All that poor girl did was go to the store...

[PCIntern]

For some reason, I am just overwhelmed by this story. In a society wherein the violence and horrors perpetrated seems to have become the norm, this story, possibly because of the stark video extant: the innocence of a young girl walking out with a package and the stalker right behind her on a mission, is just impossible to bear. I'm normally not an emotional person when it comes to these things but somehow I feel as though I've been hit by a baseball bat on this one. It's the Anne Frank Story: six million people cannot be grasped, one person can.

I grieve for the parents, the siblings, the family, the friends and teachers, and for the whole Universe of Mankind.


http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/06/07/missing.teen/index.html

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[woodsprite]

2. I'm feeling the same way. Then the Philly news followed that

story with one where a 77 yo lady was just carrying groceries into her home and was assaulted by a man - bites, sexual assault, stomped on and threatened with additional harm. She's in the hospital now, and she's afraid to come home.

[TexasProgresive]

3. What are you talking about?

It would be nice if you were a bit more specific.

[noamnety]

5. I assumed they are talking about Kelsey Smith?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19065065/

[TexasProgresive]

7. Thanks- I made that connection

after scrolling down to a Latest breaking news item that was put up about 1:30AM. The last I heard she was still missing so the OP gave me nothing to understand what it was about.

[PCIntern]

11. I'm so sorry...

I did forget that links really are required. My bad.

[noamnety]

4. This is what a number of DUers have been saying for a long time

Women in this country are harassed for being out in public, on a regular basis, and that is part of our normal culture.

Anyone who thinks that's not part of the "white middle class" culture hasn't been listening.

That's not to say that every woman that goes out gets kidnapped, but unwanted sexual attention and a feeling of threat are part of the common experience of many many women, and that transcends race and class.

I posted very recently that my daughter asked us to get her old bike from the attic while she was visiting, because she can't get from our house to the store a half mile away, in this white uppermiddle class neighborhood that is supposedly the 6th safest city in the country, without getting verbally assaulted. Not - "she got hollered at once." Every single time she has made that walk alone from middle school on up, she cannot do it without getting harassed, because she is female.

[siligut]

8. Guy offered to clean my house, naked.

It would have been funny except he was serious, I think. I laughed, of course, but it was so creepy to have this person whom I have never met think he could just approach me on the street and make a proposition. If I were quicker, I would have offered to let him clean my home clothed.

I think women are harassed in almost every country. Also, there is a fine line between what might be considered a compliment and what would be harassment. Norway and Sweden may be better. I googgled Sexual harassment by country and found a film North Country.

North Country, from Yahoo movies: When Josey Aimes returns to her hometown in Northern Minnesota after a failed marriage, she needs a good job. A single mother with two children, she turns to the predominant source of employment in the region--the iron mines. The mines provide a livelihood that has sustained a community for generations. It’s an industry long dominated by men, in a place unaccustomed to change. Encouraged by her old friend Glory, one of the few female miners in town, Josey joins the ranks of those laboring to blast ore from rock in the gaping quarries. She is prepared for the back-breaking and often dangerous work, but coping with the harassment she and the other female miners encounter from their male coworkers proves far more challenging.

May have to rent it.

[PCIntern]

13. That's really old...from the 60's at least...

it used to be a female would approach a well-heeled looking male and make the overture that way. In theory, she was not selling sex but cleaning services. Further negotiations would then take place.

Capitalism at its finest.

[siligut]

16. You mean he wanted money?

Here I thought I had some sort of animal magnetism! :shrug: :rofl:

[WinkyDink]

43. No, I just saw it; it stars Charlize Theron.

[siligut]

55. You just watched North Country?

Not wanting to create too much of a sub-thread but, how was the film? It looks good from the Yahoo blurb. I think it explores some of the anger directed toward women and expresses that fear is at the root of that aggression.

[mediawatch]

14. I was once a young woman

and I do remember walking to school or downtown. (We walked everywhere in those days) I also remember walking by construction workers, town workers and in the summer time cars just driving by. They would yell things and say things in a sexual manner. However, I never felt threatened, scared or even belittled. My girlfriends and I would laugh, if I was alone I would smile put my head down and keep walking. It NEVER even came to my mind that those men would hurt me or touch me. I think at 14 and 15 I even liked the attention.

But God damn, today is a whole different ball game! I believe what you wrote about your daughter and what a shame she has to change her ways because of this. We have gone back to another time when men see something they like they feel they can just take it and discard it when they are done.

This poor beautiful girl did nothing, NOTHING! Her faults were, she was beautiful, sexy and smart.
Although I don't know the motive that is my suspicion.

[malaise]

18. Interesting post

I walked a lot and rode my bike as a young girl/teenager/young woman. Of course young and old men made comments or whistled. As long as it wasn't offensive, I really didn't mind. Sometimes it's just a compliment. If no one made a comment I'd wonder if I looked awful. :D

I remember a Rastaman (Django was his name) who used to comment every time I walked past his stall a few blocks from my apartment in those days. One day I stopped and asked him if he could tone down the comments and he did. He was complimentary but polite from that day and I always told him hello and even bought stuff from his stall.

A few months later a man in a fancy car offered me a ride and I said no thank you. He continued to bother me and the same Rastaman walked over and asked him if he wanted to deal with him. Of course fancy car drove away very quickly. The Rastaman protected me from fancy car. I never forgot that.

Put simply I wonder if the ridiculous offense at normal male behavior has made us all less safe. People who used to protect us in the past are now scared to intervene.

Maybe I live in a different culture but I have always been able to differentiate between sexual harassment and a simple compliment.

[mediawatch]

19. nice post

I am wondering if we are the same age.

Politics has mudded up the difference between sexual harassment and a simple compliment. I remember in the early 80s at work we got a memo telling us what we could say to one another. A man could say I like your sweater, but he couldn't say "you look great in that sweater". I would take the latter as a compliment not harassment. However, I think men are now afraid to say anything to us for fear of their job.

I agree that those who used to protect us are now scared to intervene. Do you blame them?

[malaise]

22. No I don't blame them one bit

In the past people used to pick up strangers' kids and drop them to school. Now you leave them even if it's raining. All these PC rules have destroyed community and society. We're all on our own now, just like this poor kid who was murdered. I hope they catch the bastard.

[Arkansas Granny]

30. Most people can, but sometimes it goes way beyond a simple

compliment. When you can't walk down the street in your own neighborhood without having men call out suggestive comments, make rude gestures or stop their vehicles to engage you in coversation or offer rides, I don't consider it a simple compliment. It can get to be pretty scary at times. I've had similar experiences and found that I didn't receive nearly as much attention if I took my dog with me. She hardly looked threatening, but I supposed that they figured out that I was "walking, not working".

[malaise]

49. Valid point, but neighbours used to protect us

now we're all on our own.

[Iris]

91. maybe in some time in some place, but I doubt that is a universal experience.

Besides, we shouldn't have to rely on strangers to protect us.

[WinkyDink]

44. Count yourself lucky. Many sexual assaults are impulsive crimes of opportunity, one-offs.

[SoCalDem]

26. The "git-er-done"..caveman..macho mentality is pervasive

And yes times have changed.. Here's a small anecdote.

I was always attracted to older guys, and when I was almost 18 I was dating a guy who was 24 at the time... He had his own apartment, and we spent time there..Never ONCE did he try to get me into bed, because i told him I was not interested in a serious relationship..I was 5'1"..about 100lb, and he was 6'6"..and very much a grown up..but I was never afraid of him..

These days, I doubt that one could have that kind of a relationship..

That said, I am never afraid to shop at 3AM alone..but that's just me..

What I find odd is that NO ONE saw him puching her into the car..Our Target parking lot is always crowded with people coming & going..

I fee very sad for the family:(..and think of how her boyfriend must feel.. he was at her house while she was out getting a gift for him.. had he been with her, that creep would have never tried to abduct her:(

[mediawatch]

28. I was thinking the same thing

why didn't anyone help her? There had to be a minute of two of some struggle. Maybe we are so into ourselves we didn't notice or just afraid to get involved. Imagine if you were there and saw this happen, how would you feel now?

[hfojvt]

99. from the video, there was not

The struggle lasted only five seconds or so. Presumably he threatened her with a gun. It's too bad she couldn't have escaped, but it was also surprising to see other cars driving across the video.

[raccoon]

34. That guy I think was an exception. And there are some.

Plus, the fact that you weren't 18 yet could have made a difference.

Lots of guys, if you're alone in a house with them, they figure the two of you are going to have sex. Some of them back off if you let it be known you don't want to. Some don't. They just keep pressuring and pressuring you. They've made up their minds they're going to get sex, and you practically have to call out the National Guard to convince them otherwise.

[SoCalDem]

37. We actually dated for quite a while, but when I went to college

we drifted apart..I made new friends at school, and he got married a year or so later..

I haven't thought about him in ages..:)..He looked just like Glen campbell (the 1966 Glen Campbell :)..)

[Blue Diadem]

36. I think it just depends on where you lived or who might have been in

an area at any given time. From the early 70's into the 80's, I ran across many men who felt they could be not only vulgar but touch, grab etc.

[dogday]

68. I know where you are coming from and I have a

12 year old daughter and she goes nowhere alone, period. I was blasted by another female on this board that said I was not teaching her the right thing, that many women can go out alone and I was instilling the wrong thing...

I want her to take defensive classes.. I want her to be able to defend herself. I think in this day and time it is important for all women to know this...

What happened to this young lady is my biggest fear, it only takes a second and it is all over..

[LibDemAlways]

85. Raises hand...me too.

I have a 14-year-old daughter and she never goes anywhere alone either. Yesterday she was going to visit a friend who lives, literally, right around the corner. I took her there and back. You can't be too careful when it comes to your kids. Period.

[Saphire]

103. I was a young woman once also. I remember feeling the way you did.

It's not the same today. I see the same thing happing to my own 15 year old daughter and it scares the hell out of me. She will never know the feeling.

[Progressive_In_NC]

31. Pleae don't just attribute this to "Whte Middle Class"

We live in a 50/50 mixed neighborhood in Raleigh, NC. My wife is attractive and walks to the pool with the kids (she wears a bathing suit cover and a very modest one-piece). She gets yelled at by a good many of the young black men that are hanging out between our house and the pool.

She has my THREE year old in the stroller, my SIX year old by her side and these guys are yelling, "hey baby, I'd like to slide up in dat", and crap like that at a 32 year old woman. One day, a dude asked her to provide oral services for lack of a better term, try to explain what that means to a six year old boy (thankfully, I was able to change the subject).

Funny thing is, when I go with them nobody says a word. Being 6'5" 240 lbs and make helps keep that at bay I guess.

[noamnety]

35. I wasn't at all.

I was responding to the initial post that expressed surprise that this COULD happen in a white middle class neighborhood.

Some folks have a tendency, which I object to, to stereotype this into being something that "normal" men don't do or that doesn't happen in "nice" neighborhoods. Normal men do it, because it's a "normal" part of our culture - that was my point.

[Progressive_In_NC]

48. Thanks for the clarification, it does happen there too

I don't see it as much as I do in other places but I do see it in the white neighborhoods here as well. Last year, the cops pulled two guys out of one of our pools for indecent behavior. One was sitting in the corner watching women in a water aerobics class and playing with himself, the other was watching teenage girls and doing the same.

The first was white and a father of two, the second was a migrant from South of the border and a father of five. Both are now sex offenders and living in my neighborhood. Lovely.

It really does cross all boundaries.

[Iris]

90. When I was a girl, even being with my mother didn't stop men from yelling at me.

Once from the top of a telephone pole as we walked across a street from one shopping complex to another.

My mom was young when she had me, so when I was a teenager, it wasn't uncommon for both of us to be ogled at one time, particularly while driving in the car.

[wakeme2008]

6. I work around 30 miles from Virginia Tech

and probably 1/3 of the IT dept are VT grads. The killings there hit my place of work hard.

There are things you never understand. I would like to know if he knew her?

[MiaCulpa]

9. Tragic

Does anyone else recall the first such case they heard of? I do. I was in 2nd grade, and so was the girl who went missing. They found her body 3 days later in a patch of woods. Each time it's a kick in the gut. There are times I can't drive by a patch of woods without wondering if someone's child is there waiting to be found.

[Joe Fields]

10. Yes, I live there, and it HAS been a heartbreaking story.

She just graduated from high school. I have chills over the whole thing, because where she was abducted was one of the safest parts of the metropolitan areas, and so was the area where her body was found, near a recreational lake. Just plain scary. Such a waste, and so many monsters out there.

If I were a female, I wouldn't go anywhere alone. It seems someone is always watching.

[hlthe2b]

24. I almost never go out alone without my (big) dog...

Not a perfect deterrent by any means, but she certainly has deterred some from approaching me....Nothing is 100%, but you do have to live your life.

[DesertRat]

38. but you can't take your big dog with you to Target

I can't get over how this abduction happened in BROAD DAYLIGHT in a Target parking lot. I have an 18 year old daughter so this tragic story really hits home.

[hlthe2b]

41. Yup.... although I do at night...

I've always worried about parking garages... For this to happen in an open daylit crowded parking lot--absolutely hits home.

[proud2BlibKansan]

47. A little girl from Belton, same age, has been missing 2 weeks now

but that story gets NO media coverage.

That upsets me almost as much as this murder.

[Joe Fields]

72. Yes I know, and sympathize. My wife and I were discussing that

very thing yesterday. It sure is strange how the media will pick certain stories.

[Iris]

96. well, for one thing, there was the videotape.

I haven't really been following the story, but wasn't there a videotape from the security cameras in the parking lot? That's the sort of 'visual' the media loves. Our local news will go to the most banal, barely relevant places to shoot "on location" just to have a visual that is different from the black woman/white man anchor team sitting at a desk.

[Justyce]

12. It seems like this kind of thing is happening

more and more often. What the hell is happening to our world?! I just can't grasp how one human being can do this to another human being, or even want to do it. This is every mother's worst fear -- your child in broad daylight running a simple errand, in public... you worry about them being out alone at night, but if they can't even be safe under these circumstances... :cry:

[glowing]

15. I think it seems like the world is getting worse, but really its just

reported more now, especially with amber alert and all... which is good because more people outside of a small area are aware of it.

I think the worst thing I heard from another person, a mom of a teenage daughter, was "why was she wearing such skimpy little clothes." #1. I see so many teens dressed the same way, the thought never crossed my mind. #2. I don't care if the girl was a nudist, it doesn't warrant attack on her person. But it is sad in this day of age that people are still thinking that her appearance called attention to attack.

There has been a steady degredation of people in general. Media, magazines, and famous people dictate the actions of so many people... how to dress, how to talk, how to do this and that. Between glorifying thug life and trying to immitate lindsey lohan, we have really lost some values of individualism and personal achievment.

[Blue Diadem]

I think it's reported more now too plus 24 hr news channels bring it nationwide.

Back in the early 70's, when I experienced an attack in the middle of a store, no one knew what to do. The clerks stood there with me as the man ran out of the store and drove away. It wasn't until I got home that my Mother notified the police who never even bothered to talk to me nor even make a report.

What you heard that other Mother say is sad. I think sometimes people are afraid to face the fact that someone can just go shopping and never come home..instead they try to blame.

[glowing]

62. I think culture had a bit to do with it...

[malaise]

17. A very sad happening

Seriously parents should tell their teenagers to travel in groups.
This happens way too often.

[qanda]

20. This has me shaken also

I just cannot imagine what this family is going through right now. She just graduated from high school-- she had her whole life in front of her and in an instant she is gone. I know that people die all the time, but she didn't do anything to deserve this. That guy was a monster and did it in broad daylight. I just wish she would have fought, screamed and NEVER allowed him to get her in that car. I do have to wonder if he knocked her out and that's why she didn't get away. What ifs will probably haunt her family forever. RIP Kelsey.

[BoneDaddy]

21. I know the feeling

it makes me so damn sad as I watch her last couple of minutes of life as she is walking out, ignorant of her killer behind her. This poor girl and her family.

I used to be anti death penalty. I am not so sure anymore.

[mitchum]

23. There is only one solution for dealing with predators

[hlthe2b]

25. This is why the new AAR host, Lionel's recent take on Dateline's

Predator shows and his opinion that cyber connection with underage girls (aka undercover cops) is not really a crime, that it is victim-less because the crime was not "consummated" (pardon the pun)is really hard to take.

While I personally hate that MSNBC show and certainly some of these arrests may border on entrapment, which must be closely monitored, these guys do need to be stopped from preying on children via internet. I know he is a libertarian, not a lib/progressive, but give me a break.

[soothsayer]

27. That's why we need to think about The Popsicle Index and how to improve it.

Catherine Austin Fitts' idea (she was a HUD honcho under poppy)

snip

The Popsicle Index is a rule of thumb I use to assess the health of a place. It is the % of people in a neighborhood who believe that a child can leave their home alone and go to the nearest place to buy a popsicle and return home alone safely. I grew up in Philadelphia during the 1950s. The Popsicle Index was 100%. It was unthinkable for a child to not be safe running up to Spruce Street for a snack and to play some pinball.

I watched my neighborhood destroyed by narcotics trafficking and mortgage fraud that generated much higher margins than legitimate businesses. The Dow Jones Index rose as the Popsicle Index fell. I was persuaded that the waste in the win-lose relationship offered an "arbitrage" opportunity. In short, if we could retool the financial system to reflect the economic value of knowledge, it was possible to create a much wealthier society in which a rising Popsicle Index fueled a rising stock market. It is the largest capital gain opportunity on the planet today.

snip

http://www.optionetics.com/articles/article.asp?id=11457

[LisaL]

29. There is another young high school girl recently gone missing

in that area, Kara Kopetsky.

[slackmaster]

59. And MyFox of Kansas City just posted an article about her this morning

http://www.myfoxkc.com/myfox/pages/Home/Detail?contentId=3423378&version=2&locale=EN-US&layoutCode=TSTY&pageId=1.1.1

[alcibiades_mystery]

32. Grieve for the Universe of Womankind

This is a story about violence against women, and our society is fucked at its root when it comes to that.

We need radical feminism, for real.

[PCIntern]

63. This particular story is about violence against women

the Adam Walsh story was about violence against men. Now, whilst driving over a personhole cover on the way to work this morning, the thought crossed my mind, is there anyone immune from violence? The answer is no.

If you want radical feminism, so be it. We're here too, just try not to forget that, please.

[ThomWV]

33. Why do you think she was "poor"? She was certainly unfortunate and unlucky

but nothing I know about her tells me she was poor.

[LostinVA]

39. That's not how he means that adjective at all

[WinkyDink]

45. "Poor: deserving of pity; pitiable."

[ThomWV]

54. What Dictionary are you using? Mine says ...

Maybe its because mine is old, maybe word change meaning very quickly and your education was much better than mine. Who knows? Here is what Random House used to think the word ment in their 1980 Delux Revised Edition:

1. lacking money or other means of support.

2. Law - dependent on chairity or public support.

3. Indicating or suggesting poverty.

4. Wrechedly lacking; megar.

[SteppingRazor]

57. My American Heritage has the "pitiable" definition as No. 8...

are you seriously saying you've never heard someone commiserate by saying, "You poor thing"? What did you think they meant? :shrug:

[Bluebear]

58. That they had no money!

:crazy:

[Posteritatis]

64. Dictionary arguments: the apogee of intellectual vigor! (nt)

[reichstag911]

102. Vigor or rigor?

:P

[Posteritatis]

106. Touche. o/` I am so smart, S-M-R-T.. o/` (nt)

[LostinVA]

66. The poster was not using an archaic or unusual meaning for the word

I'm honestly confused by this.

[uppityperson]

75. Maybe she was deficient(5), or excessively lean (8), or modest(13)

dictionary.com
poor /pʊər/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation adjective, -er, -est, noun
–adjective
1. having little or no money, goods, or other means of support: a poor family living on welfare.
2. Law. dependent upon charity or public support.
3. (of a country, institution, etc.) meagerly supplied or endowed with resources or funds.
4. characterized by or showing poverty.
5. deficient or lacking in something specified: a region poor in mineral deposits.
6. faulty or inferior, as in construction: poor workmanship.
7. deficient in desirable ingredients, qualities, or the like: poor soil.
8. excessively lean or emaciated, as cattle.
9. of an inferior, inadequate, or unsatisfactory kind: poor health.
10. lacking in skill, ability, or training: a poor cook.
11. deficient in moral excellence; cowardly, abject, or mean.
12. scanty, meager, or paltry in amount or number: a poor audience.
13. humble; modest: They shared their poor meal with a stranger.
14. unfortunate; hapless: The poor dog was limping.
–noun
15. (used with a plural verb) poor persons collectively (usually prec. by the): sympathy for the poor.
—Idioms
16. poor as a church mouse, extremely poor.
17. poor as Job's turkey, extremely poor; impoverished.

If you truly don't understand the meaning of the word "poor" in this context, I feel sorry for you. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/sorry
If you are being silly, http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/silly , I am still sorry (see above). If you want to parse http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/parse words, still you are sill (see above)

[wageslave71]

105. I think #14

(unfortunate, hapless) is what was intended.

[dogday]

80. Pocket Oxford Dictionary definition # 4

poor adj. 1 without enough money to live comfortably. 2 (foll. by in) deficient in (a possession or quality). 3 a scanty, inadequate. b less good than is usual or expected (poor visibility; is a poor driver). c paltry; inferior (came a poor third). 4 deserving pity or sympathy; unfortunate (you poor thing). 5 spiritless, despicable.  poor man's inferior or cheaper substitute for.


It is there and she is deserving of pity and sympathy and it is unfortunate that it happened...


Why do you nit-pick this definition? A girl was killed for goodness sake....

[smirkymonkey]

86. Christ! The girl was murdered and all you can think about is getting

into some stupid fucking semantic argument on message board. :eyes:

[Bluebear]

50. For you....

[Name removed]

52. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bluebear]

56. ---

Oh, my.

[PCIntern]

65. DU is getting ridiculous. Period.

Now I am supposed to indicate which definition of which word and in which context it is to be used a priori?

Get this: Leave me alone. You want to parse, do it to someone else. I resent this type of willful ignorance, I'm sorry.

[Swede]

67. There are some real jackasses here.

And ignorance is not the excuse.

[LostinVA]

71. Yup

[Bluebear]

77. Trust me . . .

most of us are completely dumbstruck by this.

[PCIntern]

79. I know that...

I've been here a very long time and most things of this nature don't rile me much but that kind of sanctimonious nonsense involving a real tragedy is just outrageous. IMO of course.

How's that for politeness?

[bicentennial_baby]

92. Completely in agreement!!

:applause:

[WinkyDink]

40. It's the Ted Bundy Method. Women MUST read "The Gift of Fear".

My lesson learned: DO NOT accept UNASKED-FOR help from a man, even in broad daylight, even at a grocery store, with other people around.
TRUST your intuition, your raised hairs on your neck, your gut---do NOT worry about "being rude"!

[LostinVA]

69. Excellent book -- and Gavin de Becker praises women's instincts

He says women have much better instincts than me -- they just need to use them. Don't worry about being polite or offending someone. Say NO. walk away. You're not being "a bitch." In this case, it wouldn't have helped the poor girl, but it would in so many ways.

[Fleshdancer]

73. I recommend "The Gift of Fear" too

Too often society dismisses the concept of female intuition but it's a real thing and should never be ignored.

[Iris]

95. I once read an editorial in which the author (a man) asserted that one way men abuse women is

by ridiculing or making light of their intuition. I always thought he made a good point.

[CrispyQ]

97. Years ago I read a magazine article in a woman's magazine.

The author said that most women are raised to be polite, kind & helpful. Consquently, we feel guilty turning down help, even if we haven't asked for it. The article stated that some men will even push it & imply that you are stuck up or rude if you don't accept their help, knowing that that will push some reluctant women to go ahead & accept their help.

My husband is the one who stays home when we need a repair man to come over. I've had girlfriends laugh at that & call me silly, but I'm glad. I would prefer not to be in my basement with a man I don't know & no one else in the house.

[MedleyMisty]

42. Sigh

I wonder if when I'm old all I'll do is complain about the crazy kids today and how things were better when I was young.

Probably not.

I was sexually abused when I was around 10 and 11. I'm sorry, but guys making sexual comments freaks me out and makes me run far far away. It means that they only see me as a body for them to rape and throw away, not as a person.

It's only within the last few years that I've been able to walk through a display of low budget comedy and horror films without dry heaving. And we won't even get into anime.

I will not be objectified again.

If it doesn't freak you out, cool. Must be nice to have never gone through anything that would make you distrustful of sexual comments from males. Oh, and I don't need any protector to save me. I can protect myself just fine now that I'm an adult, thank you.

[LostinVA]

70. Hey -- nice post

And, one more thing: :hug:

[theNotoriousP.I.G.]

78. Thank you for your honesty

I hear where you are coming from.

[madmunchie]

101. I'm sorry for your trauma and abuse.

I too am a victim, but I don't and never have spent much time thinking about it and I don't think that it affected me in the way that I view guys making sexual remarks or doing the wolf whistling. I am maybe blessed to know that the perverted sick freaks that would rape and/or kill a woman are a far different animal than many of the macho sexist pigs that make remarks and do the wolf whistling. I know that the latter encompass a great many of the percentage of men that walk the face of the earth and that the former are very very few and far between Thank God.

We as women always have to have a 7th sense for our safety, we just have to face those facts AND we have to know how to handle the wolf whistles and the sometimes crude remarks that come our way - with strength and confidence.

There are many types of tragedies that hit most of us in our lives and how we deal with those tragedies is so much more important than the event itself. At least that is how I believe. Of course I could be wrong. But the only way that we are knocked down and made to stay down is by allowing ourselves to stay down. We must always fight our way back up and we must always remember, that there are countless others doing the same thing as we are.

So, whatever happens, please don't become bitter, that is a form of surrendering part of yourself to the dark side that struck you down. That is a long lasting victory for them.

[Akoto]

46. Such a tragedy, and ...

I hope that whoever they ultimately apprehend pays for what he's done.

It brings to mind the many shows Oprah has done on this subject. The one thing all of the experts state is: "never allow them to take you to the second location." If they're taking you to a second place, it's most likely because they want to kill you out of sight. Fight, scream, throw yourself out of the car while it's moving. Anything to keep from going to that second place.

[HughBeaumont]

51. And everyone wonders why I rarely let my kid out of my sight.

When I was a kid, I used to be able to bike to the park in my hometown by myself without a second thought. Can't do that now. My kid has to be with at least 2-3 friends and an adult at all times. He's not allowed to go anywhere by himself until he's physically fit to. I make him carry a cell phone if we're separated and after this story, I may just equip him with a pocket horn for protection. I don't care if that's being overprotective; he's tall but thin and would not be able to fight off some larger felon.

It's not him I don't trust, it's the rest of this sick fucking world that I don't trust. Too many mistakes roaming free and even living nearby nowadays. Boys aren't exempt from kidnappers and predators, as last year proved. Those kids were lucky they survived. And it is true; we're seeing more and more cases like this cropping up and more than a few of them go unsolved.

[npincus]

53. So awful.

:cry:

[formerrepuke]

60. Most horrifying of all: That guy looks like ME.. well, not exactly, but he looks

like just about any young-ish white dude in shorts and a t-shirt. Monsters are real- and they look just like us. (I realize that he has been charged, but not convicted of anything at this time)

[malaise]

76. Hope you don't look as creepy

Reminds me of young Anthony Perkins in Psycho.

He's 26, married with a young child. What in hell drives a man to do this?

[Blue_Roses]

83. Is that him?

nt

[malaise]

84. Yep

Saw him on MSNBC a while ago. Looks like a kid. Why does a 26 year old man with a young family believe he can do this and not get caught. How dumb and sick are these people.

[Blue_Roses]

61. I have been consumed by this too...

I think as a parent, we all grieve. :cry:

[blues90]

74. It is absolutely horrible , --

/and the scary sick part is this can happen anywhere at anytime .

The fact that is was in daylight and no one saw this or tried to stop this amazes me . It does not matter whether shoe was white or black or hispanic to me it's all just as horrible .

People now days if they saw this may have felt it was just a couple playing around or simply did not want to risk their own life that is if anyone saw this happen .

Then you think about what goes through someones mind to stalk someone else makes it even more of a horror .

I know people from many age groups die in accidents but this is not predetermined but it is still a part of america gone mad because I do feel many or most accidents could be avoided if everyone realized the danger driving a car and took this serious , usually they don;t until it happens to them . It reminds me of how this country sits in the hands of criminals in the white house and ignore it feeling safe until they feel the effects . It seems no one is safe anywhere .

I hope I am at least spared from the story of how she died , I know the news is just waiting for the details and we don't need these .

[Firespirit]

81. It's so depressing that I feel forced to do this

but, as a small-framed young woman in an area with concealed carry prohibited, I have felt it necessary to have a long, SHARP blade immediately available in my purse, I've thought about exactly where I'd use it on someone if it became necessary, and I would be fully prepared to kill in order to defend myself from attack.

Why?

I don't hate "men." I don't want to castrate them, drive them out of work, use them as slaves, or whatever insane notions the anti-feminist types think women secretly want to do to all males. Why do so many of THEM clearly HATE women?

[PCIntern]

82. As a male who gets to work in the dark many mornings

I do the same thing.

In 20+ years of carrying it, I've had my hand on it maybe 5 times, never withdrew it. Good to know it's there and gives one a small, but fighting chance. You go, girl.

Yeah, I know men aren't supposed to say that but hoo cares?

:hi:

[LisaL]

87. And who do you think those who kidnap little boys hate?

What does it have to do with hating women?

[Firespirit]

100. Children, of course

Are you going to deny that there is a large group of scum-sucking men in the world who hate people they perceive as "weaker" than themselves?

There is a very good reason why most victims of kidnapping are women and children, and why most perpetrators are men. Our society fosters a deep-rooted contempt for people considered weak, dehumanizing them in subtle ways. The fallout of it manifests itself in those who, like this guy, have no qualms about committing horrific crimes.

[Maddy McCall]

88. His myspace page, if anyone cares to see it.

http://www.myspace.com/97922785

[bicentennial_baby]

94. Ok, that was creepy...

[noamnety]

98. Oh!

wow

favorite movie - a clockwork orange is listed

for a long while I had a sig asking why we had a rapist for an avatar
skinner just removed it a few days ago, and then my sig thanked him for removing it
I had just changed it this morning again

seeing that as his favorite movie is just so ... uncomfortable.

[rainbow4321]

89. Dropped my daughter off at the mall yesterday

with even more strict instructions to not leave the mall..not even to wait for me in *front* of the mall door. It's scary as hell to think that a quick trip to the store can result in the kidnapping/death of someone.
I remember hearing some law enforcement guest on a talk show a while back with advise for those who are kidnapped. Do whatever it takes, cause as much of a commotion as you need to at the scene of the kidnapping ("point A", he called it), even if the kidnapper threatens to kill you right there...cuz once you leave that scene and get taken away to "point B"--(where ever it is you are taken) odds are you are going to get killed anyway, that the odds of you surviving at point B and released unharmed are zero.
Having said that, there is no telling what happened to this girl at the scene of the kidnapping, she could have been knocked out and unable to do anything at all.

[Bjornsdotter]

93. Just had this talk again

....with my daughter who also just graduated from high school. It's a parent's nightmare.

Cheers

[Ilsa]

104. It is a horrible story.

I was sexually assaulted June 6, 20 years ago in my home. Stories like this remind me of how cruel the world can be. This poor girl and her family. Their lives have been ruined. No one will be the same.

Girls have to learn about how to fend off someone like this monster. Gain DeBecker, a security expert, said that a person, when under aggravated attack, has to assume and even accept that they will probably get hurt. Once this is accepted, you are less likely to be shocked by it and can react more freely in your own defense.

DeBecker also said that women have stronger intuition to make up for typically being smaller. He advises women to follow heir gut feeling. If they feel they are being watched or followed, there is a good chance that they are.