Well I had an interesting conversion with a reagan

[nadinbrzezinski]

republican this weekend.

The short of it, he loves that man... (could not say a thing when I said, I liked the man, hated the policies... truth be told Reagan was good at getting what he wanted, until the Alzheimer's took over that is.... and since people were willing to follow yes it qualifies him as a leader... now I would not say he was good for the country, for he was not... but he was a leader.)

Now this guy voted for fearless leader.. TWICE... but now he cannot wait until fearless leader is done with... and I did bring the I word... and guess what? The DSM did not quite get him to go... hmmm I agree, now the NSA spying... he agreed whole heartedly, Bush needs to be impeached... folks I think we have found a winner... sadly not going to war over a lie, but privacy.

[Hello_Kitty]

1. That's good enough for me.

I'm done with anyone who still supports him at this point. Maybe not the entire person but that particular aspect. I'm not even wasting my time arguing with them. Yesterday I was with the one friend I have who still likes him, though she's wavering a bit. She tried to say something positive about repukes and I put my hand up and said what part of these neo-cons being a cancer on humanity do you not get? End of discussion.

[quiet.american]

2. I find myself conflicted about voters like the one you've described.

On the one hand, it's heartening to hear they've at least come to the point where they can admit voting for Bush was a mistake. On the other hand, why did they EVER cast a vote for this monster? The Abu Ghraib horror happened before the 2004 election. Amongst other things, why was that not enough to turn their stomachs, and their votes? When they cast their vote in favor of Bush, in my mind, they cast a vote solidly in favor of torture and rape (some of these prisoners were CHILDREN), sexual degradation, physical brutality and all the rest of it.

NOW that it's no longer cool to support this "popUlar wartime preznit," now that the Hammer is nailed, and now that Abramoff is the great Titanic on the horizon of the Republican party, suddenly there's enough regret to go around.

I hear very little personal responsibility from these voters for having cast a vote to put Bush in the WH. They are just as culpable. A vote for Bush is a vote for all the brutality and sheer insanity he's unleashed on this world.

BUT, one has to be forgiving, I guess.

[mitchum]

3. I won't forgive them even if they do vote Dem next time...

why should I celebrate someone's waking up and finally voting for their REAL self interest?

[nadinbrzezinski]

5. Hate to break this to you but

from talking to many folks abu what?

[quiet.american]

6. If you're replying to me, please clarify your question. n/t

[nadinbrzezinski]

7. From locals the ammount of knowledge about Abu graib

is minimal at best. Best case scenario, they have heard the name... worst case scenario, abu what?

Think about it, how many media outlets (video) covered it extenseivly and in detail? Outside the US, plenty, inside... we are news fanatics, most folks don't care

[quiet.american]

8. Ah -- I see what you're stating --

-- however, really there's not a "local" around who couldn't tell you what this is:

[FreedomAngel82]

4. Wow

I think the NSA thing is enough to make enough people go that route. It makes a lot of people uncomfortable. I think the people it makes comfortable are a small number.