I wasn't going to talk about this, but somehow, I think I should.

[Cyrano]

Yesterday, I took a walk along the beach. It was Easter, there weren't many people and, sitting in a shady spot, I got to talking for a while with an old man in his eighties. I don't have family here, and he doesn't have any family at all. We sat there talking for a while about the weather, the view, and the lack of crowds.

It turned out we were both vets from different eras. Looking at the beach, he said, "God, it's so beautiful and peaceful." I agreed and then, for some reason, I confessed something to him. I told him I couldn't remember the names of some men I'd known. This old man just gazed toward the sand and said, "It's better that way."

And then he began talking. He spoke of people that he'd all but forgotten who were there with him. The "there" turned out to be Omaha Beach on D-Day. He said he'd seen Steven Spielberg's movie. He hadn't believed anyone could ever grasp the confusion, the fear, the insanity, the unreality, the blood and body parts, the numbness, the horror, the feeling he'd died and gone to Hell.

And then he said, "All those poor kids who want to go join up today. You can't tell them different." His words reminded me that when I was a kid, I wanted to be Audie Murphy.

We walked across the road, had a cold beer and parted. It was only then that I realized that he hadn't told me his name and I hadn't told him mine. But he had shared with me the most devastating, unimaginable moment of his entire life. I don't know why he told me about it. Maybe it's a bit over dramatic to think that the only family he really had is lying under grave markers at Omaha Beach.

I hope to see him again and talk some more. Not about war, but the absence of it. And although I'm an agnostic, I find it ironic to have heard about so much death on a day that symbolizes life.

[Caoimhe]

1. Wow thanks for sharing!

What a beautiful event! I hope you see him again too, and let us know about your conversation. He sounds like such an interesting fellow.

[madokie]

2. sometimes that is just the way it is.

[Sal Minella]

3. Listening to old geezers/geezerettes is sometimes mind-expanding.

If younger ones will listen, we can give you the benefit of knowing ahead of time what happens when you Do Stupid Things, and then you don't have to go out and do them yourself.

And besides, we like being listened to. Thanks for writing this.

[Cyrano]

5. Hi, Idealist Hippie. This encounter happened about 24-hours ago and

has crashed through mind-expanding to as close as a devout agnostic can get to a (gasp) "spiritual experience."

I long ago lost any illusions of battlefield "triumph or heroism." All anyone can do, for the most part, is live with fear and hope to get home safe, sane and whole.

This seems to be something today's (mostly) Republican politicians don't understand. They love to throw around John Wayne imagery. John Wayne was an actor. So was Saint Ronnie. Do you want to hear the truth? You wet your pants, crawl into the bushes in shame, and hope that no one ever finds out, all the while knowing that the same thing has happened to everyone around you.

Anyone who's ever been there wishes he or she had not been. And any politician who wants this shit on a resume is worse than a fool. He or she is an opportunist trying to stand on the bodies of the dead.

[Sal Minella]

22. I have sat beside Viet Nam vets in AA meetings and cried with them

many times. One of the old philosophers, Marcus Aurelius or somebody, said war is never spoken of as "glorious" by anyone who's actually been there, unless he's an out-and-out liar or got nowhere near the action.

It makes me boiling mad that the idiots who got us into this don't even know what the inside of a uniform feels like -- the PNAC clowns, Deadeye "five deferments" Cheney, Rush "pilonidal cyst" Limbaugh -- etc.

You and the old man are brothers. You will never forget each other. I'm so glad you talked with him. My neighbor told me about that movie and I am TOO CHICKEN TO EVEN GO SEE THE DAMN MOVIE!!!! Imagination is more than enough, WAY more than enough.

I've been a devout agnostic for decades and I have spiritual experiences all the time. If you relax, you can learn to live with a LOT of contradictions.

I think "heroism" and "cowardice" are frequently split-second "decisions" that come out of the spinal cord more than the brain or the "character" of a person.

As weird as it sounds, I wonder if Pat Tillman's death might not do more than Cindy Sheehan to make people see the futility, the waste, the tragedy, the stupidity.

The soldier who's coming home now trying to forget he had to shoot a 12-year-old because the kid looked scared, like he might be wearing a belt, and now we know the kid was scared of being shot, is all, but it's too late because the soldier will have decades of living under a bridge somewhere reliving the nightmare.

Peace. Thanks for the note. I'm an old Berkeley hippie, by the way -- have spent decades trying to explain we were demonstrating against the GOVERNMENT POLICIES, not against the soldiers. The Johnson/Nixon boys managed to spin it that we were demonstrating against the troops. I think someday we'll find out that the original "flag burnings" were CIA psy-ops for domestic consumption, something that would "read" on TV and get people fired up against the demonstrators.

Didn't mean to talk your leg off.

Thank you for serving your country. If you loved humanity enough to refuse to follow orders, I respect you.

If you loved your country enough to FOLLOW the orders because you believed your superiors wouldn't put you at risk for no reason, I respect you even more.

I must say, Rummy and Wolfie and Cheney and Perle and Bolton make me wish I believed in an afterlife with a Hell in it.

Peace.

[Jade Fox]

27. "If you relax, you can learn to live with a LOT of contradictions."

I love that.

The rest of your post is pretty cool too. :)

[Sal Minella]

31. Getting old is fun, partly because people let you run off at the mouth

and don't interrupt. Seriously, I have more sheer pleasure out of living now than I did when younger. The knees don't work as well, but the head works a lot better. It baffles me why so many people struggle so desperately against the natural process of aging.

We're going to need compassionate older folks to listen to these people coming back from Iraq with their humanity in shreds, if not their bodies and minds. I hope some of the older guys can help the younger ones through the worst of it.

I have a friend whose brother has never returned from Viet Nam. His body has been hiding//living in the woods all these years, but his mind has never come home.

And we are going to have a whole new generation of these guys. And gals.

[roguevalley]

23. older people are such a wonder, they have so much to say about

life and things that matter. god bless him and you. you had a transcendent moment.

[Bozita]

29. When I see "old geezer" and "mind-expanding" on the same line, I think of

... Studs Terkel, a living American treasure.

[Sal Minella]

30. Studs Terkel, yeah. Yeah, he's hot.

:loveya:

[democrank]

4. Glad you posted this.

Older folks have so much to share. So much wisdom, so much life. Thanks.

[nashville_brook]

6. how cool

meeting a stranger and having a coversation like this is very 'renewing' -- easter/spring appropriate, imo.

[stop the bleeding]

7. That is a day worth remembering and passing on

thanks for passing it on.

[faithnotgreed]

8. beautiful post cyrano - thank you for sharing this

i am truly moved and i thank you for connecting with the older gentleman

we OWE those men and women something far better

[lpbk2713]

9. That was time well spent. And I hope you get to talk with

him at length again. It was probably as important and meaningful to him to have shared his experiences as it was to you to listen.

I read somewhere that WW II vets are now dying at the rate of a thousand a day. Hard to believe.

[Cyrano]

11. The other day, a DUer mocked "The Greatest Generation."

All I can say is, please don't do this.

They grew up during the depression, saved the world from fascism, came home and gave us a democracy never before seen on the face of the earth.

What they gave us has been mocked, spit on and dismantled by Limbaugh and the army of demented hate-spewing maniacs that think like him.

It's so much easier to destroy than to build.

Oh, yeah. May BushCo and their herds of media, "religious," big-business, and just plain redneck whores rot in Hell. (Sorry, but sometimes, ya' just gotta' be undiplomatic.)

[preciousdove]

26. Little brothers of the Greatest Generation

My Dad was in basic training when WWII ended. He spent a few months in occupied Japan. His oldest brother, now gone, saw action as did his father in WWI. It affected him in his world view. He has been used by the powers that be for his guilt that he was helpless to do anything during the war because he was too young. He is in limbo now. He is bright. He knows what is happening is wrong but he cannot yet give up his years long belief that those he gave his votes to were using him. The effects have not yet landed a direct hit in HIS yard.

Maybe this year things the BFEE set in motion will be bad enough he and his brother-in-laws and cousins will see.

[sarge43]

17. There were 12 million Americans in uniform at the end of WWII

An incredible number considering the population was o/a 150 million. As memory serves the average age of the service personnel was 24. So, the majority of remaining WWII vets are now in their mid 80's. Another 10 years and most will have left us.

[MoonRiver]

10. I knew someone who survived the D-Day invasion.

The trauma followed him the rest of his life. He's passed now, but I'll never forget his descriptions, which are very similar to your acquaintance's. My dad served in WWII but fortunately wasn't near the worst action. God bless our brave veterans. We must never forget that they are NOT the policy makers. They just try to serve our country.
:patriot:

[foreverdem]

14. My uncle was there and survived

Unfortunately, his best friend since childhood did not. My uncle saw his friend get his head blown off. As a result of the shock, my uncle spent months in an army hospital suffering from amnesia. My uncle has passed on, but I can't imagine what men like him and my father, who saw active duty in Germany during WW2, what they experienced.

God bless them and all our veterans for their service to us.

[Logiola]

12. Some of my favorite times right now..

Is sitting and talking with my 85 year old grandfather. He is finally now talking about his experiences in ww2.. and it is absolutely amazing to hear. He landed on Juno beach on d-day and then a while later was captured by the Germans and put into a camp. He ended up being captured after being surrounded by Germans and having shot one, i am amazed they did not kill him but they made him carry the guy he shot and then took him as a prisoner for over a year. He actually said the germans treated him well in camp, except for the part of being nearly staved to death. He also took part in the death march and saw many of his friends die during it. Every birthday i buy him a book on ww2, especially canada related and he reads them so fast it is incredible. I recently bought him a dvd player and 36 western dvds.. and plan to buy him a bunch of war related dvds.. it's amazing stuff to see what he has gone thru in his life and i feel blessed that he know talks about it.

another really interesting thing happened a few years ago. I guess when he was in London before d-day he fell in love with a girl. but since he was gone so long and presumed Dead she ended up having a baby with another fellow who ended up leaving her before the baby was born. When my grandpa finally returned he tracked her down and asked here to marry him and return to canada with the baby.. she said she could not leave england and stayed behind as my father came back home and later met my grandmother. Now, two years ago my father gets a call from the Royal canadian riffles saying that someone is looking for my grandpa and they tell the story (we had no idea about it) and i guess the ladys husband has now past away and she wanted to see my grandpa one last time and planned a trip to winnipeg. Now for the stupid part.. my grandma, an insanely jelous lady would not let me grandpa meet up with her.. but behind their back and without them knowing my family had the lady and her daugheters over for dinner and took them around town (they planned the trip anyways) and it was really fascinating.. and sad since she never did get to see my grandfater like she wished.. i guess if grandma goes first that is the first place we will be taking grandpa.. haha.

[peacetalksforall]

13. Your story reminds me of what I think about way too often. Why don't

we learn. Even with the discovery of film and film making, little of the horror gets through to people. It almost seems that some want to emulate war horror and create more horrifying weapons as a badge of what, rather than become a higher level human being. It should only take one story, one memory, one book, one film, or one documentary to realize the futility of killing fellow humans.

[MnFats]

15. veterans' comments to me concerning battle scenes like 'saving pvt. ryan'

just as an aside to the thoughtful commentary above:

I've had a couple of oldtime vets tell me the D-Day beach scenes at the beginning of "Saving Pvt. Ryan" are absolutely realistic except in one aspect.
the noise: it is absolutely deafening. it's one of the most frightening things about battle -- it's constant and ear-shattering, and one of the most fear-inducing components of battle. it actually is painful....even temporary deafness notwithstanding... the shock waves still register with the brain.

those who have not experienced it actual combat will never understand....if they actually were able to duplicate it in a theater, it would drive the audience straight out the doors...

one more reason we should not so lightly send our young to war, I guess...

[Lydia Leftcoast]

25. In Portland I knew an eighty-something man who had been

a Marine at Guadalcanal and whose body was deformed because of injuries suffered there.

He refused to see war movies or World War II documentaries on TV, calling them "recruiting films."

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

33. Makes me wonder what it...

...must've been like for the many innocents trapped in the city of Falluja, awaiting their wholesale slaughter, as the full wrath of the U.S. military (chemical weapons and all) bore down on them. And for what? Just so the mercenaries of Blackwater Security could be avenged.

[sarge43]

16. Moving story, Cyrano

I think your friend not only wanted to speak for himself, but for all the men who never left that place. As you said, they were his brothers.

You did him a kindness.

[hlthe2b]

18. Special meeting...

Some of my most memorable moments and conversations have been with total strangers and sometimes about very "intense" topics--much too intense for casual conversation. These serendipitous meetings occur for a reason, I think...

THanks for sharing.

[BrklynLiberal]

19. I have the feeling that the meeting was very special for hm as well.

[StaggerLee]

20. I had been meaning to read your post all day at work today

I am very glad that I remembered to read it this evening.

Our elders are our greatest treasure because they have seen and heard it all.

Thanks for sharing.

[rateyes]

21. My grandmother's brother...

Bruce Johnson, is buried in the graveyard at Normandy...18 or 19 years old when he was killed a month and a half after D-Day. Thanks for the story.

From WWII Memorial Site.

('http://www.wwiimemorial.com/registry/cemetery/search/pframe.asp?HonoreeID=709268&popcount=2&tcount=2')

http://www.wwiimemorial.com/registry/wardept/plaq.asp?honoreeID=1245595

[SeattleGirl]

24. Thank you for sharing this most touching story.

Though the main subject you talked about -- war -- was a sad, sad topic, your hearts touched each other in that time you spent together. I hope you do run into him again; he sounds like a very interesting person. But even if you don't, this sounds like a memory that WILL always stay with you.

Recommended.

[Bozita]

28. Thank you Cyrano for starting this truly heart-touching thread

Special stuff!

[troubleinwinter]

32. Thank you both for this post.

[WinkyDink]

34. I honor that man, and you. Thank you.

I've been to Omaha (and Gold, etc.) Beach, Ste. Marie-Eglise, and the entire Normandy region. Once, my husband and I got out of our car to admire more closely a beautiful half-timbered home and its grounds. The elderly owner came out and, finding we were Americans, invited us in (and offered us a room to stay, but we had to decline). He VERY PROUDLY showed us his display of an American helmet from WWII, and couldn't thank "us" enough.

Sometimes, sometimes, men must fight.

But Iraq is not the place, and now is not the time.

(Full disclaimer: My father was in the Battle of the Bulge, and won the Bronze and Silver Stars.)