Dean on American Morning today about FL and MI delegates

[madfloridian]

Run time: 05:08 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9YWYWRwJok   Posted on YouTube: March 06, 2008 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: March 06, 2008 By DU Member: madfloridian Views on DU: 682

 
More at the DNC blog. Other appearances today. He was very outspoken, did a good job.

I disagree about do-overs but otherwise ok.

http://dnc.org/a/2008/03/dean_on_morning.php

Dean made it clear on NPR yesterday that both states bypassed the DNC on this latest push..they went straight to the media. They shut Dean out.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1888

[Larkspur]

1. Saw Howard Dean on CBS and NBC this morning

and yes he did a GREAT job making the case that MI and FL ignored the rules and the DNC will NOT pay for a do-over. Thank Goddess for Howard Dean!

I do support a do-over as long as Howard Dean and the DNC rules committee approve the method MI and FL will use.

[ozone_man]

4. Thank Goodess for Howard Dean!

Or Goddess if she exists. :)

Aside from the horrible audio and video recording, he said everything perfectly. I think a redo primary is fine if FL and MI pay for it. Maybe next time they'll think twice about breaking the rules, and rethink about electing their dumbass party leaders.

[ProfessorPlum]

2. That guy so rocks

It is a shame what the FL GOP leg and governor have done to the state's voters, just like they are always trying to do, but you've got to have sympathy for Dean and the DNC's position.

Great appearance, Howard.

[winterlight]

7. I wish Dean could have been president

He was loathed by the media, however. Can he run again in the future?

[Connonym]

3. Dean is incredible and he's doing an amazing job heading the DNC

I know we need him there for all the fine work he's doing but it sort of chokes me up to think how much he might have done as president.

[knitter4democracy]

5. We would need a do-over in Michigan, definitely.

We had the lowest turnout I've ever seen. Many just didn't vote. Why vote? Our votes were worthless, and our party higherups disenfranchised us. Plus, Obama and Edwards weren't on the ballot, so it wasn't even a real contest.

When our state party higherups started talking about this crap, many of us said it was so they could throw the state to Hillary. Hmm. Look at what they're trying to do now. *sigh* The only way to have a real number of delegates, a number that mean anything, is to have a caucus that the state party pays for with both Hillary and Obama on the ballot.

I am happy that Dr. Dean did say that the voters had no power here, but I really wish he'd push that point. We were not listened to. Mark Brewer, our state chair, went around to all the county parties to try and sell this deal, and everyone (at least, all the people here who were at those meetings) was against it. Entirely against it. So, who was for it? Sen. Levin, Dingell, and Gov. Granholm. They got their way, and the rest of us got screwed.

I still think that the DNC could've done something to broker a better deal by taking into account what was going on at the state level last fall and also taking into account that the ones who started this whole mess were the Republicans who knew that their rules only stripped half of the delegates and our rules stripped them all. Anyone who knows anything about Michigan politics knows that it's a mess and the state leaders of both parties can barely find their asses with both hands. Still, when it comes down to it, it's the fault of our leaders to listen to the MIGOP at all, the schmucks.

[madfloridian]

6. You do know they refused to negotiate with Dean, don't you?

They refuse to recognize his authority. I give him no blame on this at all. Rules were made by Terry McAuliffe's committee, voted on by all the states. Dean is simply enforcing them. If he were not, Hillary would be the nominee right now. Think about it. If FL and MI had not been sanctioned, she would be the nominee.

They despise Dean for it. Granholm should never have teamed up with Crist and bypassed Dean.

Brewer should be made to step down as chair, so should Karen Thurman. And voters should think twice about who they vote for next time.

[knitter4democracy]

9. I do realize that.

I've read through your posts and research, plus I know what I've heard at party meetings here and such. I place the huge majority of the blame squarely on our leaders' shoulders and think we need to oust them and replace them with people who know better than to team up with Republicans. Still, I believe that there had to be a better answer than to disenfranchise two swing states.

[MindMatter]

8. What's wrong with a do-over?

I think Dean is making them a great offer. Run a proper primary where the candidates can campaign and all votes are counted, and those delegates will be seated.

Dean is absolutely right that the DNC should not spend a penny on that. The two states f---ed up. They need to come up with the money to do this by the rules. Don't waste the DNC's money right in the middle of the election cycle.

If FL and MI can't do that simple thing, then they should stop crying.

[knitter4democracy]

10. By Michigan law, it can't be a primary.

Primaries have to be state funded--and our state budget is a huge mess. We don't have the millions it would take. That means the state Democratic Party would have to pay for it, and that means that they'd be taking millions away from trying to win the state senate and several House races, which they obviously don't want to do.

The Michigan superdelegates are the ones crying. The rank-and-file are pissed. We were ignored and shoved aside, and it turns out we were right all along. Now it's going to be harder to win Michigan for the Dem nominee (McCain's got a serious campaign already up and running here with rallies and fundraisers and all sorts of volunteers--our people have nothing). It's going to be nigh unto impossible to convince people to vote for the party that stripped them of their votes.

And I get really tired of people making it sound like the people of Michigan chose this or even had a say in this. We were left out in the cold and had no idea what was happening until it was too late. Dingell and Brewer and the GOP made sure of that. So, we got screwed for some power play. That's why we're pissed. Wouldn't you be?

[MindMatter]

11. Well, what is the answer, then?

In Michigan, not only were candidates not allowed to campaign, only Clinton was even on the ballot. With the governor being a Clinton supporter, the calls to slate the Michigan delegates are purely duplicitous. Really beyond that. It is an outrageous suggestion.

I understand what you are saying about the rank and file. It would be a real shame if they punished Obama in the fall for that. Obama will just have to make the case that despite these problems, Michigan citizens will be best served with Obama in the White House compared to McCain.

Fortunately there is plenty of time for the people of Michigan to get past the unfairness of the primary situation and focus on the real issue, which is the general election. It would help that process along if the governor didn't keep stoking the fires of division in a futile attempt to salvage a failed Clinton campaign.

[knitter4democracy]

12. Obama's going to be a hard sell.

Michigan's a huge economic mess. We'd had the lovely distinction of being the leading edge of the recession. We're losing jobs, population, leading in foreclosures and job loss, you name it. We still get less than a dollar back for every dollar we send to Washington, and our state budget's a total mess (and with a balanced budget amendment in our state constitution passed during the last GOP gov's term when things were better before he screwed it all up, we can't go into debt to cover things).

Obama's never been here. He chose not to campaign here and chose to take himself off the ballot. McCain won here in 2000 and only lost here this year because people remember Romney's dad and like him and because many in the state Dem leadership told Dems to cross over and vote for Romney to keep the Republicans fighting each other longer. McCain is well-liked here, and many have fallen for his maverick bit. Obama's not as well known, and there are some who don't see McCain as BushII and are mad that Obama didn't fight for Michigan.

Keep in mind that most people here are barely hanging on. They're not on DU, they're not researching candidates--they don't have time. All they know is what they hear on the radio and what they hear at work or from friends. They do know that Obama has never fought for us and that he's never even had a fundraiser here. That sends a strong message to a state that's dying--we're not worth his time or effort, that other states are more important. These people don't understand all the party rules and crap; they only understand that a big candidate who keeps talking about hope doesn't give a crap about us. A quick listen to Michigan talk radio and all tells you that most people here at least respect McCain for coming here, having a debate here, and telling it like it is. He's going to be very hard to beat.

The best answer, I think, is a do-over. If we have a caucus and force the state party to pay for it (their dumb-ass mistake, so they should pay), and if the candidates really come here and work to overturn the anti-Michigan message, we'll have a chance. If not, I don't see the grassroots getting developed enough to win the GE.

[MindMatter]

13. He didn't CHOOSE not to campaign there

He was playing by the rules. The party required all of them to pledge not to campaign in MI and FL.

[knitter4democracy]

16. He chose to remove his name from the ballot.

That part was not required. Dodd, Kucinich, Gravel, and Clinton were all on the ballot.

We haven't seen him since, either. I realize he's busy, but if McCain can take time to run up here for a fundraiser, so can Obama or Clinton.

[madfloridian]

14. Hillary said no caucus in MI. They need to get their acts together

and speak from the same page.

[knitter4democracy]

15. For crying out loud. Ugh.

Someone in Hillary's office really needs to stay up on what's going on in Michigan. Ugh.