What is the reason for the disturbing lack of compassion at DU?

[cboy4]

I contend the majority of people here are compassionate.

But not everyone. I've heard far too many DUers echo my concern.

Some of the comments about the Lake Tahoe fire have been shocking.

Instead of feeling sad for those who have lost everything, I've heard everything from they deserved it for living in the forest to they're all rich people (which is ridiculous) to everyone will do fine with their insurance. (yea, that'll replace those photographs).

I do not understand how anyone can be so cruel as to feel another human being deserves losing their home.

It seems like whether it's mountain climbers or the San Francisco father in Oregon getting lost, they're stupid and had it coming.

When Steve Irwin, the Crocodile Hunter died, he had it coming to him because he bothered the wildlife.

Even when Anna Nicole Smith died, why was there so much hate? What did she ever do to anyone?

I don't get it, and I wonder what is wrong?

[DainBramaged]

1. I've been working, have I missed something?

[rucky]

2. It's an internet. It has no feelings.

It's easier to voice those dark thoughts, ones that go through everyone's minds from time to time, under the guise of anonymity. Not condoning it, just trying to explain it.

[cboy4]

9. Yea, I understand how people feel they can be more honest

hiding behind a screen name about certain topics.

Things like immigration and welfare and those types of issues.

But to express dark thoughts about human suffering means you are not compassionate in real life or at DU.

And I don't think that's compatible with being a progressive.

In fact, I would argue they are closer to being Republicans than Democrats.

[Lorien]

113. That was my thought as well. Some people get nastiness out of their

system online instead of kicking the dog at home (if they are unpleasant people to begin with). It's worse on broader discussion boards (like AOL) where a large segment of the population delights in writing the most hateful things imaginable. If the internet did not allow for anonymity then I doubt such obnoxious behavior would be so common.

[LWolf]

3. It's not DU. It's U.S. culture.

We live in a culture of contempt. A culture of put-downs. A culture of one-ups-manship. A culture obsessively addicted to competition as the primary means of creating and sustaining any sense of self-esteem: "I'm only ok if I'm better than you."

Simply put, a culture that does not value empathy.

If you are looking, you can find evidence of this everywhere. DU, like any other group of people, reflects the greater culture.

[Mandate My Ass]

7. Very well put

Even news anchors sneer these days, very inappropriately IMHO. It happens quite often but never ceases to amaze me. :shrug:

[Totally Committed]

8. I also believe it has to do with the combative nature of some here.

This, mixed with the fact that they never have to face those they try so hard to crush directly makes for a very non-compassionate give-and-take at times. It's easy to write something vile, and just click "send". So, maybe it's combative naure of some AND the anonymity of the internet, too.

I believe both those things shape life not only here on DU, but in daily life in the US as well.

It is beginning to take its toll.

TC

[GreenArrow]

10. that's pretty much it

Compassion is not much valued in general. The Bush years have simply intensified it, with Bush effectively existing/performing as a visible, tangible crystalization of the worst elements of the American character. It is deep sickness.

[ananda]

15. corporate-think

Corporations are not people and don't have feelings.
Everyone, thus, is a cog in the corporate machine..
which thrives on dehumanizing people.

Sue

[cboy4]

16. I understand. But I'm trying to figure out why I do "value empathy"

as I presume you do, yet others don't and still consider themselves liberals?

Why is it not everyone caves to this "culture of put-downs?"

[GreenArrow]

26. in that case, maybe it suggests that "liberal"

is a rather elastic word.

[LWolf]

34. Good question.

It might be a matter of conditioning.

If the overall culture encourages people to care for "us," but fear or despise "them;" focusing on differences as threat, rather than something to celebrate, and "ignoring" commonalities, then it makes some sense to me.

I was raised by a mom who has always felt others' pain and joy so intensely, that I'm guessing her conditioning was stronger than the greater cultures. She is so empathetic that I had to teach myself to step out of her emotional rollercoaster. She has no filter between herself and others. Still, I've always been aware.

I wonder about that "filter." We use filters because, if we couldn't put some distance between ourselves and the feelings of others, we'd spend our days rocking and crying. We couldn't function. Is lack of empathy an outcome of over-filtering? Of blocking? Of being taught to block or filter by power structures that want to maintain a certain mindset to further an agenda?

[Lorien]

114. True, and what so many people never realize is that putting another

down will not elevate them in any way whatsoever. Quite the opposite; a person shows themselves to be small and unworthy of respect when they deny respect to others. These days the whole country needs a big ol' dose of Dale Carnegie. :-(

[LWolf]

128. I see a connection between this cultural tendency

and the willingness to believe that people of different faiths, politics, races, and nations are "the enemy," or are somehow not as "free" as we are and need us to rule them.

It's also, frankly, what keeps political discourse polarized.

I've lived for most of my life in republican strongholds. While I admit that I disagree with the politics, and think my neighbors are mistaken and misinformed, I also know them to be real people who have consciences; who care about their community and who can be kind and generous.

I get along because I leave politics in the closet. Not completely; I will discuss issues, and it's generally known that I'm a "bleeding heart" and an "idealist," but when I'm called that, it's with affection and not derision. I never discuss political parties. Looking past politics, we can see each other as real people; have respect and care regardless of our differences.

You are making me think today, and I thank you. I'm thinking that, if groups of generally like-minded people struggle with respect, how are the diverse larger groups going to find common ground to work together?

No wonder. We might all benefit from a course in winning friends and influencing people.

[nashville_brook]

158. "culture of contempt" -- i LOVE it!

[Warpy]

4. Flash on "The Producers"

"Shaddap. He thinks he's witty."

[William769]

5. Other.

Fifteen minutes of fame. But then again some people are just attention whores.

[Squatch]

6. Chronic cynicism

[KoKo]

49. True....and some troll instigators who make the rounds. n/t

[salin]

144. That would be my guess.

[Marrah_G]

11. There is no real world reprecussions for bad internet behavior

People say things online they would never dare to in real life and many do it just for attention. Shocking statements get replies.

[durrrty libby]

12. I agree with you. People seem to enjoy others misfortune

There was a thread where people were joking
about the death of the Ohio pregnant mom

It is shocking how callous people from the so-called
compassionate party can be.



:hangover: :hurts: :thumbsdown: :scared:

[lonestarnot]

13. All of the above.

I haven't noticed a spike, but if there is one, it's trolls and bushitlerpissedoff syndrome. U.S. culture is becoming more and more animalistic, eating their own. That comes from daily abuse of rights and lack of pie.

[babylonsister]

14. OT:

cboy4, how are you doing? I remember you posted when the fires were just starting, so I figured you must live near there. Are you safe? I hope so, and think of you everytime I see something about those hellacious fires. Be safe! :hug:

[cboy4]

21. This is why I love you so.....thank you for asking. I have

family there whose homes did not burn, but I have friends who lost everything.

They returned to find their chimney, bathtub, and charred refrigerator.

Not rich people, just middle class, hard working people trying to get by.

You're the best. :hug:

[babylonsister]

32. I'm so sorry to hear that, cboy4.

They're lucky to have you as a friend.
I don't wish a disaster on anyone and cannot even imagine being in their shoes. I hope your family stays safe.
And no, you're the best! :pals:

[cboy4]

39. Thanks my friend.

:pals:

[NewJeffCT]

17. It's easy to get angry at public figures - heck, even Elizabeth Edwards got ripped on here

I think it's 7 years of Bush governing like he's won two massive landslides with Dems doing little to stop him...

and, that was preceded by 8 years where the Republics in Congress usually drove the agenda.

[Nikki Stone1]

51. That was shameful.

And try being Cindy Sheehan

[DS1]

18. Voting for option 2 is a copout

IMO

[cboy4]

25. I'm not sure it's a copout per se, but it's certainly not an excuse

to lose one's sense of compassion.

[Raine]

19. I wonder too

I have certainly noticed it. I wonder if it's some sort of reverse snobbery like being above feeling compassion for any other than the beaten down masses.

[Truthiness Inspector]

70. Good theory

If you haven't hit the nail on the head, you hit very close to it.

[uppityperson]

145. I think some are because of that.

[Dhalgren]

20. It could be the natural evolution of the "American Experiment".

We are a callous nation, always have been. That is why we turn our collective backs on the poor, the sick, the injured, the vet, the immigrant. We are essentially selfish, petty and mean-spirited. We have certain individuals who come along and shame us with their compassion and their empathy, but we try our best to smear them or kill them and then move along to the next "sudden death" in whatever form it takes. We don't learn from tragedy, we feed on it. Our comedies tend to be vulgar and base and that is a close reflection of who we are as a people. I really don't have to argue this, because we all know this to be true - to one extent or another...

[zalinda]

22. I think it's anger and frustration

Anger at what America has become and frustration because we can't seem to do anything to change it. Yes, there are trolls and people who love to stir things up, but for the most part, I think people on DU have their hearts in the right place.

There is also a feeling of hopelessness, but it sometimes feels like apathy. People can get angry or stir things up just to feel SOMETHING. Nothing seems to be going right in my life, at the moment, and I cry. People have to get their pent up emotions out. Maybe it's better that they get them out here than turn that anger towards their loved ones.

zalinda

[blondeatlast]

23. I just don't get the lack of respect. Even when Falwell died,

I just refrained from saying anything bad about him, even though I didn't feel a drop of pity.

I read some hideous things on a thread about Chris Benoit and his families death last night (since deleted--thank you, Mods). Regardless of the circumstances or who they are, people suffer.

Maybe it's just the anonymity of the 'net as you say. It makes it "okay" to be sadistic (and I have truly seen some absolute sadism in some of the worst of the posts--ick).

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

24. Some People Are Just Quite Simply Selfish, Ignorant, Blatantly Stupid Or Monumentally Immature.

Anyone who wouldn't have sympathy for the people affected by the fire would fit into at least one of those categories. I wouldn't chalk it up to lack of compassion, per se, I'd chalk it up to a lack of intelligence or maturity.

[mainegreen]

27. Here's your answer summed up nicely:

[Sock Puppet]

29. yes!

:rofl:

[cboy4]

31. That's pretty funny. Although, I find it impossible to believe some

of the people I'm referring to are normal in any way shape or form.

[Lorien]

116. Lol!

Perfect!

[treestar]

28. It's not a lack of compassion

You can feel compassion and still make any of the observations you mention.

Though feeling sorry for rich people is a bit much for me. I can do it, but if I make the observation that they chose to live on a mountainside, and they have insurance to cover it, and even if they didn't, they're rich, then finger wagging at me for lack of compassion is too much.

I feel sorry for Steve Irwin and his family but can point out that he chose to live on the edge and courted that kind of risk.

Same with the mountain climbers. Then we were talking of how they like to live on the edge, how bailing them out takes that away from them, how they should pay the cost, and that's social policy, it doesn't mean we don't feel sorry for them individually, and their families.

[Midlodemocrat]

42. See, that's where you lose me.

'Feeling sorry for rich people is a bit much for me'.

I work daily with some of the wealthiest philanthropists in the world. Ordinary people who got rich either through perseverance, good fortune or just plain hard work.

Some of them humbly recognize their good fortune and give back as much as possible. In fact, a lot more than one might think. People whose names we would never recognize because they aren't famous.

I can feel sorry for someone because of a circumstance like their home burning down regardless of their station in life.

I don't think compassion requires that you check their tax returns before feeling.

[cboy4]

56. I don't understand it either. It's a though just because you have

money, you don't deserve to be felt sorry for.

All the money in the world doesn't bring back a loved one nor does it some how make you no longer feel sadness and pain.

A majority of all of the hurtful posts about the Lake Tahoe fire have centered around how all of the victims are "rich."

Even if it were true (which it's not), it's irrelevant.

[Lorien]

117. Having been very poor, then well off, then poor again

I can honestly say that there is only one significant difference; when you have money then you tend not to spend much time thinking about money. When you don't have money, you spend a significant amount of time worrying about money. When concern about not having enough is removed you are still faced with health issues, personal relationships, lack of relationships, deaths in the family, etc. Money can help with some things, but it won't change everything. Would the people here say that Elisabeth Edwards' cancer is no big deal just because she's rich?

[cboy4]

118. Exactly. Well said.

:thumbsup:

[Matsubara]

147. Her cancer is still a big deal, but the fact that she's rich means her odds of survival are higher.

I'm sure that would come as little consolation, but to a person who can't even go to the doctor for lack of funds, you can imagine how they might feel. Money doesn't fix everything but it does soften a lot of life's blows.

Paris Hilton gets to go home to her palace after getting out of jail, and the offers for reality shows and guest spots will keep pouting in.

For many of us, drunk driving followed by a jail stint for violating probation would mean losing our jobs and our homes.

For the rich it's a mere inconvenience (although their outsize egos usually turn it into the tragedy of the century in their own minds).

[Lorien]

155. Peter Jennings and Linda McCartney were rich

and they are still dead. My next door neighbor is poor but still survived cancer.Wealth is a factor, but often it is not the defining factor between life and death.I've been unable to go to a doctor for seven years. When I had a gallstone attack I had to search online for alternative treatments because I couldn't afford the $24,000 surgery (note: the traditional Chinese herbal treatments and home remedies often WORK), so yes, I "can imagine how they might feel". The solution: universal health care, not damning the rich.

When I had a six figure income I was working fucking hard for it. I still work bloody hard (usually 60 hours a week) but, due to offshoring and the crap economy, my income is now down 75%. There are many factors which determine how a person becomes wealthy or how they never achieve more than basic survival. My ego has remained the same either way, as have the egos of my friends who also made it through years of struggling to pay for college, years of low paying internships, 80 hour work weeks...and finally a promotion to a well paying position. Not all wealthy people are evil, lazy egomaniacs without a care in the world. Some are just determined NOT to go back to ramen noodles and basement apartments, and they'll make every sacrifice to ensure that they never have to live like that again. That's been true in my case; I literally was living in a ghetto basement and eating nothing but ramen noodles 20 years ago. I'll never apologize to anyone for those years of success that I had later, and I know damn well that I'm far more capable of helping OTHERS when I have more than I need, as opposed to when I'm living paycheck to paycheck. Therefore, I'll put in the hours and lose every weekend and holiday until I can get back to where I was. Once I'm there, I'll be sending thousands to charity and spending one day a week building houses for habitat for humanity, as I once did. But some will still sneer that I must be lazy, evil, and a complete egomaniac because I'm no longer noble for being poor.

[Matsubara]

157. I wasn't trying to knock the chip off your shoulder...

...just saying that great wealth does soften a lot of life's blows. You're reading WAY too much into my post.

I never said all rich people were "evil, lazy egomaniacs without a care in the world". I grew up around rich people, I was one of the few in my school who was more middle-class. A lot of them were fine people. A lot of them raised their kids to be horrible egomaniacal snobs. There were all kinds, but a great many of rich people I've known, especially 2nd or 3rd generation rich, do have an amazing sense of entitlement and obliviousness to what life is like for regular people.

You earned a six figure salary - that's nice, but it's not quite what I'd call "rich". It sounds like you weren't even what my rich friends would call "comfortable" (none of them would ever own up to being "rich"). If you have to scramble every day to make payments on a BMW and McMansion, you're not rich.

Anyway, I'm glad you did well for yourself, and hope you can again.


As for nobility, all people who work for a living and EARN their money are noble in my book, regardless of the size of their paycheck.

[Lorien]

177. No chip here. Only experience

Yes, I know plenty of people who have seven figure salaries because I worked in the film industry. One of them was the single largest donor to the Gore campaign in 2000. Good man, and certainly not deserving of anyone's contempt simply because he was wealthy enough to own 1/3 interest in a major film studio. But yes, I felt quite rich even in comparison to them because I never had to think of money while I was making what I did; I had far more than I needed to live the lifestyle I desired. Now it's a daily concern. It's all a matter of perspective.

And yes, I agree with your final statement.

[Flying Dream Blues]

175. Well said. nt

[Flying Dream Blues]

174. Some would.

[durrrty libby]

43. One can not be empathetic and judgmental simultaneously

[Matsubara]

30. cboy4, I'll say right now that I should have stayed out of your Tahoe thread from the beginning.

It was your expression of sadness over what was happening, and I shouldn't have shat on it.

I apologize for that, and I won't get into the rest of what transpired in that thread, as we are both aware of it.


I realize now my remarks on that thread were inappropriate. I have a tendency to compare tragedies and weigh them against each other. I tend to be less affected emotionally by the loss of houses in Tahoe (lets be honest, a lot of them are vacation houses, and Tahoe is no slum) than I am about Darfur, or even offshoring of jobs, which I assure you is causing every bit as much misery as those fires, but to MILLIONS of people.

But I need to work on that tendency to minimize one person's tragedy simply because I see another as greater. In that you were right.


But please realize that an honest post saying "hey, that's a dangerous place or activity, it's not surprising that happened" is not the same as saying "he/she deserved it".

I realize you're a highly sensitive person, and that's cool, but other people may be able to be a bit more detached in discussing these things, and it doesn't mean they think the victims "deserved" it.


The number of houses burned in Tahoe has exceeded anything I ever imagined and I do feel terribly sorry for the people who lost their places of residence.



You mention Croc Hunter - well, I never made light of his death, but it really did not surprise me. I watched his show, and all the unbelievable risks he took - it's a miracle he lived as long as he did. Deserved his death? No, but inevitable? Probably.

If people were making light of the Oregon family's death, well that's just sick, that was a tragedy. Even if a person who died WAS "stupid", so what? It's terrible anytime a person dies. Should only geniuses get to live?

Anna Nicole - I was very sad about her death. She may have been imperfect, but to me, she really represented a real triumph of the underdog, coming from nothing to make herself into a larger-than -life star.



I think our society has definitely become a lot more coarse and callous in general, and anonymity of a web board probably exacerbates the problem.

I'm going to try to refrain from posting on threadswhere a person is expressing their genuine sorrow if I'm not in the mindset to send the kind of wishes the OP was asking for.



As for people saying that somebody deserved to die because they took a risk, or made a bad choice, I agree with you that that is just beyond the pale.



(Apologies again if my input was not wanted in this thread.)

[GeorgeGist]

33. Sometimes it's nothing more ...

than a futile attempt to feel better about their own discontent.

[Demeter]

35. I'm Saving My Compassion For Those Who Need It: BushCo Victims

[cboy4]

40. How do you distinguish who is or isn't a "BushCo victim."

I'm not sure whether you intended it, but your post reads very aggressive and hostile.

Why are you so angry?

[LeftishBrit]

59. While I agree that Bush victims do need compassion...

do you seriously think they're the ONLY ones? Suppose that someone gets cancer, or is involved in a serious accident, or loses a close relative, or is murdered, and it isn't due to Bush - does that make their suffering less real?

I can see that you may wish to save your campaigning time and energy for stopping Bush, but surely that doesn't mean that problems that aren't caused by Bush are unreal or trivial?

[Beaverhausen]

122. It's a shame you only have a finite amount of compassion and have to dole it out sparingly

there are plenty of people out there who deserve our compassion and sympathy. I for one don't choose one group over another to feel compassion for. I even have compassion for you.

[bullwinkle428]

36. A few here were laughing at the girl that had her feet chopped off

at the theme park last week...that one was really shocking to me. I had to take a breather so I wouldn't let loose with something that could have gotten me banned...

[cboy4]

41. I'm glad I missed that one.

x(

[durrrty libby]

47. That is disgusting. Sometimes I hate people. They are asshats

[RaleighNCDUer]

61. I think in that case it was because it is so horrific that it brings out

defensive joking - sort of like the 'dead baby' jokes.

but I missed that thread, so maybe I'm just talking out of my ass.

[JVS]

172. Wow.

[Guaranteed]

37. I'll say it again: Ideology does not equal personality,

or being a good person.

And we all need to work on being good people first, having the "right" ideology second.

[Arkansas Granny]

45. Very well said. Unfortunately, many people, not just here on DU,

seem to derive pleasure from the problems of others, especially those with money or celebrity or both.

[blondeatlast]

50. Amen. Very well put. nt

[porphyrian]

38. I periodically wonder why people decide to define all of DU with only their personal experience.

How many of the DU forums do you visit daily? How many DU forums did you visit and measure to come to this conclusion? Exactly how many posts by how many people convinced you of this trend?

[cboy4]

44. Why do you find what I'm saying so hard to believe? Let's forget

human tragedy for a second, and talk about Democratic candidates.

I absolutely respect every single person's choice to take back the White House in next year and would never attack anyone for who they're voting for.

But do you not see how vicious these candidate threads are?

I want no part of them because they're a waste of time.

There's hardly any exchange of ideas.....mostly abuse.

And that trickles down to other topics.

Did you not read in this thread the poster who said people were making fun of the little girl who had her feet chopped off on the amusement ride, and apparently people were making comments about the pregnant murder victim.

I cited examples of just a few topics I recall.

I can't believe you are seemingly stunned by my revelation.

[Midlodemocrat]

46. Dear God. Please tell me you are kidding about people making fun

of that little girl? How unbelievable. I missed that thread, thank God.

[cboy4]

58. I missed it too, but someone here said it happened.

And I certainly believe it.

[Bake]

124. I was there (theme park accident thread). It happened.

People made some sick jokes. I protested, because I used to Live in Louisville and had been to that park many times, and well, because that was a sick damn thing to joke about.

Some DUers suggested that she'd get a nice settlement check and would "never have to work a day in her life."

That thread just about made me leave DU for good.

Bake

[cboy4]

133. And that is exactly the kind of bullshit I'm talking about.

Who are these people?

[Bake]

146. Go back to that thread.

Some of the names will surprise you. Or maybe not.

Bake

[LostinVA]

160. They did me

[Rosemary2205]

68. I'd have to see it to believe it.

Nothing personal against Cboy. Honest. But I've learned people can grossly misinterpret what is said around here and I just learned it's best to go back and re-read the post in question for myself.

[Midlodemocrat]

71. I believe it.

I've seen some pretty horrible stuff posted prior to it being deleted and the poster banned. Which gives me hope that the poster is a disruptor and not an authentic member of DU.

[bullwinkle428]

73. The girl at the theme park? Yeah, that happened

last week in a thread in the Lounge. Ask LostinVA about it - she was absolutely pissed off at those posters as well. I understand that in some peoples' perspective, no cow is sacred, but geez, show a little human decency and consider what you choose to post! It's really not much different from the way the Freepers choose to mock Cindy Sheehan over the loss of her son...

[LostinVA]

161. Yup, I saw it -- and was royally pissed about it

Mocking a child who was just maimed is soooo funny.

I can appreciate gallows humor, but there's a difference between that and what was posted in that thread.

[LostinVA]

159. I was in that thread -- sickening

And, most of them were familiar posters, which made it worse for some reason.

[porphyrian]

48. I thought you've been here for a while.

You are overreacting to normal operating phenomena, and you didn't answer my questions.

[durrrty libby]

53. "overreacting to normal operating phenomena'

That's a good one


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[porphyrian]

55. I'm glad you think so, though I don't understand what you think is funny about it.

Maybe you weren't here for any other primary, either.

[durrrty libby]

60. It just struck me as an odd oxymoron and weird thing

to connect with people's lack of empathy

Made me laugh..That is all

[porphyrian]

63. Lack of empathy is nothing new to any group of people.

Nor is fake sympathy.

[durrrty libby]

81. I know that, but I would like to believe I was part of a group

that had genuine empathy.

It disgusts me that the truth is otherwise

[porphyrian]

83. You sound as if everyone here lacks genuine empathy or something.

That's sort of my whole point on this ridiculous thread - a few people display what some others determine to be a lack of empathy, and all of a sudden the whole community is condemned as having none. I'm calling bullshit.

[durrrty libby]

97. Not everyone, but far too many

You go right ahead and be dismissive of this thread by calling it ridiculous and bullshit.

It is however, valid and with genuine concerns.

[cboy4]

62. First of all, nobody needed to convince me of anything. I have

noticed a spike in nastiness, and you're right, I have been here since 2002, so who better to judge trends.

Obviously, I'm not alone as this poll indicates nearly 70 percent of the people who have responded agree.

And I've heard this from lots and lots of people here, believe me.

Finally, I read GD and LBN faithfully.

What else should I be reading to disprove what I'm stating?

[porphyrian]

65. So then you should know better.

There is a spike in nastiness before every election, moreso during Presidential primaries.

You alone are a horrible judge of trends. You can only speak of your personal observations, and you admit that they are limited to only two of the hundreds of forums that make up DU. So, you are, at best, making assumptions when condemning DU for what you've perceived in only two of its forums.

While 70 percent of the people who don't have you on Ignore or who have bothered to open this thread and vote may agree with you, that is hardly scientific or representative of DU.

"Lots and lots" is exactly the amount of accuracy to your observation, and my point - you are overreacting.

[cboy4]

72. Oh I see. So whenever there is a newsworthy tragedy, I should be

reading the forums that a majority of DUers do not post in.

What better way to take a sample than to check out the computer help forum, or the knitting forum. :eyes:

You know as well as I do that current events are posted in the two primary forums I read.

But that's fine, enjoy living in your little cave....completely opposed to differing views.

[porphyrian]

77. I'm not telling you what to do, I'm saying you've blown this out of proportion.

Your insane responses only prove I'm correct.

[cboy4]

79. Oh no, you're not telling me what to do, other than accuse me

of lying about an observation myself and others have made.

And on top of it all, I'm insane.

Nice.

You sound like quite the model citizen.

[porphyrian]

80. You make assumptions about everything, don't you?

I didn't accuse you of lying, I said you were wrong. I didn't say you were insane, I said your responses are. And you've proved me right again.

[cboy4]

82. Gotcha. If porphyrian believes it's an assumption or something

is an overreaction, than it must be true.

Because apparently porphyrian knows everything.

[porphyrian]

84. And you exaggerate compulsively, it appears.

Technically, your calling me out by name is against DU rules, you know.

[cboy4]

86. Wow, for a know it all.....you sure come across as a weakling.

I guess only porphyrian gets to state his view in a demeaning and sarcastic manner.

If anyone else does it to you, gotta hit the alert button. Awwww.

You lose more and more credibility with each of your ridiculous responses.

You might wanna quit while you're behind.

[porphyrian]

87. Yeah, you've proven to be such an accurate judge of anything real.

I've flushed more important things than your opinion, but keep digging.

[durrrty libby]

99. "I've flushed more important things than your opinion, but keep digging."

Wow so nasty and rude

Sorry, I wasted time communicating with you.

[porphyrian]

120. Don't let the door bump your ass on the way out.

You must've mistaken me for someone who gives a shit.

[durrrty libby]

105. Oh the twisted irony of someone bitching that there is indeed

a cornucopia of compassion, and all the while they act like a complete jackass

Really, it is mind boggling :hurts: :shrug:

[cboy4]

106. LOL!.......I know, ha? I don't know why I wasted my time with him.

Your posts have been great!

You seem really intelligent and a very nice person. ;)

[durrrty libby]

109. Thanks for putting up the poll. It was interesting, but not very

surprising to me.

[smirkymonkey]

140. I agree with you and I think the reasons are multifaceted,

many have been stated in above posts. A lot of it has to do with frustration, in people's own personal lives and due to the fact that "the good guys" don't seem to be "winning" anymore. I think that fucks with a lot of people's sense of fairness and the way it should be and they feel angry and betrayed. Therefore they just lash out. "The rules don't apply anymore, so why the hell should I be a good girl/boy".

I think a lot of us are more complex than good/bad, compassionate/heartless. Some of us care a lot, maybe too much and we feel so hurt by what goes on in the world that we start to cope by going the other way - by "getting tough" and I think that comes out in our posts sometimes. On the other hand, some people are just assholes and never had any empathy or compassion to begin with. Chances are, they're freepers.

There are also people like me who came to DU years ago and meekly expressed our opinions for the first time ever and got TROUNCED on by various "less compassionate" DU'ers and it hurt - some of us felt crushed and even went away for a while - but when we came back, we learned that we had to stand strong and fight back and sometimes even be a bit mean in order to avoid being chewed up and spit out. Eventually, once we gained some confidence in our beliefs and learned to hold our own, we could ease up a little and didn't have to be quite as nasty as we felt we had to be when we were more insecure. I think there are maybe a lot of people like that who are insecure in their beliefs and they feel that hostility gives thier opinion more weight or makes them less likely to get dumped on. Who knows, There are a lot of complex reasons we act the way we do on DU.

I know one thing though, the ugliness OUT THERE is definitely contributing to the ugliness IN HERE.

[NoPasaran]

52. On the internets, no one can punch you in the mouth

That's my theory why some people feel free to act like total assholes. Myself included from time to time.

[LoZoccolo]

54. Other.

Player-haters.

[RaleighNCDUer]

57. I suspect there might even be a little bit of 'missed the bullet'

in it. Nearly everyone has had a close call at one point or another, and upon walking away from it thought "Damn, I was SO stupid! How could I BE so stupid?" And when they hear about someone in essentially the same place, the first reaction is "Damn, that is SO stupid! How could they BE so stupid?"

And being the internet, they post their first thought and are stuck trying to defend or explain it when they themselves are not sure where it came from.

RE: the lost family in Oregon, I think that guy was a hero. He was looking at them all dying and in an effort to same his family he risked everything, knowing he was inadequately prepared for survival - and came real close to his goal, as I understand it, within a few hundred yards of finding help. To vie against the elements when fully trained and prepared is one thing, but to go up against them knowing the odds are so badly against you takes real courage.

[Silent3]

64. I won't disagree that sometimes people are simply being jerks...

...but I think there's also a problem of misinterpretation sometimes too.

I'm an analytical person. Tell me about a problem, and I'm likely to respond in an analytical way. If you say that group X is suffering problem Y Z% more than a decade ago, and I can think of a dozen ways statistics like that can lead to a distorted picture of what's happening in the world, I'll be far most interested in discussing the validity and meaning of the statistics than I will be with making sure everyone sees clearly that I'm filled with horror and sadness at problem Y.

That simply will not do for some other people here. By the way some people register compassion, only outpourings of sympathetic emotion, nothing more and nothing less, will do. God forbid you ever suggest that a given problem isn't as bad as it might seem -- that's the equivalent of dismissing the problem as a problem altogether.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

94. Very, very true.

:thumbsup:

[hyphenate]

66. I think a large part of it is

letting the keyboard speak before the brain. Too many people don't really think of the 'net as a "real" place. It's a keyboard and a monitor for crying out loud. It's completely impersonal. It's completely safe to be snarky and make comments that they would never have made in RL.

To many, there is no human element in commenting on current events--it's like a blog or a diary, only more than one personality is involved. Sort of like a cyber MPD.

People who have met others with whom they have commented online tend to take it more seriously, because they know who they are talking with. Those who have been online for the longest time, who have exchanged emails with others online, and who have in some way been interactive outside of the forums, will likely be the ones who pause before hitting the "submit" button when making some egregious remark.

That is, of course, unless despite all these things, they're just assholes to begin with. There is nothing that can be done about this, though. ;)

[MrPrax]

67. Odd list?

As an explanation to the lack of compassion, I suspect that you are more annoyed that the tenure of debate here is not the same reflected by the Media?

Each of the things you mentioned were all in high rotation on so-called news programs; almost saturation levels.

You don't think that might have something to do with the lack of compassion as you see it? I think you watch far more media than most of the people here and that's why you can't understand why people might not think that 'celebrities' and the media attention they already get is sufficient. You want to see more 'compassion' at the CERTAIN points in these narratives (death, loss) but this is largely the effect of media.

There was a great deal of compassion here for those poor firefighters that died saving fucking furniture...

NORTH CHARLESTON, S.C. - Nine coffins lined the front of a coliseum Friday as thousands of firefighters from across the United States, along with some from Canada, honoured nine colleagues killed earlier this week in a furniture store blaze.

Uniformed escorts walked the men's wives, siblings and children to their seats in a long procession of red carnations, tears and hugs.

Canada.com

****

The blaze has caused no fatalities or injuries, but has burned 185 homes and dozens of other structures, according to Henry Renteria, director of California's Office of Emergency Services.

CNN

So you take this occasion to talk about celebrities, hobbyists and vacationers ... but not heroes.

Real compassion is drawn from a palette a little wider than whatever your cable provider decides to tell you...


Compassion! You should learn something about it as well as Humility...you killed that little girl. Live with it.

[cboy4]

74. Here's the difference between you and me (besides the fact you

seem a little nutty, no offense of course.)

I feel compassion for everyone.

You, on the other hand, pick and choose who you feel compassion for.

Don't you.

[Corgigal]

165. now wait a minute

those poor firefighters were told that two people were trapped in the office of the sofa store. Of course they figured a way out but that is what was told over the radio.

Nothing wrong with feeling for those poor guys too. I can feel for them and their families, and the people in Tahoe. It's not a damn competition.

[MrPrax]

166. Yes...it is a competition

Between compassion for people who died through no fault of their own and in the service of the community and those who wish to mourn media objects.

Did I miss something in that list? I pointed out there was no loss of life in Tahoe and thankfully none of the firefighters currently working and sweating to save those remaining properties have been killed. So let's call this compassion for life.

Now the other two examples are people who simply died:

Anna Nichol Smith died of a drug overdose. I don't even understand where the terms 'compassion' fit into that 'concern' of the OP. Is the OP poster concerned that someone might mock a woman, born with a 38" rack that had it augmented to 42", so she could get more 'work!' having people take pictures of them. She was a model that had a drug overdose?? Did you miss that part? When I write that simple truism, am I guilty of being a bad DU'er showing no compassion.

Steve Irwin was an entertainer. We can say many OTHER things about him, but we all know him from his public appearances and shows. His show Croc Hunter was a TV show. It might be a reality-based TV show that got some people 'angr-ied up' where he rassled alligators, said some macho stuff about conservation and we usually got to see some big animal eat a little animal. He died unfortunately when he was doing something patently dangerous in the making of this TV show. Again where is (INSERT) compassion part in that one.

One wouldn't have thought their deaths to be contentious to begin with...or even their roles.

If I understand the OP correctly, I would think those guilty of 'lack of compassion' are probably people who might comment after reading about the death of a 'JackAss' guy that he 'might have had it coming'.

Or if one of those Mythbuster guys blows himself up, somebody might comment: "...well it was bound to happen, I figured the lack of lipservice to basic safety was ONLY edited out, not ignored"...one might think that statement 'lacks in compassion'.

Suffice it to say, it was the OP that suggested that we compete for 'who's compassionate' and who's not'...which I understand is a popular dichotomy in media that is usually translated into the much shorter: 'who's hot, who's not'.

I'm Hot
Your Not

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

69. Schadenfreude.

The germans didn't invent it, just gave it a name.

Also, some of us aren't going to pretend to care about somebody we never met just because the news is talking about them.

[cboy4]

76. Well at least your honest about your unfortunate lack of

compassion.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

85. I really don't think it's got anything to do with compassion.

:shrug:

[cboy4]

88. Why not? You said you don't give a rat's ass about anyone

except people you know.

That means you don't care about U.S. troops dying, right?

I'm pretty sure you don't know all 3,500 of them.

Not very compassionate, now is it?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

90. Ah, but I do care.

But I'm not going to pretend to care because Paula Zahn or Nancy Grace says I should. I'm not going to be all holier-than-thou when somebody cracks a gallows humor joke.

I think it was P.T. Barnum that said there was a sucker born every minute, and the media's proving him right.

[cboy4]

93. Oh, did you want to mention any other strangers you feel

compassionate about, because you said: "some of us aren't going to pretend to care about somebody we never met just because the news is talking about them."

The news obviously talks about the troops.

So if you hear about 8 children dying in a house fire in Philadelphia, does that mean you don't feel compassionate for their surviving mother who lost her kids?

Nobody says you need to take the day off from work, and weep under a blanket on the couch.

But to just so you don't care about people because news anchors talk about them, indicates you are disturbingly influenced by what they talk about.

[LostinVA]

162. Exactly -- empathy and compassion shouldn't be something you're FORCED to have

[BlooInBloo]

91. jesus. Care-ier-than-thou people suck. The poster said no such fucking thing.

EDIT: Clarified subject.

[cboy4]

95. What exactly did you clarify in your edit? Was it your profanity or

your personal attack.

You can call me what you want, but just keep in mind I eventually hit back, and you won't be able to keep up.

I promise.

[BlooInBloo]

96. I added the second sentence for clarity. And rock on.

EDIT: Sorry, second *complete* sentence. I seem to be having trouble getting things right the first time lol!

[LibDemAlways]

75. I had family up in Tahoe for years and saw how

people live up there - mostly in rental properties, working long hours at more than one job. Many, many ordinary working people up there.

Anyone who doesn't feel compassion for the victims of a fire isn't thinking. A fire is no less a force of nature than a hurricane, tornado, or flood waters when it comes to the indiscriminate destruction of lives and property.

To answer your question, I think the culture is so focused on me, me, me that few take the time or have the inclination to empathize with anybody else.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

78. people are cruel, just because one has liberal politics doesnt mean they are not cruel.

for instance, some people delight in posting pictures mocking harmless old women. just for laughs and applause. you dont have to be conservative politically to be cruel.

[rug]

89. I know. That Prayer Circle Group is vicious.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

92. It's teh tubez of teh internetz phenomenon.

Anonymity and all that rot you've heard a thousand times. Definitely truth there; I feel bolder knowing that I don't "know" any of you.

That said, there are collossally fucking stupid people on these internets. People who run around making crazy wise-ass comments and never contribute anything of value are in said column. So are the people who whine at every little personal attack, the people who gossip for hours. In essence, I'm talking about the people who forget it's just the fuckin' internet. Don't be a jerk-off and don't be a whiner, and remember: You can always just give it up and walk away. No need to take a bunch of pixels so freaking seriously. That's my new motto.

[theNotoriousP.I.G.]

98. Other...

Some people are just assholes.

[cboy4]

102. LOL. I think this is a perfect way to wrap up this thread.

Well said.

[donco6]

100. I see it all the time.

Lots of enmity between the perceived "haves" and "have-nots".

[Burma Jones]

101. It's because we're supposed to feel compassion for stuff we see on TV

We are so isolated from each other that while we may indeed have real compassion for our families and neighbors, the media constantly provides us with a glut of heart wrenching stories that can only produce numbness in the compassionate or derision in the normal.

And I don't feel sorry for anyone that hasn't digitized and stored all their photographs on a remote server :sarcasm:

[mondo joe]

103. The reason: Sometimes DU is just the mirror universe Free Republic -

just as nasty, just as judgmental, just as lacking in principle, but with an opposite focus.

Where FR can't have any compassion for the poor, the Bizarro-FR can't for the rich.

You get the idea.

Now it is NOT universally true that DU is the Bizarro FR. In fact I suspect it's rather the minority. But it happens, and it is hard to ignore.

Just as fundamentalist Muslims and Christians are more alike than they are different, Freepers and their Bizarro counterparts are more alike than different. They both discriminate based on all the same factors - just different sides.

I continue to believe there is a different way - to believe in justice and equality for all, regardless of race, gender, financial status, orientation, religion, etc.

[Silent3]

107. I try to be better than that, but I know sometimes I'm not.

Take the death of Jerry Falwell. That had a lot of people here dancing on his grave. I didn't go out of my way to do that, but I certainly didn't hide that fact I was happy to see him go, and that I think the world's a better place without him.

You can be sure the same kind of thing will happen on FR the next time some prominent liberal figure buys the farm. And then quotes from FR's grave dancing will be posted here, and DUers will express outrage and shock and disgust over it -- not willing to admit we can be just guilty of the same kinds of things.

[mondo joe]

110. But, y'know, Jerry Falwell did a lot to harm a lot of people.

I can begrudge anyone's joy in his elimination because of that.

But others - like the Duke Lacrosse players, like Anna Nicole Smith and some others - I don't know exactly what they did to earn the enmity of strangers.

[Silent3]

115. The freepers are just as certain...

...that the evil liberals, the deaths of whom would be cause of celebration for them, are just as harmful to the world as we think Falwell had been.

So the real difference is typically is who we think is worthy of such contempt, not actually the form the contempt takes. A lot of people, however, argue over the form of the contempt itself, blind to the hypocrisy that often entails.

[mondo joe]

134. I think there's a quantitative difference.

I can appreciate a difference between disagreeing with someone, and having them actually try to harm you.

Bill Clinton, as hated by the Freeps as anyone, didn't do anything to hurt them.

Even so, I don't consider FR a case for any behavior.

But going back: Even if you can argue that Bill Clinton, or Ronald Reagan, were out to hurt someone - hos does that relate to the Duke Lacrosse players or Anna Nicole Smith?

When people say they can't feel any sympathy for the victim of a crime just because they are moneyed, it's no better than saying you can't have sympathy because they're poor --- IMO.

[CreekDog]

104. I don't like the choices, but my explanation is that some people here are just jerks

[cboy4]

108. That's not very compassionate of you not liking my choices

hehehe ;)

[CreekDog]

125. I just want more choices, but your point is well taken

And I wanted to let you know that at least.

The tone here towards people who disagree is really incredible as is the response to politicians who try to be straight-up about what the political reality that they see out there.

To me the best example was when David Obey got into it with an activist and he lost his temper a little bit. At DU many people simply went after Obey, but the thing was, everything he said (despite saying it in anger) was true. The activist who confronted him was wrong, didn't understand the politics surrounding both the bill and the vote and worse, made Obey out to be a bad guy, when in fact, he is a reliable liberal, a thoughtful and hard-charging progressive.

And that's what gets me about DU. Many people here suffer from "write-off syndrome".

When one our good guys or women take a position we don't like, many of us:

1) write off the party entirely saying things like, "I'll never vote for them again" or "they are DINO's"

2) write off the candidate entirely, despite any good that candidate has tried to accomplish or actually has accomplished

3) when doing the above, do so without any knowledge of or any acknowledgement of the circumstances
(they didn't impeach because they couldn't get the votes, they didn't defund Iraq, not because Pelosi or Reid didn't want to, but because 10-20 of their members wouldn't support them meaning they couldn't pass a funding bill at all that would defund the Iraq war because not all Democrats (though most) would support it).

Anyway, the baby with the bathwater is suddenly making me into a yellow dog Democrat who is trying to get the backs of the leadership because I see them being run down so unfairly here at DU, by not most but a substantial number of people.

[txaslftist]

111. This is America. Compassion is for Europreons or Ayshins.

Now quit being such a spoilsport. I'm trying to watch a guy get beat up by the cops!

[txaslftist]

112. dupe

[Madspirit]

119. I Agree cboy

...but I don't think it's spies, trolls or freepers. I just think "bleeding heart" went out of "liberal" a long long time ago. It's sad.
Go read the deflecting and dismissing in the posts about domestic abuse.
Or go read the posts on the thread "Adults and their Noisy Noise".
Or the posts about kids...anywhere anytime.
Or the posts about PETA.
Or the posts about Paris. (You would think she was George Bush.)
Or the posts about Illegals.
Or the posts about Crime and Punishment.
Or the posts about Post Partum Depression.
Or the posts about Women's Rights and Issues.
Or the posts about Gay Rights and Issues.
Or the posts about .......

Being leftist or liberal actually used to MEAN "bleeding heart" but alas, a thing of the past and why soon............................................within the next two days..................
Lee

[cboy4]

126. I know.....the list goes on and on.

:(

[BlooInBloo]

129. Nooooooo!

[blues90]

121. It's anyones guess these days

Alot of opinions and it gets to the point where one has to be careful what they post or the bashing begins .

The thing is it's the internet and anyone can be anything they claim to be so who knows the reasons , who can catagorize all the possibilities ?

I try to stay clear or any post that begins to boil over . Perhaps count to ten before making a remark or bashing someone or at least question anothers view point instead of lashing out .

Judgement runs rampent . people need to get a grip even though there is horror and bad news around every corner we still need to try to communicate in a rational manner or no one gets ahead , there is no win or lose , look at the example our house and senate has set , pretty bad I would say , let alone the media .

[eppur_se_muova]

123. The "Morality of Facelessness".

Several have already commented on it. If you can't see whose feelings you've hurt, it doesn't have to bother you.

Kind of like the "morality of altitude" that makes it easy to drop thousands of tons of explosives on defenseless civilians, as long as it's done from thousands of feet up.

[progressoid]

153. Yep - and they can't see you.

the poster gets to hide behind his/her laptop.

[cynatnite]

127. Because it's easier to be cruel...

when a person sits in front of a monitor and types whatever strikes their fancy.

What's nice about DU is that on many occasions a lot of people here will come down on the unfeeling comments. Plus, those are the ones that's easiest to ignore and to not take seriously in the future.

[rec_report]

130. 'Trolls... who are trying to wreck the place.' --My vote, and here is the reason:

I am currently defending myself to an obvious Freeper, who took exception to the term GOPedophile that I used for Ann Coulter.
:eyes:
I mean, can the infiltration level get any more *obvious?*

Polar Bear

[cboy4]

131. Well they openly brag about infiltration on one enemy site, including

the fact that they are moderators here.

Of course there are some moles -- anyone can sign up -- although I think they exaggerate the numbers to make us paranoid.

I mean most of those conservatives are psychopaths, so they'll say anything to cause trouble.

And while I agree that there are some obvious trolls here who try to divide DU, I think there are some "progressives" who are just plain assholes.

[rec_report]

132. Well-said. n/t

[foreigncorrespondent]

135. Yes...

...one comment YOU made in your Lake Tahoe thread was pretty bad too, cboy! I commented on it in the thread, but it got deleted right along with the rest of the sub thread.

You know how I feel about the lack of compassion around here, but we shouldn't stoop to petty little snark comments in return. We are better than that.

[Shakespeare]

136. Anonymity sometimes brings out the very worst in people.

And we see it on full display here. Some folks get a perverse thrill from being utterly uncompassionate and/or shitty; it's a very twisted kind of power trip/narcissism combination.

And it's a damn shame.

[Bluebear]

138. 'it's a very twisted kind of power trip/narcissism combination.'

You said it. That is exactly what it is, and I had not had words for it until now.

[idgiehkt]

150. very true

yes.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

152. this is very true. also anonymity gives people false courage.

[Quantess]

137. I HAVE noticed

a recent increase in insensitive assholish-ness. But then, I haven't been here that long (a total of 2 years when you count the time I started lurking).

But that certainly doesn't describe the majority of DUers.

[NaturalHigh]

139. These poor people are likely considered...

upper-class and white. That's a group that tends to get raw treatment here at DU. Look at how many people still think the Duke lacrosse players did "something".

[Gormy Cuss]

141. Each of us has a different capacity for empathy.

Experience teaches us sympathy, but empathy requires the ability to put on someone else's shoes. Some people aren't very good at that.

Of course, the things on your list also contribute.

[MedleyMisty]

142. I was writing a reply when the power went out - trying again

In response to all the little digs at poor people in this thread - simply noting the fact that money makes getting through a financial misfortune easier and gives you a bit of privilege is not the same thing as "OMG all rich people suck and are assholes and need to die and I hate them all!"

Pointing out the inequalities and privilege and power system in our society does not translate to "I hate all rich white men with the fire of a thousand suns and want to do horrible things to them." - I was going to make the same observations about racism and sexism and homophobia but decided to sum them all up.

I like to think that I have somewhat equal compassion and empathy for all living beings. I say somewhat because I admit it's hard for me to feel compassion and empathy for people who post nasty hateful things on the net. So in general, I do agree with you.

But I also think that quite a few people on here really misinterpret stuff and then wildly overreact. Case in point - I spend hours in GD and the Lounge most days and never saw any really vicious nasty hate directed at Paris Hilton. I did see quite a few posters forming a wolfpack and hating on the supposed haters. And with the poor little victimized rich folk thing going on in this thread - I haven't seen any vicious hate of rich people. And if you interpreted the previous sentence as vicious hate, you're proving my misinterpretation and overreaction point.

As for the dark humor - it's a human coping mechanism. Haven't you ever heard the saying "If I don't laugh, I'll cry"? It's true, sometimes people go overboard with it, but in general it's just a way to deal.

I also understand the thing with not crying just because the TV told us to. Okay, here's an analogy that people on here will generally understand.

Most people on DU feel genuine compassion for our troops and want them to have everything they need while they're fighting and when they're at home and want to bring them home safely and really feel sadness and anger at their deaths and injuries.

A lot of conservatives go down to Tragedies R Us, buy their yellow Support the Troops ribbon and maybe an American flag magnet, cry some crocodile tears, and tell you to shut the hell up if you disagree with the war because that's hurting the troops. They are feeling surface emotions that the people on TV told them to feel.

Note: I said a lot, not all or even most and definitely not any of the ones with a relative or friend in danger in the war, so save the bashing accusations.

So yeah, when the media keeps pushing some sob story I do tend to look for their motives for doing so while feeling a quiet compassion for the people involved in the story.

Plus, there is a limit to how much you can feel for a total stranger. If I felt the same way over a stranger's death as I would feel about my husband's or mother's, I couldn't function. I would just lie in bed and cry and probably kill myself after a day or so - do you know how many humans die a day all over the world? It is possible to feel a sort of general and emotionally removed compassion and empathy, though. And because it's emotionally removed, dark humor can be tolerated and you can discuss the general topics underlying the particular event.

And I do mean general. I don't feel more compassion for strangers that look like me or live near me and less for ones that don't look like me or don't live near me. All strangers get an equal dose of compassion.

Lastly, I did see a post in the new Tahoe thread that may have been like the ones that prompted this thread. And yes, those posts are the work of trolls.

[Bluerthanblue]

143. Other- I believe much of it is fear-

and anger. Watching other people suffer random acts of tragedy, scares the hell out of some people.
And the fact that but for luck, chance, or the grace of God(s)/Allah/_______, it could be any one of us is terrifying- and no matter how we try and deny, avoid, or protect ourselves, we cannot control so much in this world.

And that makes some people very angry. And some try and distance them self from the reality. Pretending that it was something the victim did or didn't do, to have this happen to them.


But i've learned that bad things happen. even when you do everything "right" or try to be as good, careful, .....perfect as a person can be. Bad things happen- and there is nothing any of us can ultimately do to avoid it in the end. I've also learned that when going through bad times, the kindness of others can sometimes make a world of difference- suffering can be a very lonely place-

:grouphug:

but this is just my perspective-

peace

[Warren DeMontague]

148. There's a lot of bitter people, I guess.

Sad, bitter people.

:shrug:

[Swamp Rat]

149. All of the above?

:shrug:

[AwakeAtLast]

156. I vote for that one, too Swamp Rat

I am not sure we can pin it down to one thing.

It is sad to see, but not somethng that will be cured by a magic pill.

[idgiehkt]

151. trolls and etc

as well as the shadow-side coming out in people...professional shit disturbers of all political persuasions operating behind the scenes for their own purposes whether that be some ideology or just pure unfettered narcissism.

[EV_Ares]

154. I find it is getting worse all the time. It is interesting that here we

all believe in "free speech". We all know this is a liberal site so there is no room for the trolls and RWers that try to infiltrate sometimes and they should be booted.

However, the way we attack each other I find rather strange. We all supposedly have the same goal of electing good Dems, liberals, etc to office for the betterment of all mankind. But; we have different viewpoints on the candidates and who is better for the job as well.

Some here if you say anything negative about their candidate, are unbelievably rude and vicious. I feel all of us liberals should be able to say what we feel about our viewpoints.

It is ok to disagree but why attack. How many of you even get criticized about your spelling or word usage? In other words there seems to be a bunch of negativity.

Personally I like to hear different viewpoints.

[smoogatz]

163. Bogus poll, bogus question.

It's posible to have conflicting feelings, y'know. Most people do at some point. Yes, it's sad that people in Tahoe lost their homes. On the other hand, is it really a good idea to build huge trophy houses in the middle of dry mountain forests and expect firefighters to risk their lives again and again to protect them? It's an honest and reasonable question, and has nothing to do with compassion or the lack thereof. Yes, it's sad that Anna Nicole OD'd, but on the other hand, why was she a celebrity in the first place and what does the media's vulture-like interest in her demise tell us about our culture? Again, a reasonable and useful (and interesting) question. Yes, it was sad that Steve Irwin got killed by a stingray, but it was also both ironic and predictable that at some point, one of the dangerous wild animals he used to make his living would attack and kill him. It's a perfectly reasonable observation that has nothing to do with hate or lack of compassion--you can feel sad AND note the irony at the same time. What troubles me is the tendency among DU's compassion police to tell the rest of us how we're supposed to feel, how we're allowed to express those feelings, and then to express shock! and dismay! when some of us don't behave according to the strict tenets of the DU Code of Compassion, as determined by the OP, I guess. And while we're at it, where's your compassion for poor little Paris Hilton, who had a nervouse breakdown while spending a week in jail? If you care so deeply about the plight of those less fortunate, why don't you care about Paris?

[MilesColtrane]

164. The internet is the equivalent of an elementary school playground.

Except that no one gets physically hurt.

[starroute]

167. "Compassion" is too often just the flipside of the victim society

It's easy to feel sorry for someone. It's just as easy to pride yourself for feeling sorry. It's a way of patting yourself on the back and saying, "See what a special and swell person I am."

Compassion for suffering without action to address the causes of that suffering is meaningless.

Compassion for someone else's loss without real sacrifice that risks an equivalent loss on your own part is meaningless.

Compassion for the victim du jour without stopping to figure out who deserves true sympathy, who does not, and who might deserve 15 minutes of sympathy followed by a good, swift kick in the ass is meaningless.

I've noticed worrisome signs lately that too many at DU are turning into compassion junkies. I started thinking along these lines a few months ago, when I realized that threads concerning Larisa Alexandrovna's health problems were gaining attention, kicks, and recommendations far beyond what most of her serious, hard-hitting investigative articles ever get.

That seemed very wrong to me, and I've been particularly sensitive to signs of the same phenomenon at DU ever since. If it were up to me, I'd like to see a complete ban on lost puppy-dogs and abused kittie-cats, and a lot more marching in the streets and speaking truth to power. Because it isn't up to me, and because this is DU, after all, that will never happen. But a similar reaction may be the cause of the crotchetiness on threads like the one about the Lake Tahoe fire.

[cboy4]

168. No, you see some of us don't have to generate sympathy for

people, as apparently you do.

It comes naturally. It's an instinct.

I have so much self confidence that I don't need any self-pats on the back.

You use a lot of generalizations as though you're some sort of expert on human behavior, when much of what you said is beyond ridiculous.

And by the way, you lost all credibility when you said if you were in charge, you would ban certain things.

How progressive. :eyes:

[starroute]

169. And you, my friend, appear to have no sense of irony

Perhaps that one doesn't come naturally.

[cboy4]

170. What does irony have to do with anything? I'm being serious.

[cassiepriam]

171. Some tragedies are complex issues that merit discussion.

I can feel compassion for the victims, but there needs
to be some discussion about what happened and why.

[Flying Dream Blues]

173. I've also noticed a spike in the intolerance of less than "perfectly"

liberal stances. One post even talked about how they had neighbors who seemed like perfectly nice people and then went out and BOUGHT a dog, instead of getting one from a shelter. This apparently made them instantly contemptible, even though there are legitimate reasons (allergies, asthma) why you might need to know the breed you're getting. There's just so little tolerance around here these days, I rarely post and can't make it through most of the topics with "flames" around them, because it usually has devolved into some kind of self-righteous war of insults and contempt. I wish there was a way to enforce basic respect and tolerance, because I love this place but lately it seems more depleting than energizing.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

176. good point. rushing to judgement because of personal choices

is something a lot of us do.