The more I think about it, the more I realize this

[nadinbrzezinski]

Americans are really ignorant of labor history. I am seriously considering taking on this research project and WRITING a basic history of labor. We need to like recapture things like May First (Hay Market Affair and eight hour day)

But at times readying the rants on GD and the attacks on the labor union to be attacked (NEA these days) makes me go, why bother? What do you think?

[TheDebbieDee]

1. The average American is really ignorant about history in general...........

That's why we, as a culture, seem to keep making the same mistakes over and over. It's like only the really enlightened people take the time to see how other cultures dealt with some of these problems in the past. Only a few go to the trouble to analyze the results of how these cultures dealt with issues.

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. Well I am really down on how people respond to labor issues

but OS pointed out that yes it is time to do it or somebody else will rewrite history.

So went on google and found quite a bit of the material, as in original sources, for the Haymarket affair... as well as plenty of books on it... even one recent.

Sad, a critical story of US Labor History has mostly gone to the memory hole.

I got my work cut up for me.

[Blue_Tires]

3. Well, why should you be surprised? I never saw the word "union"

or "labor movement" in any of my high school history books (nor did it ever come up in any of our U.S. history discussions)...If it isn't being taught to youth, the consequences are self-evident...

[nadinbrzezinski]

5. See Texas, things are about to get much worst

See Mexico. When I was growing up the major strikes that preceded the Revolution as well as a few other labor issues were part of the curriculum (For the record they no longer are either). So the process of de-legitimatizing goes on. This is a nee liberal project. I asked my niece... you do know of the 1908 strike right? (IT was like required knowledge)

What strike.

Piedras Negras...

HUH!!!!

[SocialistLez]

14. Same here

I was one of those weird kids who was always research political things and I pretty much taught myself a lot of the history on the labor movement.

It makes me so sad to know so many kids are missing out on this.

Of course I think the big reason why they aren't taught this is because when kids are young they have a real big sense of injustice. Can't have any future workers sympathetic to unions now can we?

[Earth Bound Misfit]

4. ***SIGH***

Maddeningly frustrating, isn't it? I am by no means an expert on the subject, and had you asked me to discuss the subject as recently as 3-4 yrs ago I would probably be limited to the basic talking points being bandied about on both sides of the issue, and little else. But after having become deeply involved in attempting to Unionize my place of employment(read a little about it here), and subsequently being unceremoniously dumped by my employer for having done so, I can at least discuss such issues as the NLRB, labor law/labor law reform etc. with a reasonable amount of confidence given my limited education (HS grad) and the CRIMINALLY low level of attention given to the history of the Labor movement in this country. Did I say low level? NON-EXISTENT would be more accurate.

Having gained a somewhat workable knowledge of the current state of Labor Law in this country, trying to educate my fellow workers would (too) often result in vacant, expressionless head nodding or hurried "I gotta go" type brushoffs. Those same people would invariably be the same ones who would confront me by angrily asking questions such as "What's the UNION gonna do about XYZ?" If my reply to such a query were "What are YOU gonna do about it, YOU AR THE UNION" I'd get the quizzical WTF? look from those same people, as if I had three heads or something. They just don't or WON'T get it, rather they want SOMEONE ELSE to get it for them.

As for your question: why bother? What do you think?

I often feel that way. One needs only return to this forum and observe the HERCULEAN efforts of Omaha Steve to answer that. Why bother? Because as long as there are people like OS out there, there is still HOPE for Labor in this country, IMO.

Thank you for posting this, I sure do wish more DUers would contribute to the Labor Forum.

[nadinbrzezinski]

6. It gets worst

my hubby's union is going along with the removing of a five day week. You read right.

SO my hubby confronted the UNION LEADERSHIP... only to get a brush off. I mean he pays dues, that is the only thing they care about. When he contacted DC they were a little more political about it. And now they are actually like agreeing to making the point of going back to five days on SAFETY reasons. And then they wonder why half or more of the work force is about given up on that Union. By the way, I know that they could try to go the route of dissolving it and forming a new one... and I did mention that to hubby. Remember seeing that in the National Labor Relations Board at one point... at times, I pointed out, the mere threat of that gets the message across.

Part of the problem is that SOME unions are utterly corrupt. And those are the ones used as an EXAMPLE of why the Union Movement is useless.

What galls me is that people ask for a LINK to something that sadly is NOT breaking news.

[Earth Bound Misfit]

7. Even the "best" Unions today have been rendered little more than paper tigers

and ATM's for the Democratic Party. Absent REAL Labor law reform or the repeal/amendment of Taft-Hartley (NOT holding my breath on that happening) this slow steady erosion will continue, IMHO. Labor law and by extension Unions have (has?) been under siege since the passage of the Wagner Act (NLRA) in 1935. All this has occurred while an uninformed, undereducated Amurkin' public stood by-- idly at first and now WILDLY cheering it's demise, much like Mark Twain's "poor Southern whites" --whose economic problems are caused by slaveholders, but who nevertheless rally to their causes, fight their battles and protect their interests.

Carlin nailed it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acLW1vFO-2Q

[Earth Bound Misfit]

8. A de-cert "scare" might actually make things "worser"

...it might create a clusterfuck of epic proportions. The Union faced by a serious de-cert will employ tactics similar to those used by the Unionbusters-- IOW, they could tie things up in endless litigation, appeals, etc. Speaking of de-certs, this thread might interest you:

DECERTIFYING a Union by "card-check" http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=367x17217

Discusses how a Union can be de-certified WITHOUT the "sacrosanct" Secret Ballot election that the wingnutz & Union bashers are so hellbent on defending in their attacks on EFCA. Ironical, No?

EBM

Edit subject line.

[SocialistLez]

15. The union movement isn't useless

I HATE it when people use "corrupt unions" as an excuse to beat on unions.

Unions should be thanked for a lot of things but so many people just take it for granted.

I would love to be a union but I'm not going to rock the boat with my employer.

[PhD]

9. Some of us have been betrayed by unions so many times

that we've lost faith in the corrupt leaders only looking out for their own selfish interests.

[Earth Bound Misfit]

10. Hmmm.

Some of US? Who might "US" be?

[demosincebirth]

12. Name one group of workers who did not better themselves by joining a union. And I don't

mean, just, one guy with a hard-on against unions, theres many of them. Just like the Healthcare bill (not perfect), but I rather have it than not have it.

You might check out FR. Might be more to you liking.

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. And these US should be?

Granted there is some truth in what you say, but alas that is PART OF THIS HISTORY.

For the most part, UNIONS help to improve your life though... even if you are not part of one

[demosincebirth]

11. I've been sayin' for years, that The History of Labor should be

part of U.S. History taught in all high schools

[Sanity Claws]

16. Good luck

People are woefully ignorant of labor history and I wish you the best of luck in writing the book.

However, the failure to teach labor history is not due to a lack of good books on the subject. It is due to the contempt with which labor is viewed by many in power and how media perpetuate this feeling. IMHO.