Chertoff Gets Pounded With 9/11 Questions By C-SPAN Callers

[jakeXT]

Run time: 07:49 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KT5JZVUKPrs   Posted on YouTube: September 18, 2009 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: September 18, 2009 By DU Member: jakeXT Views on DU: 3617

 

[tnlurker]

1. I'll watch this at home

[JDPriestly]

2. Chertoff suggests establishing more surveillance within the U.S.

Our Constitution guarantees rights that, summed up, give us a right to privacy that is incompatible with the degree of surveillance that he seems to be suggesting. Chertoff needs to rethink his proposal, vague as it is. It is unacceptable. Without of association, communication, speech and movement, our democracy is a sham.

As annoying as the Tea-Baggers may be to us, as dangerous as a few of them may be, they have the right to organize. If they commit a crime, they may be investigated and arrested. But until that time, as long as they are just talking, the government has no right to investigate them and treat them as suspects. There are no suspects until a crime has been committed.

We have the right to the same freedoms. That is why our movement stresses and is committed to non-violence. The government has been known to investigate Quakers under the guise of seeking terrorists. Quakers are by definition non-violent. Government investigations of groups that are advocating and living their commitment to non-violence is wrong and violates the Constitution.

Our Constitution permits the reasonable regulation of our rights, but the government does not have the authority to set aside our rights without cause.

The men who wrote our Constitution and who signed the Declaration of Independence were unafraid. They did not write the Constitution for a nation of fearful people. Let's cut out the constant paranoia.

[Bolo Boffin]

3. We have different definitions of pounded.

Chertoff looks like the adult, and the 9/11 CT advocates look like kids pounding sand.

[frog92969]

7. Chertoff looks like a tool

Spinning and brushing off the real issues,
much like it's done here.

Do you believe that was the first he heard of
the $2T Pentagon theft?

[elias7]

17. Can't give it up, can you?

Frame it how you will; there's too many smart non-conspiracy type people who disbelieve the OCT for you to be so contemptuous.

You could break away from the 9/11 forum. I certainly don't want to belittle those I might deem obsessed.

[spiritual_gunfighter]

4. I am personally not sure if our own government orchestrated

and carried out the 9/11 attacks. I think there are a lot of unresolved questions and I really don't believe much of what the Bush administration told us about it. But I do love seeing Skeletor squirm.

[Hyper_Eye]

5. Sorry but I have to call em like I see em. These people are crackpots.

Chertoff hit the nail on the head. These people are as crazy as those that believe Barack Obama was born in Kenya or that the holocaust was fabricated. They believe 9/11 was orchestrated by the U.S. government in the face of overwhelming evidence that the attack was perpetrated by foreign terrorists. I have watched the videos and they selectively present evidence. The vast majority of that evidence consists of outright lies, misconceptions, and it is paper thin. But because their videos have scary music throughout and so-called experts share their "knowledge" it must be credible. And, of course, the government has to be lying to us and these couple of individuals are the truth seekers. It is fear-mongering bullshit.

9/11 was an attack on this country by an extreme group of radical terrorists. The attack was a surprise to our government. That doesn't mean it should have been. Had they handled the intelligence properly they may have been able to stop the attack. The governments crime in that attack was, at worst, negligence. The response from Homeland Security and the FBI to these crackpot conspiracy theorists is the right response. They should hang up and not wast time with that kind of nonsense.

It disturbs me that so many people fall into this kind of radical thinking. The same people that fall for this shit fall for the Skull and Bones crap or the lizard people and they consist of the birthers, the anarchists, the "sovereigns", the revolutionaries, etc. It was bad enough when Bush was in office and I hate to say that a lot of liberals believe this nonsense. But since Obama has come into office this stuff has gone wild and it has gone mainstream. People are losing it. Alex Jones is all over the place.

No I didn't just blow off the 9/11 conspiracies outright. I have watched many videos, read many things, and looked at the evidence. The evidence is garbage and the evidence to the contrary is so strong that believers have to turn some amount of reception in their brain off to be believers. They latch onto anything, no matter how flimsy, that supports their theory and they consider any evidence to the contrary to be skeptical. They think they have something figured out that nobody else does... that everyone who believes the "official" story are blind. Really they are the idiots and they rightfully look like idiots to every sane person who has the unfortunate experience of witnessing their inane ramblings.

[Nostradammit]

6. Crackpots? Ummmmmmmmmmm...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/01/AR2006080101300.html


9/11 Panel Suspected Deception by Pentagon
Allegations Brought to Inspectors General



Some staff members and commissioners of the Sept. 11 panel concluded that the Pentagon's initial story of how it reacted to the 2001 terrorist attacks may have been part of a deliberate effort to mislead the commission and the public rather than a reflection of the fog of events on that day, according to sources involved in the debate.


<snip>

"I was shocked at how different the truth was from the way it was described," John Farmer, a former New Jersey attorney general who led the staff inquiry into events on Sept. 11, said in a recent interview. "The tapes told a radically different story from what had been told to us and the public for two years. . . . This is not spin. This is not true."

[frog92969]

8. That's the strategy don't you know

Kick the truth with jack boots before it can get up

[Mithreal]

14. Some of these folks have good intentions

I question hostility toward statements that Bush is more responsible.

Instead each party is expected to just shout down the doubts and outright suspicion among those who have already been marginalized by being labeled truthers. Only to Republicans does something like truth sound like a bad thing.

If the Obama admin wanted to assuage the worst fears then they could begin releasing information, right?

[Hyper_Eye]

10. Yes. Crackpots.

That report is about the reaction to the events that occurred and what the public was told about those actions. That is a long shot away from the government perpetrating the attacks. I even said in my post that the government may very well have been guilty of being negligent. I would say this is as true of their handling of the intelligence leading up to the attack as their response to the attack. They weren't prepared and they fucked up across the board. But the idea that the attack was planned and carried out within out own government is a crackpot conspiracy theory. How many people would it have taken for the government to pull off such an attack? How many people do you think could have direct knowledge of the murder of 3,000 of our own people and be silent about it? It is nonsense. Sorry.

[Qutzupalotl]

15. That's true of MIHOP but not LIHOP.

Only one person would be needed to Let It Happen On Purpose, provided that person was Dick Cheney.

Cheney learned of an impending attack from meetings with the CIA throughout the summer of 2001. He conveniently scheduled NORAD training exercises for the week of September 10th, which left the eastern seaboard vulnerable to attack.

That's all he really needed to do, besides keeping various players in the dark and dissuading congress from investigating the failures.

[eomer]

38. No, it's not true of MIHOP either.

A single CIA agent (employee or contractor) could have had a single conversation with one of the al Qaeda conspirators.

Or a small cell could have done the same. We know that Cheney had connections within CIA. It would have been extremely easy for him to be in communication with one agent acting alone or with an agent working within a small cell who then made a deal with one of the AQ conspirators.

So it is not true that MIHOP would take thousands of actors. This talking point is propagated broadly but is illogical and untrue.

[Qutzupalotl]

39. Wouldn't that make it LIHOP?

I thought LIHOP meant knowing Al Qaeda was going to attack and allowing it to happen. Isn't that what you're describing?

MIHOP, as I understand it, includes things like remote controlled planes and a missile hitting the Pentagon -- although I realize that these scenarios could be from agent provocateurs muddying the waters. There's a lot of that, hence the dungeon.

[eomer]

41. That doesn't make any sense. It would be MIHOP if they made it happen.

Even if it's not one of the scenarios commonly discussed; still, if they made it happen then they made it happen.

[Qutzupalotl]

42. Then what do you think LIHOP means?

I think it covers exactly what you described.

On edit: Remember, both terms mean "on purpose".

[eomer]

44. It means "let it", of course.

So if someone took any action that was intended to cause it to happen, to instigate it, then they "made it happen".

Only if they merely neglected to prevent it did they "let it happen".

An agent giving the idea to AQ would obviously fall in the "made it happen" category. It is clearly more than just neglecting to prevent.

[Mithreal]

18. Wake up. How many people died as a result of shoddy health care

only this year? Who is screaming holy hell about that? 45,00 die from lack of health care, over 195,000 from medical errors every year. Think they could do that without a large criminal conspiracy? They seem to keep that pretty quiet.

[Hyper_Eye]

23. This is completely different.

There is overwhelming evidence that this is true! And there is no conspiracy as to how it came about. You can easily follow the path of the growth of the health care industry, deregulation, and legislation (or lack thereof) that has allowed this to happen.

[Mithreal]

26. I was addressing the idea that the "murder of 3,000 of our own people"

could go on without anyone raising hell or it being stopped.

When money is involved, and I mean large amounts, people are willing to kill fellow Americans.

Where are all the Health Care exec whistleblowers? Surely some must have a conscience, right?

There are sociopaths in this country and we had one crowned President by the Supreme Court and stolen elections.

There are whistleblowers in the intelligence community that want to speak out but they have ZERO protection. Care to explain to me why Congress cannot pass whistleblower protections for them?

[Mithreal]

9. I'm agnostic on it, but the strong denial by some is disturbing.

You don't know everything about what happened that day and the investigation was meager and a white wash.

Did you see the recent video where Rummy slips that the one plane was shot down?

[Hyper_Eye]

12. That is exactly the kind of crap conspiracy theorists grab on to.

The man slips up and says a plane was shot down and that must be the truth. It is always the things people slip up and say that are true. I know I have personally been talking on subjects and accidentally said something I didn't mean or contrary to what I meant on many occasions. That is human error. You correct yourself and move on and people understand because it happens to everyone. That slip up by Rumsfeld means nothing. It might seem important when played two or three times over with scary music playing on top of it but that doesn't make it anymore significant than it actually is. You take a bunch of small incidental things like this and string them together with scary music, an intellectual sounding narrator, "expert" commentators, and zoomed in video tape... bam! you have a 9/11 truth video!

I do not know every detail of every little thing that happened on 9/11 but I know that there is overwhelming evidence that what we saw is actually what happened and that most of what 9/11 truthers believe is easily debunked.

This site is about Democratic politics. These conspiracies shouldn't get a platform here.

[Mithreal]

16. I never saw it played with scary music, just the raw video.

Why is it necessary to string together things to have doubts?

I get it, you do not want money spent on further investigation and hope that the truthers will all just go away, no?

No, the site is about Progressive politics and criminal conspiracies are very much a part of latest breaking news often. Do you not believe in criminal conspiracies? The Supreme Court sure does and our other courts would save a lot of time if you were right.

[Hyper_Eye]

20. Sure. I believe it is possible that some conspiracies are true.

And I don't doubt there are still things to be discovered about 9/11. But you can't point your finger at someone and say they killed 3,000 people or are responsible for the death of 3,000 people without proof. There has been no credible proof towards that end thus far. It pisses us off that people claim Barack Obama wants to kill grandmothers with no evidence to back up the claim and I find it just as offensive to say Cheney is responsible for 3,000 American deaths without evidence. You can point out his responsibility in the death of Iraqis or the torture of prisoners because there is evidence of that. I also have no problem with people researching the facts of 9/11 just as I have already admitted to doing. I have a problem with unsubstantiated conspiracy. I especially have a problem with it when it is about such an important and catastrophic event. Get some real evidence that actually proves something and then start spouting this shit. Until then it is nothing more than shit.

[Mithreal]

24. I am not spouting shit. I said I was agnostic.

I do agree that an illegal war that killed over a million and refugeed more than 2 million is a real charge that the Bush administration should be held accountable for and we don't need to go looking hard elsewhere to know that they are criminals.

Since you agree that there is much that we don't know and the investigation was a white wash, why such angry words toward doubters?

[Hyper_Eye]

27. First, I didn't say you were spouting shit.

I said the theory is shit. Second, my problem with the "doubters" is that they are largely not doubters. They are strong believers. They believe without question that the facts of 9/11 are a lie and what they believe is right. They aren't looking for evidence to find the truth. They are looking for evidence to support their insane theories and anything to the contrary is questionable to them. When that ridiculous point-of-view is presented from this site they make this site look like a crackpot conspiracy site just like birther conspiracies make the Freepers look like crackpot conspiracy theorists (not that they need any help looking stupid.) They also make CSPAN look stupid.

I have no problem with you. You are open to evidence. That is different from being convinced by flimsy crap that couldn't pass for evidence in even the most kangaroo of courts and then trying to convince other people they are blind by not acknowledging that "evidence".

[Mithreal]

29. Gotcha, I misunderstood you.

The people who are absolutely sure they know what happened that day open themselves up to that kind of criticism.

I think there is a further distinction to be made between those people who have a gut feeling versus people who know they know if that makes any sense.

I feel similarly about people who believe there is a god without evidence. The truthers are not marching upon Washington like the birthers and deathers though. And the birthers and deathers have zero evidence that their suspicions are warranted. Otoh, truthers have plenty of questions that are not intellectually dishonest. I think they deserve to be heard and have their worst fears alleviated. It really would not be that hard to do. For example, images of that airliner that hit the Pentagon could be produced and we could knock down the related rumors effectively.

Honestly I don't follow what all the truthers are saying but I believe their intentions are for the most part not absurd.

[Mithreal]

31. Would be nice if OBL was actually charged for 9/11 attacks, no?

http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/fugitives/laden.htm

"But you can't point your finger at someone and say they killed 3,000 people or are responsible for the death of 3,000 people without proof."

Seems like that was done pretty effectively.

[bora13]

11. You can't call them and you definitely can't see them

[Hyper_Eye]

13. I am willing to bet many more people see them the way i do.

That is fine if they want to go on television and make fools of themselves. And it is fine if you want to support idiocy.

[Mithreal]

19. I think this is the closest you have gotten to the truth here.

Most people are unwilling to doubt or even consider the worst.

Sometimes common wisdom is wrong but I suspect we will never know who is right.

[irislake]

25. I am embarrassed to admit I am a crackpot..

Many of the 911 zealots are too willing to believe absurdities and I hate to be lumped with them. I am 71 and retired so have had lots of time to read most of the material and watch the videos.

(My kids say I don't have dimentia and agree with me that the official story STINKS TO HIGH HEAVEN.)

Alec Jones is a nut and does a lot of damage to those who question the official story. But check out the audiences OF David Griffin (A New Pearl Harbor etc) Mike Ruppert and the Architects. These events are put on at universities all over the world and are attended by intelligent people who would sooner die that be lumped in with the lizard bunch.

The ex-foreign ministers of Germany, Canada, and Britain have come out publically to say they think it was an inside job. Intelligence insiders in Italy. The Japanese Parliament doubts the official story. The NDP Party of Canada has dared to raise it in Parliament.

There is a stigma attached to admitting you believe it was an inside job. Critics attack your sanity and character, refusing to engage in serious debate about the official lies and discrepancies. It would be career suicide for many experts to side with the 911 truthers. Those who have done so are couragous. Few are nuts.

Probably the best experts on 911 are the Jersey widows who had to do so much arm twisting to get the 911 Commission. And that was an acknowledged farce and whitewash. Harpers Magazine was the first to come out and say so and there have been plenty of others, including some members of the panel, who say they were lied to.

I don't want to get into specifics. I just want to say it is very unfair to judge the movement on the noisy nuts. I have a post-graduate education and most of my friends are highly educated. Not one of us believes the official story. It's hard to believe you have seriously committed to reading all the well researched material that is out there.

Consider how many people there must be who KNOW the official story is a lie (or seriously doubt it) who simply cannot acknowledge it publically. It is politically incorrect to speak out and/or career suicide.

Over and over again nice sensible intelligent people are described as nuts and kooks for stating they believe it was an inside job. I really believe you are being very unfair to us.

You could start by learning more about the history of Al Quaeda the Pakistani ISI and CIA goings on.

In conclusion I can't believe any intelligent logical person who has researched the issues seriously believes it WASN'T an inside job!

[Mithreal]

32. Very well said. nt

[Junkdrawer]

35. +1

[Nostradammit]

37. Excellent post, irislake. Thank you.

:applause:

[mod mom]

47. Here's info the 1st caller asks-DoD Can't Acct for $2.3 Trillion (from CBS)

LOS ANGELES, Jan. 29, 2002
The War On Waste
Defense Department Cannot Account For 25% Of Funds — $2.3 Trillion

(CBS) On Sept. 10, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld declared war. Not on foreign terrorists, "the adversary's closer to home. It's the Pentagon bureaucracy," he said.

He said money wasted by the military poses a serious threat.

"In fact, it could be said it's a matter of life and death," he said.

Rumsfeld promised change but the next day – Sept. 11-- the world changed and in the rush to fund the war on terrorism, the war on waste seems to have been forgotten.

Just last week President Bush announced, "my 2003 budget calls for more than $48 billion in new defense spending."

More money for the Pentagon, CBS News Correspondent Vince Gonzales reports, while its own auditors admit the military cannot account for 25 percent of what it spends.

"According to some estimates we cannot track $2.3 trillion in transactions," Rumsfeld admitted.

$2.3 trillion — that's $8,000 for every man, woman and child in America. To understand how the Pentagon can lose track of trillions, consider the case of one military accountant who tried to find out what happened to a mere $300 million.

-snip

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/01/29/eveningnews/main325985.shtml

[mod mom]

48. Here's video of CBS coverage that Rumsfeld presented day before 9/11:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kpWqdPMjmo

[democrat0986]

21. Hypereye is right

you guys sound just like the obama birthers, and deathers. this whole idea is just as ludicrous as those conspiracy theories. if you really want to latch onto such nonsense, you might as well just go get a tinfoil hat.

[elias7]

33. How can you say irislake (post #25) sounds like a birther/deather?

That is an intellectually unrigorous statement, which quite frankly, is more worthy of the birthers and deathers type of reasoning than the crackpots who question some fundamental "truths" regarding 9/11 based on an inability to reconcile the facts.

BTW, I am one of those crackpots. Proud of it.

[Old and In the Way]

22. Lots of unanswered/unaddressed questions.

How about the money trail? The ISI and the SA prince funneling money to the hi-jackers? How does a $500BB+/year military not find/intercept flt 77 which flew into the Pentagon 45 minutes after 175 hit the WTC? Our CIA/FBI are the Keystone Kops tracking the whereabouts of the hijackers before 9/11, but have the complete story figured out within 24 hours? 3 among many unexplained questions.

[90-percent]

28. At the very least

Why the fuck do we spend so much on our glorious military industrial congressional complex if it cannot prevent an attack like this?

Why the fuck in our Government is there no one that even lost their fucking jobs as a result of 9/11?

Why did Bush not consider it necessary to have an investigation into 9/11 at all?

Why does the government not release so much info they have kept from us - like the surveillance tapes for the Pentagon? And how can they be organized enough to know where all the security cameras are near the Pentagon so as to scoff up all the tapes mere minutes after the plane crash? Is there an FBI guy assigned to scoff up tapes after any plane crashes in to any building?

The actions of our government fuels the CT movement. Almost like they are doing it on purpose.

Wasn't it Theodore White that said; "All governments lie."?

-90% Jimmy

[Mithreal]

30. Makes the doubters easily identifiable by web pages they visit, for example,

and keeps the population suspicious of the government, great for Republicans, and suspicious and hostile toward future Republican presidents, great for Democrats.

And other countries can be suspicious that America is willing to go bat shit crazy and still keep its empire intact and unchallenged and there is nothing that can be done to counter it in the short term.

Future criminal conspiracies can be handled the same way as the truther movement, easily marginalized even with all the arguments out there in the open. Want to bet the military isn't collecting valuable data on how to control a population by testing this movement and how effectively and easily truthers are marginalized?

[HughBeaumont]

36. That's the biggest Red Flag right there - the confiscated, never-seen-again security footage.

I mean, traders cannot this accurately predict the future on specifically doomed sectors/businesses. Whole governmental organizations trained to the Hilton for events like this just do NOT collectively fail this BADLY. Supposedly elected officials show emotion, concern and leadership in these happenings, not continually mug for photo-ops without a hint of Secret Service sweep. DC Airspace, let alone the heart of America's defense, doesn't go unprotected an HOUR after they KNEW planes were hijacked and crashed and two more were off flight paths.

But this one is massive.

What the usual ad-hominem masters don't get is that, like a poster above said, it doesn't really matter WHAT hit the Pentagon, it's that the Pentagon was hit PERIOD. Undefended. At least an HOUR after there were reported hijackings. At least 45-50 minutes after Flight 11 crashed. At least 40 minutes after Flight 175 crashed. And at least 37 minutes after the Pentagon was put on high alert.

Incompetence my ACE.

Show me the Pentagon security/gas station/hotel footage. Please. Shut me up. I mean, if it happened as they said it did, what's the inherent harm in just releasing it? Seriously. What's the problem? Why the cover-up? I mean, you all wouldn't be implying wrong-doing, would you? They want to shut everyone the hell up, just release the damned video. They want to provide closure to this tragedy/travesty, release the video.

[JohnyCanuck]

45. "All governments lie."

but, strangely enough, some people believer they should always get the benefit of the doubt anyway.

"We Americans are the ultimate innocents. We are forever desperate to believe that this time the government is telling us the truth." Columnist Sydney Schanberg, http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=2261

[HughBeaumont]

34. Sigh.

Complete 9-11 Timeline.

The Terror Timeline.

9-11: Press For Truth.

Timeline. Press For Truth. Read. Watch. All real, 100% documented events. No speculation, CD, missiles, drones, holograms, Rense, Alex Jones, aliens, etc. If after reading this one doesn't come away at least in the LIHOP camp, then I have ZERO hope.

DUer Warren Pease on how this Zelikow/Hamilton piece of crap fantasy was too, TOO improbable and coincidental to brush off as "we just got caught with our pants down. Nothing to see here."

[fubarsnafu]

40. Right on TRUTHERS!!!

Keep hammerin' away!

[JohnyCanuck]

43. Nothing new under the sun, including false flag ops.

You have to admit, they can be damned effective as long as the real perpetrators are successful in retaining their cover.

False flag operations

SNIP

And, as confirmed by a former Italian Prime Minister, an Italian judge, and the former head of Italian counterintelligence, NATO, with the help of the Pentagon and CIA, carried out terror bombings in Italy and blamed communists, in order to rally people’s support for their governments in Europe in their fight against communism. As one participant in this formerly-secret program stated: "You had to attack civilians, people, women, children, innocent people, unknown people far removed from any political game. The reason was quite simple. They were supposed to force these people, the Italian public, to turn to the state to ask for greater security."

Moreover, recently declassified U.S. Government documents show that in the 1960s, the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff signed off on a plan code-named Operation Northwoods to blow up American airplanes (using an elaborate plan involving the switching of airplanes), and also to commit terrorist acts on American soil, and then to blame it on the Cubans in order to justify an invasion of Cuba. The operation was not carried out only because the Kennedy administration refused to implement these Pentagon plans.

For lots more on the astonishing Operation Northwoods, see the ABC news report; the official declassified documents; and watch this interview with James Bamford, the former Washington Investigative Producer for ABC's World News Tonight with Peter Jennings. One quote from the Northwoods documents states: "A 'Remember the Maine' incident could be arranged: We could blow up a US ship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba. Casualty lists in US newspapers would cause a helpful wave of national indignation."

What about Al-Qaeda?

You might think Al-Qaeda is different. It is very powerful, organized, and out to get us, right? Consider this Los Angeles Times article, reviewing a BBC documentary entitled The Power of Nightmares, which shows that the threat from Al Qaeda has been vastly overblown (and see this article on who is behind the hype). And former National Security Adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski testified to the Senate that the war on terror is "a mythical historical narrative."

(Go to original for embedded links):
http://www.examiner.com/x-6495-US-Intelligence-Examiner~y2009m9d5-False-flag-operations

[JohnyCanuck]

46. salem-news.com: The 9/11 Commission Rejects own Report as Based on Government Lies

Gordon Duff Salem-News.com

(CINCINNATI, Ohio) - In John Farmer’s book: “The Ground Truth: The Story Behind America’s Defense on 9/11″, the author builds the inescapably convincing case that the official version... is almost entirely untrue...

The 9/11 Commission now tells us that the official version of 9/11 was based on false testimony and documents and is almost entirely untrue. The details of this massive cover-up are carefully outlined in a book by John Farmer, who was the Senior Counsel for the 9/11 Commission.

Farmer, Dean of Rutger Universities' School of Law and former Attorney General of New Jersey, was responsible for drafting the original flawed 9/11 report.

Does Farmer have cooperation and agreement from other members of the Commission? Yes. Did they say Bush ordered 9/11? No. Do they say that the 9/11 Commission was lied to by the FBI, CIA, Whitehouse and NORAD? Yes. Is there full documentary proof of this? Yes.

Farmer states...“at some level of the government, at some point in time…there was an agreement not to tell the truth about what happened... I was shocked at how different the truth was from the way it was described …. The tapes told a radically different story from what had been told to us and the public for two years. This is not spin.”

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/september112009/911_truth_9-11-09.php