"One would be hard-pressed to argue that homosexuals in America are second-class citizens."

[bryant69]

This is from an article at Townhall, contrasting the allowing of Interracial marriages with the with the allowing of Homosexual Marriages --> http://www.townhall.com/Columnists/LaShawnBarber/2007/06/11/interracial_marriage_slippery_slope

Obviously a crap article on a number of levels, but that line blew me away. I suspect many would not be hard pressed at all to make that argument.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[deadmessengers]

1. What a crock

But, I'm glad they brought up the fact that it's been 40 years since Loving v. Virginia, a ruling from which I've personally benefited immensely.

The fact is that the arguments against gay marriage today are EXACTLY the same ones as the ones made against interracial marriage 50 years ago. Every single argument I've ever heard (in both cases) can be boiled down to a giant logical fallacy (typically reductio ad absurdum or appeal to authority), or outright bigotry (gays/blacks are yucky). I've never heard an argument against either one that made sense.

[Totally Committed]

2. Know Your Source: LaSawn Barber's Bio

I don't care what you say about me. Just spell my name right! "I am a former liberal and current renegade supporter of conservative ideals. I am an Independent conservative, not a member of the Republican or Democratic parties.

If you must refer to my race, call me black, not “African American.” It is offensive to me. There is no such color, race, or nationality. I am an American of African descent.
I have degrees in English and law.

I blog about faith and politics, and I like to talk about these topics, too.

I am a freelance writer and entrepreneur. Visit my business web site, The Language Artist. I provide blog consulting, writing, editing, and document preparation services.

In addition to running this site, I blog at Fantasy Fiction for Christians in my “spare” time.

Very Brief Bio

I was born and raised in South Carolina, and I’ve lived in Washington, D.C., for about eight years.
I’ve always wanted to be a writer. I can’t remember a time when I didn’t. When I was a child, I wrote little “books” made of notebook paper folded in half or in quarters. What were the books about? Typical girl stuff. My heroines tended to be ice skaters vying for the gold and the guy. I was probably influenced by the 1978 movie “Ice Castles,” the 1980 Winter Olympics, and the 1981 movie “Miracle on Ice.” Silly? Well, I was a kid.

For many years I talked about writing for publication, but keeping a personal journal (for over 20 years now) was the only disciplined writing I’d ever done. After graduating from South Carolina State University and Temple University School of Law (where I wrote a weekly “humor” column for the law school newsletter), I was still talking.

I’ve held a variety of mostly boring, non-writing, or writing jobs unrelated to what I wanted to do. I was even a flight attendant for a few months (long story), which was interesting but not as entertaining as working for a Democratic senator on Capitol Hill during what’s-his-name’s Impeachment trial.

One day I realized I was almost 30-years-old (!) and still talking about writing and trying to figure out what I wanted to be when I grew up. But I had a few things to deal with first (Read A Sobering Truth).

Writing/Blogging

After I became sober and submitted myself to Christ, I knew it was time to stop talking and start writing. A few months after my 35th birthday, I penned my first opinion piece, which was published in the Philadelphia Inquirer the week after I sent it. The testimony article was written shortly after, and Today’s Christian Woman agreed to publish it. I was encouraged, to say the least.

Being a Christian helped me deal with another life hurdle. After failing the bar exam one time too many, I decided to move on. I couldn’t face putting in more time, effort, and money to prepare for and take it. The disappointment was almost unbearable, but life rolled on. Freelance writing for a living was my new career goal.

Almost three years after my first published article, I’m freelance writing and blog consulting for a living. I write a monthly political column for the Washington Examiner. My articles, book reviews, columns, and essays have been published in print: Washington Times, Washington Post, St. Louis Post-Dispatch, Denver Post, Baltimore Times, Today’s Christian Woman and other publications. My work also appeared online at Jewish World Review, National Review Online, Townhall.com and other sites. See Writings for samples.

Before the blog took over, I used to write a bi-weekly political column published on sites like MichNews.com, Grace-Centered Magazine, and American Daily. I started blogging in November 2003 because I needed a place to vent between columns. I’d heard about blogs, although I didn’t know why they were called “blogs.” Read the Blog Creation/Consulting page of my business site for details. The more I blogged, the less frequently I wrote and submitted the column. At one point I felt guilty about blogging. Seems unbelievable now.

Three years later, La Shawn Barber’s Corner is still going strong and will continue, God willing. This blog has opened many doors professionally and personally.

Talking

Writing has opened up new opportunities and adventures. I spoke to a group of college students at a conference called Conservative University 2004, sponsored by Accuracy In Academia. Star Parker (on the right) and I were on the same discussion panel. I wrote about the event (and having lunch with Star) on my blog.

I’m a credentialed blogger at the Conservative Political Action Conference, and I met many fellow conservatives, including one of my favorite writers, Michelle Malkin. I’ve been a guest on radio shows like The Savage Nation with Michael Savage (another Independent conservative), “The Jesse Lee Peterson Show” with Reverend Jesse Peterson of BOND, and Hugh Hewitt’s show.

I’ve been interviewed in print and on the radio. See the Press page for links.

I’ve appeared on the BBC, MSNBC, and C-SPAN, and this blog has been featured on CNN, MSNBC, the Washington Post, Dallas Morning News, and the Weekly Standard.

Working

In 2005, I made several appearances on MSNBC’s Connected Coast to Coast (with Ron Reagan and Monica Crowley) as a “blog reporter” and featured guest. I was also featured in a BBC news story about blogging.

A combination of factors — success as a political blogger, conference speaking, TV guest spots, and press generated from doing what I consider a labor of love — gave me courage to give up the horrible 9-5 grind, make a leap of faith, step out on my own, and sell what I know to people willing to buy it. As you may have noticed, I’m not shy about self-promotion.

I know what it takes to make a blog successful, and so many businesses get it wrong or don’t get it at all. I want to use my passion for expression and growing knowledge about the new medium and marketing tool to benefit others (Visit The Language Artist!). Being paid to do that is a dream fulfilled.

Life is a work in progress. Check back for updates.

http://lashawnbarber.com/bio/


I don't even need to add anything to that, do I?

TC

[rasputin1952]

3. Odd...homosexuals are "not second class citizens"...but they

sure as hell are treated as such. If there were "3rd class citizens" they would be treated as such.

Why is there such difficulty in realizing that each human being is an equal partner in life's journey? Is it so ingrained, or is it taught that women, blacks, gays, asians...Jesus, pick a group, are to be treated as unequals because they are "different?"

We live, we breathe, we think, (well sometimes), we engage in searches for truth and wisdom....All of these things are human qualities, all of us are human beings....Is it so much to ask that women, minorities, GLBT's, poor white males, for God's sake, anybody to be treated w/dignity and respect?

I have spent a lifetime trying to make headway in equality for all people, I've seen some...but there is a long way to go, it is a group effort, a human effort. Each "group" must come together and realize that we are in this together, and we need to join forces in the search for equality...isn't that what equality is all about?

Straight, Gay, caucasian, black, asian, male, female...come together in the the fight for equality and respect...Stop the division of forces...stop the hate...fight it w/understanding and love...learn to forgive...learn to live.

[BootinUp]

11. I believe what keeps it going is

basically a peer pressure. That is people risk being ostracized for taking a position against authorities like their church etc. And then its just a lot of hate/fear of things people don't understand that accounts for the rest.

[rasputin1952]

15. There is a fear f questioning authority,,,but I think that authority

should be questioned, as it is the only way to keep it in check.

As for the religious aspects...people use religion to justify their hatred and ignorance. With very few mentions of homosexuality in the Bible, and a whole shitload of diatribes against hypocrisy, one would think that is would be obvious where the "sin" lies. Cherry picking pieces of scripture is a mainstay in keeping fear and hatred rampant...precisely the opposite of what is really being taught. It is sad that people remain ignorant of so many factors they think they are knowledgeable in.

[EstimatedProphet]

4. They'd be really hard-pressed if they don't know any

Which I suspect is the underlying truth.

[Name removed]

5. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[NMMNG]

6. They're so full of garbage, as usual

But then they know that as well as we do.

Marriage is a legal union and social institution recognized by the states as serving fundamental purposes: providing structure for family formation and rearing children, and acting as a stabilizing influence that benefits the whole society.

Same sex couples can and do form families and have children. The legal union of marriage also is recognized by the states and federal government for over one thousand legal rights such as consent for medical procedures, tax returns, health insurance coverage, child custody, etc.

The whole RW attempt to keep same sex people down is pure bigotry, nothing more.

[fudge stripe cookays]

7. Obviously, a crap article.

Then why do you feel the need to post it here? Kind of lends it validity by acknowledging it.

My friend is not a fucking coward by the way. So you can tell me to fuck off now. As usual.

[MonkeyFunk]

9. This belongs in the GLBT forum n/t

[LeftCoast]

10. Yeah! Keep all the icky gay stuff outta GD!

Whatever, Mary. :eyes:

[MonkeyFunk]

12. It's a joke,

Mary.

The OP likes to be the religion thread nanny of GD.

:eyes:

[Divine Discontent]

63. anita bryant? n/t

[Morgana LaFey]

75. It belongs right here, thank you very little.

Dammit. MORE discrimination, MORE proof of second class citizenship, "your concerns don't matter and we shouldn't have to even be bothere dto see them discussed."

Bullshit.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[AlCzervik]

13. this article is total shit and i'm tired of people equating gay marriage to

letting people have multiple wives, it's bullshit. Gay people are asking for the right to have their marriage recognized, they aren't asking to marry 5 people at the same time. old and tired.

[Midlodemocrat]

24. You said it better than I would have.

:applause:

[tkmorris]

14. Why on EARTH did you post this?

The internet is full of idiots with repulsive anachronistic viewpoints, but what is the point in repeating their drivel? If it had been someone important, someone in a position of power, I could see the relevance but such isn't the case here.

[bryant69]

18. In all honesty I was thinking of using it as fodder for the blog

My main shtick is taking apart articles like this. I had just made a post there and so wasn't in a rush, so I thought I'd post it here and see what kind of response I got, see if that sparked anything. Maybe I'd go back to it for the blog; maybe not (in this case not).

I don't do that very often, I don't like posting the same stuff here as over there.

Bryant

[Sapphocrat]

52. Yeah, it sparks something.

:puke:

There's more than enough of this garbage all over the Web, and Town Hall doesn't publish the worst of it.

You really want to find vomit-making, anti-gay lies and hatred to blog? Hit CNSNews, Christian Newswire, Catholic Daily, Virtue Online, Post Chronicle, Lifesite, Jamaica Gleaner, Jamaica Observer, FamilyPolicy.net, GetReligion, Conservative Voice, Baptist Press News, NewsByUs, Christian Post, Spero News...

That should get you started.

[Bluebear]

53. It will "blow you away"! nt

[bryant69]

54. I don't want to find vomit making anti gay lies to blog

I regret having posted this much.

But as for seeking out the fringe, I'm not as interested in doing that because I don't think it's as relevant, but thank you for the information.

Bryant

[Sapphocrat]

57. What makes you think they're all fringe? n/t

[bryant69]

58. I suppose because I haven't heard of most of them

And I am pretty involved in conservative studies for the website.

Tell you what though - sometime later on this week I'll sit down and go through them all - I've bookmarked that post and I'll review them.

Bryant

[Sapphocrat]

59. Fair enough. n/t

[Bluebear]

16. Wow, the thread just shrunk in size by half! nt

[bryant69]

19. Kind of wierd that deleted the inital post, isn't it? n/t

[applegrove]

17. You have to look to the Youth to see how they are handling being second

class citizens. And many are hurting. That's how ya tell.

[dsc]

20. I get so tired of hearing this nonsense

The simple fact is that in every state except MA, NH, VT, ME, CT, RI, NY, NJ, MD, IL, CA, NV, NM, MN, HI and IA gays can be fired from their jobs simply for being gay. The simple fact is that in every state except CT, NH, MA, VT, CA, HI, and NJ gay couples are legal strangers with none of the attendent rights of even a one hour long marriage. In a majority of the states it is OK to bully gay kids. Just what is that if it isn't second class citizenship?

[mema42]

90. Really no one should be a second class citizen based

No one should be a second class citizen. I admit when it comes to the marriage thing, I'd rather see marriage change to just a religious practice, and every one get civil unions. No matter what their sexual orientation.

It doesn't seem to be heading my way though, so they should do whatever it takes to let people be happy as families, and if marriage is what people want they should get it. Sexual orientation should not be part of the criteria.


That would leave an out for those who don't want government in their relationships at all but do want the religious part of it.

[nini]

21. Her last line says it all

"Individuals are worthy of equal treatment under the law, regardless of race, but an individual’s lifestyle choices are not."


She says being gay is lifestyle choice.. she's an idiot.

[TankLV]

64. "Lifestyle"? WHAT "lifestyle"?

The poor AIDs infected rotting in some hellhole "lifestyle"?

The self loathing rich greedy selfish log cabin "lifestyle"?

The trying to make ends meet raising young children "lifestyle"?

The hiding so I won't get the crap beaten out of me by my parents/friends/family "lifestyle"?

The I want to kill myself because there's something wrong with me because that's what they tell me "lifestyle"?

The I just want to be left alone and accepted like everyone else "lifestyle"?

The its none of your business - by the way have YOU ever been fucked "lifestyle?

IT'S NOT A "LIFESTYLE" GODDAMMIT! It's a just ONE FACT of one's life!

[AlCzervik]

22. another magic thread, the more responses it gets the shorter it becomes.

[Madspirit]

23. ...and stop making empty promises about leaving...n/t

[bryant69]

25. If you actually proved your point i would leave

But you didn't bother. Just declared yourself the winner and quit

Bryant

[Madspirit]

26. Do You Actually Stomp Your Little Feet and Turn Red?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Name removed]

27. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Bluebear]

37. :)

[fudge stripe cookays]

61. .

"GET OFF MY BRIDGE!"

:D

[The Straight Story]

39. Why was that even necessary?

And how is it related to the OP and what the person it linked to had to say?

Given the chance to defend the rights of gays to marry (which I support) you went off on a tangent here. One that could better have been served by a private message.

The question that has arisen is 'if we allow a change to marriage based on X, why not on Y also?' - that status quo sees it all as this in many ways, and I think that is what the OP was addressing.

Why stop at same sex? Can the people arguing to redefine what many see as traditional marriage turn around and condemn other sorts?

[Bluebear]

40. That's the problem with "deleted subthread" all over the place

The visitor who stops in later doesn't see what went on beforehand.

[The Straight Story]

41. Understand that, seen a few myself of late and wondered :)

Sometimes I think we should leave em, but then this is not my board ;)

I think the questions addressed are valid - in the sense that one is asking where one draws the line or does one even draw a line?

My best friend, my wife's, and my brother-in-law are all gay and in committed relationships and I would like nothing more than to see them all be able to be married and happy as I am. But I can also see why some ask 'why not other relationships that are not traditional'?

It comes down to: Are we willing to stand by others as we are asking them to stand by us? Why not embrace things like polygamy, et al, and fight for them as well to enjoy the same things we are asking for?

The IDEAL (to me anyway as I have seen it) of a 'traditional' marriage is that there is a 'potential' for said couples to create offspring (though not all will, they have that potential in general) and some want to protect that ideal in reference to what it means to marry.

To me, it is not up to me to decide the reasons why but to support fellow humans in a committed relationship and ensure they are not fucked over based on their personal choice. Why should it end on a '1 to 1' mapping (ie, male to female, male/male, female/female) - if we want to support choice why not support all choice?

[bryant69]

43. A couple of poeple here read me wrong and assumed I was in agreement

with the person I quoted. One of them made an insinuation to that effect and I reacted badly. Dozens of people came to his or her rescue, most of them pretending that I must be a homophobe to have posted the initial post. It kind of degenerated from there.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[libnnc]

28. Piece of shit. Waste of bandwidth.

Why is this crap even here?

[bryant69]

29. I suppose because i haven't been banned yet.

Doubtless many are working to fix that as we speak.

Bryant

[libnnc]

30. What? So you meant to post this crap article?

I don't understand the point. What's your malfunction?

[bryant69]

31. I explained my reasonings above - response 18

Obviously I don't agree with this article.

Bryant

[libnnc]

33. If you don't agree with it why do you need our input?

If you know it's bullshit why the hell do you need us to help you pick it apart?

Dispute it your own damn self.

[bryant69]

34. Let's just chaul it up to me being an ignorant asshole, why don't we?

I think that's an explanation we can all live with.

[libnnc]

35. Whatever you say...

Crazy stupid shit.

[Madspirit]

32. Paranoia requires a great deal of vanity

I doubt anyone is even thinking of you.
Lee

[bryant69]

36. Not to put too fine a point on it, but

you clearly are.

Bryant

[IChing]

38. You lost me......a long time ago

you argue on the other side of the environment,
you leave the residue of your polls and thoughts

that is like a snail leaving a slime across the progressive experience
that is this board

and you think that we don't see who you are.

[bryant69]

42. I'm like a snail?

That is a step up from what most people call me.

Bryant

[fudge stripe cookays]

60. Don't forget...

his attitudes on choice for the ladies!

[bryant69]

65. What attitudes would those be?

The fact that I'm pro choice?

Bryant

[fudge stripe cookays]

67. The fact that you SAY you're pro choice.

But FAVOR women having children. And post inflammatory threads asking us if we would EVER change our minds about it. That's completely an individual decision, and your feedback is not needed about our reproductive systems, thanks.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1087803&mesg_id=1090780

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=734521

[bryant69]

68. Lord give me strength.

Let's do this.

1. Being Pro Choice means you are in favor of woman having the freedom to choose whether or not to have an abortion. Nothing I said contradicts that. I have an opinion on whether or not people should have abortions, but I don't get to choose. It's worth noting that my position is no that far off of most mainstream democratic politicians - Remember Bill Clinton's position? Safe legal and rare? I'd go along with that.

2. That poll was not intended to be inflammatory; rather the wording I used is pretty subdued. If someone else has posted it, you probably wouldn't think twice about it.

3. You need to get past your hatred of me and start thinking rationally.

Bryant

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

69. ...

:applause:

[fudge stripe cookays]

71. When you...

stop posting your "Look what I found on a right wing blog but TOTALLY don't support!" posts, I'll think about it.

Meanwhile, you keep posting personal attacks at everyone who disagrees with you. I'll watch and enjoy.

[bryant69]

72. I guess I'll have to live without your approval

Since I am unlikely to stop defending myself against slanders and defamations.

You're pretty sad when you get right to it. Oh well.

Bryant

[fudge stripe cookays]

73. Sad.

Hardly.

I have a life outside the internet. Unlike you.

[bryant69]

74. You are an expert on my life now?

I have a life outside the internet as well. What I find sad is your all consuming hatred.

Bryant

[Name removed]

77. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bryant69]

78. I am determined to get the last word

Unlike you who never respond to any of my posts. Laughs.

Whatever you say, you sad little person.

Bryant

[uppityperson]

79. Pro-choice to me is being bale to chose whether or not to have a LEGAL abortion or a back alley one.

Keeping the ability to chose a legal hygienic one over an illegal back-alley one is importatnt.

[bryant69]

80. Yes I agree with you

Isn't that what I said?

Or what?

Bryant

[uppityperson]

81. Not quite.

You said "Being Pro Choice means you are in favor of woman having the freedom to choose whether or not to have an abortion. "
I said " Pro-choice to me is being abale to chose whether or not to have a LEGAL abortion or a back alley one."

There is a difference between being able to chose to have an abortion or not, and being able to chose a hygienic legal one or a do-it-yourself illegal back alley one. Your definition is about abortion, my definition is about safety.

[bryant69]

82. OK - that's splitting hair pretty finely.

I guess you must be determined to paint me as anti-choice.

But to clarify, what I meant by having the freedom to choose whether or not to have an abortion was the legal freedom to do so. That's what I meant. Obviously I suppose if you want a back alley illegal, you have the freedom to do so even under our current system; but presumably most people would like a legal safe abortion, should they want one at all. And I think they should have the right to have a safe legal abortion.

Is that clear enough for you?

Bryant

[uppityperson]

83. Not painting you as anything, just replying to your question.

You don't need to be defensive or accusatory, I am just replying to what you asked.

I don't see it as hair splitting at all. There is a big difference between being able to chose to have an abortion and the choice of legal/illegal one. What you write here is along what I think, keep them safe and legal.

[bryant69]

84. Yeah it's hard to believe i would be defensive. n/t

[uppityperson]

85. I think you may have missed the "to me" in my post that started this subthread

[bryant69]

86. With the implication being that I probably was fine if with people

being able to choose between the clothes-hanger special and no abortion at all. I mean that's a choice isn't it?

Bryant

[uppityperson]

87. I give you my opinion and you say I am passing judgement on you. Not my problem.

I give you my opinion and you say I am passing judgement on you. Not my problem. If you want to fight, you will need to find someone else.

[bryant69]

88. Laughs. I can see you are a very moral person. I'll let you go on your way. n/t

[Zuiderelle]

44. Oh, I think I'll post "Mein Kampf"

obviously a crap book on a number of levels, but it just blows you away.

:eyes:

[bryant69]

45. Nice. Thank you for your participation. n/t

[Zuiderelle]

46. What? I didn't write it.

[bryant69]

47. I get the point you are trying to make.

I wouldn't post something like this if I didn't agree with it, I guess.

Whatever.

Bryant

[Zuiderelle]

48. When RW books like "Godless" and sites like "Rightwingstuff.com" are advertised on the site...

you linked, and when the quote you chose to use as your subject is that inflammatory, I have to wonder what the purpose of posting it was.

[bryant69]

49. The site I linked to is Townhall? You aren't familiar with it?

Townhall was founded by the ultra Conservative heritage foundation - they broke off about 2 years ago (I think) but they are still ultra conservative. What they provide is a clearing house of mainstream conservative thought; the whole spectrum from George Will to Ann Coulter (and parts beyond). If you want to find out what the other side is worked up about, it's a good barometer for that.

It's useful for me, since my blog's shtick is taking apart conservative articles.

Does everybody who quotes George W. Bush around here run the risk of having people think that the poster agrees with him?

Bryant

[Zuiderelle]

50. Yes, I'm familiar with it... I was pointing out the obvious RW nature of it to anyone

who was not. And I'm still curious why you would post it here. What good does it do to discuss garbage from irredeemable idiots like the author of that article?

Anyone who believes any of that drivel is not going to be convinced that it's not gospel, and anyone here is not going to be swayed by it either. I just don't get it. The subject offends me, and I don't want to read that shit here.

La Shawn Barber is not Bush. She means absolutely nothing to me, and I don't like seeing her hatred quoted here. I don't see what good it does us.

[bryant69]

51. Well don't worry I've learned my lesson

I won't be posting anything like that again.

Bryant

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

55. I Feel For Ya Bryant69. I'm In Absolute AWE At How You've Been Abused Here.

I don't know what in the world is causing some of the to knee jerk react so unfairly towards you, but I feel for what you've had to put up with in this thread.

I can't find a single reason why your posting this thread, with genuine intent to point out the absurdity of the article, generated so much attack and vitriol by some.

Hang in there man. Don't let em bring ya down too much. I see you said you won't post things like this anymore, but do that based on your own choice, not because you are avoiding the abuse from those who can't handle mature discussion. If you refuse to post for the latter, you're letting them win and you shouldn't.

Peace bro.

[bryant69]

56. Thank you for your thoughts. n/t.

[Zomby Woof]

76. Oh, the pathos

:nopity: :cry:

[Rex]

62. Wow.

Looks like a battlezone! Name Removed, deleted sub-thread, who won?

[triguy46]

66. Isn't a larger issue the fact that we have a large and growing

number of second class citizens? You can cut it by whatever demographic you choose: low income wage earners; non-insured; elderly; mentally ill; migrant worker. Or by statistic: Federal poverty level; 125% of poverty level; 150%. Children on free and reduced lunches at school. Same sex marriage is just one of the litany. These become a defacto second class because of their lack of access to education, health care, and other things that most of us can manage. The face is that of the middle aged woman working at a fast food restaurant at 2AM. The 70 year old sweeping floors in Walmart. We see them daily.

I won't argue, defend or challenge the premise of the initial thread, rather point out that the caste system is alive and well.

So in this case, the case could be made between 'are they' or 'should they be'? That is we have millions of second class citizens, whether its right or not, their lack of empowerment makes them defacto second class citizens. Should they be? Of course not, and that is why we fight the good fight.

I would suggest that the issue of marriage between same sex couples is another example of how we as a society do assign 'caste' and 'class.' Don't like it, but it does happen. Lets work to address the causes of and impact of such social policies.

[lies and propaganda]

70. you would be hard pressed to prove otherwise,,,

Im not reading that garbage, because its utter bullshit.

[uppityperson]

89. 201 vs 88 posts

Says on GD main page this topic has had 201 replies yet I see only 88. That's a lot of deleted posts.