Is there a difference between a bus and a slave ship?

[MichaelHarris]

Except for the shackles on the floor of a slave ship they are both fundamentally the same. Their job, transfer as many human beings as you can to work for almost non-existent wages. If you haven't seen the new flagships of slavery, the bus, then you haven't been looking hard enough.

I just returned from a photo trip in central Washington, for those not familiar with the area it's full of orchards. Apples, peaches, pears, and berries of all kind bloom along the hillsides. A very beautiful place with a distasteful underbelly. Early morning and late afternoon the roads are alive. Not with commuters on the way to work but full of dilapidated school buses with the logos covered in black paint. Men, women, and children, heads down fill the seats. America's new slaves, hispanics are being bussed to and from the fields to do "stoop" labor for mere pennies. The people who hire them are the Bush die-hards, bumper stickers on the cars at the beautiful farm houses speak volumes.

The faces on these human beings tell a story of long travel, far away from home, no chance of escape. How on earth can we not care for these people? The human beings that pick our food. They are not a commodity, traded from farm to farm across America. Some may never see their home again, some may never touch those they love. They only want to live, they only want to provide.

During a break in my photography I grabbed a local newspaper. A story on the second page caught my attention, a sort of putting two and two together revelation. It seems Washington has one of the highest unclaimed body count. You know, the bodies no one knows, the abandoned. I don't really know what would be a high number for unclaimed bodies but 14,000 seems high to me. I then began to wonder, when a migrant worker falls ill what happens? If one dies who knows? When one wants to go home, who drives? Fourteen thousand unclaimed bodies. Who are they? Did they pick one of our meals?

Whatever one's thoughts are on immigration it should never supersede the way we treat our fellow beings on this wonderful planet. I'm teaching myself Spanish, no real reason. I just wanted to tell the next worker I meet, "Thank you and I care".

Michael Harris
I get bothered real easy.

[PDJane]

1. Good.

Compassion is a rare commodity, and I take some comfort in knowing that this kind of treatment of human beings bothers someone besides me.

[MichaelHarris]

19. Jane

I added some pictures:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1209175&mesg_id=1209175

[sandnsea]

2. I'm in Oregon

I grew up in California, in the middle of the 60's & 70's farmworker strikes. This isn't new.

You might need to learn Vietnamese and Thai and Chinese too. There are now labor traders who import pickers from SE Asia, etc. Already been violations. It isn't just a question of someone being driven to the border. More and more people would need to be taken clear across the Pacific to make it home.

If guest worker passes, it's only going to get worse.

[TahitiNut]

3. Yep. I have a memory of those days, too.

It's gotten worse. Far worse.

[MichaelHarris]

18. sand

I added some pictures:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1209175&mesg_id=1209175

[Matsubara]

4. The main difference is the farm workers were not kidnapped from their home countries...

...to be brought here.

I don't know quite what else to say about the rest of your post. But if both labor and immigration laws were enforced, things might not be as bad for farm workers...

We need another...

[sandnsea]

5. Not physically captured

But these labor traders are coercing them with promises of big money and the kind of living conditions they see in the movies and magazines. Then they get here and the companies dump them in hell holes, don't send the money home, and abuse the hell out of them. How can they complain when they don't know the language or laws. How can they get home. It isn't quite slavery, I agree with that; but it is getting damned close. I assume they're being flown over, but I don't even know that for sure.

[MichaelHarris]

7. sand

my guess is it's a network of "labor" brokers all along the west coast. I've just seen too many buses in the last few years for any other explanation. They are always full of people using paper sacks for luggage. Considering how far the border is from here I highly doubt anyone wants to take them back.

[sandnsea]

10. H-2A, H-2B

"Contractors are also bringing southeast Asian workers on H-2A to North Carolina, the state with the most jobs certified to be filled by foreign guest workers. The New York Times on February 28, 2007 reported that some of the H-2A workers from Thailand and Indonesia reported paying $10,000 or more for US jobs that would pay $15,000 a year and last up to three years (most H-2A workers stay in the US less than a year, but those involved in sheepherding may stay up to three years). When they arrived, most earned far less, in some cases less than $5,000."


MUCH MORE:

http://migration.ucdavis.edu/rmn/more.php?id=1204_0_4_0

The buses take them to the fields and processing sheds. Some are legal, some are illegal. But they aren't all just from Mexico anymore.

[MichaelHarris]

12. I didn't see

many Asians but I'm sure they are there. You have to really drive deep into the hidden areas to see the shacks they are forced to live in. My goal is to photograph as much as I can and bring those images to a public forum.

[sandnsea]

14. Good for you

Oh yeah, none of them are given the housing and whatnot that the law mandates. I don't know why it never changes. It's good you're documenting what you're seeing. That kind of concern has been missing in this country for many years.

[MichaelHarris]

6. So

when they ask for two weeks off to go back home to visit their family the farm owner takes them there? If they break a leg on the job the farm owner gets them the proper medical attention? If they die on the job does the farm owner do everything in their power to get the body back to their homeland?

There is much more you could say about the post.

[Matsubara]

8. The conditions for farm workers are horrific, I'm sure.

Again, to me the key seems to be enforcement of the labor and immigration laws.

If employers knew they would be penalized for employing illegal immigrants, and that they would also be severely punished if they did not pay a decent wage and provide safe working conditions, much of the problem would cease to be.


But instead of focusing on the problem, which is the employers, the politicians and pundits keep scapegoating the immigrant laborers, who are really just helpless pawns.


And in answer to your questions, I don't think the employers do jack shit for the laborers.

[MichaelHarris]

9. You're right

no one, either party seems to want to prosecute the the illegal hiring and treatment of migrant workers. It truly is America's dirty little secret. Chase the scampering souls that cross the desert at night but heaven forbid don't touch Del Monte or Tree Top Apple Juice.

The one thing I hope to leave people with the post is this, "14,000 unclaimed bodies in Washington State. Who were they? Are there that many lost teens looking for Nirvana in Seattle?".

[sandnsea]

11. That's not true

It is not fair to say no one wants to prosecute those who hire illegals. I've heard many Democrats argue that point, and changing the way we prosecute employers is part of the new immigration bill, although I don't think it goes far enough. The real problem is, as long as guest worker is in that bill, workers do not stand a chance.

[MichaelHarris]

13. the problems

in the bills put forward so far is the penalties are just fines. These companies make millions and millions. A fine to them is just a product of doing business. It's comparable to them needing a new spray truck, you just have to pay for it. Prison time is what's needed for those who traffic and employ the worker. At the bare minimum jail time must be handed out to those who mistreat the migrant farm worker.

While the bills mention heavy fines I've not seen any information pertaining to prison time for those who hire or a provision guaranteeing fair conditions for the worker.

[sandnsea]

15. I agree

But have you noticed in these recent raids - they never really blast the name of the company or owner of the company raided. The media makes it all about how many immigrants are caught. If we shamed the business in the media, that would help too. Maybe we should demand a Fair Labor label, the way we have an organic label. And then elect people who will make sure the labels mean something.

[hfojvt]

16. gracias y ti amo?

Thank you and I love you. You must have already known 'gracias'. I am more used to saying te quiero (if not spelling it) but that is more appropriate for bonito senoritas.

I never did the work, but I was under the impression that apple pickers in Wisconsin made decent money. Maybe not $10 an hour, but not $1.40 an hour either.

14,000 does sound like alot. Is that for a year? I think there are only about 20,000 homicides for the whole US and 30,000 suicides. Those people are dying of accident, disease or age, perhaps, and their families do not exist locally or are too poor to pay for a burial.

[MichaelHarris]

17. Thank you very much

I'm actually going to work a little harder on the story. I'm getting some of my film developed now and images will be trickling in.

[Rex]

20. Well

You can get off a bus and walk away. You can't walk away from a slave ship. That is a fundamental difference.

[MichaelHarris]

21. that's true

they can walk away from the bus only it's 1000s of miles away from home.

[Rex]

23. I just meant the bus and ship, events are different in the life of a bus

and the slave ship. Mass transit succumbs to the will of the user.

[libodem]

22. 14,000 unclaimed bodies?

My God. Why isn't that news? All you hear about are the supposed unpaid losses hospital and welfare take treating migrant labor. And I'm talking millions being quoted by bigots who hate farm laborers. I think it's made-up statistics of course. Just like the millions they quote sucked out of the school funds. Well, the one story I did hear, from and LPN who used to work at an Armor Kill Floor, as an industrial nurse, was about a Mexican man who was mangled. They just shipped him back home rather than take a risk of having him treated. They didn't want to be caught employing an undocumented worker. A lot of meat plants hire out of country workers. Nasty, filthy, smelly, work, too. Not like those nice clean fruit pickin' jobs, they are takin' from the high school kids.:sarcasm:

[MichaelHarris]

26. What sucks

is I didn't keep the paper. I do know it was a Seattle paper, Monday or Tuesdays edition on the inside front page I think.

[Swamp Rat]

24. "Gracias y yo cuido de ustedes."

"Te amo" ("I love you," informal), as another suggested, would be inappropriate to say to someone you do not know. ;)

You could also say, "me importan ustedes," meaning "You are all important to me (I care about you)," which is what I would say.

Here are some DU forums where you might find help with learning Spanish:

Latino/Hispanic Group
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=379

Languages and Linguistics Group
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topics&forum=309

:hi:

[MichaelHarris]

25. very cool Swamp

thanks. I went to the book store and got a learning package with a book and 4 CDs. I just started the first chapter so I'm not very good yet but I'm a fast learner. This book teaches the whole deal, not just common stuff.

[Swamp Rat]

27. Don't be afraid to just start talking to others in Spanish even if you are a beginner..

You will learn a hell of a lot faster if you try to use what you learn from books. Carry a small, pocket dictionary and use it often. Read it for 'fun' when you have spare time, and invent imaginary conversations with others as if you were trying to communicate with a Spanish speaker who cannot speak English. Think of interesting things you would like to be able to say, as well as phrases you might use often. Take a trip to a Latin American country and stay as long as you can - I recommend Costa Rica. ;) There are great immersion programs there and Ticos are very nice people (I lived there).

You'll be speaking Spanish before you know it! :D

On another note, I LOVE Português and recommend it if you have the desire and time. Once you learn Portuguese, Spanish is very easy to learn (a lot easier than Portuguese), and I find I can read Italian and French very easily now with NO training whatsoever. It is harder going from Spanish to Portuguese... I had to live in Brasil before I got past the hump (of forgetting enough Spanish to not interfere with the Portuguese).



www.swamp-rat.com

[cgrindley]

28. considering how many died in the middle passage

I'd have to say a big fucking yes. a bus is a fuck of a lot different from a slave ship. the two are not even remotely comparable. it's a terrible terrible and offensive comparison.

[MichaelHarris]

30. I'll let those know

on the bus when I interview them for you.

[pampango]

31. DU'ers love to compare things they don't like to slavery or Nazi Germany.

You could point out a million differences between illegal immigration and slavery, but the OP's equating the two still has the "zing" factor that we love so much here. ;)

[MichaelHarris]

32. I'll make it a little easier

Evicted sharecroppers during the depression:



They weren't needed anymore. 14,000 unclaimed bodies in Washington State alone, that has "zing". Do you really believe slavery "ended" with the Civil War?

[pampango]

33. Thanks for the picture. It is all clear to me now.

Oh, and thanks for another slavery "zing".

If Africans had been "lured" to the US by slick advertising and planted "word of mouth", then sold into slavery your comparison of slave ships and immigrant buses would be more valid. I have never heard anyone claim that any of the Africans came here of their own free will, even as victims of a PR scam or terrible poverty in their homeland.

Some illegal immigrants are terribly exploited, while others are probably content with their jobs. Most, not all, are free to return home if they want to. You can't say that about slaves.

[MichaelHarris]

34. so

the migrant workers that have been bussed thousands of miles away from home, with limited English skills, little money, and not much more than the clothes on their back can get home pretty easy?

[pampango]

35. Pretty easy? Some yes, some no, but they can all get home more easily

than slaves abducted from Africa could, wouldn't you agree?

Are you sure that all migrants are bussed thousands of miles? Are all 12 million living in Maine, Vermont or New Hampshire? I thought a few of them worked in California, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas.

It is true that immigrants are living and working farther and farther from the southwest, but I am not sure that they all travel there by bus (perhaps forcibly?). Some may travel with family and friends by car, in order to join those who have gone before.

[frustrated_lefty]

29. Ummmm, hystrionics anyone?

Sorry, I have to be up in time to catch the bus to work. Otherwise, I might reply at greater length.

Do you have a point, other than that you're feeling feelings?