I remember Watergate....

[jaysunb]

It started off kinda hazy to most Americans--a break-in at the DNC offices gets discovered by a lowly security guard ( Frank Wills ) in May of 1972. At first blush, it seemed to be just more political pranks and hijinks. But as the names of the folks involved and their connection to CREEP ( Nixon re-election campaign)was exposed by investigative reporting of the Washington Post & the New York Times, the break-in was connected to a much larger conspiracy in the Nixon administration.

Those investigations revealed the administration was not only spying on it's political opponents, but, in their efforts to maintain secrecy and prevent leaks there was an entire extralegal operation within the Justice department and the White House known as the "plumbers" whose job it was to "plug" the leaks.

We all know how it ended.

Fast forward to today, 35 years after the break-in and 33 years after Nixon resigned in disgrace, we find ourselves with another case of lawlessness and illegality within the Whitehouse and the DOJ.
Another Vice-President with serious ethical challenges. More illegal spying. More claims of executive privilege.


It took two years between the break-in to Nixons' resignation and nearly 5 years before the last sentence was pronounced and the last perped packed off to prison..... The AG Mitchell,Whitehouse counsel John Dean, Haldeman, Ehrlichman, Colson, Liddy, Hunt, McCord, Segretti, Chapin and many more. Yes, they went to jail !

And it could happen again.

I don't have a lot of faith in the bunch in Congress right now, but back in 72 & 73 it didn't seem like much would come Watergate either. And it's true that we ( Democrats) held the majority then as now, but they didn't seem inclined to do anything at first. It wasn't until the investigative reporting of the WaPo & NYT along with nightly newscasts of the 3 major networks and finally their nonstop coverage of the hearings that truth arose for all to see.

It could happen again.

[malaise]

1. Great post

Today's young adults are very impatient. I am enjoying the process. The gig is up. Bush and Cheney know that. Now to watch the Dems tie up the knots.

[jaysunb]

3. We live in the " immediate gatification" era

and under the current cicumstances, we're lucky the process works slowly, or otherwise the neocons would have us much further down the road of totalitarism.

[mediawatch]

9. what are you talking about

we have been trying to impeach bush since 2002. No wait I take that back, since he was selected by the lovely 5.
6 1/2 years. He has a year and 1/2 to go and bush and cheney will leave the WH in the sunshine and head back to their multi million dollar estates. Richer than they thought possible

[jaysunb]

13. History can be very harsh...

I, like most others would like to see these guys in the Hague, but, maybe that won't happen. But they will never escape the judgement of history, their names forever linked with infamy.

[mediawatch]

22. I agree

and if they had shame it would mean something to them.

[ellisonz]

24. It's not just the young adults.

[Blackhatjack]

2. Yep, and who will forget the quizzing by Sen Sam J. Ervin of NC?

He set the right tone, and placed the proceedings in the proper light. It was about ensuring that our constitutional form of government survived the criminal deeds of those holding the highest offices in the land.

Properly framed, Bush/Cheney etal. will have a hard time defending themselves from their corrupt deeds.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

4. Pat Leahy.

I gotta feeling he has a pair of old boots sitting ready, ready to run them up some notorious asses.

[jaysunb]

6. This would fall to Conyers

in the house. Remember, he was on the panel back then.

[onenote]

28. actually, Ervin's hearings were not part of the impeachment process

They were a special investigatory committee of the Senate created in Feb 1973. It was that committee's work that set in motion a series of events that eventually, some 18 months later, led to the adoption of articles of impeachment. Among the steps along the path: JOhn Dean's testimony about a cover up which led to the appointment of a special prosecutor and Alexander Butterfield's testimony about a secret taping system which led to subpoenas which led to the Saturday Night Massacre which led to the commencement of a formal impeachment inquiry getting started in the House in Feb 1974 and, after the SCOTUS ruled in July 1974 in US v Nixon, to the adoption of three articles.

[jaysunb]

29. Thank you. you are correct

:thumbsup:

[LuckyLib]

43. I can't think of an event more fun to watch than Leahy facing Cheney

in a hearing. My popcorn is waiting to be popped!

[trof]

27. His eyebrows had their own zip code.

[helderheid]

5. rec 1 - thank you for this post

[jaysunb]

10. Thank you

:toast:

[Swamp Rat]

7. IMPEACH!!

:kick:

[dkofos]

8. But that bastard nixon skated, as will bush & cheney.

[madokie]

11. Yes he skated right out of our lives

[jaysunb]

12. Nixon didn't skate...

sure, he didn't go to jail, but his shame and humiliation will suffice throughout all time.imo

[alphafemale]

14. I remember being about 10, and cheering his resignation, and being scolded.

My family were huge Dem's and hated Nixon.

But at that point, they taught me to not mock an opponent that had already been defeated

[jaysunb]

16. Your parents were/are wise people.

I hope you continue to hear their counsel.

[ellisonz]

Only historians can judge...

http://www.comedycentral.com/motherload/player.jhtml?ml_video=71086&ml_collection=&ml_gateway=&ml_gateway_id=&ml_comedian=&ml_runtime=&ml_context=show&ml_origin_url=/shows/the_daily_show/videos/john_hodgman/index.jhtml&ml_playlist=&lnk=&is_large=true

[ellisonz]

26. Only historians can judge...

http://www.comedycentral.com/motherload/player.jhtml?ml_video=71086&ml_collection=&ml_gateway=&ml_gateway_id=&ml_comedian=&ml_runtime=&ml_context=show&ml_origin_url=/shows/the_daily_show/videos/john_hodgman/index.jhtml&ml_playlist=&lnk=&is_large=true

[onenote]

30. My dad was specifically targeted by Nixon when Nixon was a congressman

going after allegedly "red leaning" government employees. He blocked my dad from getting a promotion because my dad had belonged to the Lawyers Guild in the 1930s. To say the least, Nixon was not a very like man in our household.

Yet, the night he resigned I remember going out to walk the dog and my dad came along and as we walked and talked, my dad surprised me by saying "I hate the SOB, but I almost feel sorry for him". He explained that it was hard not to feel sorry for someone who had made one thing, and one thing alone his life's goal -- ie. becoming president -- only to lose it. He said it was an almost classical "tragedy". After that we went back in and had a beer to celebrate his resignation!

[jaysunb]

33. Fantastic story !

I thinks lots of people felt like your Dad.

The entire affair became bigger than Nixon...it was about the whole country and who we were. That's where we are right now.

btw see post # 16 .

[benld74]

15. HAppened when I was in high school, Nixon left office when I was a senior

[treestar]

17. When you're right, you're right

People are too excitable to get things done quickly these days. It'll happen. Chimpy and his Puppetmaster are in it all up to their ears. The People know it; that's why the approval ratings are so low.

We were just lucky to be oblivious (we didn't have the internets) during the early stages of Watergate, and in those days, didn't expect everything to happy instantly.

Thanks for the breath of sanity. :hi:

[cascadiance]

18. The biggest problems now is the media and associated "distractions" like Paris Hilton...

I remember well in high school when coming home from school during Watergate Hearings, there was really NOTHING else to do besides go outside and play ball, etc., read a book, or listen to casettes/LP's... We didn't have cable or satellite TV in those days. We didn't have any internet. We didn't even have computers then. Maybe some programmable calculators, but that was about it. Didn't have VCR's or other ways of playing videos. No video games. Even pong, or Atari wasn't around then.

But we did have non-stop coverage on ALL of the major networks in those days during the daytime of Watergate hearings. It was hard to as a kid to avoid getting exposed to them at some point. Today on the other hand, even the major news network like CNN are more focused on whether Paris Hilton is wearing or not wearing makeup after leaving prison than actual hard news, let alone all of the other distractions we have now.

We need some way now to ENSURE that most of America hears about the egregious behavior that would call for impeachment. The media is VERY questionable in its role to do this by themselves. We have to figure out some forcing functions to make sure this happens today!

[jaysunb]

20. Two things...

I don't think many teenagers had their minds on what grownups were doing then ,before or even now. But with the internets and cable tv, it's pretty hard to escape the news of the day whether it's Paris Hilton, missing blonds or the body count from Iraq. Being a teenager is an expereince that shouldn't be missed....:rofl:

Yes the media is obviously much different than it was back then, but that's where we the netroots come in. It's been shown that what begins here in the nets will lead the MSM around sooner or later. It's already happening--even if their motivations are suspect.

[cascadiance]

25. I know I myself didn't spend a lot of time watching TV during those hearings...

Back then if the hearings weren't on, we'd be watching things like Star Trek or Mission Impossible reruns in the afternoon or something like that. We were pushed away from that activity to do other things when the hearings pushed those aside. I watched a little of it at times, though I have to admit, that was too early in my life for me to get very interested in it and watch it for lengths of time. Nevertheless, I had some exposure to it, and the fact that it displaced what I might have wanted to watch then had me realize that it was important crap that was going down and to ask about it and look up info on it. Today, people can still get their "fixes" of distractions without getting interrupted like we did then.

I don't worry about the choir today. I think they are far more stronger today with the internet and many other sources of info that we didn't have then. I worry more about those in the middle that still haven't found the time out of their busy schedule of work and other meaningless distractions to absorb that some very significant and nasty events are happening now. It's hard now to build a mass movement of concern without media making it a priority for us to know about it.

[jasmeel]

19. I truly appreciate these types of comments. They give the current

situation some perspective and we need that. I guess our problem today is getting that investigative reporting!

[jaysunb]

21. Bingo

but the internets will be the place those investigations begin. The MSM is near extinction.

[crappyjazz]

23. Thank you for this view

it's a good reminder ... I was only 10 at the time, but I remember a lot of it ... my parents glued to the tv, people "tsk tsking" over Nixon's bad language and so on. Going through the chronology, you can see that even with a different kind of media back then, it still took time.

I know the country is impatient right now, they want change. It's not a drive thru, and it's not a microwave ... it's a process, and it needs to be thorough. The dems are only just slightly in charge and it's only been six months. I still believe things will happen, that things are indeed happening now. The republicans are turning now too, slowly but surely.

Of course I'm an eternal optimist :)

Edited to fix my spelling and to add that I seem to remember that it was the first time we heard "expletive deleted" in the news!

[David Zephyr]

31. Excellent observations! I also remember Watergate.

I was living in the Catskills when the break-in was first reported. It smelled from the very beginning.

[tblue37]

32. There is no comparable investigative reporting by the MSM this time,

though. If it weren't for the Internets, nothing at all would have moved forward on Bush/Cheney. But the Internets just can't reach as many ordinary Americans as the WaPo and network news reports did during Watergate.

[jaysunb]

34. true

but we can drag them along as we've already been able to do...witness the 06 elections....

[PATRICK]

39. Correct

The chilling difference is that the news scene is extremely changed and not all for the better. There is actually more investigative reporting and information and a public base following it. That is the good news. Unfortunately the MSM, the largest(though shrunken) comprised of all the ordinary Joes who never see this online, has moved along in a separate universe that we never knew was corrupting truth since its corporate inception. Gone the simplicity of covered hearings where housewives and students would be glued to the sets when dad came home. the news people on the evening news wrapped it up like sportcasters pleased to have such avid market share. Even uncritical ignorance of reporters and viewers alike, some spin for the "President" given deferentially then as now, was there for the visceral punches delivered live. There was no problem for the "Saturday Night Massacre" to be invisible. The punch to the gut hit all of America pre-spin, full attention, concern for the Constitution on high alert. the impression that lingers now is that the press was along for the ride, mostly, afraid of the president in a way that the public caught but didn't appreciate.

Nixon couldn't shake this full attention and got off cheap considering because myths were more important than consequences. The bill of goods, echoed by once reluctant Dems, was that thus far and no farther for the good of country. All the bogeymen and tremors were brought in successfully at last. So if the public really believed that why was Ford ruined because of the pardons? It was more important to betray the people and the law and for that the real fall guy was Ford.

Don't expect that scenario to be either rosy or repeated. Things are much worse, the people and the knowledge more spun and suppressed and ignored than ever. But the people, even minus the attention of the shrunken 24/7 slop MS, are absorbing the blows and getting a lasting desire for justice albeit with less knowledge or implicity than before..

Which will be ignored by the entire top establishment even more disingenuously than ever. And the Dems will be poised to take the long drop for these war criminals.

[wryter2000]

35. All true

I remember, too. Unfortunately, we don't have the same news media now. The investigations hardly show up on the "mainstream" news, and when they do, the analysis is usually about the political implications of the abuses. No analysis of the abuse itself.

Still, I haven't given up hope.

[jaysunb]

41. Keep hope ALIVE...

now, where did I hear that ??? :rofl:

[warren pease]

36. American media: Therein lies the problem...

As you write: "It wasn't until the investigative reporting of the WaPo & NYT along with nightly newscasts of the 3 major networks and finally their nonstop coverage of the hearings that truth arose for all to see."

Unfortunately, American mainstream media is now a gigantic, foul-smelling shit shoveling machine controlled by corporate America expressly to feed us a continuous diet of irrelevant pap, swill and drivel. They lost the thread of the story decades ago and are now only qualified to dish out pop culture infotainment masquerading as important developments; report breathlessly on the latest D-class celebrity screw-up; or act as stenographers and pom-pom wavers for the latest batch of official BushCo lies.

Ben Bagdikian in "The Media Monopoly," his seminal work on the causes and effects of media consolidation published in 1983, bemoaned the fact that there were only about 50 companies that, at the time, controlled the content and "spin" of all mainstream information sources in America. We should be so lucky.

Now, there are four corporations in complete control of over-the-air network TV content, a few more that run cable news outlets, and a small number of corporations, led by Clear Channel, that own the lion's share of American radio stations. Even newspapers have been swept up in the consolidation craze.

Corporate America is in sole control of mass media’s singular ability to define and delimit the boundaries of acceptable opinion, which in this case means bringing the American political agenda into close alignment with the corporate *value* system. And those values don't include impeaching the mafiosos who makes them a bit richer every single day.

Given all the above, I'm less than optimistic that the "truth (will) arise for all to see."

What happens if they hold impeachment hearings and nobody even knows about it, since they're all tuned into reality TV and don't have the time or attention span to handle actual reality?


wp

[jaysunb]

37. I can't disagree with you, but, I remain optimistic.

Mainly due to the forum (internets) we're using for this conversation.

But, we shall see....

[Zomby Woof]

38. I remember Watergate too

And history does not repeat itself.

There is a year and a half left of the Bush regime. Right now, all eyes are on 2008, not impeachment.

Impeachment is the right thing to do, and it is desirable...

But it just ain't gonna happen.

I do enjoy the occasional impeachment bonerfests in GD though.

Sorry, but my job here is to post cold little splashes of reality, even when it's not what I want to hear either.

[jaysunb]

40. Watergate did not produce impeachment...

and carefully read, you'll notice I never suggested that was the end game today. But I did mention the fact that lots of people wound up in jail. Maybe not the desired target ( Nixon) but enough to make up for him. In several other comments here, I've stated that people like Nixon, Bush, Cheney et al will suffer worse fates, as history will be very harsh on them all.

[struggle4progress]

42. It was a different time. Lots of people were shocked. But the ruling elite apparently decided ...

... the true lesson of Watergate was that we had too much democracy and political accountability.

Reagan's administration was not only more corrupt and criminal than Nixon's: it was also, at the time, the most corrupt administration the US had ever had, measured (for example) by total number of convicted Administration officials. But the Congressional Democrats had decided against impeachment, despite a large number of illegal acts (like the mining of Nicaraguan harbors), and even the Iran-contra scandal would not change their mind. We're still paying for that failure today.