Obama? Yikes

[Laura PourMeADrink]

I may be in the minority (as usual here) - but the man is flat out, not ready. Good man = but not ready. He knows only surface - he has a couple lines he can spew out about a topic - but there is an obvious lack of depth of knowledge. Like if you were involved in an intellectual discussion about Shakespeare and all you could contribute was the title and main character's name.

I mean - just compare him on this account with Biden or Richardson (forgetting all other factors for a second). They have assimilated facts over years of experience and can make wise, thoughtful judgements, whether you agree with those judgements or not.

Does it matter? Can we do well if we elect a charismatic, heart-in-the-right place, neophyte? I think not. Bush has created a list of problems a million miles long. We need someone who can hit the ground running.

Just my 2 cents.

[quinnox]

1. Obama needs to smile more

He seemed awful dour in the faith forum, I don't know if he even smiled once. Smile Obama!

John Edwards smiled a lot and even laughed at one point.

I do agree Obama is a little ahead of the game at this point but could be a possibility for the next president after the next one.

[zanne]

3. I'm really tired of hearing that about women and minorities...

"Not this, time, but maybe the next time. This country isn't ready". I think this country is ready NOW and I think it's long past due.

[Lex]

4. Did someone say this about Hillary?

nt

[elocs]

6. In defense of the OP, I don't see anything there about women and minorities.

What I read being said is that the OP does not think that Obama has enough experience. That is a legitimate criticism.

[zanne]

14. This is what I was referring to.....

"He could be the next president after the next one". Sorry if I misinterpreted that, but, like I said, I'm tired of hearing that it's not quite time yet.

[elocs]

19. I can understand you saying that, but not for this post in particular.

I, too, have sometimes commented on the general subject of a post, but not the specific subject of a post, so I know from where you are coming. Even if another Democrat is nominated, elected and reelected, Senator Obama will still be young and even more experienced.

[cui bono]

55. But it has nothing to do with him being black...

What is wrong with someone thinking he is too green?

[quinnox]

7. I think it is time for a woman

Hillary Clinton all the way.

[kiteinthewind]

45. I would rather wait for the right woman, not 'Hillary' b/c she is a woman. nt

[BlooInBloo]

11. The "white lie" was predicted waaaay back at the start of the primary.

[Clark2008]

27. The media feeds that lie, too.

I don't know enough about Obama to say whether I think he's "ready" or not, but what I can say is that he's not going to get the votes from the white males in Heartland he needs in order to flip some purple states simply because of his name or the color of his skin.

And, I put the blame for that squarely at the feet of our media structure that want to keep us divided.

(BTW, my son's middle name is also "Hussein." He's 8. My ex husband IS Arabic, thus the middle name. When my son first heard all the insults from our local jocks on the radio regarding this middle name, he couldn't understand the big deal. After all, it's his middle name, too, and all he's ever known. Prejudice is learned, not innate.)

[huskerlaw]

35. The OP said OBAMA isn't ready

not "this country isn't ready." That's a completely different argument. In fact, I agree with both of you, it's just that you seem to have missed the point of the OP.

[Matariki]

38. The OP said nothing about the country not being ready for a minority candidate.

But that Obama, as a freshman Senator, isn't ready. I don't know if this is true or not but it is an impression that many people have - they'd rather have a candidate with a few more years in the Senate or as a Governor. Because of this perception, I think he'd make a very good VP candidate (hopefully to Al Gore!). After 8 years as VP the argument that he doesn't have enough experience will be moot.

[Laura PourMeADrink]

9. You know, I even kind of wonder about that too (future). He

strikes me, for some reason, as an impatient man. Impatient people, may not be willing
to spend the time learning? I agree too - he does seem dour. He also looked like he
was jealous or even a little mad if someone else trumped him with a better answer. He looked bad when trying to answer a question about VA hospitals. He's on the committee - but didn't really seem to have too much enlightenment.

[MadBadger]

16. Obama rocked that faith forum

I loved his answer on Good vs. Evil.

[zanne]

57. I agree. He managed not to offend anybody.....

But he didn't cater to any one religion. I like that about him.

[zanne]

2. Just wait.

He's just getting warmed up.

[LSparkle]

5. I agree -- I love his enthusiasm and idealism but at this point in time

experience counts. We've spent almost 8 years with a cheerleader-in-chief while Darth Cheney plays puppeteer. I don't liken Obama to RatBastard, but we will really need a president who is in charge, who has the experience that will allow him to decisions on his own if need be, and I wonder if Obama is really ready for prime time.

[Tatiana]

8. This is a good practice run for him.

I don't think he's quite ready yet, but from what I've seen, he definitely will have what it takes down the line to be an excellent President of the United States.

[jaxx]

10. I think he's a lot tougher than you give him credit for being.

He didn't get to where he is today by being a push over. Sometimes the experience becomes a rut...I did this 10 years ago and I'll do it today. Today is different than yesterday and we need someone who isn't afraid to take it from the now.

[Blackhatjack]

12. IF Obama does not get the nomination, I do not believe it will be because of his race...

... the same with Hillary because she is a woman.

It will be because they failed to convince a majority of those who vote that they are best able to carry out the duties of the office in addressing the serious problems that face us.

I will be surprised if race or sex becomes a significant issue before the nominee is chosen.

[BeyondGeography]

20. Agreed n/t

[dysfunctional press]

13. a cabinet position in the Gore administration would give him some much needed experience.

but at this point, i don't think that he's even ready for the 2nd spot on the ticket.

[MadBadger]

15. I hear you say he has an Obvious lack of depth of knowledge

At least cite some examples.

[Telly Savalas]

22. I'd be interested to hear some examples too.

[ElizabethDC]

17. I think he's good but, with experience, he can become a lot better

he hasn't reached his peak yet - but I think he'll be there in a few years.

[Justyce]

18. This is my thinking too. He seems to be

a good guy, but he definitely seems too green. I think he would've done better to wait until he had a little more experience under his belt before taking the plunge.

[Poiuyt]

21. That's why a president has advisers

What a president needs most is a clear vision on where the country should go and a strong ability to lead and inspire. Any president is going to need a good cabinet and a good set of advisers. Hopefully, Obama (should he get elected) would be smart enough to choose good ones.

[Bake]

23. Yeah. That's what we've had the LAST six years.

Somebody with "good advisors."

The Head Person In Charge has to know what's what. We've seen what happens when he doesn't.

Bake

[Poiuyt]

25. Don't tell me Bush didn't know what was what

Bush and his advisers were (are) equally corrupt. He wasn't blind as to who was coming in. I don't think Obama would chose Dick Cheney as his VP.

[1776Forever]

42. Interesting thought - Who would Obama choose as a VP???

I would love to hear your ideas .............. Edwards????? Or would Edwards take Obama????????? I am undecided right now - still reading, listening, thinking!:donut:

[zulchzulu]

24. Have you actually been to Obama's site and watched, read before coming to your conclusion

With more experience than Edwards or Clinton and the same amount of experience as JFK and Lincoln, that charge is a non-starter.

Obama is well-versed on the issues...give him a chance.

[WyLoochka]

26. Yeah - many said the same about JFK

and that Nixon "obviously" had more "experience" and greater "depth of knowledge."

Biden has what kind of "experience?" Being a super hawk and helping BushCo march us straight into a nightmare, that's what kind - that was "wise?" It "obviously" was not.

Obama was certainly much "wiser" and showed much more "depth of knowledge" than Biden, Richardson, Clinton or Edwards on the biggest issue of our time, when it counted. Somewhere along the line he had acquired enough "depth of knowledge" to recognize a sham and call invading Iraq a "dumb war" - a depth that had somehow completely eluded the more "experienced" you tout.

Maybe a lot of "experience" in and around DC is something we should be wary about?

[cooolandrew]

28. I know he's become a broken record on the issues, all the originality is already exhausted sadly.

[cooolandrew]

29. Hillary is coming across the most cometant and well versed on all issues...

... If people knew what was good for them they would vote kucinich, but as a person who has a viable chance of election Hillary is looking more appealing. She is showing the person I fell in love with metaphorically in her biography.

[Scriptor Ignotus]

34. name a candidate that's not a broken record on the issues

they all just repeat themselves ad naseum.

[jeffrey_X]

30. And yet Bush was elected....

I'll gladly substitute his greenness for getting a politician in office that isn't corrupt or controlled by faction of a political party that has an agenda driven by corporate greed and profits.

Like others have said, he will have advisers, staff and a cabinet to do the specialty work.

Again, if Bush can be president, there is no reason Obama can't.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

31. Did you read the piece on him in the New Yorker a couple of weeks ago?

They speak to this. He does this intentionally. It's part of how he took 70% of the vote in Illinois. the average voter doesn't like know-it-alls who dissect the details of every little detail on every topic. It's a good article; worth the read.

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2007/05/07/070507fa_fact_macfarquhar

"There are three things that Democratic political candidates tend to do when talking with constituents: they display an impressive grasp of the minutiae of their constituents’ problems, particularly money problems; they rouse indignation by explaining how those problems are caused by powerful groups getting rich on the backs of ordinary people; and they present well-worked-out policy proposals that, if passed, would solve the problems and put the powerful groups in their place. Obama seldom does any of these things. He tends to underplay his knowledge, acting less informed than he is. He rarely accuses, preferring to talk about problems in the passive voice, as things that are amiss with us rather than as wrongs that have been perpetrated by them. And the solutions he offers generally sound small and local rather than deep-reaching and systemic."

"Despite the criticism he has received for being all inspiration and no policy, Obama has so far stuck to what appears to be an instinct that white papers belong on Web sites, not in speeches. It is surprising, given the recent electoral record of Democratic policy wonks, that he is not given more credit for the astuteness of this approach, but it’s true that it’s not just strategy—it’s who he is. “He doesn’t have the handicap that a lot of smart people have, which is that they come across as ‘You’re not smart enough to talk to me,’ ” George Haywood, a private investor and a friend of Obama’s, says. “Adlai Stevenson, another Illinois guy, had that—he came across as an egghead and it was off-putting to people. Barack is the opposite.”

[jeffrey_X]

32. Thank you....

I now have my reading material for the subway.

[jsamuel]

33. That may work in a nearly uncontested general state election, but a heavily contested national

Democratic Primary is not full the same kind of people.

[Tyrone Slothrop]

I might argue that.

After all, nobody really likes to be condescended to -- regardless of who they are. I fully believe that his rhetorical style -- which went over well with downstate farmers in Illinois -- would go over very well in New Hampshire or Iowa.

Of course, I have no idea whether America will bite or not. It's far too early to tell. I was merely responding to the OP's belief/contention that Mr. Obama doesn't have a good handle on the issues or facts at hand. I think it seems that way solely because no politician in recent memory has approached the rhetoric of politics similarly.

[chimpymustgo]

49. He took 70% of the vote running against crazy ALAN KEYES.

I like Obama. I'm pulling for him to succeed. But so far, not enough there there.

[hedgehog]

36. Obama knew enough not to trust George Bush from the get-go!

That puts him head and shoulders above the rest.

[karlrschneider]

37. It doesn't matter, he has no chance of being the nominee.

Not saying this to piss off Obamaphiles, it's just a fact of life.

[THUNDER HANDS]

39. nobody, save for FDR

hits the ground running as president.

It's a challenge for all of them. You grow in the role as you go along.

Obama would be a fine president, as would any of our other candidates.

The most important question is which one could actually win.

[LSK]

40. Rumsfeld and Cheney were supposedly experienced n/t

[Jillian]

41. I have no doubt in my mind that Obama will be President one day.

He needs more experience first.
We need someone that can deal with
Not only Iraq...Iran, N Korea but
Russia who is playing with their nukes right now.
Latin America.
Darfur.

And the biggie - Israel & Palestine which is causing alot of this.

Have you ever heard of the expression
"Raise to the level of incompetency"?
That's what I worry about with Obama.

I like him. I believe in him. I just want him to get more experience under his belt.

[underseasurveyor]

43. Oh good god

The man didn't get where he is today by being a bloomin' idiot ya know. However GW did, so imagine how much farther ahead of the curve Obama already is. Plus why do you think presidents have advisors anyway? Um so they can, oh, possibly, say, oh I dunno.... Hit the ground running?!!!! Helllooooo.

Not ready :eyes:

[Odin2005]

44. His "lack of experience" is a plus, not a minus.

It means he's less corrupted by the establishment

[Ethelk2044]

46. you are right you are in the

minority.

[Ethelk2044]

47. Let me see He is not ready

He was against the war from the beginning. He voiced it out in the open when the media asked. He stated he would have voted not to give Bush the authority to go to war. Right Decision

Now On the Other Hand Hillary
4 years experience in the Senate. Did not feel she had to read the bill. She had other people to read the bill for her and give her the information on the bill ( I guess it was not that important to her to read). Voted to give Bush the authority to go to war.


Let's see who made the right decision?

Obama

[underseasurveyor]

48. Touche

:thumbsup:

Match-Set


*Point* :bounce:

[bcoylepa]

50. no more white men

unless Gore gets in and then I will re-evaluate but as of now - I can't see why on earth I would not want to take a chance with a person of color or a woman - just on the slight chance that their experience may bring something new and good to the office
enough damage done - I say - listen and learn - Obama has something to say - and the leader is only as good as the people he or she places in office and one of Obama's advisors is one of my favorites - Samantha Powers
I'm just saying - he is not getting those crowds for nothing - listen and learn - forsake the conventional wisdom

[Laurab]

51. I disagree - just my 2 cents

I've read both his books - he is a thoughtful, very intelligent and caring man, who would surround himself with the best people, and look at all options with an open mind, IMO, kind of like Bill Clinton did. He doesn't just want to be President, he wants to be a GREAT President.

The oddest thing about Obama to me, is that he seems to be the only one who can cross the divide, and maybe get some repuke votes. I was talking to my (one and only) hard core repuke friend, and she hates Hillary, hates Edwards, but also doesn't like any of the repuke candidates. I started telling her a few things I'd learned about Obama, and she was VERY interested, and wanted to tell her husband right away. That was something I wouldn't have expected in a million years.

I don't think Hillary or Edwards has any more experience, really, than Obama does - only Al Gore would, IMO. Hillary has Bill, she was a first lady, and has been an unimpressive senator - she's my senator - I don't know anyone who is impressed with her. Edwards is a nice guy, he has one term in the senate - also unimpressive. They're both okay, but I don't see either one as being overly experienced.

Obama's did a lot of things before he went to the senate - in the state. He didn't just come out of nowhere and run for the senate. I really don't believe either of the other "top runners" have much on him in the way of experience.

[bcoylepa]

53. what LauraB said

read his books too - nothing shallow or phony there- he's as authentic as we are going get

[bjnumb9]

54. Either Hillary is dishonest or dumb

when it comes to "The War on Terror." That term is a political tool that has been used against our democracy, and it runs on a combustion engine that requires a fuel mix of fear and ignorance. One thing that Edwards, who I am not all that crazy about, has impressed me with.

Either she's wrong or she's playing the politician game, and either way I don't like it.

Obama or Gore. Ron Paul before Hillary. Sorry, but as of June 5, 2007, that's the way I feel.

[tammywammy]

52. I disagree

[Quixote1818]

56. He is not my first choice but I think he would be a great president. nt

[Matsubara]

58. I'd vote for a stoned college kid with an Amnesty Int'l Sticker over Biden anyday.

No thanks.