How Herd Immunity Works

[activa8tr]

Run time: 10:16 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-cKzzPkz2o   Posted on YouTube: September 04, 2010 By YouTube Member: shanedk Views on YouTube: 843   Posted on DU: September 05, 2010 By DU Member: activa8tr Views on DU: 1440

 
Science and statistical analysis versus anti-science conspiracy theorists.

Which side do you want to live on?

[Pharaoh]

1. Go ahead an pump your veins full of it!

Just leave me out of it!!

[AlbertCat]

11. Just leave me out of it!!

Then please move away from the rest of us. Thank you.


Anyone who thinks vaccinations are dangerous is an idiot.

[HuckleB]

14. Hmmm.

Dr. Strangelove Mandrake and General Ripper Bodily Fluids
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0he-LZNzVg0

[tabatha]

2. That was not science - there were no citations

for his bogus data.

[activa8tr]

4. Is there a citation for addition and subtraction? Or do you

deny all math?

[tabatha]

5. Really? - you expect there to be citations

Kindergarten arithmetic.

There is not 100% mortality for every epidemic of disease - as he indicated in his phony statistics.
Some people succumb, many do not because of natural immunity.

Despite the devastation of Aids, there have been many people who have survived - and these people have provided important immunity information to researchers.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/library/10/4/l_104_06.html
http://www.accessexcellence.org/WN/SUA04/natural_immunity_HIV.php
http://www.bioedonline.org/news/news.cfm?art=1635
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/05/100505133250.htm
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Could_you_develop_an_immunity_to_Black_death

Read more, learn more, and do not assume that everyone else is uninformed.

[AlbertCat]

13. Some people succumb, many do not because of natural immunity.

what percentage is "some"?

what percentage is "many"?

What virus are you talking about?

Ebola Zaire kills 90 to 95% of its victims. See? Some did succumb, and "many" didn't.... if 5% is many. How might these "somes" and "manys" change if there were a vaccine? Isn't the vaccine for those who need help in overcoming the effects of the virus, not the ones who won't get it or who will naturally survive it?


Besides, none of the detractors here have addressed the main claim that the vaccine itself causes disease.

Don't assume the rest of us are idiots.

[tabatha]

15. Did you read any of the links?

"Duncan's team points out that when the Black Death first struck, killing some 40% of Europeans between 1347 and 1350, only 1 person in 20,000 had the CCR5-?32 mutation."

I was not speaking for any of the detractors, and how, by providing reputable references, was there an assumption that the rest of you are idiots? I was addressing ONE person with facts.

I am not anti-vaccine, just anti-garbage.

[HuckleB]

3. K & R!

[Aristophrenia]

6. How is questioning vaccination

born from socialism ?

This guy's entire premise is that people are making bogus assumptions based on ignorance- and starts his ENTIRE video off with two pieces of complete crap.

The vaccination worries were not borne from Organic, Natural or alt-meds. It was borne from a discredited scientific study which asserted a link between
Autism and certain combined vaccinations.

Vaccination is important - but why use the fully creditable argument of urgency of vaccination to push an agenda against socialism, Organic, and Natural
life styles ?

Why attempt to discredit alternative therapies ? Acupuncture and Hypnosis are both considered alternative - yet are considered to be totally credible and
part of modern western medical treatment...

What a moronic thing to do.

[tabatha]

7. Agreed. Crap.

Anyone who resorts to mockery usually does not have a case.

[Confusious]

10. Or the shit is so ridiculous it can't be taken seriously

At least, not by a person with half a brain.

I.e. vaccines are not necessary

[HuckleB]

9. Acupuncture and hypnosis are not credible in any way, shape or form.

I agree that the socialism comparison is pointless and ridiculous and stupid. However, trying to say "alternative therapies" are credible falls into the same category.

[AlbertCat]

12. Acupuncture and hypnosis are not credible in any way, shape or form.

Thank you for pointing that out. It worries me that chiro-quack-ty is considered more than a good massage. And that placebo effects are ignored by those who just loves them some alternative medicine.

[tabatha]

16. I would NEVER consider acupuncture

under any circumstances; I think exercise is a better option. However, I have read that studies have been done, and here are some observations.

"Subsequent studies found that acupuncture stimulates the secretion of endogenous morphine-like substances called endorphins. <2>, <3> Endorphins act on the opiate receptor sites and inhibit the transmission of pain signals. There are several lines of evidence to support this action: endorphin levels in blood and cerebrospinal fluid change in response to acupuncture, naloxone and other opiate receptor antagonists block this effect, and loss of opiate receptors in genetically altered mice results in suppression of this effect. It is now known that acupuncture stimulates the secretion of not only endorphins, but a range of neurochemicals, including monoamines, that inhibit pain perception. <4>

It has also been demonstrated that acupuncture stimulates the type 3 small afferent fibers within muscle tissue.<2> These fibers are connected to the hypothalamus-pituitary axis and thus can act both locally through the spinal cord, and systemically through the release of neurochemicals. The local and distal pain suppressing effects of acupuncture is dependent upon electrical stimulation of the acupuncture needle. Different frequency and intensity of electrical stimulation determines whether the effect is local (within the region of the body innervated by a single spinal nerve tract), or distally (through the systemic secretion of neurochemicals).

More recently, the ability of acupuncture to regulate more complex physiological processes (beyond just pain) has been studied using magnetic resonance imaging (MRI). <5>, <6>, <7> These studies suggest that stimulation of an acupuncture point leads to activation of specific regions of the brain that correspond to the function of acupuncture points according to East Asian medical theory. For example, Cho et. al. studied an acupuncture point that is commonly used to treat auditory problems. <5> When this point was stimulated the auditory cortex region of the brain was shown using MRI to be activated. These studies are exciting because they connect Oriental medicine theory with modern science. They suggest that acupuncture works via the nervous system."

http://www.tufts.edu/med/ebcam/eastAsianMed/acupunctureOverview.html

It is ALWAYS good to keep an open mind.

[HuckleB]

18. Another overhyped acupuncture study misinterpreted

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?p=5452

Potential New Mechanism of Pain Relief Discovered
http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?p=5437

Unfortunately, this is typical of acupuncture studies.

On edit, this is a fine explanation of true "open-mindedness."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T69TOuqaqXI

[tabatha]

19. I do not have an opinion either way

but I did not find the rambling "science based medicine" article very convincing - in fact, I seem to remember that there was another article on that site that I questioned.

For some people, the proof is in the pudding - did you see the comment by "egmorin" at the end of the first link?

And despite your links, I shall not dismiss something out of hand if I do not know enough to do so.

[HuckleB]

20. You seem to be sharing an opinion, nonetheless.

What about the two articles on this study at SBM bothers you, exactly, or doesn't convince you, exactly? (I'm sorry, but I don't buy the claim that the articles are rambling.) What about the studies as published do convince you? What do they convince you of...?

Science is about taking a look at the evidence present. Currently the evidence that supports acupuncture is extremely weak to non-existent, and it often shows that sham treatments work better. If well-designed studies show otherwise in the future, I will be more than happy to change my mind. But there is currently no justification in the literature to support the use of acupuncture as a treatment. Should I ignore that?

This explains what CAM practitioners do in general in order to "support" their businesses. It's not science.

Choosing Your Evidence
http://www.theness.com/neurologicablog/?p=1609#more-1609

[tabatha]

21. My opinion is that I will not dimiss something about which I

know little. I would never choose acupuncture for myself, but I would not dismiss others using it.

If you read the comment to which I referred, the person in question sold "science based" medication that also appeared to be a hit-and-miss undertaking.

[HuckleB]

22. Uh huh.

Thank you for clarifying your marketing strategy.

:rofl:

[tabatha]

17. see #16

[HuckleB]

8. Some more good videos on this topic.

(1/2) Do Vaccines Cause Autism? Correlation vs. Causation
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW1IEqKuf6s

(2/2) Do Vaccines Cause Autism? Correlation vs. Causation
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Tl3tUQng9Q&feature=related

Vaccine False Alarms - Harriet Hall TAM7 Excerpt
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=el5jYoaoV_E&feature=related

Anti-Anti-Vax Steve Novella
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ap_0uQDbZl4&feature=related