NT) )

[Tesha]

9. You know, I'm starting to suspect that a whole lot of DUers...

You know, I'm starting to suspect that a whole lot of DUers
will adapt just fine to living under fascism. As long as the
rights being violated aren't being used by you at that instant,
so many of you are awfully willing to let our constitutional
rights be trashed...

Here's a right *WE USED TO HAVE*, which used to be
guaranteed by the Fourth Amendment:

"The right of the people to be secure in their
persons, houses, papers, and effects, against
unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not
be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but
upon probable cause, supported by Oath or
affirmation, and particularly describing the
place to be searched, and the persons or things
to be seized."

What probable cause did the authorities have for
this search? Where was the warrant?

This is one of the rights that government has been
taking the greatest steps to eliminate, and the
"war on drugs" has been a major foil they've used
in that elimination. (And now, of course, the
"war on terra".) Remember this when they finally
decide that *YOU* are worthy of search and the
swabs taken of *YOUR* possessions test positive
for cocaine and opiates, even though you've never
actually seen a stronger opiate than a poppy-seed
bagel or a stronger cocaine-like substance than
the novacaine your dentist gave you that morning.

Tesha

[Selteri]

13. $th Amerndment? Isn't that on that piece of god damned paper?

You know, the one Bush and Taft are wiping their ***es with?

War on Drugs? I thought it was the war on freedom and personal responsability.

[DS1]

18. *yawn* Whatever. Bye.

[Atman]

20. Oh, puh-leeze

I wonder how many of us...me included...mean their comments to be taken literally, Tesha? Don't be so sensitive. This young women did a just plain dumbass, stupid thing. If she didn't do a crime, she certainly shouldn't have been locked up. But for christ's sake, you don't think she at least deserves some sort of award for being a major-league dolt?

[depakid]

23. That's one reason I'm trying to get out

after I get my degree.

I pretty think a majority of Americans deserve what they're going to get- just like some think this girl deserved the treatment she got.

Detained overnight, maybe. 3 weeks over flour- Makes me sick.

[G_j]

45. anyone familiar with the criminal justice system

knows that people sometimes die in custudy because "shit just happens".
Three weeks in jail can be dangerous for anybody.

edited to take back a careless assumption :-)

[DS1]

48. Nice assumption

Yes, I think her time in jail was excessive, but putting her there in the first place was reasonable under the circumstances.

Yes, I'm thinking about leaving the country, too.

Funny how those things work, isn't it? :eyes:

[G_j]

59. ok sorry

my apologies, I said "probably" and I was wrong. Also, if you think the time was excessive, than my comment didn't apply to you.
Still assumptions often come back to bite a person, and I should know better.

[Beelzebud]

49. Ever hear of bail?

[G_j]

66. $500,000 is pretty high

I have no idea what the specifics of her circumstances were or how much a bail bondsman would have cost. I doubt she stayed there by choice.

[Beelzebud]

69. 500,000 is not high for smuggling coke on an airplane.

[Tesha]

72. Shame it was just flour, huh?

The bail for smuggling flour is, what, $0?

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

73. Are you the girl this article is about? because you are just as naive..

[Tesha]

87. Nope. I'm just someone...

Nope. I'm just someone who still believes that the
Constitution of the United States ought to still
mean something.

Rare, I know.

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

91. It's a privately owned airplane. When you buy a ticket you AGREE to be

searched...

You can't really be this obtuse.

[Tesha]

97. You're confusing things.

Even if you agreed to be searched, it's not entirely clear
that an agent of the government that you have allowed to
conduct a limited of search of you for one purpose should
then throw your ass in jail as a result of their conducting
a search for another purpose *IN WHICH THEY DIDN'T ACTUALLY
FIND ANYTHING CRIMINAL*.

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

99. No. You're confused. Big-time...

[Tesha]

Lemme know how it goes for you...

Lemme know how it goes for you when the cops stop
you someday because "your brake light is out".

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

104. Been there done that.

The cop told me to get it fixed tomorrow and sent me on my way.

[Tesha]

109. Ahh. A precedent! Don't count on it in the future. (NT)

[Beelzebud]

111. It's happened more than once to me, and I've never been asked to

step out of the car...

[Tesha]

113. You understand that...

> It's happened more than once to me, and I've never been asked to
> step out of the car...

You understand that "past results are no gaurantee of future
performance", right?

And if the cop stops you for a bad brake light, he *OWNS*
your ass (and your car, and that marijuana seed you in-
advertently tracked into the footwell), right?

You need to read-up on DWB cases.

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

114. THE POLICE STATE IS HERE!!!! THE SKY IS FALLING

because i got pulled over for a bad tail-light.

[Tesha]

116. When it happens to you, you won't be so cavalier.

But it's mostly only happening to brown people right now,
so big whoop, right?

Tesha

[JVS]

232. As long as the passenger seat isn't covered in white powder, you...

should be fine.

[Horse with no Name]

177. I've never had a speeding ticket in my life

But I have been pulled over for flashing my lights (when I didn't), I have been pulled over for a faulty brake light (when it was not), I have been pulled over for numerous other silly things that weren't at all warranted.
Luckily, there was never any other reason for them to detain me, but that certainly didn't keep them from trying or looking and poking through my things.
There is such a thing as the Constitution that is supposed to protect us from illegal search and seizure and that is precisely what these unwarranted traffic stops are.
As far as the original OP, the girl was stupid.
Being stupid isn't a crime.
What happened to her after that WAS.

[Bonobo]

165. Ass***le

[Beelzebud]

167. Hey thanks.

Thats very ass***ish of you to say!

[High Plains]

210. By the way, what ever happened to the Eighth Amendment?

Amendment VIII - Cruel and Unusual punishment. Ratified 12/15/1791.

Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.

[Silverhair]

220. They usually charge 10%. So she would have had to come up with $50K. NT

[JVS]

233. Which would probably be managable for a Bryn Mawr student.

Provided that her family is not destitute, and if that were the case, I'm sure she had the opportunity to explain to the judge why the bail should be lower.

[pitohui]

43. if you can't see the probable cause

see, this right here is the problem of why we are having trouble being taken seriously when we complain

if you can't see why a condom full of white powder is not probable cause of a crime, then you are just not firing on all four cylinders and you are not going to be taken seriously when you have a genuine issue

there was clear probable cause here, either the lady was transporting drugs or she intended to fool someone, prob. some friend she planned to rip off at her destination, into believing she was transporting drugs

in other words, she intended to commit a fraud

she got stopped

the law worked as it should

everything tests positive for cocaine and/or opiates, a worrisome issue sure, one i have tried to raise awareness of for 20 years, but it's not the point in this case, since the arrest was a GOOD arrest

i suppose if she raises enough fuss w. her lawsuit she will give the police no choice but to re-arrest on the counterfeit drug charge, she never would have been released and been in position to file this lawsuit if she'd been flying whilst black or hispanic, you can bet your ass

we have a double standard in this country, one law for the yalies and the bryn mawrs, another law for the rest of us

in real world, she would have gotten more than 3 freckin weeks for her crime, which IS a crime, you know, counterfeit drugs are not a harmless hobby, they are a fraud

we need to focus on innocent victims of bad drug tests, not on people who are clearly guilty of some evil deed & also clearly capable of looking out for themselves politically and financially

[Tesha]

47. I'm sorry, but how did they even notice...

I'm sorry, but how did they even notice the three condoms
in the first place? Was it because, during the alleged
screening against terrorist threats, they just "happened"
to notice the possible drugs? Do you think that's okay?

The question of probable cause doesn't occur at the
moment that the baggage screener hands the condoms
over to the cops; it occurs at the moment that the
screeners first decide to take a look.

Tesha

[pitohui]

70. you are given fair warning

if there is anyone so ill-informed that they are unaware that bags are subject to search at the airport, there are only like ninety million signs informing you of same at the airport

if you don't want to be subject to search, it's pretty simple, don't fly, they still have highways that run from the east coast to the west

everyone is subject to search at the airport, no exceptions, not even for bryn mawr students!

you must know you are making an unreasonable argument

without proper searches and security, airplanes would be hijacked and blown up and diverted every day, i can't be the only person here who remembers the early 70s?

she consented to search when she decided to fly, she did have a choice, and she made the choice that she would allow the search

i'll let you in on a little secret, your suitcase does not have civil rights, it is not a protected class under the 4th amendment

leave your drugs and your fake drugs at home, thank you v. much

[Tesha]

85. Warning or not, do you even figure *THAT* should be allowed?

Warning or not, do you even figure *THAT* should be allowed?

If you actually *BELIEVED* that the words in our Constitution
were true, you might start to consider whether the Fourth
Amendment permits screeners to report all those other
crimes that they just happen across in the course of
preventing you from being blown to tiny bits.

Lets put a different hypothetical out here:

In your luggage is a sex toy. But you're flying to/
from/through a place where such things have been
made illegal. Should you be subject to arrest when
your dildo shows up on the X-Ray screen?

Another:

You have, packed in your luggage, a piece of documentation
that clearly identifies you as an abortionist. (They found
it when they saw the set of curettes in your luggage and
opened the bags for a deeper-cutting search). You're in
one of those red states that has laws on the books calling
for the murder prosecution of abortion providers. Should
you be arrested, imprisoned, and perhaps executed?

Or should the Fourth Amendment have protected you (in
both of these cases) against unreasonable, warrantless
search and seizure of evidence?

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

88. Do you honestly think you shouldn't be searched before boarding a plane?

Is that what you are arguing for here?

[Tesha]

92. You know, there used to be a time when it wasn't done.

> Do you honestly think you shouldn't be searched before boarding a plane?

You know, there used to be a time when it wasn't done.

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

94. OMFG... Yeah that worked real nice...

[Tesha]

98. Curiously enough, it did.

Of course, since then, we've allowed the world to
become a far cruder place. And we've incited many
lillions to hate us who didn't hate us before.

So now you can kiss your freedoms goodbye.

(Ohmygosh! That sounds just like the typical
descent of a society into *FASCISM*! "We *HAVE*
to destroy your rights inorder to protect you!")

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

102. LOL... Yeah it worked real great for hijackers and drug smugglers.

[pitohui]

120. well you see tesha I ACTUALLY FLY

so hell yes, i want all checked bags and carry-ons searched

it violates my rights to be dead or diverted to cuba, which was a routine risk of flying in the pre-security era

go back and read the old records of the early 70s, it was just hijacking after hijacking and bomb scare or actual bomb after bomb

again, keep in mind, your suitcase NEVER had 4th amendment rights or any other civil rights, it is a suitcase, if your boundary issues are such that you are stressed by having it properly searched, then you don't need to be on an airplane w. me

because guess what, you are not the only one w. civil rights, i have rights too


!

[Tesha]

126. Golly! So do I! What a coincidence!

> i have rights too

Waive them often enough and you won't.

Tesha

[Thorandmjolnir]

149. What fraud?

Fraud is a legal term with a very specific meaning. How di she commit fraud. She did not try to gain an advantage over anybody, nor did she try to suppress the truth.

Definition of Fraud:

All multifarious means which human ingenuity can devise, and which are resorted to by one individual to get an advantage over another by false suggestions or suppression of the truth. It includes all surprises, tricks, cunning or dissembling, and any unfair way which another is cheated.

Source: Black’s Law Dictionary, 5th ed., by Henry Campbell Black, West Publishing Co., St. Paul, Minnesota, 1979.

fraud

Intentionally deceiving another person and causing her to suffer a loss. Fraud includes lies and half-truths, such as selling a lemon and claiming "she runs like a dream."

http://www.nolo.com/definition.cfm/Term/50857DE1-DE31-401F-A1E549CF6F035785/alpha/F/

[mongo]

83. Unfurtunately, the 4th amendment is not in play here

The autorities are there with the permission of the airline company whose private plane she was about to board. If the airline sanctions you being searched before boarding, that is their perogative.

Not in keeping much with the spirit of the 4th amendment, but if I see someone hitch-hiking and I stop and ask to search them before they get in my car, they can either be searched or keep walking.

Now she may have a case against wrongful imprisonment under the 6th, but she did have materials that were SUPPOSED TO LOOK LIKE CONTRABAND. In my states, selling fake drugs is also a crime, and having this in her suitcase can be considered possesion with intent to sell.

She did a really dumb stunt here.

[enlightenment]

118. Have to agree with you, Tesha.

It seems like this story has struck a nerve -- exposing several issues. From the article, it seems like a silly, young girl decided to try a silly stunt -- and was surprised at the outcome. Law enforcement over-reacted, and a judge made a poor decision. That's one issue.
Another is the broader ramifications of the story, that you are pointing out.
Another is the response of some of the folks here at DU -- disturbing, from my perspective, but as liberals we embrace differences, right?

I would ask those DU'ers who think she that she got what she deserved to consider another hypothetical:
assume for a moment that she did this on purpose, to draw attention not only to the law but how the law is enforced. Would we applaud her then -- as she had made herself a martyr to the erosion of constitutional protections?
In 1892, Homer Plessy broke a law, to challenge it's constitutionality. In the end, his attempt to strike at the law failed; it really made things worse -- but he did what he did to force change, and we admire him today for his conviction.
I know this girl didn't do this to make a point -- but what if she had?

[malaise]

174. I agree with you n/t

[sendero]

178. I'm pretty sure you are right...

.... personally, I wonder on just what constitutional grounds the drug laws are based to begin with.

I doubt any field test of any kind was done. Just a routine bust.

Here in Dallas, several men were sent to huge prison terms on what later turned out to be gypsum dust. I forget every detail, but basically one or two cops were involved in every one of these busts, and in every case the defendant insisted they had nothing to do with cocaine.

One of the policemen was convicted of falsifying evidence or somesuch, and his case is on appeal. This kind of official corruption would be met with the stiffest penalties if I were king, this joker would never see the outside of a prison again.

[jmowreader]

207. The cops had three "probable causes" for the search

Who the hell carries condoms full of flour around? It does seem a silly thing to have in your suitcase.

Being a fucking idiot is not currently illegal, but sometimes you have to wonder...

[Benhurst]

If being a moron were illegal, Bush would have been locked years ago. NT

[elehhhhna]

190. We are free to be morons. Three weeks is a bit long, though.

[ddeclue]

204. But it can get you killed...

[haydukelives]

75. No

you can be sued for throwing someone in jail for 3 weeks without cause!

[Beelzebud]

78. She was in jail for 3 weeks because she wouldn't post bond.

Thats how it works when you are arrested for possession of cocaine.

[Tesha]

100. Too bad it was flour, ehh? (NT)

(A point you seem to be reliably missing.)

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

105. Too bad it tested positive for cocaine, and was packaged like cocaine.

A point you seem to be reliably missing.

[Tesha]

110. By what test? Conducted in what drug-contaminated back room?

Someone else mentioned it, but someday, you might
want to test your cash (or even your person) for
cocaine. You might be surprised what you'll find.

Hypothetical:

The bomb-sniffing devices at the airport get up-
revved so besides nitrates, they also detect opiates,
cocaine-relatives, and cannabinoids.

Will you still go through airport security with
your cavalier attitude? Or will you just carry
a matchbook with your bail-bondsman's number on
it and a book to last three weeks?

Tesha

[elehhhhna]

193. No! No matches allowed on the plane. lol

[JVS]

184. And when it turned out not to be coke they let her go. The system works

[Tesha]

229. Just a tough break about spending three weeks in jail, huh?

And when it happens to you, how will you feel?

Tesha

[JVS]

231. That's what happens when you get arrested for suspicious activities and...

don't pay bail. If I ever get arrested for doing something so stupid, I'd be surprised.

[High Plains]

215. $500, 000 bond.

I don't think it was because she "refused" to post bond.

What ever happened to the Eighth Amendment? You know the one about no excessive bail?

[Atman]

4. What I find interesting is Janet Lee's stupidity.

Some joke! Har har...let's go to an airport with a bunch of white powder in our luggage, packed just like drugs! Woo hoo, this'll be fun! Dumbass. The three-week sentence should be considered punishment for being such an idiot!

[Thorandmjolnir]

7. Well, Like said previously

being an idiot is still not illegal.

You would think they had a way of testing this stuff on the spot.

[NYC Liberal]

21. Some people will do just fine under fascism it seems.

[Atman]

24. Double *yawn*

:eyes:

[Tesha]

26. Yes, I realize we're boring you...

Yes, I realize we're boring you, what with our ramblings
about the rights we used to have (and not take quite so
for granted).

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

25. If you think this is fascism you dont' know the meaning of the word...

This girl was a dumb-ass. Period. End of story.

No fascism required. Don't bring Cocaine Condom Look-A-Like's with you on an airplane and you'll be fine.

[Tesha]

30. One of the aspects of fascism...

One of the aspects of fascism is that the government has
official positions which seem to assure your rights while
the *ACTIONS* of the government deny you those very rights.

You don't need me to enumerate all the rights that our
government claims we still have but which that same
government is currently trampling into the mud just
as fast as it can.

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

31. I stand by my statement.

If you think this idiot getting in trouble for smuggling condoms, filled with white powder, is fascism, you don't know what fascism is...

[Tesha]

34. Perhaps not.

But I'm pretty sure we all will soon if attitudes as expressed
in this thread take root.

Go ahead; excuse the government *ALL* the excesses that don't
affect you personally.

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

35. I'm not excusing *ALL* government excesses... for fucks sake...

Here's a hypothetical situation.

I go on an airplane. I have a shoebox full of wires, clay, a battery, and a stopwatch.

Should I go to jail? My shoebox wasn't a bomb, it just appeared to be one. It was just for stress relief.

[Tesha]

44. That's actually a pretty subtle question.

Perhaps you shouldn't be allowed to fly until the clay is tested
and just maybe, they should take your toy away before letting you
fly. But throwing you in jail for a few weeks even after the
officers took a sample of your clay and completely failed at
trying to detonate it seems like a pretty sick over-response
to your hypothetical.

Our society seems to have no compunctions any more against
applying broad-brush, stupidly-ignorant, canned solutions
to problems. A potential threat? Don't think, just lock
'em up!

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

53. If she wanted out faster she should have had someone bail her out.

[Tesha]

58. Is that the test of our legal system?

> If she wanted out faster she should have had someone bail her out.

Is that the test of our legal system? That if one can find a
friend, relative, or bail-bondsman, it's "good enough"?

Golly you must have low standards!

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

60. Thats how it works! You are as naive as this girl apparently...

If she didn't want to sit in jail for 3 weeks until her court date came up, she should have bailed out!

That is how the system operates!

[Tesha]

63. Answer my question. (NT)

[Beelzebud]

67. I did answer your question. You just don't like the answer.

That is how our legal system works.

You get arrested. You sit in jail until your court date, or until someone can post bond, and bail you out.

Why should it be different for this white college girl?

[Tesha]

71. I asked you if that was "Good enough?"

Was it "good enough?" Would you still think so
if it was your ass unjustly placed in the slammer?

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

76. I don't carry flour filled condoms on airplanes. Good Enough would have

been her leaving her flour filled condoms at home, and not packing them in a suitcase!

[High Plains]

217. What an asshole response.

Are you suggesting she sat in a stinking cell for three weeks because she felt like it?

Or maybe, just maybe, she didn't have half a million dollars?

What a prick!

[Thorandmjolnir]

152. Any idea how much it cost

to post a $500,000 bail?

I bet it is not cheap, since in reality youre getting a loan.

[Tesha]

153. I believe 10% (so $50,000 in this case) is a typical fee.

http://www.lawcollective.org/article.php?id=50

> Bondsmen don’t always charge 10% of the bail as their fee.
> Sometimes they can charge a lower rate, such as 8%, if the
> bail is very large, or the defendant has a private attorney,
> or is a union member, etc. The range within which bondsmen
> can set their fees is governed by state law. Definitely check
> with your lawyer if the bondsman is quoting you a rate that’s
> over 10%.

Surely *EVERY* DUer has a disposable $50,000 just sitting
around, right?

Just in case they get busted for possession of baking ingredients?

(:sarcasm:)

Tesha

[sendero]

180. Your whole opinion..

.... rests on the assumption that a positive test, conducted properly, actually occurred.

My opinion rests on the fact that it did not.

The fact that the condoms contained flour gives a lot more creedence to my version than to yours.

If the police are going to arrest you based on "evidence", they need to have repeatable and reliable practices and procedures for assessing such evidence. Clearly, they do not.

[AZBlue]

54. Exactly!

[Bonobo]

168. So I bring flour in a flour bag and wind up with the same results...

Does that make me an idiot for carrying flour on the plane. Or does she deserve to be in jail cause she's stupid? If so, I sentence you to life imprisonment, "Atman".

[Beelzebud]

169. If it wasn't stuffed into condoms like cocaine, no you wouldn't.

[Bonobo]

171. But if the test still gives a false positive I will be!

[Lisa]

182. I would be amazed if drug smugglers hadn't tried using a flour bag!

Or can of talcum powder, etc. -- anything that would look innocuous, on first inspection. Surely packaging it in condoms (unless you were planning on swallowing them) would attract attention -- which is precisely what smugglers would want to avoid. Which would indicate a rather stupid smuggler, at the very least.


What I'm wondering about (completely aside from the debates over how stupid a prank is and what constitutes an unreasonable search, and access to bail) -- is why the flour gave a positive test. Is this due to spermicide (as someone suggested earlier), or cross-contamination, or problems with the test sensitivity or the way it's performed in the field? If it's one of the latter things, we could see people running into unexpected difficulties with their flour, talcum powder, toothpaste, etc.

p.s. in some jurisdictions, there is a charge called "wasting police time" which can be applied in these kinds of cases. I don't think it involves quite as much jail, but it does get the point across.

[JVS]

192. Do you hate us for our fake cocaine toting freedoms or what?

;-)

[High Plains]

216. Bullshit.

The girl was a dumb ass, yes, but that's hardly the end of the story.

This was way fucked up. The cops said the flour tested positive for hemp and cocaine!?!? That was the first indication something is screwy. What, hemp powder?! Second, these are airport cops who bust people for drugs every day. They couldn't tell the difference between flour and cocaine? Jesus Christ, just taste it, for fuck sakes! This was a pathetic performance by those cops and it resulted in a wrong arrest, and I guess we'll see how "wrongful" it was. $$$$$$$

And then there's the bail. $500,000 for a few ounces of a drug?! You have no problem with that? Or is just your run of the mill daily injustice of the drug war. Ho-hum.

Remember, this innocent college student spent three fucking weeks in some jail cell over a fucking mistake by the cops. I hope she collects big time.

[napi21]

5. I don't see her winning this! She needs to recognize that was just

a dumb thing to do!

That is akin to someone walking into a bank pointing a gun. He really has no case against the guard who shot him, just because the gun was a realistic looking toy!

[sweetheart]

27. It is nothing like that whatsoever

It is legal to have flour in your bag. It is legal to have condoms too.
It is legal to put flour in condoms, and to pack them in your bag.
Most persons would use tupperware or a more appropriate container, but
whatever container is not really an issue.

These things were packed INSIDE her suitcase, not pointing a gun... geez,
what a fantasy you've constructed to justify the criminal behavour of the
police.

Years ago, i was pulled over for speeding in Los Angeles, and the police
found in my back seat a baggie with little white dust and crumbs in it.
They tested what turned out to be salt and breadcrumbs from my lunch sandwich.
by tasting it in their mouths... to test... and i just laughed at the assholes.
..chewing on my sandwich crumbs, 2 very stupid looking and somewhat embarassed
drugs nazis they were. As nasty as 1 of those cops was, they at least had
the common sense to street-check the suspected drugs.

I think all americans should travel around with a condom full of flower. You
never know when you'll need some for making pizza dough, and in the worse case,
it can make a bland meal if your hotel does not have room service. I you pack
enough flour in to the condom, it could be even used as a rather effective
sex toy.

THis woman should sue them for the time in jail. It is fair that she should
be compensated for a false arrest, for violation of her civil rights to carry
food in her bags, and for any duress. I hope she wins big and the police
assholes stick to finding terrorists.

[Beelzebud]

40. You do know that condoms are the #1 items use for smuggling cocaine

on an airplane? You do know that, right?

[sweetheart]

46. Yes, i do

I also have read the constitution.
I have read the universal declaration of human rights.
I have studied in depth the erosion of civil liberties under the
drugs war over the past 30 years and the damage has been *SEVERE*.

They have no right. The nazis have gone too far.

[Tesha]

52. It doesn't matter.

> You do know that condoms are the #1 items use for smuggling cocaine
> on an airplane? You do know that, right?

It doesn't matter. As someone else pointed out, possession of
condoms, flour, and flour-filled condoms *STILL* isn't a crime.
In the same way that being (for example) a long-haired, tee-
shirt-wearing, hippy freak doesn't give them probable cause
to frisk you for drugs.

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

56. It IS a crime to have fake drugs!

And if she didn't want to sit in jail for 3 weeks she should have had someone bail her ass out!

[pitohui]

77. it is indeed a crime

possession of
condoms, flour, and flour-filled condoms *STILL* isn't a crime

if you don't know what you're talking about, just stop for a minute

transport and sale of counterfeit drugs is a crime, yes, it was a bad counterfeit drug but clearly this young lady intended to cheat her friends or acquaintances at her destination

at least it's a crime when black people do it, not sure why it suddenly isn't a crime when Miss Bryn Mawr does it

fair is fair

[sweetheart]

156. ya know

I don't do cocaine, but even "I" could tell cocaine from
flour. The only persons fooled by a condom full of flour
are the police.

I do agree with your universaity view, that if its a crime, then its
a crime no matter your skin colour... but this was no crime.

This was false arrest of a US citizen, on false charges.
Its happening too often, way too often... and is incited by
the drugs prohibition laws.

What maniac interprets freedom as doing what your told.
This woman is living in a *free* country, or so they say.
In a free country, carrying some of the most basic foodstuff
used by people all over the earth for thousands of years,
every single day... is no crime.

[High Plains]

219. When they are swallowed by the mules

No drug smuggler is going to put drugs in his luggage that he knows is subject to inspection.

[pitohui]

57. oh please

i'm sorry, i think the sellers of counterfeit drugs should be in prison

if the young lady was instead of being a bryn mawr student, let's say she was a six foot two 18 year old high school drop-out black young man from detroit with the condoms full of flour

he'd still be in prison

it wouldn't be news

because, you know what?

carrying and selling fake drugs is illegal, it has been illegal for years, it SHOULD be illegal, it is fraud

she got special treatment and still has the nerve to want to cash in

as for the cops eating your sandwich crumbs, that's a nice story, but i don't see why we should ask cops to make a routine habit of tasting other people's crap and leavings, thank you v. much, that is just unhygenic and filthy, jeez, i've seen a car with roaches before (the insect kind) and it's because of people who don't throw out their damn garbage, but to expect the cops to taste the damn garbage you're too lazy to throw out...come on, that is not a reasonable expectation

[Tesha]

61. Where does it say she was "selling" these alleged fake drugs?

Or are you adding that just to soothe your conscience
over how our justice system no longer functions?

Tesha

[pitohui]

84. she was interdicted

she never got there to sell, did she, because the system worked and she was stopped

lots of people are in jail for possessing oregano and other kitchen fakes, but who cares, they're not white bryn mawr college girls

sometimes it really is that simple, it's just class and race, stories like this are not usually even put on the news because if they were, you wouldn't care

i am for equality, the law should be the same for all, no special treatment for bryn mawr girls

[Tesha]

103. Lowest Common Denominator, huh?

> i am for equality, the law should be the same for all, no special treatment for bryn mawr girls

Lowest Common Denominator, huh?

Which Amendment is that?

Tesha

[Demit]

107. Boy you really have a hard on for the college she goes to, don't you?

Not everybody who goes there is rich, you twit.

And your other assumptions! "Clearly this young lady intended to cheat her friends or acquaintances at her destination, she's "clearly guilty of some evil deed", "she obviously wanted someone to think she had drugs"--you are reading way more into this story than is there.

[pitohui]

122. oh come on, i'm not a jury, i don't have to pretend to be stupid

we all know why people carry around counterfeit drugs and it is not for stress relief

what am i reading into this story that everyone, who admits to having an ounce of common sense, wouldn't read?

re-type the story, except everywhere it says "janet lee" type "terrell lee" and everywhere it says "college student" or "attends bryn mawr" put "ex-high school basketball player" and "unemployed detroit resident"

we wouldn't even be talking about the story because no one would care!

[Demit]

154. Yes, you don't have to pretend to be stupid, all right. True that.

People who have common sense wait to hear the actual facts of something before pronouncing that "we all know" already what they are.

You've decided that she was carrying counterfeit drugs, and you've decided that you know what her intent was. You're very sure of these things. Cop, judge & jury, that's you. So, okay, what would happen if this was Terrell Lee, basketball player from Detroit, and all the other facts in the story stayed the same? Talk to me. Would you make the same automatic assumptions about him as you have made about this young woman who goes to college? Would you assume you know what his financial situation was? Would you accuse him of "wanting to cash in" if he sued the police? Aren't you doing exactly what you decry?

[High Plains]

221. That's certainly right. No pretending necessary.

And you're carrying a real hard-on for Ivy Leaguers, too.

Nobody except you said anything about fake drugs. Not the cops. Not the girl. Nobody. It's all in your fevered imagination. And your notion that she is going to sell fake drugs to her friends is equally bizarre.

I'm sorry she wasn't a poor black man. But you don't have to be a poor black man to get screwed.

[elehhhhna]

194. Can't taste/sniff test now: anthrax, don'tchaknow.

[Selteri]

10. I don't think she shold sue... but

I think she deerves an apology since she was arrested falsly and that the cops had a bad test somehow...

They seem to get coke a lot though, they found coke on a munch of hemp plants that were growing on aa reservation supposedly, something that makes absolutely no sense at all.

[William769]

11. Well I guess the joke was on her

As it should have been. Ignorance can be fixed, stupidity can't.

[depakid]

14. I'm sorry, but if they were filled with flour

Then there is no goddam reason why she ought to have been locked up for 3 weeks, however lame brained a stunt she pulled.

You can't tell me that the authorities WEREN'T NEGLIGENT for not being able to detect common household flour after she disclosed to them what it was. It's flour, for crissakes. You bake with it.

People who think otherwise really need to spend some time abroad among reasonable people for awhile. America's collective insanity is getting to you.

[NuttyFluffers]

191. shit, all you have to do is spit on it and watch it clump into glue.

flour and coke are very different substances and even rudimentary analysis can figure it out. DARE 'graduate' here and it's beyond stupid to think these authorities couldn't figure out the difference that easily. how come i was exposed to what drugs looked like, etc. in DARE class and these security people can't tell? is their training THAT bad? and we are excusing incompetence THAT bad? this place is beyond fucked if we're trying to defend this level of incompetence.

gonna really enjoy my pina colada overseas as i watch this country go to hell in a handbasket.

[Initech]

17. What a freaking idiot!

I mean come on, anyone stupid enough to actually bring open condom packages in their bags deserves to be locked up!

[LeftHander]

19. When I first heard this they were"relaxation" devices...

Hmmmm condoms filled with flour....what are those for....???


I wonder.

[Tesha]

32. (The linked article does go on to say this)

(But DU's policy is a four 'graph max, right?)

(Tesha)

(If you can't hear me, it's because I'm speaking
in parentheses. -- S. Wright)

[LisaM]

28. I'm not really sure why she packed them

they seem strange, but also sort of expendable. If I had created such a thing, I don't think I'd pack it in a suitcase. I'd make new ones later if I needed them.

[Tesha]

39. Perhaps as a deliberate provocation? A test?

> I'm not really sure why she packed them.

Perhaps as a deliberate provocation? A test?
But even if it was a deliberate test, it still
wasn't a crime. Well, not yet. But I'm sure
"simulating drugs" will be soon; better kill
off any false aralias that you have. :-)

Tesha

[LisaM]

159. Well I think that's a waste of the TSA's time

I really don't have any use for people who would bother the TSA with fake drugs (especially during Christmas) unless they were in law enforcement or airline security. Mind you, I don't think she should have been in jail for three weeks, don't agree with the bail, and believe that the drug tests should have shown what the subject was, but why on earth someone would use up resources like that is beyond me. However, I don't think she did it on purpose. That's why I can't figure out why she packed them. It's like, here is her conversation with herself: "Hmm. Should I take my three condoms filled with flour? Oh, of course I should! I can't possibly replace them and I might need them."

[EFerrari]

29. This thread is amazing.

So much focus on a naive kid.

So little on the incompetent fascists.

Better hope you're not stupid or naive today.

[G_j]

37. agreed! n/t

[sweetheart]

42. the mindstates of "the rules"

People are brainwashed for the rules over and over, until they see all frames
as endemic to following the rules.

Immoral is to "break" the rules... when really, immoral is to do wrong.

Increasingly, people can't tell the difference.

[Tesha]

55. "Hey buddy, you're tail-light is burned out."

> Better hope you're not stupid or naive today.

No kidding. Or just plain unlucky.

"Hey buddy, you're tail-light is burned out. Step out of the car."

It's that simple, these days, especially when people are so willing
to cede their (or at least others) rights to those in "authority".

Tesha

[pitohui]

33. on what grounds?

she threw away 3 weeks of her life, now she wants to throw away her money, well, prob. her parent's money

she's lucky she isn't still in prison, in my state, intent to sell drug counterfeits is also a crime, maybe not a 20 yr crime, but the lady obviously wanted someone to think she had drugs and she has some time coming, stress relief my ass, what other purpose could there be than to rip somebody off with fake drugs?

no pity here

[Tesha]

68. Perhaps she was just being deliberately provocative.

> what other purpose could there be than to rip somebody off with fake drugs?

Perhaps she was just being deliberately provocative? I've heard
folks used to challenge laws (or civil procedures, etc.) that
they felt were unjust. (I realize now, based on the responses
in this thread, that that attitude is passe.)

Perhaps she was just testing the system (with, who knows,
the intent to commit a crime in the future). But that
alone isn't a crime.

Tesha

[Thorandmjolnir]

155. I am confused

From where in the story does it say she had the intent to sell drugs? Where does it say that she intended to defraud anyone or pass off the flour as real drugs?

Sorry, but unless something is illegal, you don't go to jail. It's as simple as that.

It is scary that anyone can say you should go to jail for being stupid or naive even when what you did is not illegal.

Scary indeed.

[High Plains]

222. Why don't you stop with this "intent to sell fake drugs" bullshit?

It is all in your head, dude. Did they charge her with selling fake drugs? No.

"No pity here." That's certainly clear. Hope your proud of yourself.

[McCamy Taylor]

41. The first "test" was a fake. She has grounds to sue. The DEA

obviously thought that she was part of a drug trafficking ring, that someone switched drug filled condoms with fakes, that she might not know about the switch and would talk if put under pressure (i.e was jailed long enough after being told a lie). Only after three weeks did they finally decide that she was not going to talk to them.

Her attorney needs to get the evidence back, demand to know what screen was used and ask that independent forensic experts verify that the test would show a false positive with pure flour if used correctly. I will bet that the test would not show a positive. There may not even be a rapid test. There might even be a negative test result, though I doubt it. The DEA is quite corrupt and it would probably have been trashed by now.

Also, look for a pattern of similar abuses.

If her lawyer looks aggressive enough, the government might settle this one, calling iy incompetence rather than maliciousness, though in fact I would place money on the latter.

[Village Idiot]

50. No offense, but I think she got what she deserved.

I hope her lawsuit fails miserably. What responsible person, in this day and age, in this country would attempt to bring flour-filled condoms through Airport Security? I hope the authorities cavity searched this idiot ON THE SPOT, with really thick, wooly gloves!

"I'm amazed at how naive I was."

What a complete and utter MORON.

[Beelzebud]

51. Don't want to sit in jail for 3 weeks? GET SOMEONE TO BAIL YOU OUT!

Some of you are acting like they threw her in a cell for 3 weeks with no bond...

[Lars39]

62. If your family isn't very well off, making bond could be a hardship.

[Beelzebud]

65. Then you sit in jail until your court date. That is how it works.....

Why should this white college girl get it any different than any other person arrested on possession of cocaine?

As others have said. If this were an 18 year old black male, they would have charged him with posssession of counterfit drugs, and he'd be sitting in prison right now...

[LostinVA]

223. WHAT white college girl? Lee is Asian-American

[MadHound]

74. Interesting how many people around here are welcoming the police state

With open arms, and blaming the victim in this case, Janet Lee. Naive, yes, she is, but weren't we all a bit naive when we were her age?

And yes, I can see her using these as stress relief devices. Hell, they sell the exact same ingredients every day in those little stress relief balls that the make by the millions. Most are made with fine grain sand or flour as the filling, with thick walled latex rubber enclosing them. For the prudes out there, companies don't make them with condoms, but hey, I can see it done as a joke.

In fact I saw just this recipie for making stress relief balls back in late eighties, use flour and thick walled rubber balloons. This girl made them out of what was handy.

And quite frankly the cops who busted this poor woman were completely out of line. Three weeks in jail?! $500,000 bail!? And they got a false positive for coke?! What kind of Mickey Mouse operation are these idiots running in Philly? I hope she gets every dime that she's suing for, and then some. Whatever happened to those field tests, you know, rub a little of the suspected substance over your gum, taste it a little? But no, apparently they only have faith in their lab equipment, which judging by this incident is contaminated as hell. If I was some other person being held in Philly on a drug charge, I'd be suing the piss out of them also, because this is evidence of massive negligence in their testing labs and equipment.

But these people around here, blaming the victim:eyes: By what right did they have to search her? Why do you think she should be arrested for, as several have put it, "due to her own stupidity"? Good grief, no wonder fascism is taking hold in this country, judging by the posts on this thread, liberals are welcoming the police state almost as much as conservatives are:eyes:

I got picked up on a bad check charge twenty five years ago. At the time I was carrying a dug-out willed with snuff. The cops thought it might be hash, even though I assured them it was snuff. Did I get arrested? No, they simply confiscated the dug-out, sent it to their labs, and let me go(yes I had to pay for the bad check). AFTER they tested the snuff, they notified me that all was well and that I could pick up the dug-out. Was I being a bit naive, sure. But one should not have to pay the price for being naive, especially when you aren't carrying drug paraphenalia, and the substance in question is flour. Hell, have any of you had the chance to compare flour to coke? I have, and there is a world of difference in the look, texture and feel of flour, and if these idiotic cops couldn't figure that out, well they should be busted down to parking tickets because they don't have the brains or skill to be involved with narcotics.

[Beelzebud]

81. "By what right did they have to search her?"

When she purchased her ticket, and agreed to be screened before boarding the plane!

[MadHound]

95. Sorry, I don't think that one will fly

Everybody in this country is so fucking terrified that they're willing to throw away their rights. I hoping that somebody will have the money and guts to bust airport screening to the Supreme Court as a trial case. I'm a firm believer in Fourth Amendment rights. Or didn't you here, the same arguement that you're making about airports was made by the Tampa Bay Buccaneers defending their searching procedures. A couple of fans got fed up with it, sued and won. Now no NFL teams can search their fans. I'm waiting for that to happen with the airlines.

Just because "everybody is doing it" or "it's a law" doesn't make it Constitutional friend.

[Beelzebud]

106. So you think no one should be searched when boarding an airplane?

I didn't realize a sports stadium could be used as a vehicle to smuggle drugs, or have the ability to be hijacked.

[MadHound]

117. Gee, for the longest while nobody was searched

Oh, yeah, that's right, "9/11 Changed Everything". Yeah, so did the Reichstag Fire, and look what happened with that mess.

Sorry pal, but you can give up every single damn right you have, get those full body cavity searches, and guess what, terrorists could still blow your happy ass up.

Rather than giving away our civil rights in the fraudulent and ultimately futile quest for security, how about we stop pissing people off to the point we make terrorists out of them? You know, setting in motion illegal, immoral wars that kill hundreds of thousands of innocents. Or refusing them humanitarian aid when they ask for it, things like that. Do you realize that we could have had a staunch ally in bin Laden for the pricetag of 2 million dollars? Back in the eighties, when Reagan was hailing them as Freedom Fighter, after they kicked Russia out of Afghanistan, bin Laden asked for some humanitarian relief from his US allies(that is what he thought of us as, allies, since we had provided arms for him) Afghanistan was seriously beaten down and needed some help. But guess what, we refused. There lies the root of bin Laden's deep abiding anger at the US, 2 million dollars. How much did we lose when the WTC came down? Billions.

Hey, as the Iraqis have amply proven, cars can be used as weapons of terrorism. Should we start doing strip searches on you before you drive? Same logic applies now.

Go read you Ben Franklin, the man has some serious words of wisdom about peope who give up liberties for faux security. I suggest you live by them.

[Beelzebud]

121. We were searching for drugs on planes way before 9/11..

I never mentioned 9/11, you did.

I'm not talking about giving up my rights to be safe from terrorists. Jesus fucking christ.

She got caught for carrying what appeared to be condoms filled with cocaine. She got busted. She didn't bail out. And now she wants to sue for it.

It has nothing to do with terrorism.

Oh fuck it. A white girl had a bad time for smuggling fake drugs. We should just let anyone on an airplane with anything they want now right?

I'm not a god damn freeper. I just don't hold too much sympathy for idiots that do something stupid and then want to sue somebody because they were a jackass...

[MadHound]

125. She made some home made squeeze balls

And any halfway competent cop could have figured out, on the spot, that it was flour. Instead, they through her in jail and put an outrageous bail amount on her. Gee, could you pull a half mill out of your ass? If she is from the typical middle class household, throwing away the ten percent, $50,000, for a bail bondsman would be a severe hardship. So yeah, she had to sit, unjustly, in a jail cell for three damn weeks. And yes, if it is legal, and not a weapon, we should let anyone on an airplane with anything they want. It's called a free society, I realize that it's hard to recognize anymore, but it is technically still there.

And yes, we were searched before, namely our bags were X-rayed, that's about it. Not the full search they require of you now. And hell, thirty years ago they didn't even do that. Shows you what this stupidity of the "War on Drugs" brought us, and how it has utterly eroded our civil rights.

But I suppose there were apoligists for the Third Reich's actions too:eyes:

[Tesha]

132. "It's okay, they only are doing it to the Jews..."

> But I suppose there were apologists for the Third Reich's actions too

"It's okay, they only are doing it to the Jews..."

"Well, Gypsies too."

"And the occasional Catholic."

"And the homos."

"And the Commies."

"And me??!?"

Tesha

(Paraphrasing the famous)

[Beelzebud]

136. Oh for fucks sake...

What's the rule? First person to call the other person a Nazi has lost the argument.

I'm an apologist for the 3rd Reich, for thinking it's stupid to sue the state because you couldn't bail yourself out of jail, after doing something stupid?

What a bunch of fucking garbage. I'm done "debating" this. It's fucking stupid.

I can't belive I'm being called a fucking Nazi because I think you should be searched before boarding an airplane, and because I think this white girl shouldn't get any money for sueing the state, over something that would have landed a minority in prison.

[Tesha]

138. Nahh, you're not a Nazi. Just someone...

Nahh, you're not a Nazi. Just someone who would (apparently) stand
there and play the part of "Good German".

In the future, it will be interesting looking back and seeing if
these really are the 1930's redux, when all of us Good Germans
could have stood up and made a difference but we didn't.

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

142. Oh, I'm a "good german" now?

A "good german" says Iraq is a just war.

A "good german" says the NSA should be able to spy on citizens.

A "good german" says that Bush is above the law.

An IDIOT smuggles fake cocaine on an airplane and then has the nerve to sue the state after she didn't bail herself out.

[MadHound]

143. Not calling you a Nazi at all, just drawing a comparison

You are an apologist for our current police state. There were apologists for the Third Reich too. And it didn't matter to either sets of apologists what happened to others, so long as it didn't effect them.

But what both sets of apologists fail to realize is that sooner or later it always will come back and bite you in the end. That is why we have got to put a stop to this shit right now. Because while today it might be a young naive woman, tommorrow it could be you.

[Beelzebud]

147. I'm an apologist for the police state?

un-fucking-believable...

[MadHound]

151. Let's see here

Making excuses for police incompetenctcy? Check
Blaming the victim for the actions taken against her? Check
Thinking that excessive bail is just fine? Check (just for your information, the average amount of bail set for a murderer is aprox. $82,000. Yet this young woman got hit with $500,000)
Thinking that piss poor field testing by the cops is just fine for busting this young woman? Check
Think that intrusive, unwarranted searches are A-OK? Check
Thinking that a lawsuit, which would curb in these police excesses, is just wrong? Check

Yeah, I think that the term apologist fits just fine. If you can't see the utter, absolute wrongness in these actions, then I really do feel for you. Let me guess, you were born in the seventies or eighties, and don't know any better. See, I remember when we actually lived in free country, without the intrusion of the police. Many many people never lived in such a time, thus these sorts of actions are just fine with them.

Tell you what, when you get popped for doing something that is similarly naive remember what you said here.

[baby_mouse]

199. I think the Nazi thing comes from your apparent position

That stupid people should be jailed.

Perhaps making it clearer that you believe stupidity or naivety itself shouldn't be an imprisonable offense will pacify your opponent somewhat.

Sorry to jump in...

[Tesha]

123. Thank you for making that point.

No matter how intrusive the searches, highly-motivated
people will still find ways around them. You could have
us all strip naked for the flight and be packed into
containers and someone will still find a way to smuggle
a weapon onto a plane.

At some point, someone will have to draw a line and say
"Enough! The searches are clearly now far beyond the pale
of what is acceptable in a free society!".

One indication (at least to me, if not to many of the folks
replying here) that the searches have gone beyond the pale
is that they are nabbing a lot of non-terrorists for ordinary
crimes unrelated to terrorism).

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

127. They screened for drug smugglers before 9/11...

[rd_kent]

79. Good, serves her right!

I only hope this superfluous lawsuit gets dismissed. And if it doesnt, I'M going to do some stupid prank, get areested for it, then sue so I can get paid too!!!

[pitohui]

89. word

seriously, if she thinks she's going to win a lawsuit lottery over this, she's freckin nuts

[EFerrari]

96. You won't have to do a stupid prank. Someone with

a badge will just decide you are a criminal and away you go.

Good luck. :hi:

[Tesha]

115. (It's amazing how they don't get it, isn't it?) (NT)

[pitohui]

124. threatening people is not attractive

i have been falsely accused of a crime

away i didn't go

i'm sorry your experiences have been so negative but the fact remained, in this case, the system worked exactly as it should have

[EFerrari]

195. No threat here. Just life. Police departments in most major

cities have fulltime offices just to help people get bad arrests off of their records. And, you don't know anything about my experience, do you? So spare me the fakery.

Now, let's talk about how well this system worked.

A young lady wanted to play a joke on a peer, and she thoughtlessly tried to board a plane with some kind of powder in condoms. She naively believed that this system works, didn't she? And that people like her didn't have to worry as she was doing nothing illegal.

Was she?

No, she wasn't.

So, system did not work as it is supposed to. Searching her? Sure. Testing her stuff. Sure. And then, the system broke, didn't it? They got a false positive which conflicted with her report and with what their own eyes were seeing. And then an innocent person was in detention for three weeks -- likely because there are so many other dummies in detention for no good reason that the whole system is slow as hell.

And you people somehow believe this dummy deserved to be in detention for three weeks?

Now, THAT is scary.

[Tesha]

108. Make sure you keep all the lights on your car working.

> Good, serves her right!

Make sure you keep all the lights on your car working.

"Sir, I noticed you have a brake light out. Please step out
of the car..."

Tesha

[AZBlue]

90. How about the Stupid Traveler Law??

Here in Arizona we have the Stupid Motorist Law.

We have "washes" here that fill up very quickly with water when it rains. It is accepted that you don't try to cross or enter these washes when they are full because the water level can be deceiving and they can even ave a strong current. Often police will set up barricades at entrances to the washes, but even if there's no barricade we know not to go through them (and there's a permanent sign warning not to proceed if filled with water).

There's always someone who thinks it's not as deep as it is or that their truck is high enough or that it will be fun to try it. When they get stuck, police and firefighters have to come rescue them - they've even had to bring in helicopters once or twice. This is time and money wasted.

So, Arizona passed the Stupid Motorist Law. Which means that the idiot who is caught in the wash and has to be rescued has to pay for the rescue. All costs associated with the rescue are to be paid by the moron who created the need for the rescue.

Now, since trying to get through an obviously filled wash doesn't endanger the lives of others (well, I guess it does endanger the lives of the police and firefighters) I think the Stupid Traveler Law should also include a fine and an arrest. Three weeks is a bit much. Just the fine, the costs repaid and the criminal record are enough for a stupid, idiotic, childish joke such as this. I mean, you can be arrested for joking about a bomb in an airport, why not this as well? I'm sure at the very least she took personnel away from their other duties, wasted money, distracted other personnel and caused a traffic jam in the line at the airport.

[Egalitariat]

93. What did she hope would happen when she set her plan in motion?

I'm betting she got exactly what she wanted. Including the ability to tell her story and sue.

[MadHound]

101. Oh yeah, right

Like she really wanted to spend Christmas vacation in jail, miss classes, subject herself to the humiliation of being caught with condoms full of flour, yeah, that's the ticket, she did this all on purpose.

Did I mistankenly log in to Free Republic today, because I thought this kind of idiotcy only existed over there. Sad to see it creeping in over here.

[Egalitariat]

189. Why else would she do it?

She ran out of Zip Loc bags and flour was real expensive where she was going. And she needed to bake a cake after she got there?

[pitohui]

129. oh i'm sure that's exactly it

i wouldn't be surprised, you hear stupid people talking all the time abt how easy it is to get money by litigating, don't they ever notice that they actually never get that money?

hell, even if you have good reasons for a lawsuit, you usually don't get anything for years if ever

i have a good friend, who was awarded six figures after being assaulted years ago by a security guard, he still don't got the money altho i'm sure the jury thinks he does, they even came out and congratulated him at the end of trial

people have the wrong idea, even juries don't know, only people who actually have experience w. lawsuits know that playing these games is a waste of time, you make more money if you just show up at a job every day

[Thorandmjolnir]

161. Anyone who thinks you can get "easy" money

by litigating, does not know much about the legal system. It is brutal. If the defendant think you have just one weakness it will be explored in court to embarrass you.


Again, a lot of people here are just making up facts out of clear air.

These are the facts, based upon the story:

1) her luggage contained three condoms filled with flour

2) devices that she and some friends made as a joke.

3) Airport screeners found the condoms, and their initial tests showed they contained drugs.

4)She was arrested for alleged drug trafficking and jailed for three weeks.

5) she was released after a lab test backed her story (No drugs, flour).

6) She told city police they were filled with flour. she made them as a joke and would squeeze them to relieve stress.

That it! Those are the facts. Nothing more, nothing less.

No Intent to sell, no intent to defraud, no intent to pass the flour on as fake drugs.


So please, stop making up stuff and stick to the facts.

Oh, by the way, based upon those facts. I would say she stand a very good chance on winning the lawsuit or settle.

[aikoaiko]

112. Maybe next time she can try the old fake bomb joke.

That would be funny too. :bounce:

Seriously, I feel bad for her, but it does seem like the popo had grounds for the arrest. I doubt the suit will be successfull.

[Tesha]

119. It will be settled.

> I doubt the suit will be successfull.

It will be settled. We'll never know the exact terms of
the setllement. (Government being able to cover its tracks
when it fucks-up is another aspect of fascism, BTW.)

Tesha

[pitohui]

130. no it won't

no reason to settle, any reasonable judge is going to throw this one right out

[ladjf]

128. Considering the degree of malfeasance surrounding this case,

the young lady is most fortunate that the lab didn't dump her flour and replace it with cocaine. They could have easily covered their asses by so doing.

[pitohui]

131. what malfeasance?

yes, what you say does sometimes happen to bad guys, i recently heard of a case where a man who thought it cute to sell some flour and what-all as heroin got popped, and the lab came back and said it was heroin and now he's screwed

so what, i have no pity

he intended to cheat his customer and have them put flour and contaminants into their veins, now just think about that for a moment and then decide if the cops were wrong to arrest


the law worked as it should in this case, a bad actor was stopped from distributing fake drugs

[ladjf]

134. I would say that analyzing cooking flour as cocaine or some other

drug would qualify as malfeasance. Almost any layperson could have done better than that by a simple taste test.

[Tesha]

137. Probably not malfeasance.

> I would say that analyzing cooking flour as cocaine or some other
> drug would qualify as malfeasance.

Probably not malfeasance, as that word usually implies deliberate
intent (although that is certainly possible here, just as an effort
by authority to "show her").

Incompetence is the word that would come to my mind first.

Tesha

[Tesha]

135. You seem to be assuming facts not in evidence.

> the law worked as it should in this case, a bad actor was stopped from distributing fake drugs

You seem to be assuming facts not in evidence. It is patently *RIDICULOUS*
that she needed to transport her fake drugs in order to sell them. They
sell condoms and flour everywhere, you know.

Tell me she was being deliberately provocative and I'll agree that's
plausible.

Tell me she was running a test to see how good the screening was (with
the hopes of then "going luve" on her next trip) and I'll agree that is
plausible too.

But tell me that she was transporting *THESE PARTICULAR CONDOMS FULL OF
FLOUR* with the intent to sell them as fake drugs and I'll just have to
laugh in your (virtal) face.

Tesha

[pitohui]

140. whatever

i'm not clear why running a test to see if her drug buddies could then get past and smuggle real drugs is better than the simple suggestion that she is just an idiot who planned to immediately meet people at her destination and sell directly to them

in any case, we're all in agreement here that she had intent to commit a crime

it's up to law enforcement to develop the case and prosecute her for conspiracy, counterfeit drugs, etc, whether she's guilty of conspiracy (as you suggest) or simple counterfeit activity (as i suggest) is not that important, either way she's guilty of a felony and was indeed properly detained




Tell me she was running a test to see how good the screening was (with
the hopes of then "going live" on her next trip) and I'll agree that is
plausible too

[Tesha]

144. Actually, we're *NOT* in agreement.

> in any case, we're all in agreement here that she had intent to commit a crime

Actually, we're *NOT* in agreement. I simply suggested one scenario
that is plausible.

Tesha

[Thorandmjolnir]

162. What crime?

What crime did she intend to commit?

[Tesha]

163. She was carrying the murdered pre-remains...

What crime did she intend to commit?

She was carrying the murdered premains* of the Pillsbury Dough Boy!

Tesha

* Yes, I just coined that word.

[High Plains]

225. We ARE NOT all in agreement she intended to commit a crime

In fact, you are alone in this curious obsessive delusion.

She's guilty of a felony?! Are you out of your fucking mind? What, possession of flour? What is your problem? Really. I don't understand your hateful attitude on this thread.

[Beelzebud]

139. What I've learned in this thread.

If a white girl smuggles fake cocaine she shouold not be punished.

If a white girl refuses to post bond and bail herself out, she should be able to sue the state.

No one should ever be screened/searched before boarding an airplane, because that would be unconstitutional.

Anyone that thinks you should be searched before boarding a plane is an "apologist of the 3rd Reich".

Anyone that thinks you should be searched before baording a plane would be happy to give up security for freedom.

Did I miss anything?

[Tesha]

141. I thought you said you were done?

> Did I miss anything?

I thought you said you were done.

You apparently missed that reply.

Tesha

[Beelzebud]

145. That was my recap of all the nonsense I heard in this thread.

[MadHound]

157. Gee, what you failed to learn is even more telling

Things like we're supposed to live in a free country, that we have Constitutional amendments specifically dealing with unreasonable search and seizure, that security cannot be bought at the cost of freedom, that these police were incompetent boobs, and that blaming the victim is never, ever a good thing to do.

But hey, it's all good right, it didn't happen to you:eyes:

[Beelzebud]

158. Key word: Unreasonable

Unreasonable search and seizure. When you buy an ticket for an airplane you AGREE to be searched.

[MadHound]

160. Again, let me refer you to that Tampa Bay case settled recently

In which the Buc's front office made the same arguement that you are making. Guess what, they lost.

[Thorandmjolnir]

164. Well one thing you missed is reading comprehension

"If a white girl smuggles fake cocaine she should not be punished."

First she did not smuggle, and second it was not fake cocaine.

She told the screeners what it was. She did not try to conceal it. There is no law saying you have to tell the screeners what's in your luggage.

So, I would say you missed a lot.

[K-W]

148. It all depends on whether they followed procedure.

If they did, I dont see a case, she tricked them into arresting her.

[Tesha]

150. A hypothetical you might want to consider...

> It all depends on whether they followed procedure.
> If they did, I dont see a case, she tricked them into arresting her.

A hypothetical you might want to consider... (just as an exercise,
I don't necessarily disagree with your position, per se.)

You place in your car, in plaine view, a large *PLASTIC REPLICA*
of a marijuana plant.

Now, it wouldn't be terribly surprising to find that the police
stop you frequently, and it certainly wouldn't be unconstitutional;
after all, there in plain view is (apparent) visual evidence that
you're committing what is probably a felony.

The interesting part is, of course, what the police do once they
order you to step out of the car. Good cops will fairly quickly
recognize that it's a plastic replica and that you don't (we hope!)
in fact have real marijuana concealed about the car or your person.

Bad cops will arrest you for possession, throw your ass in jail
for three weeks, and only grudgingly release you when forced.

*REALLY BAD* cops will take the marijuana seeds out of their pockets
and toss them in your car, "find" them, and arrest you whereby you'll
go away for quite a while, even though they'll only be able to
prosecute a misdemeanor quantity of real dope.

DUers will (apparently) have you arrested for possession of fake
plastic drugs with intent to sell them to (I guess) Gumby and Pokey
or Barbie and Ken.

Tesha

[K-W]

166. You are comparing a plastic plant to a condom containing white powder.

One is very apparently and obviously fake, one requires some form of analysis to detect. That is why it all depends on if they followed procedure and did the analysis they were supposed to do. And it wasnt as if she was being hassled by the police for no reason, she brought attention to herself with fake contraband at a place where searches occur to protect airplanes.

[Tesha]

179. Flour and cocaine are nearly as easy to distinguish...

Flour and cocaine are nearly as easy to distinguish as a plastic
pot plant and a real pot plant.

Tesha

[K-W]

187. So you can tell, looking at a condom full of white powder,

the exact chemical composition of the powder inside?

Because I can tell by looking at a plstic plant that it is plastic.

Like I said, what matters is the analysis procedures and whether they were followed and why they took so long to ID the substance. Something we know very little about and will be addressed by a court that can look at the facts we dont have.

[Cronus Protagonist]

196. I can tell flour from cocaine on a visual test

And I can tell for sure it's flour with a small sample and some water. Flour makes dough. And the test wouldn't even cost anything.

Educate a Freeper Today!
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[K-W]

198. Perhaps. But none of us know what happened exactly.

And none of us know thier procedures so all this speculation and assuming is pointless.

[sweetheart]

183. one person's fake contraband

Fake contraband does not threaten airplanes. This whole thing comes about
from scope creep on bomb-searches, so now they search for everything, and if
your tax return is late then they search for that too, and if you've not made
your childcare they search for that too... as "searches" occur to protect
airplanes.

[K-W]

186. Nobody argued that fake contraband threatned airplanes.

And we arent talking about searches of tax returns or anything else. We are talking about bag searches at airports which actually do protect airplanes.

[sweetheart]

202. Well fine then, was a bomb found?

Were hyjakkers discovered? Was terrorism prevented? Then the search was out of bounds for
the requirement. Bag searches are allowed for 1 purpose. This is a domestic bag check,
not an internaional smuggling bag check, and american citizens were involved, yes? .. with
4th amendment protections from illegal searches.

The police did not prevent a terrorist event, but they used terrorist search powers to
apprehend a sort of crime for which the terrorist powers were not enacted. This is not
that different from searching your house from attic to basement because you got a parking
ticket. The two, the search, and the "protection" do not agree. Flour OR cocaine would
not affect (protect or no) an airplane. If it is not an explosive or a thing for which
the terrorism search powers were enacted, then it should remain private.

What you propose is the spooky route that justifies bush using the full patriot act powers
to attack medical marijuana smokers because "dope is terrorism" in the anslinger racist
psychosis the pukes suffer from. (knowing you K-W, no insult intended.. but why are you
supporting an erosion of the 4th?)

[K-W]

205. So they cant search a bag unless they already know what's in it?

Well fine then, was a bomb found?

If they already knew which bags had bombs in them they wouldnt have to search, so of course, not every bag searched is going to have a bomb in it.

Were hyjakkers discovered? Was terrorism prevented? Then the search was out of bounds for
the requirement.

So the only legal searches are those that find things? How exactly does that work?

Bag searches are allowed for 1 purpose.

Bag searches, like all searches are allowed when there is just cause, like the extreme danger involved in Airplanes.

This is a domestic bag check, not an internaional smuggling bag check, and american citizens were involved, yes? .. with 4th amendment protections from illegal searches.

Yep, except these are legal searches.

The police did not prevent a terrorist event, but they used terrorist search powers to
apprehend a sort of crime for which the terrorist powers were not enacted.

Right, because during a search, if any crimes are discovered, the police can act on them. This has always been the case.

This is not that different from searching your house from attic to basement because you got a parking
ticket.

Actually it is completely different. You are drawing comparisons to absolutely absurd hypotheticals. A search of a house has nothing whatsoever to do with a parking ticket, searching bags at airports has a rather obvious lot to do with keeping weapons off planes.

The two, the search, and the "protection" do not agree.

Actually the search and the protection agree entirely. What doesnt agree is what was found, but that does not invalidate the search or mean that they cannot act on what they found.

Flour OR cocaine would not affect (protect or no) an airplane. If it is not an explosive or a thing for which the terrorism search powers were enacted, then it should remain private.

I dont neccessarily disagree with you, but you are asking for a change in the law. There is nothing in the constitution that demands this.

What you propose is the spooky route that justifies bush using the full patriot act powers
to attack medical marijuana smokers because "dope is terrorism" in the anslinger racist
psychosis the pukes suffer from.

I have proposed nothing of the sort. Please show me the quote where I proposed such things.

(knowing you K-W, no insult intended.. but why are you supporting an erosion of the 4th?)

I'm not. The real violation here are the drug prohibition laws which are absolutely a violation of our rights.

[sweetheart]

208. xray machines see explosives

in various colours. Flour does not have the same colour. The search,
the instant an xray insisted the bag was opened, had already moved beyond
the scope of explosives, as there was no just cause to search for them
to start with, and none to end with either. Some flour in condoms would
clearly show on teh xray as non-explosives.. air-safety-job-done.

If you have special police powers for bomb searching, search for bombs.
if you use those powers to search for other stuff, then the search is out
of scope, and this has been a tradition in law enforcement (especially
with the drugs laws) to use false laws for entirely different purposes.
The principal uses to date of the inter-national terrorist cooperation
laws between the UK and the US has been to extradite corporate criminals
for price-fixing which is not even a crime in the UK.

When you make laws for 1 thing and use them for another, it is an abuse,
no matter of some persons excuse it. Then i can introduce a law to make
slavery abolished and use it to promote the civil rights of corporate freemen.

We have a legislative tradition of grossly bending the intent of "laws legislated" to
an entirely different circumstance: "laws applied"

The spooky route i was on about is that we can no longer trust that any law is
relevant to its legislative context.... and this erosion allows terrorist legislation
to be glibly applied to a criminal war on drugs users and the poor.

Over the long haul, i'll wager most of the terrorist leglislation gets overturned
except for the stuff they managed to meld in to the drugs war as the new lower
stnadard of social erosion on search.

yet, we have the same conclusion, that the drugs laws are the root civil rights violation here,
and if that were not in question neither of us would dispute a measure that otherwise "could"
be used just to insure personal safety.

[K-W]

213. It doesnt matter if what they found wasnt what they are looking for.

The same way it doesnt matter why the police entered your house(assuming they had cause), if they see drugs in it they can arrest you for it.

If the use the powers to search outside of where weapons might be, only then are you violating the scope of the search.

The law is to search bags in airports and they are searching bags at airports, they are within the scope if they see drugs during thier searches.

The terrorist legislation isnt being applied to a war on drugs in the case of airport searches. The law being applied is the law against drugs. Its just as if an officer entered your house with a warrent to look for a gun and sees drugs on the kitchen table. He can arrest you for the drugs.

First off drugs shouldnt be illegal. Secondly I agree with you that legally security searches should be limited in what they are allowed to act on. That would be a great way to maximize the protection of rights, but that isnt the current law.

But as long as drugs are illegal, when they are seen in a security search, law enforcement can legally act on them.

[On the Road]

170. Now, When Patsy from Absolutely Fabulous

was stopped at the border and had an unidentified white substance confiscated, the official left the room and came back saying: "It's a harmless white powder. You're free to go."

After which Patsy ran after him screaming "Come back here! I paid 500 pounds for that!"

:smoke:

[meisje]

172. Am I supposed to feel sorry for her?

[newportdadde]

173. What an idiot. What happened to not being a dumbass?

Ow its just a joke ooww oow just a joke. Right, not the first time something that was 'just a joke' turned out to not be funny at all. What should we play next? I know I know, how about we get a trenchcoat tape fake explosive to it and run through the airport.. its JUST A JOKE!

Valley Girl "Like hey Janet wouldn't it be funny if you filled up these condoms with flour on your way home? I still have a couple left from my college freshman economy pack".

Janet "Ow yeah haha this will be funny, it will be like I'm smuggling cocaine. Hehe".

Freakin idiot.. emotional distress...

"Ibrahim said the lawsuit was filed near the end of the two-year statute of limitations because Lee, now a junior, was emotionally devastated.


"She lost significant face with this event," Ibrahim said."

In other words she got over it two years ago then decided to try and cash in now before she ran out of time...

[Thorandmjolnir]

175. Please, please read the story

you're making up stuff.

And it is still not illegal to be either dumb or naive per se. You actually have to break a law, before you go to jail.

[K-W]

176. Not being a dumbass was never a legal classification.

This court case will depend on whether procedure was followed by the officials involved. Not only is doing stupid things a pretty much univerersal trait of humanity, it is not criminal nor does it bar people from seeking redress in court if in fact they have suffered unjustly.

What ever happened to not making snap judgements about people youve never met based on limited information. Oh I forgot, its an American passtime to read news stories and judge people from afar.

[Blue_Tires]

181. wow....lots of back-and-forth going on here

can we all at least agree that both parties in the story did incredibly stupid things??

[rocktivity]

185. If they didn't know it was flour, they should have.

Flying around with flour-filled condoms isn't the smartest thing to do. But what kind of security have we got if they can't tell flour from another substance, illegal or not? And why did it take three weeks--if they're THAT understaffed and underfunded, I guess it begs the question why they goofed it up in the first place. Or maybe they realized it was flour, but said the initial test was positive to justify the bust and avoid a false arrest charge.

:headbang:
rocknation

[K-W]

188. What if I hide my coke in flour when I smuggle it?

Thier procedures may call for chemical analysis in a lab to definitively determine what the substance is.

[Cronus Protagonist]

197. How would you seperate it at the other end?

Not an easy task, I bet.

Educate a Freeper Today!
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[K-W]

200. Im sure theres a way to do it.

And considering how valuable cocaine is I very much doubt it would be cost prohibitive, but this is off the point.

I dont know how coke is smuggled, the point is that its not always so easy to tell what does and doesnt have drugs in it. Just because it looked and smelled like flour didnt neccessarily mean it didnt have something in it. The agents probably had a procedure they had to follow for all suspicious substances.

But we know very little about what happened and should avoid jumping to conclusions either way.

[bleedingheart]

201. My mother in law did something like this and didn't get arrested

my bro-in-law was living in Europe. He hadn't had "american" style chocolate chip cookies in years and was really pining for them. (don't ask me...I have no idea what the difference is)....

so she mixes bags of flour, sugar, salt, baking soda and packs them giant ziploc bags in her luggage along with about four bags of nestle chocolate bits...

when they got to europe and were unpacking my father in law was stupified that the luggage didn't get checked....

[ddeclue]

203. MORON ALERT!

What kind of idiot packs flour into condoms and takes it to the airport?

Aren't you just ASKING to get a government funded full cavity search and 4,000 consecutive games of 20 questions from Mr. Good Cop and his friend Mr. Bad Cop who likes to grab you by the shirt collar and yell a lot?

MORONS..

Thank God they did this in the United States where they only got into the trouble they did and not on of those countries in Southeast Asia where they take you out everyday in front of a firing squad until one day it's for real..

:spank: :nopity: :spank: :nopity: :spank: :nopity: :spank: :nopity: :spank: :nopity: :spank: :nopity:

Doug D.

[LisaL]

211. Exactly. I find it's impossible to feel sorry for her. She is

just too freaking dumb.

[High Plains]

226. She was dumb, yes, but she still got fucked over.

Unless you think being falsely arrested and held in jail for three weeks on a half-million bond is okay?

[Tesha]

227. Only in Bushworld. In America, we used to have rights.

> What kind of idiot packs flour into condoms and takes it to the airport?
>
> Aren't you just ASKING to get a government funded full cavity search
> and 4,000 consecutive games of 20 questions from Mr. Good Cop
> and his friend Mr. Bad Cop who likes to grab you by the shirt collar
> and yell a lot?

Only in Bushworld. In America, we used to have rights. But it is
interesting how many people here have completely surrendered
their rights, and gladly, too!

Tesha

[ecstatic]

206. I'm assuming she's not Black

because if she was I'm sure she'd still be in jail... for one charge or another. That's why I have mixed emotions about this. On one hand, I think she should sue their butts off; on the other hand, I welcome even more situations like this to occur in order to get more everyday Americans involved in trying to reform our justice system.

[LisaL]

212. Why didn't she just make some fake grenades while she

was at it?

[file83]

234. I think the point of her lawsuit isn't that she was suspected....

...it's that the police ran a test on flour and concluded that it was cocaine. In other words, they obviously didn't take a test or are so incompetant that the police violated her rights. Sure, she's an idiot for doing it, but that doesn't give the police the right to abuse their authority.

I hear what you are saying though, concerning her stupidity. First Class dumb ass move.

[ecstatic]

214. Philly Enquirer: Guard took pity on her, thought it might be racial

A prison guard recognized her from a Bryn Mawr volunteer job at Overbrook High School and took pity on her. The guard told Lee that she believed her and that the whole thing was probably racial.

Lee acted tough to protect herself. She did modern-dance moves to keep limber. Inmates saw this and gossiped: "Everyone thought I knew karate because I'm Asian." She certainly didn't discourage the stereotype.
Inmates saw the high volume of visitors and figured she was important. Again, she did not discourage the notion. She did not tell her cell mates that the visitors were actually volunteers from Catholic churches in Philadelphia who had taken up her cause.
The volunteers helped her hire Oh.

"I believed her story because things just didn't add up," Oh said. For one thing, Oh said, the field tests were odd because they detected the presence of not one drug but three.

"People don't mix drugs like that," Oh said.
First, Oh contacted Bryn Mawr and confirmed that Lee's dorm mates had, in fact, made the condoms together during a pre-exam session they call a "hall tea."

Then, Oh said, he called Assistant District Attorney Charles Ehrlich, who agreed to expedite laboratory tests. Ehrlich also agreed to help seek reduced bail, Oh said. A day after the new test came back and confirmed that the substance was flour, Lee was released.

http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/13504147.htm

[dcdacrazydemocrat]

218. typical

bull shit from the feds. well, i can not wait till we can get control of congress in 2006. fight on!!

[MrSlayer]

224. Frivolous lawsuit.

She'll be laughed out of court and rightly so.

[Tesha]

228. I guess someone will just have to put a note in the DU tickler file

> Frivolous lawsuit.
> She'll be laughed out of court and rightly so.

I guess someone will just have to put a note in the DU tickler file
so we can find out if you're correct.

Tesha

[MrSlayer]

230. I'm betting on myself.

I'll give you 3-1 odds.