Passengers on Detroit Flight Witness Accomplice and Passenger Video

[EmeraldCityGrl]

Run time: 08:23 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAtK7FFDukQ   Posted on YouTube: December 29, 2009 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: December 29, 2009 By DU Member: EmeraldCityGrl Views on DU: 9146

 
These passenger witnesses sound like rational people. There's much more to this story than we currently know.
Abdulmutallab, according to them, was accompanied to the gate by another man vouching for his lack of a passport.

This is very strange.

[pberq]

1. Kick and nominated

[leveymg]

2. Certainly seem sober and credible eyewitnesses. This is adding up to one big WTF?

If what these people are saying is true, this is very strange, indeed. Put the pieces together -- 1) the statement that the bomber had no passport, 2) the witnesses report he was given special handling to board the flight, 3) he wasn't searched, 4) the other passengers were allowed on with water bottles and without having their shoes X-rayed, 5) the bomber was named on a UK watch list that is shared with the US, 6) the US was warned weeks ago about this guy's ties to al-Qaeda -- and you appear to have another 9/11 type operation. And, I don't mean strictly an Al-Qaeda operation.

[Nothing Without Hope]

8. Good points. K & R

[zeemike]

17. Seems obvious to me that someone should look at the surveillance tapes

And talk to the ticket agent and the manager.
I wonder if they will and if we will ever hear of it.
And if it is a false flag operation the witnesses will never be talked to again and if they keep getting press they will be exposed to some shit slinging themselves.

[rury]

78. Probably U.S. neocons attempting to pull off

another inside job 911 attack and hoping to force President Obama to wage a perpetual war against "Islamic extremists" and "terrorism."

[Hello_Kitty]

3. No passport??!? eom

[RayStar]

15. No passport

I think it's a crock. Has his passport been recovered from the plane? That should dispel this story.

[peacetalksforall]

36. You are calling what the Haskell's said as a story - their story - as a made up story?

What about the other woman - do you think she made up a story about the filming?

You think this bomber had a passport?

What part of this video is a crock?

[JPZenger]

80. CNN: Scorched Balls Bomber Had a Passport and Checked Bag

http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/europe/12/30/airline.terror.schiphol/index.html?iref=allsearch

The initial information is often wrong. According to the latest CNN article, the scorched balls bomber did check in a bag and did have a passport. This article doesn't specifically say if he presented it, but he would have to be an idiot to not show a passport if he had one. (The bomber by the way was well educated).

[PDJane]

4. Smells like false flag ops.........a bit fishy.

[DJ13]

5. Same as I was thinking

Rogue elements with ties to the past administration?

[timeforpeace]

6. They only want us to think it was Muslim terrorists from Yemen. Good catch.

[Subdivisions]

11. Yes, isn't that convenient? In fact, there are two things that are very convenient

with this incident. The first is that the "bomb" was located in the dude's draws - hence the urgent need for those nekkid body scanners. The second is that we've already shot missiles at Yemen and you can bet they'll need to shoot some more. What better way to market an attack on Yemen than to suddenly have someone they can tie to al qaeda in Yemen come floating in on the wind? It's the Iraq playbook only this time it's terrorists from Yemen come to get us instead of WMDs in Iraq.

[timeforpeace]

14. Plus, it's Barack Obama instead of Bush. How fucked up is that?

[Skip Intro]

16. Didn't the guy reportedly say there are more like him in Yemen?

[Enthusiast]

35. Very suspicious to me. nt

[grahamhgreen]

66. +1, and they did not immediatly go after the Indian accomplice, there must be video of the two

Of them from Schipol, as well as something from when he got clearance from the bomber -WHO HAD NO PASSPORT!

[Subdivisions]

10. Yes, designed to take away more of our freedoms and to make someone rich

selling those perverted scanning machines.

[Change or Revolution]

21. RE: Getting rich off of scanning machines

I did a little research on this, and lo and behold...a major manufacturer of the ProVision body scanning machine is L-3 Communications, based in Canton, MA. Here is a brief description of them: L-3 Communications Corporation is a leading supplier of a broad range of products and services used in a substantial number of aerospace and defense platforms...need I say more? Here is a link to their product line: <http://www.l-3com.com/products-services/>

So now we've just enabled the profiteers to keep it rolling, once again on our backs and freedoms. What a country!

[Subdivisions]

42. Well, well, well...good catch! And welcome to DU! L-3 Communications

raises its ugly head again. I am not surprised in the least.

Edited to add: Make that a belated welcome. I just looked and see that you've been here for over a year. Not exactly burning up DU pixels are you? Welcome anyways =)!

[Holy Moly]

39. BEWARE OF KOOTIES!

ahem,
dear PDJANE,

Sounds to me like mebbe you're getting a bit
too close to the guys drawers for comfort..
and/or safety.
BEWARE OF KOOTIES!

[PDJane]

46. Well, that's clever repartée......

and it really says something. When I figure out what it is, I'll get back to you.

By the way, if you want to know how long and how often the US has used black ops and false flag terrorism, read Operation Gladio; Nato's Secret Armies. Or, better yet, watch the BBC documentary here: http://www.disclose.tv/action/viewvideo/27701/Operation_Gladio__Behind_False_Flag_Terrorism_1of3/

[fascisthunter]

81. thank you PDJane

[icee]

63. Yep. Although the bomber himself may have actually been

duped by the Indian guy or his contact. The party who planned the caper instructed whoever the airport contact was to let the bomber on the plane minus a passport. This makes the planner or implementer someone in or with elevated contacts to the US government. I'll quit bullshitting around.

I have always believed that 9-11 was planned by someone in the Bush administration to be carried out by designers in some terrorist organization. A black op. This Nigeria Underpants bomber was just another black op carried out by the Neocons to make Obama look bad so that they could ultimely regain power and continue their work. The planner was kind of stupid though, but then it really had no choice of bombers. It is much more important as to who the Indian man is than who the bomber is. The first question to the Indian man: Who do you work for? Then follow the money.

When the US is finally bombed into submission, it will be done with the consent of Republican Neocons.

[ArcticFox]

83. Neocons or Israel

Wasn't Lieberman spouting off about how we should be attacking Yemen recently?

[icee]

85. I would say the latter. They are guiding us into destruction. I

believe Israel has been the real Flag in many black ops. They know they can keep pushing until they have the right button. Then we'll go off and kill a bunch of poor helpless people to keep mama, Apple Pie, and Paris Hilton well. And while they do this, America becomes poorer, less moral and less desired as a world neighbor. We for some reason seem to not care if people like us, as long as they fear us. That trick don't work much anymore. Obama now owns one war...maybe two, and he's going into three. Wait until we attack Iran--or Israel does. Ain't gonna end up how either Israel or the US expects. You think the Na'vi was bad. Wait until the Iranians start shooting those new Shahab-5's, which they must have ten thousand of now. They'll blow enough ships up in the Strait of Hormuz to keep traffic snarled for months--no matter what the US military advisers (sic) say. But I diverge... Anyway, most of the major conflicts in the world have Israeli roots. And that's the way it is.

[Windy]

7. I've traveled out of Schipol in Amsterdam. My passport was checked when I picked up my ticket

at the first screening, at a secondary screening and then again, before boarded the plane to the US by customs agents. There is definately something rotten in Denmark here.

And what is the deal with the man and the video camera standing there calmly filming?

I don't want to put on the tin foil, but would Cheney go that far to expand the neo-con agenda?

Look at all the immediate whining from the right because Obama didn't fly home and didn't make a big deal out of it by playing the fear card...


Wow...just Wow

[Subdivisions]

13. "My friend is from Sudan. We do this all the time." ...

Code words? Hmmmm.... *rubs chin*

[CJCRANE]

34. I hope the NSA is wiretapping

Cheney and his associates. If they aren't they should be.

[pjt7]

48. Cheney & Rumsfield & others will NEVER stop

until there Dead. I really hope you understand this.

[sorcrow]

9. Indian Man?

That's an offensive assumption. How do we know this man was not Pakistani, Bangladeshi, Sri Lankan, or other south Asian? Are we gearing up to invade India now?
Crow

[Subdivisions]

12. Haskell has said elsewhere that it was someone that looked to him

like an Indian man but he was not certain. He wasn't trying to be a racist/bigot.

[Devil_Fish]

87. The correct terrm is Native American. Oh..... Wait..... Nevermind. NT

[EmeraldCityGrl]

18. I'm wondering if this is connected...

I was over at HP reading Roey Rosenblith's account of what happened. He was also a passenger on the plane, when I ran accros this statement.


"The only thing that I recall happening is seeing an Indian guy off to the side, an older gentleman wearing a gray suit leaning against the wall. Suddenly there was a police officer next to him pulling his arms back and pulling handcuffs on him. The man didn't struggle, the bags which seemed to be his were left there, and he and the police officer disappeared around the corner."

Apparently this happened after the passengers were off the plane and waiting for debriefing by security agents.

There's more to this story than what's being reported.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/roey-rosenblith/over-detroit-skies_b_404255.html

[WileEcoyote]

19. Great! Every time I put an Infowars report here

it gets panned and smeared because of the association with Alex Jones. Of course since I have less than 6oo posts the general clique must ignore everything I write...

That said: The best way to take down the corporate/war agenda is to support those elements attacking the Illuminati responsible for false flag ops, assassinations and media censorship/monopoly.

To the extent he does that Alex Jones is your friend. ditto Jesse Ventura. You may not like them today. But by next week or the very latest next year their concepts will ring true to you.


So why not stay ahead of the curve before it's too late? What else you got left to lose?

Here's a helpful hint: Describe how a fire crumbled this building here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LD06SAf0p9A

OK, now you're getting smarter!

[bertman]

25. It's not your post count, WileEcoyote. It's your handle. We're all roadrunners here.

B-)

Thanks for the link, but you're way behind schedule. We revisit that frequently. Stick around. You'll find out.

P.S. Watch out for that anvil, dewd!

[CrunchMaster]

30. Alex Jones is an agent of right wing to sandbag truth movement

I feel pretty sure he is involved knowingly or unknowingly with people purposely trying to corrupt the truth movement from within. Stop quoting him. If you find something interesting that he has brought up go to the root source of the information and post it. If there is no root source he is probably making it up. AJ freely associates with anti-semites, New World Order Paranoiacs, and other flakes. He collects good facts about 9/11 and then smears them by association with garbage. Cut this guy out of the loop by not quoting him. If he has said something factual you will be able to find a root source of what he said without quoting him. I believe he is a tool of the same far right wing foreign and domestic agents that allowed or made 9/11 to occur in order to advance geo-strategic reasons for war in the middle east. If Alex posts something interesting I go right back to where he got it from to confirm it.

[WileEcoyote]

31. I've had some of those thoughts myself

like "Why isn't he (Alex Jones) dead yet?" Because if he were a serious threat to the Illuminati he'd find himself in a steel drum at the bottom of the sea. Quick maybe.

But I'm not so sure about that. His clock is wrong at times but he's correct more often than not. And sure the anti global warmimg stuff is total B/S. As well as other concepts of his.

However I knew a good friend who ran a successful wind and solar device sale company. A mail order thing that survived the Reagan tax credit cutbacks. He too was one of those "End the United Nations" types. But this did not degrade his other good ideas.

In the mean time Jones is a mixed bag. Someone needs to say SOME of his ideas. He's a flawed character but a good debater. I'd keep him around as a check and balance on other talk shows.

[snot]

49. the point isn't that you shouldn't read him; it's that when you share the info

with others, you shouldn't quote Jones, but rather go back to the original source.

In this case, the original CNN footage, without Jones' logo all over it, would be a start.

[WileEcoyote]

50. Got it!

[snot]

71. thanks!

[colorado_ufo]

20. Makes no sense that this man got on the plane with a bomb.

A year ago I was flying home, in-state, from the State Fair. I was stopped in security, pulled aside, searched, and had my shoes, purse, ID - everything - confiscated. Why? Apparently, in visiting some of the animal exhibits, I had picked up some minute bits of manure on my shoes that had been embedded in the dust (I never entered any animal stalls). This set off some red flags for, I suppose, a ferilizer-type bomb. Eventually I was cleared and permitted to go on my flight, but I was terrified, especially when I realized that I had no identity left on me and no way to prove who I was. And I realized that, from this little small-town airport, I could have been "disappeared" and never heard from again by my family!

All this because I had some sh_t on my shoes, and this guy gets on a plane with a bomb strapped to him?

By the way, I now am certain only to wear new shoes when I travel and make sure that I do not wear them in any environment that could compromise them. And my friends do the same!

[EmeraldCityGrl]

24. What's frightening is,

that you, an American citizen, would be in a position to feel your very existence is in jeopardy
while doing nothing but traveling from one town to another. What has happened to us?

The culture of fear we are living in is nothing I could have imagined a few years ago.

[Hulk]

22. Again...if this jerk off boarded in Amsterdam....WHY...

..are we planning to increase OUR security to a higher lvl?? This just doesn't make sense. This butt head never should have been allowed to board the flight...buy a ticket, board without a passport. WTF is going on here??

Will we need to strip down next time an international airport lets something like this happen?? Holy shit. This is driving me nuts!

[CrunchMaster]

33. your answer: the world is crashing...they are trying to keep control using Terrorism to scare people

A mountain of lies and false flag terror has been piled up high by various nations in a world economic system teetering to the point of crashing and they need to keep the system under THEIR control... to keep the current "Gods" and "Kings" at the top of the pyramid by soaking up the dollars of everyone else on the bottom.... to keep the order of things as it is without allowing Kings and Serfs to swap positions... terrorism has been the mechanism of choice to keep people distracted while our current crop of Kings and Gods struggles to convince us how horrible it would be if we let them fall.



But the popular Zeitgeist has changed... and people aren't really buying it..hence the need to crank up the terror as reminder

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GumE7pMNRgM

[marshall]

47. All the security in the world does no good if the host countries don't cooperate

This guy was a walking red flag--one way ticket, no luggage, no passport, schleped past security with no checks. He would NEVER have been allowed even to the gate in a US airport.

[Andronex]

23. False Flag Operation

Who had the authority to let this passenger board without a passport, certainly not Al-queda...

[winyanstaz]

26. I will never fly again,.....

the thought of some little pervert locked in a dark room looking at naked bodies just doesnt make me feel safe.

[snot]

51. Personally, I find highly amusing the thought that it was conservatives' prudery

that prevented the more effective scanners from being put into place long ago.

I dont't know whether we need them or they'd be cost-effective, but I don't give a dam' if someone wants to scan what nature gave me.

[bertman]

27. Standing in the aisle calmly filming the incident. Ummm. Sounds like he wasn't worried

about the fire or the altercation. Wonder why?

Somebody should have asked Rochelle if the guy looked like Dick Cheney. (Just kiddin')

Lots of questions. Wonder if we'll get any answers?

Rec.

[robo50]

37. Very strange! Very strange!

He was the only one standing and filming the entire thing!

[Turborama]

41. He wasn't the only one filming and it's not really that strange, if you think about it

Lots of people take their video cameras onboard and if I had mine handy I would have been filming it too.

From last night's Larry King...

KEEPMAN: Well, as this was all going on, I just happened to look over and about ten seats ahead of me was -- to the left-hand side, was a man who had a camcorder and he was filming the entire thing. So it was definitely a little out of the ordinary. I mean, I don't know why he was standing up and we were supposed to be seated. And he was filming it.

CROWLEY: We ought to just tell everybody that Jeanne Meserve has reported tonight that the FBI says it has analyzed a number of videotapes that were shot by passengers on that flight. And none has proven particularly useful to the investigation. Nonetheless, there is a lot of commotion and someone is filming it. Although, in this day and age, I suppose we shouldn't be too surprised, since everything shows up somewhere eventually.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0912/29/lkl.01.html

[bertman]

62. I think you're right about that, Turborama. Oh well, so much for a good conspiracy angle.

[democracy1st]

28. K & R

[alp227]

29. Wow...is the National Enquirer driving the news coverage of this attack?

Of everything (the no-fly list, father alerting the State Department), this allegation that the attack was "staged" sounds so outrageous that only a tabloid editor who had drunken 50 bottles of liquor would approve of its publication. I can't believe that someone would have the heart to rig an extremely scary situation!

[Mithreal]

32. "Staged" is one of the lesser unbelievable possibilities.

[Turborama]

38. Sorry to burst everyone's bubble but this "story" has been thoroughly debunked

Here: http://boardingarea.com/blogs/flyingwithfish/2009/12/28/myth-flight-nw253-terrorist-boarded-the-flight-with-no-passport/

I always wondered how the Haskills could have heard the conversation so clearly and yet no-one else has come forward.

[proud2BlibKansan]

40. I have been saying this all along

It's such obvious bullshit. But even here on DU we get taken in with this story. :crazy:

This needs to be an OP, so I am posting it.

[Turborama]

43. Have you posted an OP?

If so, can you share the link please?

[proud2BlibKansan]

44. Sure

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7355353

[Turborama]

45. Thanks, I already found it and posted there

As I thought, the cognitive dissonance is strong. I wonder if they still believe in fairies, too.

[pjt7]

53. that's a pretty weak blog you linked

& it proves nothing.

A couple of serprate eyewitness have mentioned the Indian guy & that connection needs to be understood. The underwear kid bomber certainly had a handler. Al-Queda/CIA or whomever.

BTW anytime all the press talks about the same thing 24/7, I know there's a lot of BS involved.

[Turborama]

55. Attacking the blog as weak and saying "it proves nothing"

without actually coming back with any counter arguments against the facts that are laid out there is in and of itself "weak".


"A couple of serprate eyewitness have mentioned the Indian guy & that connection needs to be understood"

Who? Where's that been reported?

[pjt7]

58. On a very detailed Huffington Post blog

& the CNN interview.

Get real.

These people were on the plane, you're blogger wasn't.

[Turborama]

59. Link to the very detailed HuffPo blog with details on the "couple of serprate eyewitness", please

I am getting real. Just because they were on the plane doesn't exempt their story from close scrutiny. Again, no counter arguments against what was in the blog, just more weaksauce insinuation.

[snot]

54. Far from "debunking," your source is mostly irrelevant.

Most of it just says that letting him on board without a passport would have been against the rules. We knew that.

The only pertinent part is the statement that he HAD a valid passport -- that I'd be interested in knowing more about.

Also note, if the Haskells are attorneys, they'd have a lot to lose by making up such a story.

[Turborama]

56. "Mostly" "Most of it" What about these questions then?

"Most of it" does, apart from this bit...

- Airlines are required to transmit passenger lists to the United States prior to their departure, as per the TSA Secure Flight program
- Abdulmutallab would have been required to provide his passport number to the airline prior to receiving his boarding pass
- Passenger security screening at Schiphol Airport is conducted at the gate for all non-Schengen Flights, passengers must provide a passport and boarding pass to clear security

When you get off a plane you have to go through immigration and check out before you can check in, even when you're in transit. How could he have gone through immigration without a passport?



Also, why would they have been playing cards sitting on the floor within earshot of the check in counter? That would have been really close to the check in counter and, if the check in counter was open, they would have been queueing like everyone else.

[pjt7]

60. Turborama

Please read this detailed eyewtiness account & his refernce to the Indian.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/roey-rosenblith/over-detroit-skies_b_404255.html

"The only thing that I recall happening is seeing an Indian guy off to the side, an older gentleman wearing a gray suit leaning against the wall. Suddenly there was a police officer next to him pulling his arms back and pulling handcuffs on him. The man didn't struggle, the bags which seemed to be his were left there, and he and the police officer disappeared around the corner."

[Turborama]

67. Thanks for that article, it's an interesting account. However...

He refers to "an" Indian guy afer the incident, maybe not "the" Indian guy that has been mentioned before it. It is quite possible there was more than one "Indian guy" on that, or any other, flight. And this particular guy could have been handcuffed and taken away for anything. In that hightened security atmosphere they could have been whisking away anyone for questioning who fits into their "profile". I guess we'll never know because there's no reports of an "Indian guy" being charged with anything.

BTW Any answers to the questions I posited in the post you replied to?

[snot]

69. Re- the first 3,

you're just reciting the rules.

Re- the last, this is totally speculative. Many travelers (like me) don't bother queueing up 'til the last second. And I've sat on the floor in airports before, and see no reason why they couldn't have been sitting close to the check-in counter. Have you seen a lay-out of the check-in area?

I'm not trying to be contrary; I just don't find anything other than the statement that Abdulmutallab had a passport to be very compelling.

[Turborama]

75. The last one was about him having to go through immigration

This guy is saying the incident happened at the very last point they ask for your passport. He'd have to have shown his passport a couple of times before then, immigration/security being the most scrutinous ones.


As Mr Fischer said:

- Passenger security screening at Schiphol Airport is conducted at the gate for all non-Schengen Flights, passengers must provide a passport and boarding pass to clear security

[fascisthunter]

61. ok... a blog poster's opinion?

I'll take the word of the actual passengers over the blog you linked too. This is not a good source to rely on, the passengers/witnesses are.... your post is ridiculous.

[Turborama]

64. Another attack on the blog without refuting what's actually in it

That's what's "ridiculous".

[Andronex]

65. To the rescue of the official narrative...

...the damage control crew in full force. Do not question your leaders or their motives.

[fascisthunter]

76. yeah... well too bad for them

dishonesty just leads to more trouble for us all. Idiots playing political games further deteriorates our country.

[grahamhgreen]

68. Not even close to debunked - more like a bad cover up of an operation gone wrong!

[Turborama]

74. Yet more lameness

People constantly using ad hominems about the blog without even countering it is getting boring.

Here it is in its entirety so you can all pick it apart piece by piece...

Myth: Flight NW253 Terrorist Boarded The Flight With No Passport

12.28.2009 | Author: flyingfish | Posted in Uncategorized

28/12/2009 - Myth: Flight NW253 Terrorist Boarded The Flight With No Passport

Earlier today the Detroit News and New York Daily News reported that a couple, Kurt & Lori Haskell, of Newport, Michigan, both attorneys, witnessed Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab boarding Delta Flight 253, operated by Northwest Airlines without a passport at Amsterdam’s Schiphol Airport.

Kurt & Lori Haskell clam that Abdulmutallab, was ‘poorly dressed’ and was accompanied by a man dressed in an ‘expensive suit’ at the ticket counter. The Haskell’s have told reporters that the well dressed man asked that Abdulmutallab be allowed to board the flight without a passport, representing Abdulmutallab as a Sudanese refugee, stating “He’s from Sudan and we do this all the time.” The Haskell’s go on claim that Abdulmutallab and the man in the suit were turned over to a manager down a hallway and they didn’t see him again until he was on the plane.

This story is completely false on a number of levels.

We’ll start with the basics:

- Airlines are required to transmit passenger lists to the United States prior to their departure, as per the TSA Secure Flight program

- Abdulmutallab would have been required to provide his passport number to the airline prior to receiving his boarding pass

- Passenger security screening at Schiphol Airport is conducted at the gate for all non-Schengen Flights, passengers must provide a passport and boarding pass to clear security

Now onto to the not-so basic aspects of this story being completely false…

…entering the United States as a refugee falls under the US Citizen & Immigration Services Section 208 of the Immigration & Naturalization Act, as created in 1952

Under USCIS Section 208 Abdulmutallab would have been required to fill out substantial paperwork proving refugee status. This paperwork cannot be filled out the same day as a flight, and certainly not at the airport. Paperwork, like all governmental paperwork must be processed and proper documentation will then issued to the person seeking to enter the United States with refugee status.

If Abdulmutallab were seeking Asylum status in the United States, he would have been required to already be in the United States, with a legal entry, then beginning the asylum status process.

Airport and airline staff aren’t authorized to overrule United States immigration laws. Airlines are very careful about passports and visas, as any airline that transports a person to the United States (or any other country) without proper documentation is not only required to cover the costs of flying the person out of the United States for deportation, but also faces significant fines levied against them.

No airline wants to deal with deportation or fines.

All relevant information pertaining to the rules and regulations regarding USCIS Section 208, INA, have been verified with Chief Ron Smith of U.S. Customs and Border Protection in Washington, DC.

It has previously been established that Abdulmutallab held a Nigerian passport and a valid Visa to the United States issued in June 2008, valid through June 2010. With more than 6 months left on Abdulmutallab’s Visa to the United States his legal status to board the flight would not have been challenged by the airline.

As the facts surrounding Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab and Delta Air Lines Flight NW253 continue to unfold it is important to be factual on important issues, such as those pertaining to security issues.

This guy is trying to "cover it up"?

http://www.stevenfrischling.com/

Uhm, okay....

[grahamhgreen]

84. You want me to believe that the two lawyers are just making stuff up? There is a far higher

probability of a false flag attack than two lawyers, who just happened to be on the flight, would subsequently jeopardize their careers by making up a story about an international terrorist incident that they were eye witness to.

[Turborama]

89. He's blatantly contradicted himself (lied) and just been interviewed by Alex Jones

Of course, if you want to continue to believe him that's up to you.


But Haskell, who talked yesterday with the FBI, is sticking by his account.

"I never stated he didn't have a passport," he told MLive.com this morning. "I stated he was trying to board without a passport, what transpired after that I don't know" ...

From: http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2009/12/dutch_counter-terrorism_agency.html

What he said in the AC360 interview:

"And I could hear the entire conversation. The only person that spoke was the Indian man. And what he said was, this man needs to board the plane, but he doesn't have a passport. And the ticket agent responded, well, if he doesn't have a passport, he can't get on the plane, to which the Indian man responded back, he's from Sudan. We do this all the time.

And the ticket agent said, well, then, you will have to go and talk to my manager. And she directed them down a hallway. "

From: http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0912/28/acd.01.html

If you want to find the Alex Jones interview, Google "Flight 253 WITNESS Kurt Haskell & Alex Jones - No Passport, Bomber Had Inside Help1"

[grahamhgreen]

90. He has not contradicted himself in your example.

To clarify: it is not possible for him to know if the panty bomber had a passport. He is only recounting what he overheard said at the airport.

What do you do for a living?

[Turborama]

91. I don't "work for" anyone, what a stupid strawman ad-hom

If you can't see in the clearly highlighted quotes that he contradicted himself, you'll "believe" anything.

I just noticed your edit. You asked me, "who do you work for" and changed it to "what do you do for a living". Well, if you must know I'm an environmental consultant for hotels and a writer.

[go west young man]

96. If the bomber was allowed to board by our government wouldn't it

make sense that they provided the necessary documents for him to do so? Everything you've posted is contingent upon trust in the government. Our government could easily manipulate governments in Africa or Holland and provide the paperwork to back up the claims. The link to some random guys website does not proof make even if he took it from the TSA or State Dept it does not mean it applies if the government set out to go around their own rules. Hence the reason people refer to these things as conspiracies. The fellow at the link you posted has increased traffic to his site however. That's a fact. I wonder if he's selling many pictures with all the new traffic.

[Turborama]

97. You think the bomber was allowed to board the plane by Obama's administration?

"The link to some random guys website" contains statements/facts/laws that you fail to refute other than to say Africa and Holland were brought in on this conspiracy by President Obama's administration to bomb a plane flying in to America. That's not a refutation. That's just a loony conspiracy theory.



But, let's say (http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7376032&mesg_id=7376874">as I've suggested before) for the sake of argument, that he's right and some "Indian guy" (who wasn't on the flight but managed to get into the departure lounge) did say those things and the scene played out as Haskell described. So what? It would mean that the planners for this attack were even more sophisticated (or stupid) than we thought, that's all. This is where the Alex Jones-iness comes into play. To make this a conspiracy theory worth taking to Alex Jones, he lets Jones imply that the whole thing was an inside job and the "Indian guy" was some kind of CIA handler (as you also suggest).

Personally, I think that if they were that sophisticated and could get the terrorist through immigration (and the Indian guy into the departure lounge) but for some reason didn't want him to show the same passport to the flight crew at the departure lounge, they would have made sure he had 2 passports - one fake one real (another suggestion made by you). Having an "Indian guy" go through with the scene Haskell describes would have been a huge unnecessary gamble that could have jeopardized the whole mission right at the very last minute where passports are just glanced at and aren't even scanned (hence the "or stupid" comment).

[go west young man]

99. Call it loony if you must.

It is a conspiracy theory. The CIA could easily have done it without Obama knowing. They are the CIA afterall. Everything else you throw out is just speculation. Same as my loony self.

[Eatacig]

52. Be Afraid!!

x( There's an election coming up, time to get the American People afraid, be very afraid!! Looks like Obama needs to check on NeoCon infiltration of the CIA or whoever made these decisons.

[AzDar]

57. K & R & WTF?

:kick:

[debbierlus]

70. After 9/11, every fucking story has to be examined and picked apart

We never did get any real answers about 9/11.

Skepticism is required.

[BeatleBoot]

72. Skepticism may be required, but

Jumping to conclusions is not.

[pjt7]

73. Exactly. & any story linked with TERRORISM &

put on by EVERY major station 24/7. really needs to be pin-pointed.

Is it me or do you think more people are figuring out the propoganda?.. just a little more EVERY DAY.

[fascisthunter]

77. exactly (nt)

[onpatrol98]

79. Conspiracy???

This could be a cover up or major incompetence involved. I am not certain. Regardless, it is curious that these people warranted only a 15 minute interview from our government, even though they seem to have more personal knowledge of what took place at the airport. If it's a conspiracy, it really doesn't make sense. And, it's doubtful it would include this young man's father and his being a denied a passport into another country. I'm more inclined to believe someone was supposed to be watching him more closely and dropped the ball. A pay off here and there and we just narrowly missed a truly horrific Christmas day.

[Subdivisions]

88. If it is incompetence, I'm sick and goddamned tired of it endangering

me and my fellow citizens! And I'm sick of incompetence resulting in laws, regulations, and restrictions that seem oddly very competent in enslaving us further!

[Truth2Tell]

82. "we didn't even have to take our shoes off"

therefore she thinks the Amsterdam security was lax. Wow.

[Devil_Fish]

86. The guy with the video camera is sending the tape back to the terrorist training camp

so that they can figure out how this attack was foiled, and do it better next time.

Dear Agent Mike,

I am not, nor have I ever been associated with terrorist. This statment is speculation. Probably accurate if you havn't found the guy with the video, but still speculation.

[MinM]

92. Flight 253 passenger Kurt Haskell: 'I was visited by the FBI'

http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2009/12/flight_253_passenger_kurt_hask.html

[MinM]

93. Customs official confirms 2nd man held from Flight 253-Scott Horton interviews Kurt Haskell

http://www.detnews.com/article/20100101/NATION/1010405/1410/METRO01/Customs-official-confirms-report-of-2nd-man-held-from-Flight-253

http://scotthorton.org/radio/09_12_31_haskell.mp3

[Turborama]

94. Alex Jones interviews Haskell for half an hour, twice. Andrew Brietbart interviews him, too

As I pointed out a couple of days ago here (includes links to both Alex Jones interviews): http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=277864&mesg_id=277975

He also says in the second 1/2 hour interview that he's going back for a 3rd interview on Sunday. He's clearly a big fan of Jones and his work.

Instead of adding a live link, here's the Google search results for the Brietbart interview: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&rls=com.microsoft:en-US&q=Andrew+Breitbart+kurt+haskell&btnG=Search&aq=f&oq=&aqi=

It seems like freepers are huge fans of his story, too. Check out the second link "What do you think of Kurt Haskell's story?" here: http://www.google.com/search?q=free+republic+kurt+haskell&sourceid=ie7&rls=com.microsoft:en-US&ie=utf8&oe=utf8

[mainer]

95. overseas, taking off shoes and liquid restrictions are not required

I've flown all over Europe and Turkey. In almost every overseas flight, you could leave your shoes on, and often no one cared about our bringing along fluids. I recall standing in a security line in Istanbul airport, trying to surrender my water bottle that I'd forgotten I had, and the security guy refused to take it and waved me through.

[Tx4obama]

98. I believe the passenger/attorney!

http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2009/12/flight_253_passenger_kurt_hask.html