Oct. 1st Military starts Martial Law Mission, no more posse comitatus, heads up 'unruly crowds'

[ProfessorPlum]

Run time: 00:50 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYxTzDFofZQ   Posted on YouTube: September 23, 2008 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: September 23, 2008 By DU Member: ProfessorPlum Views on DU: 8682

 

[midnight]

1. Subdue unruly crowds. Isn't that the job of the police.

[Joe Chi Minh]

33. Hasn't the distinction between them become somewhat blurred?

[Faith No More]

51. These bastards are getting ready to steal another one.

You'd have to be blind to think that they've given themselves all this power just to turn it over to Obama. There are quite a few videos on YouTube showing old government facilities that have been surrounded with chain link fence and barbed wire to turn them into internment camps.

[dgibby]

59. Unfortunately,

the police have been militarized, the National Guard is under the control of the president and will if necessary be called up to active duty with the regular military, and we have mutual defense pact with Canada. Also, Northcom encompasses ALL of North America, and not just the US.

[GimmeDANEger]

2. soon the rest of the nation will feel the anxiety we felt in Minneapolis/St. Paul

and maybe the lack of justice will be just as clear to them.

[JohnDoe_America]

3. So what's the plan?

What's the plan? Steal the election and then put down the revolt?

[Indenturedebtor]

11. Steal the treasury first. They have a couple more months to do awful things

And hell, October is the month for surprises no?

[JohnDoe_America]

41. True. This country is so bankrupt from the tax cuts, the Iraq war and

now the bailout, the crooks have just about destroyed our ability to anything.

It makes me sick sometimes to think that I live amongst people who would elect the destruction of their government and then complain about it. I have been having more and more thoughts about finding a country where people use reason to make their decisions. I want to find a country where being intelligent is not a handicap when running for office. FDR, Lincoln and ALL of the founders would not get elected today because they would either be too smart or elitist or both.

[snappyturtle]

50. I hear you. Although we cannot re-locate, it would be nice to be able

to live and have freedom of speech and the right to protest and to have elected officials looking out for us. I'm so thankful for DU....I would lose my mind if it weren't here. Welcome to DU! :hi:

[dgibby]

60. I second that!

:hi:

[CubicleGuy]

58. What would cause a big uprising?

I wonder if there are any assassination squads training somewhere right now. There was already one group that got arrested before the Democratic Convention, right?

Maybe they weren't the "authorized" team.

Anyway, if something were to happen to the "wrong" candidate, I imagine that just might cause all sorts of stuff to hit the fan.

[dgibby]

61. probably some sort of "false flag" operation.

:grr:

[boomerbust]

4. Tin Foil Checklist

War for oil - check
Spying on American citizens - check
Destroy economy to loot treasury - check
October surprise Martial Law - ?

[Just-plain-Kathy]

38. This is getting scary.

...And to add to your list, start WWIII before the end of the Bush's term.

[organic produce]

5. I love Amy but

I lost a little respect for her in Minneapolis, she appeared old, afraid and weak outside the comfort zone of her booth. I do like her and her politics but I guess I expected more thunder and guts.

[bvar22]

6. ?

Amy Goodman IS old (middle aged).
Amy Goodman IS small and weak compared to a group of violent, 240 lb men pushing her around.
Scared?..... Where were you?

[krkaufman]

10. That's a pretty high bar. Especially given how few would measure-up. n/t

[Alameda]

13. Um mm??? What did you expect her to do?

She did exactly what she could, and should have done. Leave Amy Goodman alone. She does a H**l of a lot more than 99% of us.

[peacetalksforall]

14. You don't feel respect because she is 'old' and a small size? What ridiculous words.

Outside the comfort zone? She went after her right as the employerr to protect her staff and she got roughed up and jailed while she and they were wearing official passes issued by the RNC and everyone else responsible for the protection of journalists.

I think you should tell us how old you are, which sex, your physcial stature, and what you would have done.

I can't believe this attack on her.

Let's have it - YOUR age, sex, physcial stature, and your solution for fighting for your employees?

Utterly low ball critique.

[sabrina 1]

26. I would be interested in hearing that also

Obviously this commenter has stood up for the rights of all of us and must have succeeded in over-powering an army of robo-cops, as any super-hero is expected to do. Otherwise, I can't imagine this level of disappointment in Amy. Clearly s/he believes that being small in stature is all that prevented Amy from defended us all from the thuggery of the government's forces.

Of course, she could have shed her 'journalist' attire, revealed her wonder woman costume, pulled out her weapons, and rescued her producers from captivity.

I guess it is disappointing that all she did was to confront them, unarmed and without any superhuman powers, standing up for the rights of journalists everywhere.

[peacetalksforall]

28. Yeah. Small in stature. She does two months of work in one. She takes risk

simply by bringing us the truth day in and day out.

I never saw a photo of her photographer, but it is not Johnson. I feel they targeted him, her, and Democracy Now.

I have many suspicions about why the police did not pull back when they realized all of them were legitimate identification holders.

I love her because she brings me what I was promised as a kid - integrity, veracity, freedom. Freedom from the lies and propaganda of corporate networks.

Good 'ol Amy - probably in her 40's.

[groovedaddy]

39. The police didn't pull back BECAUSE they want to intimidate the press

They would really prefer that the press not show up at all.
At the '04 RNC, the great majority of the arrested protestors had their cases thrown out because the police actions were caught on camera and proved the cops were lying.

[checks-n-balances]

16. Oh? I've never heard anyone else describe her that way...

At least not other DUers or Democrats I know. By "outside the comfort zone of her booth" do you mean during her arrest?

Your strange comments make her sound like McCain! Care to be more specific?

Edited to be more specific

[Oilwellian]

29. What an assinine comment

So you lose respect for people once they "appear" old and weak? That says a lot about YOU and nothing about Amy Goodman.

[Forrest Greene]

36. Yeah, The Uniforms

... the badges, the guns, the riot shields, the clubs on the big bad strong young men are so much more... ...impressive, aren't they? Bet you'll enjoy the thunder & guts on TV when the Army visits your town. No guts of your own, though, I guess, huh?

[eagertolearn]

42. Obviously a repug plant. Dems don't put down people fighting the cause!

Keep up the great work Amy and thanks for keeping us informed! I think we should all be ready to hit the streets in such masses that there's no way the repugs can subdue us if needed. If they steal this election again this is what will happen. Maybe now i the time to get those gas masks!

[dgibby]

63. Three little words:

"Non-lethal microwave weapons"!!!

[valerief]

46. Thank you for your concern.

[puebloknot]

49. How about *exhausted* from doing the work that we who sit at home ...

... and behave as keyboard warriors are not doing???

And there is the fact that she's been through a major illness which would have kept lesser beings at home, and not out on the streets of Minneapolis!

Does "old, afraid and weak" add up to not deserving respect in your book? I'd say that's a latter-day American value that a lot of people would be glad to join in. It's all about image, after all!

[dgibby]

52. Asinine!

Let's see how well you'd do in that situation, especially if you'd already almost been almost beaten to death in a previous incident,like Amy was. BTW. how old are you, 10,11? As for being weak, that woman is made of steely resolve, so don't even, ever go there.:wtf: :spank: :grr: :nuke: :thumbsdown:

[SteveM]

68. What did/do you expect from her?...

Even after her arrest and release, MSM gave this 3rd World quashing of dissent (and now-routine round-up of the media) short shrift.
Comfort zone? Where?

In any discussion of "thunder and guts," remember that the Democratic Party, liberals & progressives and what's left of the Left have a record of precious little "front line" time fighting the GOP Far Right over the last 8 years. The Right knows this and is going for all they can get -- and may get more after January if they so CHOOSE.

BTW: Revere-riding, he warns of fascism, yet demands gun control.

Heard any of that in these threads?

[organic produce]

80. I apologize unreservedly!!

I failed to articulate what i intended to say but I can see how retarded my statement looks. I love Amy and can only apologize and beg for forgiveness.

[dgibby]

91. apology accepted (at least by me)

:thumbsup:

[SteveM]

108. Hey, no problem, and thanks. Guts are where you find them (nt)

[paparush]

81. Ghandi was small and old too...he managed to accomplish quite a bit.

[StopTheNeoCons]

7. Operation Garden Plot has been commenced, goodbye free speech

The United States Civil Disturbance Plan 55-2


The following information was obtained under the Freedom of Information Act. The original printing was of June 1, 1984. The information herein is UNCLASSIFIED and does not come within the scope of directions governing the protection of information affecting the national security.

It took a little more than three years to obtain a full copy of Operation Garden Plot from the U.S. Government, and was done so under the freedom of information act for unclassified documents. The implications within the full context of this document should make the hair on the back of your head stand on end!!!!!

In this document signed by the Secretary of the Army, is hereby assigned as DOD Executive Agent for civil disturbance control operations. Under Plan 55-2 he is to use airlift and logistical support, in assisting appropriate military commanders in the 50 states, District of Columbia, and the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico and US possessions and territories, or any political subdivision thereof.

The official name of this project is called "Operation Garden Plot."

Under this plan for the deployment of Operation Garden Plot, the use of CIDCON-1 will be mandatory. This direct support of civil disturbance control operations is to be used by the Army, USAF, Navy, and Marine Corp. with an airlift force to be comprised of MAC Organic Airlift Resources, airlift capable aircraft of all other USAF major commands, and all other aerial reconnaissance and Airborne Psychological Operations. This is to include control communications systems, aeromedical evacuation, helicopter and Weather Support Systems.

If any civil disturbance by a resistance group, religious organization, or other persons considered to be non-conformist takes place, under Appendix 3 to Annex B of Plan 55-2 hereby gives all Federal forces total power over the situation if local and state authorities cannot put down said dissenters.

Annex A, section B of Operation Garden Plot defines tax protesters, militia groups, religious cults, and general anti-government dissenters as Disruptive Elements. This calls for the deadly force to be used against any extremist or dissident perpetrating any and all forms of civil disorder.

Under section D, a Presidential Executive Order will authorize and direct the Secretary of Defense to use the Armed Forces of the United States to restore order.

2 TAB A APPENDIX 1 TO ANNEX S USAF CIVIL DISTURBANCE PLAN 55-2 EXHIBIT POR:SGH, JCS Pub 6, Vol 5, AFR 160-5 hereby provides for America's military and the National Guard State Partnership Program to join with United Nations personal in said operations. This links selected U.S. National Guard units with the Defense Ministries of "Partnership For Peace." This was done in an effort to provide military support to civil authorities in response to civil emergencies.

Under Presidential Decision Directive No. 25, this program serves to cement people to relationships between the citizens of the United States, and the global military of the UN establishments of the emerging democracies of Central and Eastern European countries. This puts all of our National Guardsmen under the direct jurisdiction of the United Nations.

Section 3:
This plan could be implemented under any of the following situation:

(1) Spontaneous civil disturbances which involve large numbers of persons and/or which continue for a considerable period of time, may exceed the capacity of local civil law enforcement agencies to suppress. Although this type of activity can arise without warning as a result of sudden, unanticipated popular unrest (past riots), it may also result from more prolonged dissidence.

This would most likely be an outgrowth of serious social, political or economic issues which divide segments of the American population. Such factionalism could manifest itself through repeated demonstrations, protest marches and other forms of legitimate opposition but which would have the potential for erupting into spontaneous violence with little or no warning.

(2) Planned acts of violence or civil disobedience which, through arising from the same causes as (1) above, are seized upon by a dedicated group of dissidents who plan and incite purposeful acts designed to disrupt social order.

This may occur either because leaders of protest organizations intentionally induce their followers to perpetrate violent acts, or because a group of militants infiltrates an otherwise peaceful protest and seeks to divert it from its peaceful course.

Subsection C: (2) Environmental satellite products will be continue to be available. (d) Responsibilities. Meteorological support to civil disturbance operations will be arranged or provided by AWS wings.

The 7th. Weather Wing (7WW) is responsible for providing / arranging support for Military Airlift Command (MAC) airlift operations. The 5th Weather Wing (5WW) is responsible for supporting the United States Army Forces Command.

(3) SITUATION. Civil disturbance may threaten or erupt at any time in the CONUS and grow to such proportions as to require the use the Federal military forces to bring the situation under control.

A flexible weather support system is required under control. A flexible weather support system is required to support the many and varied options of this Plan.

ANNEX H: XXOW, AWSR 55-2, AWSR 23-6, AFR 23-31, AR 115-10, AFR 105-3.

Subsection B:

Concept of Environmental Support. Environmental support will be provided by elements of Air Weather Service (AWS) in accordance with refs a-f. The senior staff meteorologist deployed int the Task Force Headquarters (TFH) will be the staff weather officer (SWO) to the TFH.

Centralized environmental support products are requested in accordance with AWSR 105-18. (4) Weather support is provided by weather units located at existing CONUS bases or by deployed SWOs and / or weather teams to the objective areas.

(5) Support MAC source will be provide in accordance with the procedures in MARC 103-15. MAC forces will be provided in accordance with the procedures in AFR 105-3.

(a) Air Force Global Weather Central: Provides centralized products as requested.

REFERENCES : JCS Pub 18 - Doctrine for Operations Security AFR 55-30, Operations Security

1. GENERAL Opposition forces or groups may attempt to gain knowledge of this plan and 'use that knowledge to prevent or degrade the effectiveness of the actions outlined in this plan. In order to protect operations undertaken to accomplish the mission, it is necessary to control sources of information that can be exploited by those opposition forces or groups.

OPSEC is the effort to protect operations by identifying and controlling intelligence indicators susceptible to exploitation. The objective of OPSEC, in the execution of this plan, is to assure the security of operations, mission effectiveness, and increase the probability of mission success.

2. RESPONSIBILITY FOR OPERATIONS SECURITY (OPSEC):

The denial of information to an enemy is inherently a command responsibility. However, since the operations Officer at any level of command is responsible to his commander for the Overall planning and execution of operations, he has the principal staff interest in assuring maximum protection of the operation and must assume primary responsibility instibility for ensuring that the efforts of all other staff elements are coordinated toward this
end. However, every other individual associated with, or aware of, the operation must assist in safeguarding the security of the operation.

3. OBJECTIVES:

a. The basic objective of OPSEC is to preserve the security of friendly forces and thereby to enhance the probability of successful mission accomplishment. "Security" in this context relates to the protection of friendly forces. It also includes the protection of operational information to prevent degradation of mission effectiveness through the disclosure of prior knowledge of friendly operations to the opposition.

b. OPSEC pervades the entire planning process and must be a matter of continuing concern from the conception of an operation, throughout the preparatory and execution phases, and during critiques, reports, press releases, and the like conducted during the post operation phase.

4. Specific operations orders and standard operating procedures "MUST be developed with the awareness that the opposition may be able to identify and exploit vulnerable activities.

Reference Material:

Released under Freedom of Information Act on March 30th, 1990. All material presented here has been declassified and supersedes USAD Operations Plan 355-10 of July 16, 1973. Information released by USAF under supervision of Alexander K. Davidson, BRIG. GEN, USAF, Dep. Director of Operations.

APPENDEX 5 TO ANNEX E TO USAF CIVIL DISTURBANCE PLAN 55-2 Annex Z. Other References: 10 United States Codes 331,332,333,8500,1385, MARC 105-1, MARC 105-18, AR 115-10, AFR 105-3, PDD-25.

Additional backup documents will be found on another site at

http://www.cafes.net/mo/Gardenplot.htm

That is a good site to read this type of material. Lots of curious stuff.

If I can give anyone credit for this great file, I give to the guys in the "cafes". Thanks, guys.

Please notice that your "faithful" political servants did not tell you about this law. But they wrote and passed it. It took someone about there years to find it. And they had to force it out into the open. Congressman Gonzalez admits that it exists. Gee, thanks a lot, you guys.

[onethatcares]

24. what are flexible weather support systems?

that line blows me away.

Now we know what those concentration camps are for in the mid west.

What happened to our country? Will the troops fire on thier families? Gauddammit,

[dgibby]

37. Google: DARPA and HAARP

[kristopher]

34. The "Operation Garden Plot" link doesn't work

And the post cobbling together all the various references is extremely suspect, IMO. There are provisions for martial law in military planning, there has to be. I mean, just to grab the most obvious example, what do you think is going to happen if there were a massive attack on the country?

http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_mlaw.html

The post on "Garden Plot" looks like a paranoid rendering of such planning.

As to the OP, I don't have high speed so I haven't seen the video. Therefore I can't really comment directly; however, it is my experience that (as demonstrated by the "Garden Plot" post) people unfamiliar with the military often don't understand what they are seeing.

[dgibby]

57. I AM familiar with the military (ret Navy)

Google: Army Times, garden plot, operation Northwoods (for historical/hysterical perspective), Northcom, presidential signing statements, presidential executive orders. There are also several other posts on this page that address this. The point of this post is contained in the original Army Times article. The posse comitatus clause has been restored, but the fact that it's illegal (once again) to use active duty military for anything other than threat from foreign attack, has NEVER stopped BushCo before, and certainly wouldn't stop them this time! This is very serious, very scary business, and should NOT be taken lightly. It is NOT tinfoil hat stuff.

[kristopher]

64. I'm as wary of increasing executive power as anyone

And as aware as anyone of the steady move toward such concentration and the various means by which it is being done.

I don't know what you did in the military, but you clearly didn't work with contingency planning.

This thread IS tin foil hat stuff. For example, you give a bucketful of search terms as proof of a reason for your appraisal that this is "very serious, very scary business". That approach is to reasoned argument what garbage scraps are to a carefully prepared meal.

[dgibby]

89. You are entitled to your opinion, (response to #64)

as I am to mine, but you'd probably get better exercise at the gym than you would jumping to conclusions on this thread.

As a matter of fact, I was involved in contingency planning, but would never discuss anything even remotely related to classified information, so it would probably be best not to go there.

As for my posts listing subjects to google, I am not computer literate enough at this point to be able to cut, paste, and post links, but I'm working on it, and would be grateful for any info/instruction from anyone who could help me with this. The reason I post the subjects to google is that I don't want anyone to take my beliefs & opinions as fact. Other posters on this thread have linked to other sites which provide good info, some of which are posted on DU.

I personally don't care if you think you're eating table scraps or dog chow wrapped in tinfoil. That's part of why I,and many others, served in the military, to guarantee everyone the right to express his/her own opinion. In fact, I'd like nothing better to find out that you're right and all the rest of us are wrong, and that we all get to keep expressing our thoughts, beliefs, and opinions freely and without fear of reprisal.

[Yes We Did]

35. Thank You... Posting To CallThemOut

link in the sig line... suggest forwarding it.

[keepCAblue]

83. What is meant by "meteorological" and "weather support?

:shrug:

[keepCAblue]

85. I googled HAARP ... OMFG. n/t

[dgibby]

90. I rest my case!

[undergroundpanther]

97. This:

http://pesn.com/2005/09/06/9600160_Weather_Modification/
http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapcf/06/05/china.rain/index.html
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h109-2995

[krkaufman]

8. "unruly or dangerous individuals and crowds" ... a.k.a. American citizens n/t

wtf.

[Anticon]

9. Look out Rome..

Ceaser has crossed the Rubicon.

:hurts:

[jimlup]

12. Is the October Surprise an ...

attack on Iran?? That is about the only thing that would explain this contingency measure. Either that or a really bad run on the banks...

[katty]

15. concur with either of those

[Porschenut1066]

17. The USA is being taken over by Nazi's

This is a well researched list of events in the order in which they have occured. Warning this is very disturbing.

Mobs of young men dressed in identical shirts shouting outside a voting center in Florida to intimidate people to stop a recount.
Mobs of men dressed in identical shirts (brown shirts) stood near voting stations shouting and intimidating people.


Mobs of young republicans are organized by the National Party to make bonfires and burn CD's produced by the Dixie Chicks
Mobs of Brown shirts and Hitler Youth are organized by the Nazi Party to make bonfires and burn books written by those they disagreed with

Members of the Young republicans are shaming academics for saying something they disagreed about.
Members of the Nazi Party would shame academics for saying something they disagreed about.



The FBI being told to stop peace activists flying or boarding aircraft on orders of the White House.
The German authorities were instructed to stop peace activists and other “trouble makers” at airports.


When the US invaded Iraq V.P. Cheney asserted we would be “greeted as liberators”.
When the Nazi's invaded the Rhineland, Nazi propaganda asserted that they would be “greeted as liberators”


Bush Administration using phrases such as we will find terrorists “hiding in their spider-holes”
Nazi's would find their enemies “hiding in their spider-holes”


The Bush administration increased security restrictions at airports. Airport security guards were forcing passengers to drink their own breast milk. Others to drink baby formula in front of all the other passengers
One of Mussolini's intimidation tactics was to force citizens to drink body fluids and emetics in public. The Nazi's followed suit with breast milk and urine in front of the other passengers


2002 Bush created the “Department of Homeland Security” White house spokespeople started referring to the United States as the “homeland” for the first time in history instead of the nation or republic.
1930 Nazi propagandists started to refer to
Germany not as the Nation or Republic but rather “Der Heimat” - “the homeland” Deputy Fuhrer Rudolf Hess Formed a “Department of Homeland Security”


2001 USA Patriot Act let federal officials compel doctors to hand over confidential medical records without a warrant showing probable cause.
1930 German doctors were required to disclose citizens previously private medical records to the state.

2005 Guantanamo prisoners reported seeing the Koran being flushed down toilets.
1938 the Gestapo forced Jews to scrub out toilets with their sacred phylacteries, the tfillin.

Amnesty International reports US interrogators tormented prisoners by playing heavy metal at top volume day and night.
1938 the Gestapo interrogators tormented prisoners by playing music on the radio at top volume day and night.

Iraqi human rights group complained that in 2004 the US forces seized the innocent wives of suspected insurgents and held the women hostage to pressure their husbands to turn themselves in.
In Stalinist Russia, the secret police seized the innocent wives of suspected dissidents and held the women hostage to pressure their husbands to turn themselves in.

After 9/11 National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice and V.P. Cheney coined a new phrase: America was now on a permanent “war footing” but we were not actually at war.
Nazi leaders said after the Reichstag fire that Germany was now on a “war footing” but were not actually at war. But would remain pertinently on a “war footing”

The Bush White House “embedded” reporters with U.S. Military units in Iraq. Uncritical coverage of the war expanded considerably.
Nazi propaganda officials embedded reporters and camera crews with their armed forces. U.S reporters drove with German units into France.

The Bush administration unloads coffins of dead American soldiers from planes at night and has forbidden photographs being taken of them.
The Nazi's unloaded the coffins of German military dead only at night and no photographs were allowed.

Paid informants having received hundreds of thousands of dollars found a “sleeper cell” in Lodi, California. The two men explained later that they had confessed to the imaginary “sleeper cell” to end the terrifying series of interrogations.

“Sleeper cell” was a term most Americans were unfamiliar with until a TV movie in 2005 Making sure the general population were alerted to the threat made everyone suspicious,
Stalin invented “Sleeper cells” and had paid informants find them among the general public. Stalin said that the US Government was planting the sleepers so that one day they could all rise up and create mayhem

In 2006 a terrorist plot against US bound planes uncovered in London gave the world a much quoted sound bite. “If this had actually happened the world would have stood still”
In 1940 after Hitler had set up his plan for world domination said that if everything happens as planned “the world will hold it's breath”

At first the only people held at Guantanamo Cuba were brown skinned foreigners, in October 2006 that changed and white English speaking prisoners began to appear. They had been charged with treason, espionage, subversion and aiding the enemy. Enemies of the State.
At first the Germans arrested only the Communists and criminals and enemies of the state and placed them in concentration camps. But is was not long before he turned his attention to a group long held as potential spy's and subversives the Jews. Enemies of the State.


2007 Bush had started to criminalize speech in new ways. Journalists who write articles criticizing the Bush Administration are being arrested and released after a warning, editors are being treated the same way. Journalists are subject to arrest, torture, and trial by tribunal outside judicial system
1938 Germany started to crack down on anyone who did not agree with the Nazi philosophy. Journalists were arrested and released after a warning, editors were treated the same way. Anyone criticizing the Nazi party or any official of the party was subject to arrest, torture, and trial not in a German court but by tribunal outside the normal judicial system

2006 Bush administration passed a bill to setup Military Tribunal Courts. This gives the leaders of the Bush administration the authority to establish a separate justice system without the right to due process, a lawyer, or a trail in the normal court system.
1937 The Nazi's passed a law and setup Military Tribunal Courts. This gave the Leaders of the Nazi Party the authority to establish a separate justice system without the right to due process, a lawyer, or a trail in the normal court system.

[Wizard777]

19. We've pushed for the government to legalize marijuana. They legalized treason instead.

But what would you expect from something that began with the war on drugs? A Constitutionally defined act of treason. "It won't be a real war," said Ronald Reagan. The Geneva Convention makes provisions for that war that is not recognized as a war. Now the republicans have managed to legalize their treason against the US Constitution and We The People.


"The war on terrorism will be a lot like the war on drugs."
George Bush's 9/11 Speech.

[nachoproblem]

21. Nazis don't get an apostrophe

Not an important point, but I refuse to give them anything unless I have to. ;)

[peacetalksforall]

18. I think it's time to figure out how we are going to communicate.

[nachoproblem]

20. Can this be verified?

If this is true, why aren't the people taking to the streets with guns RIGHT NOW?

(Oh yeah, because all the people who have guns are intent on taking away all our OTHER rights.)

But seriously, does anybody know if this is a real fact? This can't go unnoticed and unanswered, if it is. And if it is true and it does go unnoticed and unanswered, the sky really is falling. God damn it.

[soulcore]

22. It is indeed real.

Linkie poo - http://www.democracynow.org/2008/9/22/headlines#10

[Porschenut1066]

23. It is TRUE.

Yes this is true but hard to believe. Also this administration has one of the largest private armies in the world. It is called Blackwater. These forces are above the law, so when they shoot someone they cannot be prosecuted because the company is an Iraqi contractor. They were used in New Orleans and some folks got shot. They went to the police and were told that there was nothing they could do about it! Blackwater has it appears about 150,000 men under arms currently. They just acquired some attack helicopters and of course you know that the Texas National Guard purchased from the Federal Government 200 A1M1 Heavy battle Tanks.

Did you see the "police" at the RNC. They wore no identification on their uniforms since a number of them were Blackwater practicing for I guess what is to come. Check out the "Democracy Now" website and see the "police" arresting journalists and camera crews who were only recording what was happening.

[nachoproblem]

25. I knew that Blackwater is above the law in Iraq

I did not know that they were operating in New Orleans, or under the same kind of immunity. You heard jack about it in the MSM of course.

Time to make as much noise as we can while it is still physically possible.

[sabrina 1]

27. First they came for the Iraqis n/t

[Joe Chi Minh]

32. Probably, it wouldn't even be a civil-war, technically:

Don't Blackwater employ lots of foreign mercenaries at knockdown rates?

[MadrasT]

40. It's a real fact. Here's the Army Times story

http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/09/army_homeland_090708w/

[bdamomma]

54. I just sent this article to Rachel Maddow

maybe she could investigate this.

[Forrest Greene]

45. We've Got Bigger Problems Right Now

...than your damn pet guns.

[dgibby]

67. Ha! I wish that were true, but

it's all tied together. Time to dust off the old PNAC primer!

[nachoproblem]

69. I don't have a pet gun.

Too much responsibility. And I hate cleaning up after them.

[dgibby]

92. nevermind what it costs to feed them!

[SteveM]

74. 'Revere-riding, he warns of fascism, yet calls for gun control'

Maybe fascism isn't that big a threat if some folks feel it necessary to restrict gun ownership to the powers which threaten fascism.

[nachoproblem]

86. What am I saying here that's so objectionable?

That guns should only be permitted to the people who oppose fascism, or that the people who oppose fascism should be restricted from having the guns?

Or did somebody else say one of those?

Because I don't recall seeing either of them.

[SteveM]

105. Do you have the right post?

[SteveM]

75. "Rever-riding, he warns of fascism, yet demands gun control"...

Fascism must not be that big a threat if folks see it coming, yet favor giving government the power to restrict gun ownership.

[SteveM]

73. Ah, yes, another poor citizen waiting for armed fellow-citizens...

This is another legend in the long mythology of gun-control:

"If this is true, why aren't the people taking to the streets with guns RIGHT NOW?"

Armed citizens are no more informed (lest they be accused of "militia paranoids") of the true extend of BushCo's authoritarianism than the average unarmed citizen; yet you seem to imbue folks with gun with a mysterious power to see the truth -- and to act accordingly.

"But seriously, does anybody know if this is a real fact? This can't go unnoticed and unanswered, if it is. And if it is true and it does go unnoticed and unanswered, the sky really is falling. God damn it."

Well, you do entertain the possibility after all. I can only speak to Goodman's remarks, which are sufficient cause for at least a crack in the sky. This action CLEARLY supersedes the posse comitatus acts, and is designed to quash active and effective dissent (I mean, why would anyone be concerned about dissent which was meaningless?).

"(Oh yeah, because all the people who have guns are intent on taking away all our OTHER rights.)"

Assuming you are not facetious, this is a fine way to categorize some 75,000,000 fellow citizens (many millions left-of-center Democrats).

[nachoproblem]

84. Why would you assume I'm not being facetious?

And, was I unfairly stereotyping 75m gun-owning citizens by imbuing them with a mysterious power to see truth, or with something else?

Or was I merely pointing out the irony that people who consider their right to own guns to be a thin but vital last line of defense against fascism haven't made a peep about the fascism yet?

I've quite lost track.

[SteveM]

106. Concerning the "irony:"

Why should any group of people have inordinate knowledge of rising fascism and then act against it? There are women who think their right-to-choose is in serious jeopardy (I agree), but have not shown a particular interest in defending against fascism. There are folks who have been denied 4th Amendment search & seizure protections in drug busts, but have not shown a particular interest in defending against fascism.

And there are people who see the rise of fascism, yet still advocate gun-control. An absolutely stunning irony.

Does this help? A few months ago, some of the gun-controllers who post here started this kind of argument: "Why are gun-owners not stopping the rise of fascism in the U.S.?" Usually, the argument is followed by: "They don't seem to care about any of the other rights as long as they have guns." Some posters even suggested that gun-owners should be out in the street NOW stopping the rise of fascism (as if they were suddenly charged by gun-controllers with a "proper" use of firearms).

EVERYONE is charged with stopping the rise of fascism in the U.S. Gun-ownership confers no more (or less) responsibility in achieving this aim. I'm not trying to be combative, here.

A computer glitch caused a double posting of the "quote" about fascism.

[nachoproblem]

110. Why indeed?

"Why should any group of people have inordinate knowledge of rising fascism and then act against it? "

Beats the hell out of me. But there are those who claim to, or claim that their having guns somehow puts them in that category, or in some cases even claim to be the last line of defense against fascism, and have damn all to show for it. I was mocking them. I don't think that applies to you.

Let me be blunt then. You pulled an argument about gun control out of nowhere. I never brought up gun control, and I'm not even for it in particular. If you actually read what I posted, yes, I made a gross generalization about gun owners, but a statement about gun control would read more like... oh, I don't know... "people shouldn't have guns." If you saw that in there... well damn, you may not be combative, but you're not especially rational either. Or maybe you're just sensitive. If you're a gun owner on DU, I can't really blame you.

In any case I was trying to ask a serious question about the topic, with some basically irrelevant joke about gun nuts (see paragraph 2 for definition of gun nut) thrown in. It was not my intent to advocate gun control. But frankly, I don't apologize for every joke I make that goes wrong. Shit happens.

[SteveM]

111. All of us have different threshholds for catching "jokes"...

let's just let it drop. No one is calling for an apology (maybe a better punchline).

Having been accused of insensitivity before, I'll take the "sensitivity" description as a compliment! And rational? Who needs that if the first three letters are R-A-T? (Ba-da-boom)

[nachoproblem]

87. Can this be verified? (EDITED)

FOR THE CONTEXT-IMPAIRED:
-------------------------

If this is true, why aren't the people taking to the streets with guns RIGHT NOW? <--- FACETIOUS

(Oh yeah, because all the people who have guns are intent on taking away all our OTHER rights.) <--- FACETIOUS

*** "But seriously," *** does anybody know if this is a real fact? This can't go unnoticed and unanswered, if it is. And if it is true and it does go unnoticed and unanswered, the sky really is falling. God damn it.

[LaPera]

30. We truly live in a corporate fascist country...it's real and will progressively get worse quickly.

They want control of all the money and want us to work for as little as possible, work for free if they can get away with it and you better not utter a word of protest or rock the boat....

Who here thinks they won't steal the election again?

All those massive prisons Cheney's Halliburton built were not built for nothing. Pay attention....Corporations running wild in complete control as they are now with little or no regulations.... will only want more & more and must suppress the people more & more.

The republicans support corporate rule....that's what their ideology is all about.

[dgibby]

43. Not surprising, considering

that Dubya's grandfather, Prescott Bush and a group of other well known businessmen were Nazi sympathizers who tried to get Gen Smedley Butler to help overthrow FDR. Google: Bush Crime Family

[Yes We Did]

31. I am truly terrified now.

What can we do?

[whistle]

44. Will these be mostly Blackwater commandos and other private army personel

...under the command of our military I wonder?

The "unruly crowds" and "dangerous individuals" would consist of who exactly. College students? Protestors? Demonstrators? Riots like those of the 1968 Federal election?

Why would the government suspect such dangerous events now given that no violent demonstrations have appeared at anytime during the past decade has there?

[dgibby]

93. All of the above?

[Porschenut1066]

99. Blackwater is not under the command of the Military at all!!!!

Blackwater does not come under the command of the military at all. They are a private army (the largest and most powerful in the world) and they work directly for the White House currently. Although their CEO said on TV that they will work for anyone who can pay their price.
I wonder if $700 Billion dollars would be enough to hire them to help the neocons take over America.

[dgibby]

103. Thanks

I was trying to be sarcastic, but forgot the add :sarcasm: My Bad!:hi:

[chupacabranation]

47. How do we get this...

...on the news?

...how do we get the Democratic campaign aware of this?

[valerief]

48. They're aware. Industry owns the news programs on the airwaves. They own them, too.

[SteveM]

76. My bet is that MSM and DNC will NOT deal with this --

There are three topics MSM won't deal with in a forthright manner:
(1) U.S. military intervention (including slap downs of domestic criticism)
(2) War on Drugs, Inc.
(3) War on guns.

The DNC aligns with the above once more powerful individuals & institutions frame the issues.

[Porschenut1066]

100. To get it on the NEWS

Simple really, become a huge corporation and then buy most of the media outlets and then that's it.

Of course you remember Fox News was taken to court about a story they ran and in court they said
"We consider the NEWS to be entertainment and as such it is fantasy and does not need to reflect
what is actually happening in the real world. We have script writers just like most entertainment shows"

[SDFalconer]

53. I wonder what they expect is going to happen???

Unruly crowds when they try to steal this election too?
:sarcasm:

[Az_lefty]

55. Are they expecting riots when they steal the next election?

it's too easy to imagine this scenario playing out.

[dudewheresmycountry]

56. Amy does what she does best

Amy is one of the best reporters, I have ever seen. She reports on thought provoking news, When her team was in danger, she dropped what she was doing and ran into the fire to save her partners, She demanded there release, and got arrested as well. My question to all of you would you be brave enough to do what she did... When she was released and her partners were released she went back into the fire to report on and confront the unjust that was done... Amy is a hero in my world......

[colonel odis]

62. this is very, very, very serious and represents a total break with the past

ok. now i'm truly scared.

this is the beginning of the end, ladies and gentlemen.

[keepCAblue]

65. Martial law and now this, published today in SF Chronicle

DU link:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=4078078&mesg_id=4078078

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/09/24/MN9P133LEA.DTL

(09-23) 17:06 PDT SAN FRANCISCO -- The Bush administration has overturned a 22-year-old policy and now allows customs agents to seize, read and copy documents from travelers at airports and borders without suspicion of wrongdoing, civil rights lawyers in San Francisco said Tuesday in releasing records obtained in a lawsuit.

The records also indicate that the government gives customs agents unlimited authority to question travelers about their religious beliefs and political opinions, said lawyers from the Asian Law Caucus and the Electronic Frontier Foundation. They said they had asked the Department of Homeland Security for details of any policy that would guide or limit such questioning and received no reply.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/09/24/MN9P133LEA.DTL">Continued

[Blaze Diem]

71. They did it. Bit by bit, While the American public was busy voting their favorite

reality show contestant on or off, our great Nation was stolen out from under our feet.

Our trusted members of Congress knew.
People who would expose them were silenced.
Thought Control via Nazi radio and Nazi TV.

Pelosi knew.
And until the day I die, I will believe that New York/Sept 11, was as preplanned as the selection of GWBush.
Now they would like us to meet Sarah Palin.
We'll be seeing a lot of photo-ops of her in years to come.

--------------
Anyone name a couple of countries, slightly resembling the once great America, that some of us may consider moving to?
I am serious about this.
I don't have a passport, but I will be applying for one this week.
I do, however, expect to be detained for my political affiliation, as I attempt to board the first plane out of this broken Country should worse come to worse.
--------------

If DU & other sites like it suddenly disappear, "The website you are trying to access is No Longer Availible", I'll know its time to flee, and may powers greater than mankind be forever with us all.

[Porschenut1066]

101. I laid out exactly what this Bush Admin has been doing for years

I have laid out exactly what this Bush Admin has been doing for the past several years but I was always told
"If you don't like this country leave" WEll sorry about this I am American and was raised when this country was still
free and democratic. Anyway as a History buff I complied a list of actions that seem to mirror Nazi Germany from the 1930's
All of the entries are well documented but the reference pages were in excess of 6 pages long so did not include them but could if someone particularly needs them.

Mobs of young men dressed in identical shirts shouting outside a voting center in Florida to intimidate people to stop a recount.
Mobs of men dressed in identical shirts (brown shirts) stood near voting stations shouting and intimidating people.


Mobs of young republicans are organized by the National Party to make bonfires and burn CD's produced by the Dixie Chicks
Mobs of Brown shirts and Hitler Youth are organized by the Nazi Party to make bonfires and burn books written by those they disagreed with

Members of the Young republicans are shaming academics for saying something they disagreed about.
Members of the Nazi Party would shame academics for saying something they disagreed about.



The FBI being told to stop peace activists flying or boarding aircraft on orders of the White House.
The German authorities were instructed to stop peace activists and other “trouble makers” at airports.


When the US invaded Iraq V.P. Cheney asserted we would be “greeted as liberators”.
When the Nazi's invaded the Rhineland, Nazi propaganda asserted that they would be “greeted as liberators”


Bush Administration using phrases such as we will find terrorists “hiding in their spider-holes”
Nazi's would find their enemies “hiding in their spider-holes”


The Bush administration increased security restrictions at airports. Airport security guards were forcing passengers to drink their own breast milk. Others to drink baby formula in front of all the other passengers
One of Mussolini's intimidation tactics was to force citizens to drink body fluids and emetics in public. The Nazi's followed suit with breast milk and urine in front of the other passengers


2002 Bush created the “Department of Homeland Security” White house spokespeople started referring to the United States as the “homeland” for the first time in history instead of the nation or republic.
1930 Nazi propagandists started to refer to
Germany not as the Nation or Republic but rather “Der Heimat” - “the homeland” Deputy Fuhrer Rudolf Hess Formed a “Department of Homeland Security”


2001 USA Patriot Act let federal officials compel doctors to hand over confidential medical records without a warrant showing probable cause.
1930 German doctors were required to disclose citizens previously private medical records to the state.

2005 Guantanamo prisoners reported seeing the Koran being flushed down toilets.
1938 the Gestapo forced Jews to scrub out toilets with their sacred phylacteries, the tfillin.

Amnesty International reports US interrogators tormented prisoners by playing heavy metal at top volume day and night.
1938 the Gestapo interrogators tormented prisoners by playing music on the radio at top volume day and night.

Iraqi human rights group complained that in 2004 the US forces seized the innocent wives of suspected insurgents and held the women hostage to pressure their husbands to turn themselves in.
In Stalinist Russia, the secret police seized the innocent wives of suspected dissidents and held the women hostage to pressure their husbands to turn themselves in.

After 9/11 National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice and V.P. Cheney coined a new phrase: America was now on a permanent “war footing” but we were not actually at war.
Nazi leaders said after the Reichstag fire that Germany was now on a “war footing” but were not actually at war. But would remain pertinently on a “war footing”

The Bush White House “embedded” reporters with U.S. Military units in Iraq. Uncritical coverage of the war expanded considerably.
Nazi propaganda officials embedded reporters and camera crews with their armed forces. U.S reporters drove with German units into France.

The Bush administration unloads coffins of dead American soldiers from planes at night and has forbidden photographs being taken of them.
The Nazi's unloaded the coffins of German military dead only at night and no photographs were allowed.

Paid informants having received hundreds of thousands of dollars found a “sleeper cell” in Lodi, California. The two men explained later that they had confessed to the imaginary “sleeper cell” to end the terrifying series of interrogations.

“Sleeper cell” was a term most Americans were unfamiliar with until a TV movie in 2005 Making sure the general population were alerted to the threat made everyone suspicious,
Stalin invented “Sleeper cells” and had paid informants find them among the general public. Stalin said that the US Government was planting the sleepers so that one day they could all rise up and create mayhem

In 2006 a terrorist plot against US bound planes uncovered in London gave the world a much quoted sound bite. “If this had actually happened the world would have stood still”
In 1940 after Hitler had set up his plan for world domination said that if everything happens as planned “the world will hold it's breath”

At first the only people held at Guantanamo Cuba were brown skinned foreigners, in October 2006 that changed and white English speaking prisoners began to appear. They had been charged with treason, espionage, subversion and aiding the enemy. Enemies of the State.
At first the Germans arrested only the Communists and criminals and enemies of the state and placed them in concentration camps. But is was not long before he turned his attention to a group long held as potential spy's and subversives the Jews. Enemies of the State.


2007 Bush had started to criminalize speech in new ways. Journalists who write articles criticizing the Bush Administration are being arrested and released after a warning, editors are being treated the same way. Journalists are subject to arrest, torture, and trial by tribunal outside judicial system
1938 Germany started to crack down on anyone who did not agree with the Nazi philosophy. Journalists were arrested and released after a warning, editors were treated the same way. Anyone criticizing the Nazi party or any official of the party was subject to arrest, torture, and trial not in a German court but by tribunal outside the normal judicial system

2006 Bush administration passed a bill to setup Military Tribunal Courts. This gives the leaders of the Bush administration the authority to establish a separate justice system without the right to due process, a lawyer, or a trail in the normal court system.
1937 The Nazi's passed a law and setup Military Tribunal Courts. This gave the Leaders of the Nazi Party the authority to establish a separate justice system without the right to due process, a lawyer, or a trail in the normal court system.

[Blaze Diem]

66. And here's my take on all this: Same as I've held for some time.

They will NOT give up all they have achieved:

Oct.1st Convenient for the massive turnout expented in favor of Obama.
Great care to all those who will gather to protest problems at the polling booths.

-----------------
Lots of love for Palin on CNN this morn. Laura Bush passes the torch
from her husband to Palin, GOP's brightest & best I'm sure.
CNN also goes to Alaska to dispell those liberal rumors of troopergate, rape kit gate, banned bookgate, bridge to nowheregate the road to nowheregate, which as expected was NONE of Palin's fault.
Guess they put all the Palingates to rest.

Now on to the possible October Suprise.
McSame bows out and Palin, with certificate of completion in 'Presidentin for Dummies 101',
steps into the Presidential slot..who will she choose for her VP?

I would not put this past the Rovian bag of tricks.
Just saying..& judging by the way they've shoved Palin in our faces, sanitized her past, photo-opped her with world leaders (sans conversation). This is all too reminicent of Bush 2000. Every step of the way.
Nothing has changed and I really doubt they will simply hand over the power they have to anyone other than their own kind.
These people do not abide by the US Constitution and they certainly will not allow the part about the 'vote the people' to deter their march to the New World Order.

------------
Al Gore should have been our President, John Kerry should have been our President, and so should have Robert F Kennedy become our President.
Great men who had the best interests for the America we all know & love have been stopped short, and who were they replaced with?
And by whom?
Not the preferred and wiser man.
It continues today.

I have certain fears for the outcome of this election.
I can hope and pray that America can still be saved, and that our entire government has been not been tainted by corruption, to the point where our recovery is lost.

Blaze

[dgibby]

70. Ding, ding, ding! We have a winner!

Agreed. There ain't NOOOOOOOOO WAY IN HELL they'll give up power and slink back under their rocks. They've worked too hard to gain power, broken too many domestic and international laws, made themselves too legally vulnerable to give up power now. Bush WASN'T kidding when he said that it would be easier if we were a dictatorship as long as he was the dictator. Contrary to popular belief, he is NOT stupid, just evil and cunning. It's all smoke and mirrors. He ascribes to the theory that "perception is reality", that if we perceive him to be the village idiot, then we dismiss him, and he is free to proceed with his plans, unfettered. He has accomplished EVERYTHING he set out to do, including this latest Wall Street meltdown. It is all part of PNAC and the NWO. We have been SCREWED.:banghead: :grr:

[BrklynLiberal]

78. I wish I did not share those same exact fears....

:(

[abqmufc]

72. HR 6894

What adds more concern to this issue is the fact that the House passed HR 6894 last night at 10:43 PM EDT. The House suspended the rules to allow a vote despite not having a quorum. HR 6894 reauthorizes, for one year, the Defense Protecton Act of 1950. This Act is where Executive Order 10161. This is what sets up the right for martial law and who is in charge of the nation's resrouces under martial law.

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h110-6894

http://www.access.gpo.gov/uscode/title50a/50a_75_1_.html

http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=60772

[dgibby]

94. Thank you!

[BrklynLiberal]

77. and the icon of the coming regime is upon us...

Artwork by Zina Saunders

[Irish Girl]

79. and the stench keeps getting worse...

Bush's grandfather was a poor salesmen until the Bush Dynasty made their fortunes funding Hitler's Third Reich.

How Bush's grandfather helped Hitler's rise to power

The documents are housed at the Library of Congress in Washington and the National Archives at the University of Maryland.

... and Prescott Bush was directly involved in a fascist plot to overthrow FDR, before a very patriotic American named Smedley Butler blew the whole thing wide open. (Research into Prescott Bush, Smedley Butler, The Business Plot, and the McCormack-Dickstein Congressional Committee). Now Bush intends to deploy troops to our streets and has been quietly building FEMA Concentration Camps all over the place. (Research into "Rex 84")

The answers are right in front of us ad we have a responsibility to protect our Constitution and our children's future from these cockroaches. Please make this topic heard because time is running preciously short. The government has been infiltrated on every level by these corporate fascists.

[wundermaus]

82. So, the October Surprise is Oct. 1st?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWkWSLEW-Ds">

[Riverman]

88. Gee Any connection with the Facist Takeover of Wall Street?

Over the past thiry years raw Capital has sucked as much as they could from the world and US economy and is going down because there are few place/lands/people to pillage left. So, now they have to scare the population that only drastic measures are necessary to keep Americans safe, to protect us from things getting worse. Look for major scapgoating on the public airways. Build up to widepread war against "the enemy" who is destroying our culture and lifestyle. Read Naomi Wolfe's book and recent articles. When Big Capital and Big Government work in unison that is a definition of facism. Nothing New! In Germany the went thru hyper inflation - had to bring barrels of money to buy a loaf of bread- as the stories were told. Words were used as the first weapons used to stir up the true patriots to go after the subjects of those negative, put-down, blaming words. In Germany it was the jews and unionist and commies. Today, it is the "terrorist" - the hdden face of "them" and next it will be us alternate gender oriented people - gay, lesbian, bisexual, transgender (attacks long in the public domain - the ground has been already prepared), then it will be the government workers (started by Reagon and still used today - the republicans are blamming the Wall Street crash on those government agencies Fannie Mae and Feddie Mac run by the real demons - "democrats" advisors to Barrack Obama - of course they easily right off their own connections, advisors and lobbyist who have been the real thieves in this ecomnomic collapse. My dear black sisters and brothers - DUCK! Here it comes and what a big target they have now in our new emerging leader Mr. Obama! OMFG! (I was in high school and had great hopes until RFK was gunned down two months after another hero MLK was taken out five years after my first national hero JFK was killed.) Maybe Obama should suspend his campaign permanently. Why would he want to occupy the whitehouse when the chickens come home to roost? What courage he has for such a decent man! He and all of us - his multi-ethinic, moderate, liberal, progressive supporters will be painted as the cause of the Depression of 2010! My ironworker dad had me and my brothers and sister say prayers every night for President Kennedy. I know we will all

If McCain somehow wins - he will be dead is a few years as medical experts give him 2-4 yrs to live with the type of melonoma (cancer) that he has - four surgeries - he is not cured! Then Palin will step in with the entire NeoCon ganster mob pulling everyone of her strings and stage managing the Palin Presidency as they are now in the campaign - sell her image to the scared American families who have since lost their jobs, homes, investments, retirements and who will look for someone to rally around as she points those fingers at those who are too blame for the condition of our beloved America. Palin will give great speeches written by her for the ROVE/BUSH/CHENY team. My god we have not seen nothin' yet. We will pray for a return to the good old days of the Bush administration when we had some civil liberties, has an SUV, not too expensive gas and could get to the beach once in a while! Not anymore! The new global warming will be from the fires burning around the world engulfed in resource, water and food wars!

Somebody wake me up from this nightmare! Please!

[Blaze Diem]

96. Riverman, so very well said.

I've read your post 3 times, now.
I'm a bit teary eyed right now.
Robert Kennedy, John Kennedy, & of course the great Martin Luther King.
Role models for children and grown ups.

Barack Obama is of the same breed.

[iamthebandfanman]

95. to be honest, i hope they DO deploy after the elections

id hate to see anybody hurt...but...
if its one thing that gets other americans angry, its our army shooting at its citizens.

it wont be tolerated.

if they want a revolution, then go on pansys... fire the first shot.

itll be the last.

[daggahead]

98. So, will they be stationed ...

... around gated communities? Will these be the ones that round up civilians after Bush decides he wants to be the unelected president for life?

If Barack Obama wins, I have a very unsettling feeling that he will never serve a day. Bush will start something with Iran, or even possibly Pakistan, and declare Martial Law.

I just hope that these soldiers, made up of our sons, daughters, brothers and sisters, will protest using any force against us.

[SuckItTrebeck]

102. I have a feeling...

...that they will.

At least the ones I know will.

[one-eyed fat man]

104. tin foil hat too tight?

The sinister characterizations would be more believable if the Army wasn't made up of your fellow citizens. "Operation Garden Plot" contingency plans for domestic disturbance operations were in the OD's and CQ's instruction books since the days of CONARC, STRAC units and Nike missile batteries around major US cities. (If you don't have sufficient military experience to understand the jargon, ask a male relative old enough to remember the draft.) As a career NCO I was well aware of "Posse Comitatus" and its importance and relevance.

The Army has had domestic emergency missions since the Posse Comitatus Act of 1871. A few quick examples come to mind. The Commander of the Presidio dispatched troops during the 1906 San Francisco earthquake. The commander of the garrison at Fort Knox sent troops to Louisville during the 1937 flood.

Domestic unrest? Remember in 1957 when, in defiance of a Federal Court order, the governor of Arkansas ordered the Arkansas National Guard to keep the black students out of Little Rock High School. President Eisenhower responded by sending troops from the 101st Airborne to Little Rock with orders to protect the nine students. This marked the first time since Reconstruction that federal troops were sent to the South. And it wasn't the last time Federal troops had to be used to protect black schoolchildren from "unruly white mobs."

Having spent most of my adult life as a soldier I really appreciate the Founding Fathers' distrust of standing Armies. The concept of citizen-soldier as a safeguard from tyranny was a concept they grasped firmly. Once there is segment of the population that feels they are "too good" to serve in the military, the military will no longer represent them. Once that happens it is easier to get the military to adopt an "us" and "them" attitude.

If you want to know how dangerous that can get, consider this:

In May of 1970 I was a tank commander in the 2nd Bn, 34th Armor about 30 miles inside Cambodia when we heard news of Kent State on Armed Forces radio. We had a typical mix of regulars and draftees in the company, 3 of the crew on my tank were from Ohio. As we got more news over the next days, our discussions of the incident did not revolve around the ethical questions of the Ohio Guard firing on its own citizens but Guard's dismal marksmanship that so few people were hit for the ammunition expended.

If your core beliefs are that military service is only for some nebulous knuckle-dragging serf class than perhaps fear of vengeful servants is warranted. By subjecting soldiers to scorn and alienation from the 'civil' society they will form allegiances to their buddies and their units. The society that disdains military service and is contemptible of its "mercenaries" should not be surprised if an army is no longer interested in protecting them.

[trthnd4jstc]

107. Wow! Bush Truly Is A Fascist. What is Strange is that The Army would probably be superior to

The cops in St. Paul during the RNC.

[SteveM]

109. Don't know, but I see your point (nt)

[MetaTrope]

112. Is there an MSM link for this story ANYWHERE?!

I can't even find the Army Times article being cited.

Edit: Nevermind, found it here http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/09/army_homeland_090708w/

[one-eyed fat man]

113. I was just on Fort Knox this morning

Troops still marching to class at the Armor School. Tanks still in the motor park. Stockade still pretty much empty.

Didn't see a single "Code Pinker" being dragged down Eisenhower Avenue.

Where are the guys with fixed bayonets coming to drag us all away?

[one-eyed fat man]

114. where are they?

y'all told me Martial Law was coming a week and a half ago???

I think I'll go the the machinegun shoot at Knob Creek tomorrow. Surely that must qualify as an unruly mob and it's just on the northside of Fort Knox military reservation. That way the Army won't have far to go to come get everyone.