What Grade Would you give Howard Dean as head of the DNC?

[WI_DEM]

[blm]

1. It would be an A if electronic voting machines were a greater focus - so,

until then I will give him a B++++

[sui generis]

3. agreed

here's what I think: if BBV is an unsexy topic now, it will always be an unsexy topic.

It needs to be addressed, at least obliquely. The DNC may not be able to formulate a policy for it, but they can initiate work towards accountability in voting.

It is so hard to imagine that those words just rolled off my fingertips in the 21st century . . . .

[mod mom]

26. exactly!

[prairierose]

33. a big me too here....

we need to see more discussion of the voting machines and more praise for the WI law that requires the software to be open source and available for people to see.

The fund raising and the 50 state plan are moving along...now let's take a look at BBV.

[Atman]

2. I select B

I'll give him an A when we take back the government. But it all truthfulness, I think he's doing a great job, and if he'd offer up a few more smack-downs like the one he dealt to Wolfie on Sunday, I'd even give him extra credit and a gold star on his forehead.

[Dob Bole]

4. He's doing a great job. He isn't afraid to defer to others...

For example, during his campaign, he seemed to be pretty ignorant of religious matters...but when he makes a mistake, he corrects it. He's brought in people who understand the roles that different religions play. He also checked to make sure that no Democrats were involved with Abramoff before he said it publicly, instead of making a mistake and continuing to whore anyway. That's what Republicans, and maybe past DNC chairs, would have done. I respect that.

[LVdem]

5. Definitely an A

He's showing spine...he's raising tons of cash for the party...he doesn't mince words...

What's not to like?

[Gidney N Cloyd]

6. The man's been a breath of fresh air.

[JAbuchan08]

7. B - I like him as much or more than most Democrats

but there is too much still to be done to give him an A.

[jsamuel]

8. A and as he gets more experience, I hope it will be an A+

[Burning Water]

9. I vote 'F'.

But I would be willing to upgrade him, depending on the success of the 2006 election. NO excuses about 'stolen elections', or Diebold will be accepted. If he knows the problem, it's his responsibility to get it fixed. If he doesn't, what use is he?

[jsamuel]

11. you gave him an F because he hasn't been through an election yet?!

I believe the grade for that would be and I (Incomplete)... that was harsh.

[Burning Water]

22. 'F' because I see

him as ineffective. It's a judgment call, and I may be wrong, but I am not as optimistic about 2006 as many people here are. I would love to be wrong.

[insane_cratic_gal]

27. Give us your plan for effective then

What would you do different as DNC to get politicians elected. Democrats of course not that other nasty breed of clueless meanies


You can't call him ineffective because I'd have to assume your talking out your ass or on some juice. He's done better job of rebutting RW talking points then any other DNC leader. He's raised more money for the DNC then any other.

so why exactly is he ineffective?

Oh what about that poll that said 64 percent of Americans want congress to be controlled by dems in 2006?


I'm not trying to call your bluff, though I'm sure your putting on. But every comment (and i searched) you made was an empty one. It was negative toward Dems or completely not about Dems .. it was more related to Constitution related matters of Hannity, Coulter, Limbaugh's free speech rights.

So what's up with that?

[Burning Water]

37. OK, then

I believe the tactics that Dean uses are ineffective in that there is no reaching out to the center. The base of the Democratic party is, let's face it, to the left. The base of the Republican party is to the right. But, IMO, the center is neither one way nor the other. It is more a pragmatic, is this going to work out the way it is sold, is this going to work for me kind of group.

I don't think this group appreciates the divisiveness that has entered into Washington in recent years. Yes, the Republicans are divisive, but the Democrats are not taking advantage of this by acting like the mature party. Instead, they are joining right into the fray.

What I would do is cease the name-calling, for one thing. Point out Bush's mistakes. That's not only fair, but essential, But stop imputing evil motives to him. This may be true, but it doesn't have to be said. It's an ad hominemattack that is logically worthless. It's preaching to the choir, and will not, IMO, change any minds. In fact, I think it is more likely to cause people to be repulsed by the message of the messenger that uses it.

The facts of Bush's crimes and mistakes are enough, by themselves, to cause people to reject him. If they are kept clearly before the public. Let themdecide he is criminal. Let them (that is , us) press their Congressmen to impeach. But let the politicians keep out of the personal attacks until it is time to move. Sure, there will have to be a few that keep the issue out there, but should it be the very top of the party?? I just don't think so.

Look, I don't know why you are so offended. I'm not against the policies of the Democratic party. In fact, I support them. But my judgment, such as it is, tells me that the tactics are not working and will not work. Not up till election time. I can't prove this to your satisfaction, I'm sure, so I'm willing to wait and see. I will be disappointed if I am right, not wrong.

Cheerleading is simply not enough. Anger is not enough. Work is not enough. Even being right is not enough. The anger should be used to drive intelligent work, effective work. If it is not, then once again the Democratic Party will snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

And all this doesn't even include election fraud. What is actually being done to prevent it in the future? Something that has produced results, I mean. There is not much time left for the 2006 elections. If something is done here, I will immediately and drastically revise my opinion of Dean's leadership upwards.

Now maybe all this is 'bullshit', as you so graciously put it. I've been wrong before. But I still fail to see why you should be angered when someone suggests a different approach. I think it should be debated on the merits. And again, I don't think you'll find too many of my posts objecting to Democratic policy positions, just criticisms of the way they are running their campaigns and battles.

[leftofthedial]

41. oh boy! A DLCer

the Dems have been reaching out to the mythical "center" for a generation now.

Repuke-lite is no solution to the problems we face.

[Capn Sunshine]

42. You just bought in to Meme # 1 of the neocons

The BASE of the Democratic party is the FREAKING CENTER.

You gave up the game when you let them move the goal posts.

America is and always will be fair minded and liberal.
Re-read your history, look at what the leftists are saying aboutthe Democrats. We're in the center, pal, and until you realize this you are unconsciously helping the neocons fascist nation become a reality.

[Burning Water]

44. See, you still don't get it.

It doesn't matter so much what the Dem's politics are, left or center. I mean it does, of course, but I think the important thing, electorally, is how are they presented. I think we refer to it as 'framing' at this website. But the presentation has to be so much more than the words used to describe the idea or policy. It's also the manner of speaking, soft-spoken and reasonable, more-in-sorrow-than-in-anger type. Or angry, shrill, and unwilling to let the opponent have his say. As the previous poster brought up, I am a great friend of the 1st Amendment.

Give the Repukes enough rope and they will hang themselves. Keep the arguments on positions and not personalities and they cannot win. We're right, they're wrong, and it would be obvious to see to most people if personalities did not keep getting in the way. At least, I think so, but then I've never run for public office.

I think we are losing the PR war more the war of ideas. Look, it's just my thoughts. I understand that other people think differently, and I'm not really trying to tell them how to act. Couldn't if I wanted to. On the other hand, I expect more out of the leaders of the party. I want them to demonstrate a little gravitas. Is this unreasonable??

[NYCGirl]

50. "Give the repukes enough rope"? We've been doing nothing but giving them

rope for the past eight years, and look where that's gotten us? Out of power — completely. All "soft-spoken and reasonable" gets you is completely ignored by the media. Let's try it differently this time. Outspoken and truthful is the way to go. Be a leader, not a follower.

[sendero]

49. Name calling and ad hominem attacks..

.... are what put Republicans in power.

The Dems' perceived weakness is BECAUSE they will not rhetorically stand up to the bullying Republicans. You have it exactly wrong.

[Burning Water]

53. It could be.

I don't think so, but if Dean and the Democrats manage to 1)stop the Alito nomination, 2)do something about election fraud, or 3)win the House or the Senate this year I will have to seriously re-evaluate my thinking.

[insane_cratic_gal]

18. You have to justify that

Because I call Bullshit!

AN f?

Have you been paying attention? or just lurking? or just watching a certain news channel?

AND considering you made this comment: Your really gonna have to back that up .. Cuz I call double bullshit, I'm not convinced you know what your saying.

Burning Water----
"voted for Gore in 2000, but
the total lack of fight that he showed in this epic battle has soured me against him. He had a chance to make a difference, then didn't."

[Burning Water]

23. Well, I could be wrong, and I would

love to have to eat crow on this. But we won't have too long to wait to find out, will we?

[WI_DEM]

19. Well, his first election cycle was NJ-VA governorships

which we won and gains in State Leg. in those and other states. So I think he's off to a very good start.

[Burning Water]

24. There is that, of course.

I hope to be able to upgrade him in November, when the first big exam occurs.

[TheFarseer]

29. We won the two governorships in NJ and VA

I know only two elections and he wasn't in the forefront of either, but still the VA win was a quality 'W'.

[WLKjr]

31. he raises money, and more than the rest of the bunch

That's his progative.


He got this 20 year old interested in the process.

[EFerrari]

32. If you think election fraud is an excuse,

you need to spend some time reading the evidence. And Howard Dean can't fix it by himself.

[blm]

43. I hate that talking point - vote fraud is NOT an excuse, it's a REALITY

that the Dem party needs to deal with. FAST.

I cannot understand those who claim it's just an excuse. That is SUCH a Republican talking point.

[Burning Water]

48. See post

#46.

[Burning Water]

46. I don't see how

you got that I thought of it as an 'excuse' by what I wrote. I thought I was clear that it was a problem that neded to be fixed. But also, that it wasn't the only one.

[EFerrari]

51. Thanks for the clarification. I read this:

"NO excuses about 'stolen elections', or Diebold will be accepted. If he knows the problem, it's his responsibility to get it fixed. If he doesn't, what use is he?"

And assumed 1) You were discounting the very real problem of election theft and 2)That you were suggesting, if it was a problem, that Dean should somehow fix it on his own, which he can't do.

I have a lot of faith in Howard but we are the only ones that can fix this problem. He can help make it an issue; we have to make sure it gets addressed.

[Burning Water]

55. Yes, we all

have a responsibility, but he is in a leadership position, I am not. I don't know about you. Here's the thing: I'm not a follower, but I'm not a leader, either, nor do I want to be. Basically, I'm a loner, and if you leave me alone, I'll leave you alone. that doesn't mean I'm not interested in the world, and won't follow a good leader in a cause I believe in. And if HD has a plan to eliminate election fraud, let's hear it. I reserve the right to criticize it if I think it is foolishness, and to praise it if I think it deserves it.

When the Democrats put up a presidential nominee in 2008, I will vote for him, even if I have serious disagreements with him. But I still reserve the right to criticize him. Maybe not here :)

[EFerrari]

56. LOL! I hear you.

Dean needs us to push on election fraud so he can bring it up, and he needs us to keep the pressure on.

Leadership must be under some pressure not to bring up this issue. We have to bring them into the light.

:)

[Burning Water]

57. There you go.

I see we've found something to agree on. And that's basically my position. Let's find things to agree on with those we see as our opponents, and push the issues they can be pushed on, while resisting, in the politest possible manner their reverse pushing.

Well, here's to victory and my humble pie party, if Dean does happen to lead us in from the wilderness.

[EFerrari]

58. If I have to be polite, I guess I can manage it!

:silly:

[sandnsea]

10. B

I had really hoped to see a little more invigoration from the states by now, a trickle up agenda, so to speak. I don't really blame him, but I had hoped he'd be able to remove some log jams. Maybe he needs to discover the beauty of the leak.

[Ksec]

12. An A like always

The man speaks the truth and the rethugs cant handle the truth. It destroys them.

[FreedomAngel82]

13. I gave him

a B because we haven't won elections yet. After the midterms than we'll see how well he's doing where it concerns that, but I think he's the best chairman. :) We're so lucky to have him. I remember holding my breath hoping and praying that Dean would get the job and than the committee voted overwhelmingly for him and I could breathe again. :D

[BReisen]

14. An A, half way through the marking period

He's earned an A so far - for fund raising and the way he presents himself and our cause (ala Wolfie sigh). The marking period isn't over until after the elections, though, and he has to pass the final to earn a good grade!

[KittyWampus]

15. B+. Still needs to work on Dems who show up on tv.

He could also find a longtime staffer to help him prepare for appearances... much like a relief pitcher throws some balls before taking the mound.

[SaveElmer]

16. A-...he needs to be more circumspect about what he says...

In some situations...

His comments about not baing able to win the war were incomplete and unhelpful...

On the other hand he has been impressive regarding the Abranoff allegations...

And he is doing a great job revitalizing the party grass roots wise, and in his fundraising...

[fujiyama]

17. A-/B+

Somewhere on that borderline.

He's done well so far.

[ecstatic]

20. B until he gets his people in line (if thats possible)

The message coming from our Dems is still too scattered. He needs to get the Dems in line so we can have a unified message, approach, and strategy.

[realFedUp]

21. Just gave Howard some more money. nt

[MADem]

25. Frigging TWEETY's topic tonight is CORRUPTION

If he can get the shills to carry the people's water, he gets an A+ from me!

Who would have thought, a year ago, that there would be any criticism of the Greedy Old Pigs? Hit 'em hard, Howie!

[TheFarseer]

34. watch the show before you get excited

Tweety has been carrying water for the GOP on this issue, trying to say that dems are just as bad. Did you see the clip where he got all indignant and demanded to know how his guest could say Tom Delay was corrupt when he lived in such a modest middle class apartment?

[MADem]

54. Just the fact that it is the topic at all is hopeful (no idea if he will

host, could be Nora again). Regardless of his bent, the clowns at management are seeing the writing on the wall--they're picking the topic, I suspect. It seems a while ago that Nancy Pelosi first used the phrase 'culture of corruption' and now, at last, we are seeing it in the media, so that gives me cause for hope.

The corporate slugs care about one thing--their margin. If the Democrats regain power in a big way, watch Faux lurch left, and consign their righties to shitty time slots, while dropping them, one by one...

It is all about the dough with the corporate media. Cash is king. Power, or access to it, is everything. They go with the "winning team."

[TheFarseer]

28. I'd give him an 'A' except

he goes to far sometimes and hands the GOP bricks to throw at him. He was quoted as saying we are going to lose in Iraq or we can't win or something. That was poorly thought out and gave the GOP a nice opportunity to counter-attack when they seemed to be swirling down the toilet bowl. He's had other similar poorly thought out statements. But I do like how he generally fights back and swats down their talking points. I like how he seems populist in his point of view and brings alot of common sense to the table. He seems to be doing well in the $$$ department. He's good but still some room for improvement. Maybe he'll learn from his mistakes and help us win big in November.

[insane_cratic_gal]

30. He's right in a sense

We can't win in Iraq. Only Iraq can decide they are going to win.

The problems are far too big for the USA to contend with, that and our collation of the dwindling.. what do we have 1500 foreign fighters now and a couple of mules?

[TheFarseer]

36. then he should say

"only the Iraqis can decide if democracy wins." His answer was incomplete and begged to be hit into the bleachers by the GOP spin machine. As DNC chair, he's got to be aware of how his statements are going to sound.

[NYCGirl]

40. How do you "win" an occupation? NT

[m_welby]

52. he didn't phrase it correctly, he should have said

we can't win in iraq BECAUSE OF BUSH'S TOTALLY INCOMPETENCE. The failure needs to be pinned on them before they start pinning it on progressives (and they will).

[depakid]

35. A- but I still think he needs to find a graceful way out

and get back onto the campaign trail.

There's just too much inertia, and the longer he stays, the more he gets associated with the cowardly, right wing enabling element of the party.

[leftofthedial]

38. C. His rhetoric and energy have been good

but the Democratic Party is still mired in ineffectual old school bullshit and is still in thrall to corporate interests.

Virtually zero progress has been made in reeling in out-of-control psychotic corporations; indeed things have gotten worse

Virtually zero progress has been made in restoring legitimate elections to America; indeed things have gotten worse

The Democratic Party still has no message, no clear direction, no compelling issues

etc.


and to the extent any progress has been made, that progress has been in spite of, not because of, the DNC.

[DanCa]

39. B plus or A minus he hasn't pursued election fraud as hard as I

would like to see him to do it. Other than that I think he's doing a great job.

[bunkerbuster1]

45. A. He's living up to expectations, which were high.

He's raising good sums o' cash, he's using his bully pulpit when he can, and he is pissing off the wingnuts to no end. Thanks, Doc!

[Swamp Rat]

47. A

A

:)