Having Read The First 3 Parts Of The 4-Part Washington Post Cheney Article

[ThomWV]

It seemed to me, after reading the first segment of the 4-part article, that maybe what I was seeing was the shotgun blast to blow Cheney out of office while making sure no pellets hit Bush. Throughout Part I Cheney was introduced as the conniving demon, rarely observed but always in charge. However, at the same time Cheney was being exposed as the powersource of the Bush Administration there was always a clear undertone suggesting that an ideologically purer Bush stood on a higher plain. Part II continued with more of the same. Today's Part III portrays an almost omnipotent Cheney controlling tax policy with disregard for the economy while at the same time continuing to hold Bush at some higher ideological level.

It was my assertion Sunday, and continues today, that this piece in the Washington Post is part of a move to remove Cheney from office while simultaneously taking heat off of Bush and reassuring his position as the ideological leader of the Republican Party.

[hippiechick]

1. Bingo!

Dick's got nothing to lose at this point, he's not running for office again.
He's got his brazillions & doesn't give a crap about a "legacy" or what people think of him.

He'll take the heat - along with alllllll the blood money - in order to leave Dimson's halo only partially dented for history's sake.

[Solly Mack]

2. Wouldn't be the first time Cheney saved a Bush

and yeah, it reeks to high heaven of that same smell

[PDJane]

3. Perhaps Rachel Maddow isn't totally nuts after all........

when she says that they're removing Cheney to make way for Jeb Bush, so he can keep the legacy going.

It's nightmarish enough to be true.

[mopinko]

15. if rachel says it,

i believe it. that sounds like just the kind of slimy move they would make. if impeachment heats up, they got the getaway car idling by the back door.

[Norquist Nemesis]

20. Make way for him how? He'd have to announce an "exploratory"

or something. Is it legal for a President to appoint his/her first-line blood relative as VP? Seem to recall something about JFK could not Constitutionally do it with Bobby. :shrug:

[Maggie_May]

4. I don't agree

Cheney is a reflection on the white house. I do agree it will take some of the heat off Bush but it also will open just another can of ruthless deception that this administration has played on the American people.

[ThomWV]

7. Well, maybe we actually do agree

Maggie,

I don't disagree with you at all that Cheney is indeed a reflection of the Bush White House and I personally don't think for a moment that Bush is any less to blame than Cheney for the mess we have - indeed I place 100% of the blame directly on Bush himself - but that really wasn't my assertion. What I was trying to say was it seems to me the purpose of the articles is to elevate Bush as a man who continues to be ideologically pure and that all the mistakes were made by a power hungry Cheney who was operating essentially out of Bush's sight. Its all hogwash of course. I think they are joined at the hip but the name of the office door is still Bush.

Thom

[Totally Committed]

5. That's been my take on it, too

Cheney will not go quietly, and probably not at all.

TC

[Maggie_May]

10. Well I just hope they all go to

HELL! I know thats very nice but Cheney isn't a very nice person either.
LOL

[sutz12]

6. Only a brain dead Republican could consider Bush a "Leader" nt

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

8. it might also be an effort by the wapo to make the paper relevant

and boost their readership. they keep offering me free weekday/saturday delivery. (i'm sunday only)

this series makes bush look weak.

[Moochy]

9. Two Year Old Story

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/05/31/bush.plug/

Senior Bush plugs Jeb for president 'someday'

Wednesday, June 1, 2005 Posted: 9:48 AM EDT (1348 GMT)

CNN) -- Florida Gov. Jeb Bush would be "awfully good" in the job of president, but the timing isn't right, his father and former President George H.W. Bush told CNN Tuesday.

Asked if he would want Jeb to run, Bush said, "Someday I would, yes."

Bush, who was president from 1989-1993, appeared on CNN's "Larry King Live" with former first lady Barbara, from the family compound in Kennebunkport, Maine.

Jeb Bush is in his second gubernatorial term, which ends in January 2007. His brother George ends his second presidential term in January 2009 and cannot run again.

"He'd be awfully good," the elder Bush said. "This guy's smart, big and strong. Makes the decisions.

[acmavm]

11. I think the whole thing is a whitewash for the neocons. They're

making old Dick look like he instigated it all. There was a cabal of movers and shakers (as they saw themselves) who felt that the time was right to put all their dreams and schemes into action. They can get rid of Mr. Visible, but will that stop anything? I mean, he's gotta go. I agree with that. But I still suspect that the hand of Poopy is in all this somehow.

Getting rid of old Dick? Like they got rid of Rummy? He's still around, isn't he? I read here that he's still there in an 'advisory' capacity.

[UTUSN]

12. Shrub is ALWAYS exempted. When anybody brings up Shrub's lowest polls,

the IMMEDIATE response is to bring up Congress's even lower ones. This is a micro version of EVERYTHING that Shrub is criticized about.

[GeorgeGist]

13. If that's what Bush thinks ...

he's in for a rude awakening.

[Time for change]

14. Perhaps you're right, but I'm not convinced, and I have a question

Do you think that it makes Bush look good in any way to suggest that he has been little more than a stooge for his VP?

It seems to me that those who disapprove of Bush for the most part already know that Cheney has been a major force in his administration, and few of them are inclined to give any credit to Bush or take away much blame simply because they see Bush as a weak puppet who is controlled by Cheney or other powerful interests.

It also seems to me that an article like this has the potential, more than just about anything else, to erode the little support that Bush continues to enjoy today. Those who continue to support the idiot monster (IMO) do so mainly out of their opinion that he is "strong and decisive", with little care about the great harm that his decisions cause to our country and to the world. It seems to me that the kind of reporting that WaPo is now doing is the only kind of reporting that is likely to erode the little support that Bush still maintains.

[Solly Mack]

21. Did it hurt Reagan? He's a god now to some

and people remember him as something he never was

George HW Bush was portrayed as Reagan's puppet-master and that earned him the oval office...where his son sits today.

Oh, and let's not forget Chaney's role in getting HW off on Iran-Contra.

It's all in how they spin it..and how much shit the public is willing to swallow.

I've seen the public swallow a lot of shit without even blinking.

If Shrub is incompetent and stupid and clueless and ignorant and easily lead and he had a VP that took advantage of him - then he becomes another Reagan.

If Cheney is this out of control monster of a VP who acted outside the office of the executive at every turn, then it wasn't Bush - and by extension - it wasn't the Republicans who supported Bush - it was all Cheney. It wasn't conservative policy - it was Cheney with his own policy. A rogue VP who manipulated Bush - sure Bush looks like a fool - but think about it - Bush people have always counted on people thinking Bush a fool...an easy-going beer drinking every day Joe. Sure, they've tried to humanize him from time to time with their "he's like us" bullshit stories(Bush reads! Bush clears brush!)...but that's just part of the whole bullshit media driven image.

Happy-go-lucky, god-fearing Bush with the best of intentions gets hoodwinked and manipulated - bullied and lied to by mean old Cheney.

Poor Bush.

If they can spin it that way - they will.

Just a thought.


I don't support any language or any thinking that in any way mitigates Bush. I've wanted Cheney in prison since Iran-Contra. I want Bush in prison now.

[glitch]

23. Yep. It's all about perception, profit and keeping them out of prison.

If George has to be seen as a doof for awhile, no big. Poppy did it before him. Probably Prescott was just a nice man tricked by that nasty Hitler.

Edit: who wants to bet Thompson picks Jeb as his running mate? Because there is no such thing as too rich (they threw out the too thin a long long time ago).

[Time for change]

27. I don't believe that most Reagan supporters saw Reagan as

some doofus idiot controlled by his VP or anybody else. We see him as a puppet, but I don't believe that most Americans do, let alone his supporters.

If there had been widespread publicity of the kind that Bush is getting now regarding the way that Cheney ran the show I believe that it would have hurt Reagan's popularity.

Let's see what happens to Bush's approval numbers now.

[Solly Mack]

29. A prime example of good spin(lies) – Saint Ronnie's popularity

You're right in that if the media wasn't intent of protecting Reagan and promoting the lies and the myth - a lot would be different - especially about how the public was duped into thinking Reagan was "just so popular" and "just so great" even when the truth - and the polls - showed something different.

Bush supporters don't necessarily see him as a doofus either. They might not like a policy - but that doesn't mean they think poorly of him as a person. And it is handy to see him as someone controlled - because then his guilt is mitigated. Better an easily controlled dupe than a criminal.

And you have to ask yourself - knowing Bush is just as guilty as Cheney - why the mad push all of a sudden to out Cheney's actions? The media is just now finding out about Cheney? I don't think so.


Clinton and FDR both had better polling numbers when they left office than Reagan did.

So when you hear – most popular President ever in his second term – it’s cods-wallop.

Yet the myth lives. It’s the spin that wins. Saint Ronnie – popular beyond measure.

Reagan: Media Myth and Reality


A lie repeated so often that people just take it for granted that it’s the indisputable truth.

“Some in the media similarly emphasized Reagan's likability. CBS anchor Bob Schieffer asserted, "You could hate his policies, but it was hard not to like Ronald Reagan (6/6/04). But Reagan's "likability" numbers did not score much higher than other modern presidents, including Jimmy Carter”


“Mainstream media have relied heavily on Republicans and former Reagan officials to tell the story of Reagan and his accomplishments, which results in a decidedly one-sided version of events.”



Don’t be fooled by poll numbers – either for or against anyone.

The real test is how the blame is placed and how the truth is framed – the spin that wins is what the public remembers.

People might disapprove of Bush’s policies – but that doesn’t mean they disapprove of the man – rather, the image of the man promoted by the same media that promoted Reagan’s myth.


Iran-Contra took place under the Reagan’s administration. Reagan was guilty and so was Poppy Bush.

Cheney saved Bush then – though what he was ultimately protecting was the idea of a unitary executive. He championed the breaking of law – the Boland Amendment - and he went so far as to declare Congress in breach of law for attempting to hamper what he viewed as the powers of the President that were above challenge.


Poppy Bush pardoned Iran-Contra figures and tongues wagged and fingers were pointed.

Yet Reagan road off into the sunset – myth intact.

George W. Bush will never reach the myth status of Reagan but then he doesn’t have to…

All he needs is to be seen as decent and well intentioned – likable as a person – a President lied to by his Vice President and others – used and manipulated – given bad intelligence by those associated with Cheney - and Bush rides off into the sunset.

Cheney can give him that…

And the media is obliging – whatever their motives

Remember at the end of Poppy’s Presidency, the right was calling him liberal and distancing themselves from his policies – chiefly Iraq and the Gulf War.

Just because people on the right are appearing to distance themselves from Bush now doesn’t mean Bush is on the outs with the right or that they are tossing Bush aside. It could mean that - but I wouldn’t bet on it.

GOP Congress-critters aren’t having some heart changing epiphanies – they see the writing on the wall – want to be re-elected? Stop supporting an unpopular policy – the war.

GOP Presidential nominees are wearing Saint Ronnie masks but they're spouting a whole lot of Bush rhetoric.

Now, suddenly, thanks to the Cheney papers, Republicans are seeing Cheney as dangerous? Something they couldn’t see before? Something that didn’t concern them before now?
Now their eyes are open? Gee, I guess they were duped too.


I’m not saying it will happen – I am saying it can happen and has happened before.

I’m saying it stinks and shouldn’t be taken on face value.

[Time for change]

32. I couldn't agree with you more about the fact that the news media gave Reagan

every break in the book, and without them covering for him at every turn his approval ratings would have been much lower than they were -- and they weren't that high anyhow, despite all the breaks they gave him.

I don't take much at face value -- but I do take the reporting on Cheney at face value, though I could be proven wrong. Perhaps the WaPo is trying to make up for past omissions and give themselves a little additional credibility by reporting it.

But a major reason why I don't see it as some dark plot is that I can't see any likely advantage that it gives to Bush or to the status quo. It serves more than anything IMO to bring Bush's whole presidency into disrepute. I don't see how showing him to be a dupe in any way makes the point that he's a nice guy or that he is somehow immune to removal from office because of that. It makes him out to be terribly weak -- much weaker than most Americans suspected, and so weak as to warrant removal from office for that alone.

[Solly Mack]

33. Everything they are saying about Cheney is true...it's the motives I question

Better weak than criminal.

Bush wants an easy out...

I agree it makes Bush looks bad to those who haven't been paying attention...

But a bad President - and one thought bad because he looks weak - isn't a criminal President. (and we both know Bush is a thug)

This isn't about making Bush look good...but about making sure the next Bush won't be tarnished - it's about saving the Bush family political clout...and if Shrub isn't held accountable in proportion to his crimes...there will be another Bush entering the race to the WH sooner or later. Probably sooner if Bush can get out of the WH with just the "weak" label stuck to him.

Expose the family - reduce the risk.

It's not just Cheney that is guilty...but I worry that will be the main push.

[SpiralHawk]

30. "What these chickenhawk republicon clowns need is a good astrologer" - Ronald Reagan

"We republicons always depend on our occult sources. The problem with Dickie "Five Military Deferments" Cheney and Commander AWOL, is that their breed of occult Skull & Boner cabal is perverted beyond the point of sanity."

- Ronald Reagan (As channeled by his dead astrologer)

[Solly Mack]

31. LMAO

[The Backlash Cometh]

16. Bush delegated the power to Cheney. The buck stops in the oval office.

[lonestarnot]

17. Well it's not going to work. They are both heathens from hell and must be both

their mommas too.

[Norquist Nemesis]

18. Seems very plausible, but I keep asking 'part of a move' by who/whom?

That's what I can't quite put my finger on. Did Cheney piss off someone just enough to push a year-long investigative report by the media? Is Cheney putting this out there to test how far he can push without being pushed out, or a distraction to run out the clock?

In the end, the buck stops at Bush's desk. Whether Cheney's been running this shadow government with or without Bush's nod makes no difference. Bush is responsible and should be held accountable, period! He doesn't get a pass on some loose definition of a rogue VP; It's HIS VP and when it comes to the Executive Branch Bush's head is on the block.

BTW, the next time a Con is arguing 'all things Right when as applies to Bush/Cheney', I'm going to have to ask them if they consciously thought "I'm voting for Dick Cheney!" when they stepped into the voting booth. My guess is that they were voting for Bush and gave no consideration whatsoever to Cheney.

[ThomWV]

26. Poppy Bush and Barbara

Just a guess but I think George Senior can still punch a lot of buttons.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

19. What a bunch of hopeless, hysterical hypochondriacs of history

So, think he'll be the third VP to resign? Or am I being a nattering nabob of negativism?

[Morgana LaFey]

22. Did you see this link?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1185023

Edit: this one may be of interest to you as well:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1176452

[glitch]

25. And there you have it. They always telegraph their moves.

I really do bet they run Jeb as vp. Thompson is dumb, lazy and malleable, IOW perfect.

[madokie]

24. sounds that way to me too

[Disturbed]

28. Darth will not resign.

The concept that a new VP would be the contender for Pres. 08' doesn't compute. After a year this "new VP" will be smeared with the same manure as Busholini. It sure wouldn't be Jeb. Fred T. might give the nod to Jeb or maybe Mittens would. It is interesting as to what will happen with Darth now, though. Will Congress be able to strip his money and everything else that now goes to the VP? Would Congress dare Impeach this vile Asshole, Darth? I suspect nothing will happen to Darth.