Lou Dobbs is BUSTING out of the seams. His head is gonna EXPLODE

[Blue_Roses]

I'm watching Lou Dobbs now and he is so pissed about the "amnesty agenda" and I can't help but keep thinking about what Bill Maher said on his show this weekend. Bill Maher's NEW RULES usually hits it smack on. Here's a snip:


--snip--

And finally, New Rule: Don't blame illegal immigrants for driving down wages. Blame Congress. Republicans in Congress have to stop saying that the problem with Mexicans coming over the border is they keep wages down. You know what keeps wages down? The fact that Congress hasn't raised the minimum wage since 1997. 1997, when my dealer still had a beeper! Car dealer, car dealer, what did I say?

Yes, news flash: Congress controls what the minimum wage is. Who did you think it was, the valet parking team at Tony Roma's? And upping the minimum wage would affect wages. It has to. The word "wage" is right in it. Even George Bush could understand that. Maybe not. The point is, the elephant in the room is that no one can live on minimum wage, and that we are making a whole swath of our society - tens of millions of people - live like animals. So that the luckier segment can live with indulgences their parents never dreamed of.

--snip--

In summation, I am not saying that raising the minimum wage is going to solve the illegal immigration problem. That can only be solved by arming Lou Dobbs. But five bucks an hour in an America where the luckier ones spend that on a coffee, is a cruel joke.



More New Rules here:

http://www.hbo.com/billmaher/new_rules/:evilgrin:

[TheWebHead]

1. he just went off on Ah-nold too

[RebelOne]

2. I agree with Lou Dobbs. n/t

[Joanne98]

5. So do I.

[Blue_Roses]

7. I do on some things, but some of his comments come off very

racist.

[MoonRiver]

46. It's NOT racist. He's trying to protect the American middle class.

He's been saying this for years. It is his mantra. And I totally agree with Lou on this.

[magellan]

61. And me. (nt)

[radio4progressives]

67. PoppyCock! He's Using the Middle Class to Protect White Supremacy.

[leftstreet]

71. ...

:hi:

Do you really think so? I mean, I don't watch him but read his show transcripts all the time. There's a lot of push-button terminology used, but his guest line-ups floor me. Lots of anti-corporate/pro-labor talking points get on the air. I read one last week with Byron Dorgan just slamming the shit out of corporations.

The reason I ask, Dobbs is an educated economist who's been around the block. He KNOWS there's no such thing as a "middle class" left. Unless you mean he's using the term to stimulate viewers who still believe they are, or can aspire to, some "middle class" myth?

[radio4progressives]

75. He is very selective ...

Yes he talks a good populist message on the "Middle Class" which he knows is quickly disappearing - Any economy based on Capitalism MUST have a thriving Middle Class for it to be sustained for future generations.. Dobbs knows and reports the sham of Administration and WSJ reports of a thriving economy and low unemployment - and he's spot on how NAFTA was a huge contributing factor of the desimation of the Middle Class.

Weird timing of this post, I've got Dobbs on now while I'm typing this and I was just going to add a "but he never talks about the "working class" ...
and he just mentioned those very words....

Dobbs will be an excellent advocate for the plight of the working class the more he focuses on our issues on a wholistic approach...

But the instant he directs his venom and blame on "illegal immigrants" he loses me, because at that moment he is doing exactly what Adolph Hitler did in the late twenties and early thirties - blaming Germany's economic woes and depression on "immigrants" ...

Dobb's conscience needs to be raised on this issue, dramatically and he needs to understand that what he is projecting is fear of losing White Supremacy, whether he is conscience of it or not, and he also must be reminded of the history of a (now) historical figure who is considered the most evil human being this world has ever known using the same rhetoric, making the same arguments - just replace Jews and Gypsies with "illegal immigration" ....

Reading racists/nationalists xenophobic emails on TV isn't exactly enlightenment... :hi:

[leftstreet]

77. I forgot about the viewer emails.

:puke:
I usually skim right past them. Guess I too am being selective. Which obviously isn't possible when you're sitting in front of the teevee.

You make some great points about his potential.

Maybe I'll email him.
Try to start raising his conscience.

:o

[Zorra]

48. Yeah, me too. n/t

[Blue_Roses]

3. He's letting them all have it today.

:crazy:

[Joanne98]

4. That won't stop employers from paying under the table.........

[eleny]

6. His last guest was great - NAFTA cause this problem

[Joanne98]

15. He was right. NAFTA fucked the Mexican farmer........

millions of them. If fact the wages of workers in all three countries went down. But Mexico was hit the hardest. And never forget who pushed thru NAFTA! BILL CLINTON! That's why I will NEVER vote for Hillary.

[katty]

29. that's right-NAFTA was the poison pill&does Bill care? nada

[The Backlash Cometh]

41. Maybe it's time he rethink it. I really wish he would review

the situation and explain where we went wrong. It would really help the Democrats if he'd give them guidance on this one.

[eleny]

30. And never forget that the Republicans pushed it at Clinton till he agreed

Neener, neener.

[kenny blankenship]

37. I'm sorry but that is simply not true

Bill Clinton committed to total support of NAFTA during the '92 election before becoming President (with a Democratic House to assist him to govern in a capital D Democratic fashion, if he wanted it once he took office). Instead of stopping NAFTA he pressed for its ratification. He lobbied Hill Democrats to drop any opposition to NAFTA and went so far as to publically denounce labor unions, which were of course anti-NAFTA,for using "strong arm tactics" against Congressional Democrats, as though political pressure from unions acting in the interest of their membership and ordinary workers was something the Democratic President found improper.

Pushing through NAFTA was the one and only early "victory" for Bill Clinton. It wasn't just something he adopted temporarily to get himself elected. Many other positions of his weren't so firm. National healthcare was bungled and tossed aside, gays in the military he crawfished on, although by Executive Order it was in his power to decide, he retreated on Bosnia, he retreated on "social investment" and retraining.

[FloridaPat]

33. I heard that. But we now import a lot of our food from Mexico instead

of Florida. So how did the Mexican farmer get screwed? One needs a playbook to keep track of how our gov'ts screw us all.

[nolabels]

59. They made another middle man and moved the producers farther..........

away from the consumers. The misnomer is this oxymoron "FREE-TRADE". The idea that somewhere far-away makes things better or cheaper is only true some of the times. The Free-traders would like to turn the whole world into their slave-junkies and sweep out any idea that something produced domestically or locally is even worthwhile of having.

[imlost]

56. Very True. Soon CAFTA will do the same. n/t

[radio4progressives]

8. Dobbs is a racist pig..

period end of story.

[RebelOne]

12. Explain your comment as to why he is a racist pig.

Why? Because he is against illegal immigration?

[SoCalDem]

17. Lou Dobbs has ALWAYS been against immigration

He wooed the left for a while with outsourcing because that's OUR biggest fear, and lots thought he was our champion, but as soon as his book had been fully promoted, he swung right back to his favorite topic..bashing Mexicans.

[Joanne98]

24. What does that have to do with racism. Not all immigrants are

dark. How about we let in 20 million Polish immigrants?

[radio4progressives]

68. Been there done that .. Where was Dobbs fomenting then?

Millions of European illegals entered our country, this is an old old tired racist discussion.. and frankly i'm sick of it, i'm sick at heart at the continued ignorance on this age old issue in this country - and i'm totally sickened by the fact that all of you anti-illegals are actually LITERALLY fomenting Adolf Hitler's stump speaches on "illegal immigration" which he blamed Germany's bad economic conditions on, and which gave him political power in Germany.

What the Germans refused to know or understand was the the economic depression was world wide, it was not solely in Germany, and it had absolutely NOTHING to do with immigrants of Jews or Gypsies.

People that don't learn from Histoy, are doomed to repeat it and that is truly frightening to see this ignorance spread on DU.

[RebelOne]

35. He is not against legal immigration, just illegal immigration,

as am I also. Why should illegal immigrants jump in the front of the line of all those awaiting the chance to immigrate through legal channels?

[EVDebs]

51. Why doesn't Mexico and Latin America promote a sane visa program w/USA?

The present humiliating situation should have shamed any Latin American government long ago.

[Bridget Burke]

63. The US sets up its visa program. Most sovereign nations do.

Presidente Fox had an immigration plan for Bush--presented at their very first meeting.

He proposed a guest worker program of some time--not a good idea unless the workers could earn eventual citizenship rights. Otherwise, that "they drive down wages" objection would remain true & even get worse.

Fox also proposed setting up incentives for Mexicans to return to Mexico.

Bush ignored the whole thing.

Fox is no working man's hero, but he did fight some corruption in Mexico. (Corruption did NOT begin with him.) Bush wouldn't do anything for the working man (or woman) in his country--or any other country.

[radio4progressives]

76. That's a legitimate question and issue...

a policy pursuing that question, with solutions is the task at hand... not blaming the people, the peasants for the corruption and evil policies of their rulers.

[radio4progressives]

69. who wouldn't be against "legal" immigration?

it only takes a very very long time and a lot of money and good connections.

[radio4progressives]

65. What it is it about Blatent Racism that you don't understand?

Need a primer on the subject in general?

If Lou Dobbs spent a fourth of his rabid frothing at the mouth on the subject of "illegal immigration" from Ireland and previously from the former Yugoslovia, the former Soviet Union, Poland and other Western and Eastern European countries as he does on "our southern border" - then I'd have to qualify my remarks.

But he doesn't now, and he never has and so I rest my case.

I live near San Francisco, once deeply emmersed in the Irish and Celtic music scene, and i have personal knowledge of the hundreds of thousands if not illegal immigrants just from Ireland alone (heavily in the 80's and 90's - but i think possibly less now due to their much improved economy) double the figures for New York City, Boston, Chicago, Seattle, Portland and other Irish populated centers in the country.

Their skin is white, so they blend in easily until they start talking. I've never been concerned about it personally, but many of these people actually worked with undocumented workers from Mexico in restaurants especially, construction and other labor sites.

[Joanne98]

16. Mexico throws out Central Americans crossing their border..

Are Mexicans racist?

[radio4progressives]

66. Should we blame the People for the policies of the Rulers?

Hello? Do you mind being judged by Bush policies?

[Joanne98]

28. Illegal immigrants are taking jobs away from black men.

Plight Deepens for Black Men, Studies Warn

By ERIK ECKHOLM
Published: March 20, 2006
BALTIMORE — Black men in the United States face a far more dire situation than is portrayed by common employment and education statistics, a flurry of new scholarly studies warn, and it has worsened in recent years even as an economic boom and a welfare overhaul have brought gains to black women and other groups.

Black Men Falling Behind

Plight Deepens for Black Men Focusing more closely than ever on the life patterns of young black men, the new studies, by experts at Columbia, Princeton, Harvard and other institutions, show that the huge pool of poorly educated black men are becoming ever more disconnected from the mainstream society, and to a far greater degree than comparable white or Hispanic men.

Especially in the country's inner cities, the studies show, finishing high school is the exception, legal work is scarcer than ever and prison is almost routine, with incarceration rates climbing for blacks even as urban crime rates have declined.

Although the problems afflicting poor black men have been known for decades, the new data paint a more extensive and sobering picture of the challenges they face.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/20/national/20blackmen.html?ex=1300510800&en=57e0d1ceebcbc209&ei=5090&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss

I guess Mexicans who TAKE THEIR JOBS must be racists.

[NNN0LHI]

36. My white racist parents told me that blacks were taking jobs away...

...from white men for decades. All their white racist friends felt the same way. They wanted to put all the blacks in a boat and send them back to Africa. In a boat made of cardboard.

See what ignorance can do to people?

Don

[radio4progressives]

70. Yep... It's incredbile the ignoranc of today is no different than decades

past.

[mondo joe]

39. Please provide evidence to support your accusation.

Thank you.

[rodeodance]

9. Lou was very rude, interrupting, crass!

[pimpbot]

31. huh, what interview were you watching?

I just watched the interview between Lou and the univision host. She wouldn't let him get a complete sentence in without saying something.

[earthside]

10. Well, Maher is wrong.

I'm for a big increase in the minimum wage .... but ...

It is a MINIMUM wage. Nothing prevents employers from paying more --- except, an over-supply of labor willing to work illegally for even less than minimum wage.

Sorry, but you simply cannot get around the common sense economic reality: too much supply drives down wages/prices.

You have to be fair and understand that Republicans and Democrats are responsible for the current invasion of illegal immigrants from Mexico. Bush the Older negotiated NAFTA and Clinton got it passed.

[Blue_Roses]

14. I disagree

http://www.dol.gov/esa/minwage/america.htm

Do you expect people to feed their families on $5.15 an hour? That's nuts.

[Joanne98]

20. Building contracters pay sub-contractors who PAY CASH!

[Joanne98]

19. Finally. Someone who knows what they're talking about...

the laws of supply and demand. It's pretty simple.

[GraysonDave]

26. Supply and Demand

In suburban Atlanta, the minimum wage is irrelevant. We have to pay the Mexicans $8-10 an hour. I don't know of any of them that would work for less than minimum wage.

[thethinker]

43. You need to visit the southwest

Illegals do not get minimum wage here. They work under the table for cash. As someone mentioned earlier, the builders (and other employers including big corporations) subcontract to one guy who loads his truck up with illegals.

Before Reagan, 30,000 came across the border a year. Now a million come across the border a year. No one is arresting them and sending them home. It just doesn't happen and they know it.

Yes, the minimum wage needs to be raised but that does not solve the problem.

[FlaGranny]

74. Do you have a source for that information?

I can't believe there are that many contractors paying "under the table." It would cost them much more to do that than it would to pay minimum wage. Wages are tax deductible for a business. For a business to do that, they would have to massively unreport their incomes to make a profit. If you know of cases like that, you should report it to the IRS, because underpayment of taxes is costing us all.

[napi21]

47. Come a little north to Gainesville, Ga. I'll be happy to introduce you

to lots of immigrents from Mexico who work for a whole lot less than $10.00!

Hell, I can introduce you to a lot of Americans who work for a lot less too!

[StellaBlue]

52. I work in a bank in NE Texas

The Mexican immgrants we get in are making $200-400 a week doing hard work... construction, trailer manufacturing, etc... don't know if they are legal or illegal... most don't seem to speak English, though.

[acmejack]

21. That is an inescapable reality.

Inconvenient, impolitic, socially unacceptable, whatever. The laws of supply & demand are immutable, claiming they are not does not make it so.

[Hoping4Change]

23. You conveniently fail to mention that if employers weren't

willing to hire illegals the problem would be solved.

[rman]

58. What prevents employers from paying more: the profit motive

They'll pay as little as they can get away with.

[TankLV]

73. That's why we need a LIVING wage that is different for each locale.

Living in bum fuck Iowa is not as costly as NYC or LA or Vegas or Honolulu.

Support a LIVING wage, not a "minimum" wage!

(the wage at which a person can SURVIVE without ANY government subsidies, for those who are too lazy to look it up)

[agincourt]

11. The economy took off last time the minimum was raised,

But every useless as a dog turd on shag economic expert will tell you that non-slave labor wages hurt our economy. Blow up every right wing think tank posing as policy experts. Our nation would be far better off. Bush is no president anyway, he just pushes the same shit that right-wing conservative think tanks do.

[Joanne98]

25. That had alot to do with the internet and Y2K!

[Iris]

13. Bingo for Maher.

Why can't the Democratic leaders be so clear?

[doc03]

18. Raising the minimum wage would do nothing

other than make more employers seek illegals willing to work for less. I'm not against raising the minimum wage but until you stop employers from hiring illegal workers the flood of illegals will be even worse if the minimum wage is increased.

[Joanne98]

22. Exactly!

[mondo joe]

38. Precisely. If you're hiring illegally who cares about legal minimums

anyway?

[frankenforpres]

40. BRILLIANT

i was going to post the same thing

the only way the min wage increase would matter is if the illegals were legalized

[Bridget Burke]

64. Raising the Minimum Wage would help all those American workers...

Who are champing at the bit to take those construction jobs. If the bosses keep driving wages down illegally--why can't the Unions speak up?

Oh--the workers can't be bothered to join a Union.

[chicofaraby]

27. Can this string be titled better?

I thought it was about a real issue.

[spanone]

32. Lou needs to get real. You can't send 12 million 'back'.

Just can't Lou, sorry.

[napi21]

49. If you actually LISTEN to Lou, you'd know what his position is!

FIRST, the US must gain control of the borders! You cannot begin to work on a solution to the millions of illegals UNTIL you control the borders. If you don't, but begin by granting some sort of amnisty to those already here, all you're going to do is invite millions MORE!

All you folks who are screaming about Lou's positions obviously aren't listening, or you're only hearing what you want to hear!

[mondo joe]

50. But it's so much easier to just say he's a racist.

I guess.

[sendero]

34. Bill Maher..

... is occassionally funny, sometimes insightful, but in this case plain old full of shit. There is this thing most people learned about in Economics 101 called supply and demand. When you raise the supply of something (workers) their cost (wages) goes down. Any argument to the contrary is ridiculous.

[Disturbed]

42. It gets down to one simple thing:

Cheap labor. US Corps and US citizens will hire the cheapest labor that they can.

The solution is a bit more complicated.

[CrazyForKucinich]

60. Not unless you have congress raise the min. wage.

As they should.

[TankLV]

78. And when you try to (justly) raise the LIVING wage, the employers will

OUTSOURCE the jobs - just like the architectural firm I work for is doing.

We've got a bunch of slave wage schmoes in India that we are endeavoring to get to do the majority of our drafting/production work.

"Screw the recently graduated architecture students - give all the work to India" is the mentality we have to deal with now. And mind you, we are one of the better firms that have great bennies, etc.

It stinks, and stinks BAD!

[Miss Chybil]

44. Solution: Punish those who hire illegals. EOM

[jbnow]

62. Lou calls them illegal employers

and wants it t90 be a felony for the employers, not the undocumented workers.

He understands they will come if they can get work. Employers want labor as cheap and uncomplaining as they can get it. He wants the penalty put on the corporate employers. Good idea.
But he does get carried away and overly offended and It's the one issue I can't listen to him on too long.

I am disturbed by the timing of this debate too. It needs to be looked ar carefully, not for political motives, it is a complex issue. They wanted the dissent now. To turn our eyes from all the scandals?. as the Ports deal turned out attention from the warantless wiretapping.

In a time where Congress is in session so rarely with big issues to resolve all they can do is use rhetoric and blame, not reach a true accord.

[Canuckistanian]

45. Dobbs made one too many calls to his "dealer"

He needs a prescription for Xanax.

[0007]

53. Lou's Poll

Do you believe that middle-class working men and women will have to demonstrate to create sympathy and interest for their cause?

Yes 92%
11544 votes

No 8%
1033 votes

:redbox:Total: 12,577 votes

[markus]

54. That can only be solved by arming Lou Dobbs.

Must stop laughing. Must beathe...

[Blue_Roses]

55. finally, someone gets the joke

:) The comment was meant to be a comedic satire by Maher. That's all folks.

[Brigid]

57. Did We Watch the Same Show?

Lou Dobbs did not seem any different than he ever does. He certainly didn't seem ready to explode. And he's not the xenophobe he's been made out to be. He just wants a sensible, humane immigration policy, which we do not have. He's said the same things for years.

[Javaman]

72. I agree, raising the wages so Americans can complete with those

same jobs will be the simple way to solve the illegal immigration.

If an illegal comes over and discovers that the low paying job now pays well but he has to compete with American citizens for that same job, you will see the amount of illegals coming over drop. Because the hope for a job will fade.

[mdmc]

79. real time rules... dobbs is the guy that hates Mexicans, right?