Gore calls for elimination of payroll taxes

[elehhhhna]

Gore calls for elimination of payroll taxes, CO2 freeze

RAW STORY
Published: Monday September 18, 2006


Former Vice President Al Gore has called for the end of the payroll tax and a freeze on CO2 emissions to "solve the climate crisis," RAW STORY has learned.

"My purpose," Gore told a crowd at NYU, "is not to present a comprehensive and detailed blueprint, for that is a task for our democracy as a whole." Gore is calling on lawmakers to "expand the limits of what is politically possible" and take major action to halt global warming.

"We should start by immediately freezing CO2 emissions," Gore indicated, "and then beginning sharp reductions." Gore also called for a ratification of the Kyoto Treaty.

"Third, a responsible approach to solutions would avoid the mistake of trying to find a single magic 'silver bullet,'" he elaborated, "and recognize that the answer will involve what Bill McKibben has called 'silver-buckshot' -- numerous important solutions, all of which are hard, but no one of which is by itself the full answer for our problem."

The former Vice President also called for a "revenue-neutral tax-swap," eliminating all payroll taxes in exchange for pollutant taxes.





http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Gore_calls_for_elimination_of_payroll_0918.html

[Phredicles]

1. Y'know Mr. Gore, you could really help make these things happen if

you were the president. Just sayin'.O8)

[ikojo]

2. The payroll tax is among the most regressive

taxes..it taxes only earned wages.

[papau]

14. right - indeed a simple tax cut for Dems is a 2% payroll tax cut for employees - no cut for

employers -

all paid for by removing the cap on the amount of wages taxed - the extra money from all wages being taxed, even after giving the rich huge Social Security checks, pays for the tax reduction because the Social Security benefit formula is progressive and the very rich greatly overpay for their benefit check.

[ozymandius]

34. You said it papau.

This has the double benefit of putting money in the hands of those who would spend it: poor and middle class. This would feed money back into the economic mainframe for those who directly benefit from the extra disposable income.

[tblue37]

23. And only up to $50,000, I beleive--

so someone who earns more pays less.

[mopinko]

40. closer to $90K

there is a max payment and a max benefit. it is INSURANCE! basic insurance. see, basic, only just so much per customer, even if you are rich. you can't have any more than the basic? see.
/rant sorry, pet peeve.

[lumberjack_jeff]

42. ... but it pays for a program that only benefits workers.

Even Al is entitled to a strike from time to time.

Social security without payroll taxes is welfare.

[melody]

3. Gosh, he's sounding very Presidential for a non-candidate

:bounce::bounce::bounce:

[BurtWorm]

5. I kind of noticed that to.

:bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

[AikidoSoul]

39. He IS presidential. He IS our president. Go AL!!

:bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce::bounce:

[malaise]

8. Al Gore is the

next President.

[Skink]

4. Does he have Secret service?

[NYCGirl]

9. No. Former VPs don't. NT

[Pirate Smile]

12. No - only former Presidents and their families get secret service protection for life.

[Retired AF Dem]

21. Used to be

Former presidents and their spouses for their lifetimes, except when the spouse remarries. In 1997, Congressional legislation became effective limiting Secret Service protection to former presidents for a period of not more than 10 years from the date the former president leaves office

http://www.secretservice.gov/protection.shtml

[Pirate Smile]

24. What a shock that a Republican Congress decided to do that during the Clinton Administration.

[SharonRB]

45. Yup -- Bush will only have protection for 10 years after he leaves office

"How long do former presidents receive Secret Service protection after they leave office?

In 1965, Congress authorized the Secret Service (Public Law 89-186) to protect a former president and his/her spouse during their lifetime, unless they decline protection. In 1997, Congress enacted legislation (Public Law 103-329) that limits Secret Service protection for former presidents to 10 years after leaving office. Under this new law, individuals who are in office before January 1, 1997, will continue to receive Secret Service protection for their lifetime. Individuals elected to office after that time will receive protection for 10 years after leaving office. Therefore, President Clinton will be the last president to receive lifetime protection."


Of course, if he's in prison, I guess it won't matter. :evilgrin:

[rzemanfl]

25. Cheney too? n/t

[Pirate Smile]

38. I don't know if the Dick Cheney/Fourth Branch of Government is covered.

:)

[PA Democrat]

54. LOL! Dick is busily drafting a special Dick ( as opposed to executive) order

to provide him with his own personal army upon retirement. Hey, why can't he still start wars and plunder other countries' natural resources after he leaves the White House. Correction, make that IF he leaves the White House.

[AzDar]

6. Swoon....Let's make it HAPPEN, President Gore.

:loveya:

[Uncle Joe]

7. Thanks for the thread elehhhna.

Kicked and recommended.

[elehhhhna]

10. Anytime. I like to repost this periodically.

along with the Bush'es interview where they "had a good laugh" hte night of 9/11 and of course, the audio of "Peaance freeance", here:

http://www.unoriginal.co.uk/Audio/dubya/George%20W.%20Bush%20-%20UNORIGINAL.CO.UK%20-%20Peance,%20freance.mp3

[sellitman]

11. Run Al and make it so.

Pretty please!!!!!!!!!

[glowing]

13. How would this work? What kind of tax breaks would the poor and

middle class get? Income tax breaks come with children, buying a home... I would assume that there would be more tax on having children, since they would add CO2 emissions, and unless you have an extra 5 to 10,000, making your home "green" would be quite an expense.

I don't like the income tax, but how would the CO2 tax work? There has to be some serious money spent by govt and private sectors in switching to solar and wind power that is economical for people barely making it pay check to pay check. And just the other day I said we needed to take the tax off gasoline to pay for our roads, and I got poo-pooed. If the govt and states still use that tax, then they aren't really pushing any initiative for states to encourage alt. transportation.

[NYCGirl]

15. The CO2 tax is not on individuals, but on corporations and other large polluters.

Edited to add Al Gore's words:

"For the last fourteen years, I have advocated the elimination of all payroll taxes — including those for social security and unemployment compensation — and the replacement of that revenue in the form of pollution taxes — principally on CO2. The overall level of taxation would remain exactly the same. It would be, in other words, a revenue neutral tax swap. But, instead of discouraging businesses from hiring more employees, it would discourage business from producing more pollution."

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/09/18/gore-speech/

[glowing]

20. Would that inspire more corporations to move to oversea operations?

Or would that tax be passed down to consumer? And I would think a business that has to spend more money on pollution, would hire less people.

I don't think its so cut and dry. Besides, one of the biggest green house gas emitters are food productions, mainly from meat, and then their would be additional costs to the transportation ind. to truck everything around.

I think we would end up spending more in offset taxes. Corporations are about making money and paying CEO's way too much money. I think it would become very expensive to live in America and even worse for the poorer of our people's.

I'm not sure we have the systems in place to ensure that the American people wouldn't become royaly screwed. If this was to happen, serious reform in our trade policies would have to happen.

[elehhhhna]

26. Big polluters are captive-- power generation and concrete manufacturing.

Can't move concrete & utilities overseas.

[papau]

16. Why get complicated like Gore is doing - a simple 2% reduction/wage cap removal is a no brainer-then

separately pass a pollutant tax - if you can.

[gulfcoastliberal]

31. Considering overpopulation is the root cause of pollution/global warming, there should be policies

to discourage having children. This pyramid scheme of constantly adding population growth to generate economic growth is going to soon come tumbling down - it's painfuly obvious we don't have enough resources even for the current 6+ billion people. It's a fact that the world now cannot produce enough food every year for the current population - we've been eating up the stored reserves the last 6 years, even during years of record harvests. It's even more grim now, what with huge droughts everywhere.

[glowing]

36. So, I should be penalized for having a child?

I guess it will be the rich who will truly inherit the world.

[diane in sf]

37. Urbanization all over the globe is causing the birth rate to drop.

I saw a great presentation by Stewart Brand last week at the Commonwealth Club in San Francisco. He pulled his information primarily from U.N. population and demographic studies. For rural people children are workers/moneymakers. When people move to the city (as 80% of the global population is forecast to do by the middle of this century) children cost the equivalent of around a million dollars to raise--and that's excluding college costs.

U.N. population studies have the world population peaking in the next 30-40 years and then dropping to slightly below population replacement as they have in Europe. Even in places like Bangladesh the birthrate has halved in the last 30 years as women get more education (it doesn't take much--around a sixth grade education) and move to urban areas. When they move to urban areas their lives get much better and one of the first things they do is work on educating their fewer children.

The coming group of problems we're going to have is maintaining economies in the face of falling populations as well as a diminished natural world.

[Clark2008]

49. You can discourage all you want, but accidents do and will happen.

Both my children were "birth control" babies.

Hubby and I are taking more drastic measures - he's getting fixed - now that we've had our second. But, you must remember what Jeff Goldblum's character in Jurassic Park said, "Nature will find a way."

While, I agree with you in theory, I don't believe taxing people for their children is wise in a free society.

[proud patriot]

17. Run Al Run

[otohara]

18. I Call On Gore to Run For President

because the planet needs him.

:patriot: Al Gore reporting for duty!

[byronius]

19. From the small business perspective -- me -- this would be a dream.

Payroll taxes are a heavy burden. What a boon it would be. Al Gore -- He's Just Right.

[tblue37]

22. Because a self-employed person has to pay both the employee's

share and the employer's share of payroll taxes, every cent I earn doing freelance editing, tutoring, and writing gets taxed at about 40%. Understand, I don't make that much money with such freelancing--only about $20,000/year--but 40% of that goes into taxes because of the way self-employed people get nailed twice on payroll taxes. I would love to see payroll taxes reduced or done away with!

[elehhhhna]

27. You do realize he means Federal Taxes, not just Soc sec.

It's a boon to the economy.

[tblue37]

33. All income tax? I had not realized that. n/t

[lumberjack_jeff]

43. He may or may not have meant that...

...but that's not what the article says. "Income tax" is not the same thing as "payroll taxes".

I'm skeptical. Taxes collected for a valuable public purpose tend to get spent for the most part on that public purpose (in this case, social security). If they're collected for pollutant mitigation, it's too easy to short change the public purpose.

[elehhhhna]

47. He's been tyalking about this for 14 years and he DOES mean

personal federal income taxes.

[B Calm]

28. I vote for that! Show me the law where it's legal for them to tax my

pay in the first place!

[whopis01]

44. The 16th amendment to the Constitution

The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration.

[rzemanfl]

51. I've seen it argued that this amendment was never properly

ratified.

[whopis01]

53. I've seen it argued that the moon landing was faked.

Now go try and get a court that will agree with the arguement that the 16th amendment is invalid because it was never properly ratified. Then you have a starting point. Of course you still have to get all the courts up the line to the supreme court to agree with that idea as well, but at least you would have a start.

[rzemanfl]

59. If Bush/Cheney were in office at the time of the moon landing

would you have believed them?

[whopis01]

60. since this thread is dealing with the legality of income taxes

I fail to see what Bush/Cheney have to do with this. It is not as if income tax was something that was first implemented under their administration.

[B Calm]

58. EXACTLY!!!

[whopis01]

61. And Ohio was not a state until 1953, making Taft an illegal president, right? n/t

[B Calm]

56. What is the number of the bill passed to authorize taxing our wages??

[whopis01]

57. It is hard to name just one bill as there have been several

and they have been modified over the years.

But, if I had to pick a few major ones, I would choose:
HR 3321 of the 63rd Congress
HR 8300 of the 83rd Congress
HR 3838 of the 99th Congress

The first is the Revenue Act of 1913, which was passed shortly after the 16th amendment went into effect. The second is the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 and the third being the revisions that enacted in the Internal Revenue Code of 1986.

The relevant law is:
Title 26, Subtitle A, Chapter 1, Subchapter A, Part 1, Section 1 of the US Code.

You can read it here:
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=browse_usc&docid=Cite:+26USC1

[dogday]

29. He could do that if he would just Run Al Run

kind of like when the little girl in the the Forrest Gump Movie
who would yell Run Forrest Run...


All I can think about is Run Al Run.........

[Stephanie]

30. And he's not running?

The man is running. You heard it here first.

[ProgressiveAmPatriot]

32. Go Gore! This is an extremely progressive tax proposal n/t

[diane in sf]

35. This could be great--I believe it's part of the Apollo Energy platform.

We have lots of under- and unemployed people and a degrading environment. This move comes out of the school of physical and financial reality endorsed by people like Paul Hawken, Amory and Hunter Lovins, et.

Al's getting my money and volunteer time.

[DemGa]

41. Wow!! I've no doubt Gore is running. n/t

[SharonRB]

46. Run, Al, run!

Come on, you know you want to. We need you!

[RestoreGore]

48. He sounds like an environmentalist to me

And he already admitted these proposals are far beyond what the political system would ever allow. But yet again, people take something he stated because it would actually help this planet and not discuss that, but only use it to cheerlead. No wonder he frowns at book signings.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=115x74608

[Deja Q]

50. It's said even computers emit CO2 into the air...

His own comment "We should start by immediately freezing CO2 emissions" is not only irrational, it's implausible once you think about how far reaching his actions would be. Just how does Al demand everything get shut down, globally? Convince China to do that... or India. And will he do his part like he's telling everyone else do do theirs?

I'll agree with the swap of 'payroll tax' for 'pollutant tax'. It's a lovely idea. Unfortunately, there's one small problem in the works: How's all that going to be tabulated? With more than just an abacus, of that there is no doubt.

[sicksicksick_N_tired]

52. "pollutant taxes" REALLY TURNS ME ON ON ON!!!

Just imagine the revenue off "pollutant taxes"!!!

Hell, we could support this nation's people for centuries off that!!!

:rofl: :bounce:

[Selatius]

55. I would support such a move. Anything to shift the burden of taxation off the poorest people. n/t

[yurbud]

62. I love Al, but disagree with him on this. Social Security survived because it is regressive

and doesn't touch the rich to any appreciable degree.

If he tried to raise the same amount of money by taxing businesses use of CO2, they would get the scientific equivalent of tax accounts to prove that they emit none.