Did anyone see this show last night called wife swap....

[butterfly77]

that comes on friday nights. The show swaps wives and one of the families had a lesbian family and the other had a family where the wife was very intolerant of gays,mexicans and others she just seem to be isolated from the world she lived in oregon. Her husband was a control freak also he had the children playin sports all week long and when one of the daughters sprained her ankle he told her to suck it up and walk on it and keep playing but she couldn't. His wife went to stay with the lesbian family and she went out to dinner and was askin people if they were gay, she said that if she knew that her child would have down syndrome she would abort it and she compare the woman who she was staying with to having a birth defect... I didn't realize their were so many people like this woman, now I can see where Bush's base comes from...

[bluerum]

1. Yes - a lot of his base must be aborted downs syndrome fetuses. eom

[donsu]

2. yes I saw it - what a rude woman, what unhappy children she has

but on the subject of down's babies:

I too would abort a down's fetus.

[orpupilofnature57]

3. I bet for different reasons though.

[butterfly77]

9. What I was amazed at was that...

she told the woman who was a lesbian that she was a birth defect...

[Katherine Brengle]

10. I think I might too...

but I guess there's no way of knowing until you've been there...

:(

[mmonk]

28. As a disability advocate,

that attitude bothers me a little bit. Though I understand it on some level, that's not a reason I support abortion rights. But I know there's nothing I can do and that position contains some logic.

[ima_sinnic]

29. my brother has downs syndrome

and he is one of the funniest, friendliest, warmest, most welcome members of our family. He tells funny jokes and paints neat pictures. He spent several years in a mode of creating funny cards for people that were densely covered in his own unique handwriting (by the way, books have been written by people with Downs Syndrome). He inspired my parents to be active in the ARC, and they became officers of that organization and fought tirelessly for better conditions and rights for mentally challenged people. They also tirelessly devoted themselves to Special Olympics, at which my brother won a huge chestfull of medals. When my mother died in 1984 the church was packed with mentally challenged people who had loved her.

In the late 1950s, when he was born as a twin to another brother who is "normal," my parents were under a lot of pressure to institutionalize him. They swore that would happen over their dead bodies.

Our whole family has been made better by the presence of Andy. He inspired my sister to go into work with handicapped folks and she met her husband while working at a camp for them and they adopted an 8-year-old mentally challenged but abused boy from an institution, in addition to their own two very young children. That boy has grown up to be an outstanding citizen, now working for the Library of Congress, and gave a moving little speech at my father's recent 90th birthday party about how much Grampa and Gramma had loved and accepted him as a grandchild. She later got a degree in special education for deaf people.

I feel sorry for people like you, whose "convenience" and shallow definition of what is "acceptable" will rob you of true joy in life. Would you also abort someone who might have a little physical imperfection? Mental "imperfection" is just that--a slight aberration from what is "normal." But perhaps it is just as well, since you probably would feel embarrassed and unduly put out by such a "burden."

[ThatsMyBarack]

30. Handicapped/challenged people are NOT....

....sick, bad, or diseased. Just different. I find that very refreshing! B-)

[BlackVelvet04]

32. I had a cousin who had

downs syndrome. I was her only playmate as none of the other children would be gentle with her. She had a heart defect and couldn't get overly excited. She died in her sleep when we were both 7 years old. I've never quite gotten over it. I was always terrified of having a baby with downs syndrome....not because of embarrassment or inconvenience but because of the pain of that loss. I ended up having no children.

Although extremely limited in her abilities my cousin was a sweet, gentle soul that had a huge impact on my life.

[ima_sinnic]

34. when my brother was born DS life expectancy was only about 14

if I am remembering correctly. Fortunately during his very lifetime science, as well as attitudes toward and life conditions of DS people advanced so much that I don't think their life expectancy is very different from that of "normal" people. My brother is now 47 and still going strong, though admittedly seemingly aging faster than might otherwise be expected. He does have weight problem.

But, yes, there are concomitant physical conditions; the syndrome occurs with a wide range of characteristics both mental and physical. I'm so sorry about your friend; because of you, her short life was happier, and she left you with something, too. Not everyone is "fated" to live to a ripe old age, but I truly believe that all souls are reincarnated in various forms and at different times, maybe even in other dimensions that we can't even conceive. She's still "out there" somewhere. :hug:

[BlackVelvet04]

37. Thanks.....

my cousin was born 6 months before me so we were natural playmates I guess. I didn't know that after all of these years I would still cry for her. Seven is an awfully young age to understand why someone your own age has died. My cousin was very physically frail because of her heart condition and the doctors didn't feel they could operate on her. This was many years ago and I have no doubt things would be different today. How wonderful your brother is 47 years old!

[JVS]

57. Thank you for sharing your story.

:thumbsup:

[earth mom]

84. Wow, what a beautiful story!

:applause:

I think many people would benefit from having a mentally challenged person with downs syndrome or autism in their lives. The unexpected beauty, insight and sweetness they possess and share is a gem in our increasingly cynical, ruthless and cruel world.

[ima_sinnic]

88. and I didn't mention how it brought us closer together as a family

--we were all involved more with each other because of Andy's extra needs as an infant and young child. It taught us kids the hardship as well as the rewards of accommodating someone else's needs. It wasn't overwhelmingly burdensome or anything, just an extra dimension of coming together and being responsible.

[Midlodemocrat]

36. At one point, it was thought that I was carrying a son with

Down Syndrome. It turned out that I wasn't, but I wouldn't have aborted him.

But what you are talking about is choice. Something all women should have. I have a dear friend who knew she was carrying a daughter with Down Syndrome and she has been an incredible advocate for that child and the child is adorable beyond belief.

OTOH, I have a neighbor who has never come to terms with her son with Down Syndrome. It's actually very, very sad.

[knitter4democracy]

45. I couldn't. That's me, though.

I had an early miscarriage, and I still grieve for that lost one. I couldn't lose another one, especially because the genes weren't perfect or because the baby looked different. I know how much work a special needs child is (I have a cousin who is special needs, and I was a high school English teacher who worked with kids of various abilities), but I couldn't kill a baby of mine because some test shows something is different from "normal."

Then again, I have resources to raise another child and a support system. Not all women have that, and I respect their decisions to control their own bodies.

[bleedingheart]

4. it is far easier to think in absolutes

people who are intellectually lazy are literally drawn to absolutes because they don't have to think any further than a statement like...

"gay people are bad"

that's it...no critical thinking...nothing. They accept that and then they rationalize (which does sometimes take some effort)..but you will find that they won't rationalize very long either because they are the first to erupt and then walk away because any further effort might hurt their calcified brains.

Once in a while, an intellectualy lazy person gets motivated and when they do they typically feel betrayed by some mythical "those people" who supposedly were keeping them in the dark but that is their defense against their own laziness.

[sakabatou]

5. Another boil on america's ass

[dysfunctional press]

6. i tried watching that show just once...

and in my opinion, it should either be forced to change it's name, or be sued for false advertising.

[donsu]

7. what do you mean? why change the name?

nt

[dysfunctional press]

8. because it has absolutely nothing to do with the kind of wife-swapping i'm familiar with...

maybe they should be calling it "mommy-swap".

[Connie_Corleone]

15. The actual title is Trading Spouses, not wife swap.

[in_cog_ni_to]

16. No. It's "Wife Swap" on Fox on Friday nights. Trading Spouses is on ABC? or NBC?

2 different shows....same premise though.

[LostinVA]

19. No, you're wrong about the show titles

Trading Spouses is Friday on Fox, Wife Swap is Monday on ABC.

I know my reality TV shows.

[dysfunctional press]

21. they should both be called something else...

like mommy-swap or trading mommies.

either that, or start living up to the prurient nature of the shows' titles.

[in_cog_ni_to]

25. :) You're right and so was Connie_Corleone. My apologies.

:spank: Obviously, I don't know my reality shows.;)

[LostinVA]

33. I, to my shame, do!!!

[in_cog_ni_to]

38. LOL...don't feel bad,

I watch them too. I watch most of them and that's probably why I screwed up the networks...so many reality shows, so few memory cells.:)

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

46. Trust me, she doesn't feel bad.

Uh-oh. She's going to kill me now for saying that.

:hide:

[LostinVA]

58. OMFG!!!

And who was it that watched seven hours of reality shows with me yesterday???

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

62. Um...err...

your girlfriend?

[Midlodemocrat]

69. She said they were cooking shows, so that doesn't count.

:hide:

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

70. Actually, they were the home remodeling shows.

The trashy guido couple had really bad taste.

[Midlodemocrat]

71. I LOVE those shows.

I really like that Clean Sweep show. I wish I could get them to come to my friend Jennifer's. Now THAT would be an exciting episode.

[donsu]

89. I like Clean House (isn't it House and not Sweep or two diff. shows?)

whatever it's called - it's amazing how much stuff people can stuff in their rooms. and the 'why' of it, is interesting.

and Niesie (sp.) is a great host

[JVS]

61. Ah, the ugly truth comes out. A proud viewer of garbage!

[ThatsMyBarack]

31. That's RIIIIGHT!!!!

Tell her what (s)he's won, Don Pardo! :applause: ;)

[Dorian Gray]

27. You've got it backwards...

Trading Spouses is the one on FOX. Wife Swap is on ABC.

[in_cog_ni_to]

39. I know. I apologized.

:spank:

[Dorian Gray]

74. It's an easy mistake...

one of my friends, however, worked on Wife Swap, so I know more about that show than I'd ever want to. :)

[donsu]

53. guess we know where your mind resides

nt

[in_cog_ni_to]

11. I saw it. That was the most bigoted, racist, hateful, bitchy, MEAN, disgusting

xenophobic, pitiful excuse of a human being I've ever seen. I would have SLUGGED the wench. It's obvious she's never been decked for the shit she says. It would take one black eye or one bloody and bruised lip to shut her the hell up. Her husband sucked too. They deserve each other. I feel very sorry for her one daughter. The one who got hit in the ankle with the ball. I felt so bad for her and her father just tells her to "shake it off?" :eyes: That man needs parenting classes. The other daughter is exactly like her mother...she's a lost cause. OMG...I've never witnessed such mean and hateful behavior!

[butterfly77]

12. I don't think I could have taken her for a day...

let alone for a week, next week the second part will air and they will divide the money for each family. I bet the woman from oregon will state that they go to see some type of clergy or classes to get over their lesbianism...

[in_cog_ni_to]

13. Yep. She did something hateful like that with their money because they were shocked

when they opened the envelope.

The preview for next week...Did you see the freak act like she was having a breakdown and said she felt like she had been held hostage for a week? Man, that woman needs to be given a severe dose of reality. What a mental case! She's right up there with the "G-D WARRIOR!!!":eyes:

[butterfly77]

14. That women was unbeliveable...

I would like to see her with a black or hispanic family, I don't think she would make it. I would not be able to control my self , this woman can't even hold back a thought...

[SemperEadem]

22. typical for those kinds of people

they are the boorish, intolerants one who cry that they are victims when they are surrounded by people who do not agree with their stance in life.

No one forced her to sign up for the show... she wanted the money, so she sold her soul to be on TV to get money. You can't serve both God and money and that's what she gets for trying to serve money, greedy salope.

[pnwmom]

17. Seriously advocating slugging, decking, or a black eye or bloody lip

puts a person in the same category as this couple.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

41. I agree. n/t

MKJ

[Midlodemocrat]

35. Trading Spouses is the same show that brought us "The God Warrior"

Remember her?

IMHO. The Faux version of the show is mean spirited and hateful. The ABC version of the show is pretty interesting a lot of the time. It's kind of neat to see how people who are raising their children in such different manners end up.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

40. "...mean-spirited and hateful."

I knew there was a reason why I liked it.

[LostinVA]

59. giggle

[Midlodemocrat]

64. Well, if you weren't a

TQ, you could be on that show.






:hide:

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

67. It's a sad day when you can only call me a TQ, B.

And if I was on that show, that homophobic b**ch would have a broken jaw.

[in_cog_ni_to]

42. The G-D Warrior ....UGHHHHHH! Don't remind me!

Wife Swap is much better. Most of the families DO end up changing their ways for the better. Some just don't realize how bad they really are! The show that sticks in my mind is (I THINK this was Wife Swap..not sure though) the father who spent his mornings, days and nights playing video games and the ONLY way his son ever got any attention from his father was to play video games with him! It was so sad. The wife waited on him hand and foot. His meals were served to him at his computer and his son had NO FRIENDS because all he did was play video games in the house with his dad. That was a sad, sad show.:( The dad was SO immature, he didn't even realize what he was doing was wrong! He had NO parenting skills AT ALL. By the end of the show, he had changed his ways. His son was in sports and was making friends. Dad curbed his video gaming. It is interesting to see how other people live and raise their children. Sometimes it's very sad to see how some kids have to live though.:( I do like it when we see 'positive' changes though. That's encouraging.

[Midlodemocrat]

65. Exactly! I watch Wife Swap with my kids and sometimes

we come away from it thinking, 'hey, maybe that is worth trying'.

It seems that there is a lot of positive change on Wife Swap if the contestants are open to it. Of course, you do see the ones who are my way or the highway queens, but my feeling is that when we are raising children, we all live in a glass house and ANYTHING that promotes cooperation and healing as well as compassion is a good thing.

[pnwmom]

18. I saw it and it was gripping. Did anyone see the one about the puppeteer

her French husband (the baker) -- vs. the military parents?

I missed the second half and am curious how it turned out . . . what the "prizes" were.

[brentspeak]

20. Sick idea for a show...but it's just par for the course, these days

[donsu]

49. I think the shows are very instructive and interesting, showing us how other

american families live

[mmonk]

23. Sick on two accounts.

[11 Bravo]

24. My own wife had a couple of glasses of wine with dinner, so ...

we were otherwise occupied.

:evilgrin:

[PCIntern]

26. Gotta get her drunk, eh?

OK

:toast: :rofl:

[cgrindley]

43. Abortion before Downs

I don't that there's really any question of whether or not to abort a Downs fetus. It'd be pretty much automatic. Not even an issue to consider. My wife and I are planning on having a kid and that was the first thing we discussed. There's no way I'd consider bringing a Downs baby into the world.

[knitter4democracy]

47. Have you ever known a person with DS?

Amazing people. Yes, the health costs are high, as they often have heart trouble and other issues, but they are amazing people and worth knowing.

[cgrindley]

54. Argumentum ad Misericordiam

I wouldn't want to bring a child into the world if that child has that level of birth defect. There's no reason for anyone with Downs to be born. It's a condition that simply doesn't need to exist.

[knitter4democracy]

72. Wow. Um, okay.

People have used that argument for many other genetic tendencies, like skin color, six fingers, twins, and many traits that don't faze us at all today. I wonder what other conditions don't need to exist . . .

[cgrindley]

79. That's a false analogy

A child born with six fingers can have the offending digits removed. A child born with Downs has Downs.

[knitter4democracy]

80. And a kid born with some other genetic anomaly might not.

I was naming various genetic anomalies. There are tons. What if the child inherits some other trait you don't like that can't be taken off or changed? It's possible with every child. The reality is, we don't even know most until after the baby's born.

[Midlodemocrat]

82. If you are going to do that, you might want to call it by the correct

name. It's not Downs. It is Down Syndrome, named for the doctor who identified and put a name to the syndrome.

And while you are of course free to make your own decision, you might want to temper your comments as there are people on this board who have elected to knowingly bring a child with Down Syndrome into this world and believe that child to be the light of their lives.

[LostinVA]

87. Jeebus, I know

[spoony]

85. Yay for eugenics!

:sarcasm:

[philosophie_en_rose]

86. Down Syndrome is not a monstrousity.

I know many people with Down Syndrome. They functional well and are kinder than most.

I'm sorry you don't have the heart to see the value in a human being.

[Donald Ian Rankin]

81. I have at least one friend with DS.

She has a perfectly good life, and her mother copes absolutely fine, but it's certainly even harder work for her than parenting would otherwise be. I could certainly understand the decision to abort a foetus if you discovered it was going to have Downs, and it's the one I would probably take if I found myself in that position. I can definately understand the alternative too, though.

[watercolors]

44. Cannot watch any of those reality shows

I believe it is dumbing down our country, the shows are so sick!

[donsu]

50. what is 'sick' about them. I don't understand.

nt

[cgrindley]

63. Take Nanny 911 for example

It actually provides useful parenting advice to a generation of inept parents. Sure it's a cheap and nasty giggle, but there are people out there who honestly don't know how to get their kids to go to bed by 8.

[Midlodemocrat]

66. Yup. I think those shows in particular

Super Nanny and Nanny 911 provide a service to some people, especially the ones who are causing all kinds of hurt by the way they talk to their children or instantly resort to hitting to get their own way.

Those nannies and their calm demeanors can really, I believe, teach all of us that there is a better way to interact with a child.

[cgrindley]

78. American Idol is also useful

In that it teaches people that not everyone is a beautiful wonderful snowflake of special wonderfulness. And that trying real hard and believing in yourself might not lead anywhere useful.

[LostinVA]

60. Whatever

I'm tres intelligent and I love 'em. They certainly aren't "dumbing down" the country.

[HuffleClaw]

48. imo these shows are a form of child abuse

what possesses people to sign up for this crap i don't know. and why is it called 'reality' tv anyways, there's not one thing realistic about it in the least. these shows take hundreds of hours of video and pick out the most sensationalist/worst/funny/cruel parts and compress it into 48 minutes of 'reality'.

[mondo joe]

51. What I don't get is why people who are unwilling to play along sign up for these

shows.

If they'd just treat it like a real social experiment, or even like a crazy relative is coming to stay with them for a week, no harm done.

But I don't know why anyone would sign up to do this and then be absolutely rigid about it.

[donsu]

56. it seems it's mostly the husbands who want to back out of the contract

when they come up against the new wife's ideas.

they have lost control of the 'woman' in their household and are in a panic.

most of them usually get over the panic (after yelling, anger, door slamming, etc.)and actually look at their own actions and relations with their family members.

[HuffleClaw]

76. those shows don't show the aftermath either

though that would almost be entertaining.

[Midlodemocrat]

68. You know, lately, I have been wondering the same thing.

Some of the spouses are so incredibly rigid, and it's like you said, just pretend the crazy relative is here for a week.

I don't like it when they start screaming at each other, because I don't think that is good for the kids.

I do think some of the dads, (at least in most of the shows, it is the dad who stays put while mom trades families) deserve a lot of credit for going along and actually listening to what the other wife has to say.

[mondo joe]

73. I guess I just don't understand a lot of households. In mine we wouldn't

move forward on something like this if everyone didn't agree about our willingness to really do it.

:shrug:

[HuffleClaw]

75. i'm pretty sure they are grossly misinformed about what to expect

and like so many people, are SURE that THEY are the 'good guys'

[mondo joe]

77. How many episodes do you need to have seen to have a clue what you're going to

have to do????

[Midlodemocrat]

83. LOL. It's like the Springer show back in the day.

My brother said to me once about that show. You know it's not gonna be good if the Springer show comes a calling.

[donsu]

52. but the 48 min. are real - that's the point, showing how 'real' american

families live their real lives.

[tinfoilinfor2005]

55. Strangley, yes.

Now I know why I never watch the show.

What an ugly person, inside and out. And she's really messed up her kids along with her crazy hubby. :crazy: