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State Legal Advisor John Bellinger at the Hague: We Don't Violate International Law

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-09-07 04:14 PM
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State Legal Advisor John Bellinger at the Hague: We Don't Violate International Law
Saturday, June 09, 2007

We Don't Violate International Law--"We have simply not reached the result or interpretation that (our) critics prefer"

Marty Lederman

That's the Orwellian message from State Legal Advisor John Bellinger at the Hague on Wednesday, in a lecture entitled "The United States and International Law."

What are these "results" and "interpretations" of international law that our critics do not "prefer"?

That "extreme sensory deprivation" is permissible.

Not to mention waterboarding.

And hypothermia.

And stress positions.

And severe sleep deprivation.

And detaining six-year-olds in order to use them as leverage against their parents.

And disappearances, outside the purview of any legal system.

And renditions to nations in which torture is common, or to CIA "black sites" in Poland and Romania in which some or all of the above techniques are used.

And refusing to cooperate with an Italian prosecution of CIA and Italian agents who engaged in such lawbreaking, even when the prosecutors are those who have been fighting terrorism for years.

And, when confronted with the evidence of such barbarism, to send Mr. Bellinger to Europe with the explanation that we can hardly be faulted because "there is a legal murkiness that applies to international terrorism."

And, to send Mr. Bellinger to Europe once again to also assert that the Convention Against Torture does not apply at all to the armed conflict against Al Qaeda, because it is superseded by the Geneva Conventions -- treaties that the Administration insisted do nothing at all to protect our detainees. (In his Hague speech on Wednesday, Bellinger stated that "I should add that contrary to what you might hear from some critics,no one in the United States government has sought to disregard or avoid these obligations (under the CAT)." Well, except that the Bush Administration has rendered legal opinions that (i) interpreted away to nothing the prohibition on cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment, particularly overseas; (ii) insisted that the prohibition on rendition does not apply if the rendition begins in a European nation rather than in the United States; and, for good measure, (iii) concluded that the CAT is completely inapplicable to our current armed conflicts. Other than that, we don't seek to disregard or avoid our CAT obligations.)

To his credit, Bellinger addressed these issues directly in his speech. But what he said is quite remarkable:

This Administration has worked hard to identify and implement international rules applicable to these terrorist suspects. We have not ignored, changed, or re-interpreted existing international law. In fact, last year, our Supreme Court ruled that the one provision of the Geneva Conventions that does apply, even if the Conventions as a whole do not, is Common Article 3.

Did Bellinger utter this with a straight face? The Supreme Court, of course, is not the "Administration." And the actual Administration fought tooth and nail against that very holding for five years, because the conclusion that Common Article 3 did not apply was the critical cornerstone of its interrogation practices, which employ the "cruel treatment" CA3 forbids.

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hobbit709 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-09-07 04:17 PM
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1. And I never exceeded the speed limit in my life either
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kath Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-09-07 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Me neither. And I've never even told so much as a "white" lie, much less
a real one. And I NEVER gossip, or say anything bad about anyone I know.

Just trying to live up to the consummate goodness of the current Murkan govmint...
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PDJane Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-09-07 04:59 PM
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3. This administration has been ignoring international law
from the very beginning. If they hadn't been, the first thing that was bombed in Iraq would not have been the civilian infrastructure, but military targets.

Hospitals would have been rebuilt, the guages on oil lines would have been repaired, and medicines and food would have been coming to the populace. Afghanistan would not have been bombed back to the stone age.

In fact, Iraq would not have been invaded at all, nor would Afghanistan, under the dictates of international law.

Those bombings were meant to serve as a salutory lesson. So were the sanctions and the invasion.

This is slicing and dicing and spin of the worst kind. I'm disgusted at the moment.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jun-09-07 06:57 PM
Response to Original message
4. Kick! n/t
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Senator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-10-07 01:05 AM
Response to Original message
5. He's Crazy Too --- And Now, A War Criminal
He happily waves the Hamdan Ruling, then "ignores" or "re-interprets" or "disregards" or "avoids" the REALITY that it was a finding that YEARS OF WAR CRIMES had already been committed.

Sorry, but "Honestly, I've stopped committing crimes," is not a defense for crimes already committed.

What planet are these people on?

The speech itself is prosecutable. He ought to be on his way back to The Hague as a defendant.

----
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Canuckistanian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-10-07 02:03 AM
Response to Original message
6. So, the US gets to violate law and interpret it at the same time?
I'm going to try that for my next parking ticket.
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indepat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-10-07 09:08 PM
Response to Original message
7. We neither violate international law, start illegal wars, commit war crimes nor lie
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