Liberal journalists outnumber conservatives by 5-1?? Need help refuting

[NewJeffCT]

Or, at least putting it in context.

This is the letter I'm responding to:

Columnist Fudged Data

Some of the figures in Leonard Pitts Jr.'s June 27 column "Conservative Nation? Hardly" seemed to distort the real picture on the issues researched by Media Matters.

Media Matters does, as he acknowledged, have an agenda. A 2003 CBS poll on abortion found that 39 percent of respondents thought abortion should be generally available; 38 percent wanted more limits on abortion and 22 percent wanted a ban.

Consider gay marriage, where perhaps the best indicator of public opinion is the fact that 44 states have banned it via referendums that have usually passed by overwhelming margins.

Today, Americans rightfully embrace the African American civil rights movement. But how many other reform movements were rightfully rejected?

Media Matters' report is interesting, but it forgot that conservative journalists are outnumbered by their liberal colleagues 5 to 1. There is no doubt that among journalists there is a "progressive majority."

Michael Polito
Essex


http://www.courant.com/news/opinion/letters/hc-letters0629.artjun29,0,5755982.story

[n2doc]

1. What matters is who people see

I could care less about some beat reporter in some podunt rag. Millions see the fake "news" RW propaganda spewers on Faux, CNN, MSNBC, etc., etc. And the same goes for op ed writers in the papers. Not a one of the "big 3 news anchors" is liberal. Brian Williams has come out on record as saying he gets his news from Rush. If someone wants to do a similar count on the big news and op ed folks I suspect the numbers would be quite different. After all, how often does a liberal get on any of the sunday talking head shows?

[SteelPenguin]

5. Editors tend to be conservative

So yes, the reporters and journalists do tend to be liberal, but by the same measure the editors tend to be conservative. So the people who actually determine what goes on the air, or in the paper, and what that says are conservative. Pointing out that most journalists are liberal is a bad statistic for understanding the media bias.

[BOSSHOG]

2. Isn't there something oxymoronic

about putting such adjectives next to "journalist?" I do not have onhand an answer to your question but those who employ "journalists" are overwhelmingly right leaning.

[unhappycamper]

3. If the dreaded liburals have such a control over the media, why

1. can we not impeach?
   
2. are Katrina refugees not back in NOLA?
   
3. are we not discussing the $600,000,000+ annual military budget?
   
4. are we not discussing the ramifications of the USA PATRIOT Act v. the US Constitution?
   
5. is our government spying on Americans at home with impunity?
   
6. did Alito & Roberts get on the US Supreme court?
   

[unhappycamper]

13. "Americans rightfully embrace the African American civil rights movement"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1210441

[bryant69]

4. Well there are a few questions to consider

1. We do kind of have to acknowledge that on social issues; i.e. issues where money isn't involved, like Gay Marriage and Abortion, the media probably does skew a bit left. But consider any financial/business/class issue and the situation is reversed. Reporters know which class they are in or want to be in, and they protect the interests of that class. Which is why Unions are habitually the villains in any story they appear in, for example.

2. Does being a liberal make one dishonest? Or mean one can't be a good and honest craftsman? I mean if a reporter was as blinded by liberal ideology as say, a Sean Hannity, that'd be a problem. But I have a hard time believing that such ideological blinders exist across the board.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[JHB]

26. In other words, more of a "Yuppie bias" than "liberal bias" n/t

[bryant69]

29. That's a good way of putting it. n/t

[JerseygirlCT]

33. But

1. is that skewing to the left, or simply sitting mainstream?

2. I think we're accepting his premise by even going there. I don't think the letter-writer has in any way supported his assertion that so many journalists are liberal.

In fact, I'd be interested in his definition of "liberal". Seems like he means "middle of the road", or perhaps "not as far to the left as I am".

[underpants]

6. Do journalists/reporters get to decide what is in the paper or on TV?

or do the editors and publishers and the producers and owners get to decide that? The latter of course and they tend to be overwhelmingly conservative or at least NOT "liberal" (most readers of that term probably think that Hillary is a liberal BTW).

Now as far as using gay marriage and abortion as the litmus tests-that is a two pronged attack.
1. the only reason these are brought up is as wedge issues
2. these issues will never be resolved so they are the perfect flash point to bring up. That being said Loving v. Virginia is only 40 years old and in that time we have seen the acceptance of "mixed race" weddings go from very low to about 83% in the last poll I saw so the side trying to restrict rights (marriage rights) won early battles basically by rushing it to the ballot box but over time they will lose just like the rest of the reactionary/resistant to change conservative ideology has (with a weird hiccup of the last 30 years or so).

[proud2BlibKansan]

7. The media is overwhelmingly owned by conservatives

And the owners get to decide what stories are told and how they are reported. So the politics of the reporters doesn't mean diddly squat.

[havocmom]

8. IF true, might be 'cuz (some) journalists are better informed?

But they still have to get past the editors/publishers/owners who ARE overwhelmingly NOT LIBERAL to get any real news out there.

[Iris]

40. that is the argument to every accusation of a profession being "liberal"

Same with college instructors - perhaps they are liberal because they know how to inform themselves?

[w4rma]

9. Editors and owners are corporate/neo-con and they decide what gets print space/air time. (nt)

[Cooley Hurd]

10. Reporters can be flaming communists and it wouldn't matter a whit...

...if the editorial board and the publishers are all conservatives. They control the content of what gets in the paper.

I was married to a newspaper reporter (who was a Dem - if she wasn't, I wouldn't have married her ;)) and EVERY paper she worked for was run by Republicans. It's the nature of the beast.

Besides, investigative journalists HAVE to be, by definition, liberal (meaning they want to change the status quo). If not, then they're just stenographers (like Susan Schmidt of the WP).

[rpannier]

11. You could always remind this person that

William Kristol and Ann Coulter say that the media is not dominated by liberals.

[malaise]

12. Ask them about the producers, editors

and owners.

[ellacott]

14. Also, what's wrong with having an agenda

Every one has an agenda. It's not a bad word but the Republicans have turned it into a bad word.

As far as Gay marriages, this article doesn't mention the fact that recent polling shows increasing support for Gay marriage.

This article also doesn't show how the data was fudged.

[NewJeffCT]

16. That is part of my response

while states may have been gay marriage in 2002 and 2004, there were states that rejected bans in 2006 and polls show increasing support among the public, especially among the younger generations.

[Rydz777]

15. It sort of depends on the definition of liberal. eom

[sinkingfeeling]

17. Best reference: 'What liberal media?" by Eric Alterman.

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20030224/alterman2

[NewJeffCT]

20. thanks

excellent reference!

[Vidar]

18. Reporters do tend to be liberal; owners & editors don't.

[KharmaTrain]

19. Look At Their Papers And Positions

Assistant Copy Editor in Elmyra, New York...Assingment editor in Lubbock, Texas...yep, opionion makers all. They have as much influence on "the media" as I do. Nada.

Good chance most of these "libruls" work for Conservative owners. I'd check the paper...see who owns it and then run a check on both the campaign contributions of the company and of the principal owners. Wanna bet a vast majority of those checks go to the RNC.

Media Matters has its agenda, but not when it presents facts. You may not agree with their conclusions, but the facts are there for you to evaluate. I don't always agree with Brock of Fosser or Boehlert, but at least they put all the information and links out there. I see it as a valuable resource in the documenting of right wing spin and media distortion and bias...and the materials they present offer plenty of proof of both.

[NewJeffCT]

21. I found the survey

it's a pew study and includes several major newspapers (NY Times, LA Times, Washington Post, etc) - but, oddly enough, not the NY Post, the NY Daily News, the Washington Times, the Boston Herald and several other noted conservative publications.

[KharmaTrain]

23. I Saw A List On MSNBC Cited

I think it was ThinkProgress that had it on their site and when you opened the PDF, it showed a lot of small market papers and middle management.

And, yes, a great point about papers and corporations that weren't included. While you at it, look at the Tribune Company, Pittsburgh Daily Scaiffe.

I love to turn this argument around...I ask these morons to show me what "Libruls" own major papers. It's always the employee who serves the boss...not the other way around.

[NewJeffCT]

24. This was the Pew list

Television Networks: ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, CNN, C-SPAN, CNBC, MSNBC, FOX Cable News, Telemundo, Univision.

-- Chains with Washington, D.C. Bureaus: Gannett, Cox, Hearst.

-- Radio: Associated Press Radio, ABC Radio Networks, CBS Radio Networks, Westwood One, Black Radio Network, National Public Radio.

-- Newspapers: Arizona Republic, Atlanta Journal-Constitution, Boston Globe, Chicago Tribune, Detroit Free Press, Houston Chronicle, Long Island Newsday, Los Angeles Times, Miami Herald, New York Daily News, New York Times, Philadelphia Inquirer, San Francisco Chronicle, USA TODAY, Wall Street Journal, Washington Post.

-- Magazines: Newsweek, Time, U.S. News & World Report.

-- Wire Services: Associated Press, Bloomberg News Service, Reuters.

-- News Services: Copley, Cox Newspapers, Gannett, Hearst, Knight-Ridder, Newhouse, Scripps-Howard.

Notice that there is no Washington Times, NY Post, NY Daily News, Boston Herald among the newspapers (I assume there are others outside the northeast that are similar to these papers)

And, among wire-service, the Moon-owned UPI is not there.

Among magazines: no National Review or other RW rags.

[KharmaTrain]

25. Don't Forget The Other Right Wing Networks: Religious

TBN, CBN and the others...plus their radio counterparts that run James Dobson 20 times a day. We forget what a big megaphone these people have.

[JerseygirlCT]

34. The paper is owned by The Tribune Cos.

That gives you an idea of where the corporation stands on the spectrum.

[MiniMe]

22. That wouldn't be surprising, since Dems tend to want the truth,

and the repukes want to regurgitate the latest republican talking points.

[shadowknows69]

27. Possibly

except they're all standing in unemployment lines.

[LoZoccolo]

28. Why do it? It's a cop-out on the conservatives' part.

Every story needs to be judged on its own merits, and can't be dismissed due to the political leanings of the author. Anything less is often an excuse to dismiss facts reported by the media.

[NewJeffCT]

30. my letter so far

Michael Polito of Essex cites the typical Dittohead Talking Points about journalists being liberal and about Americans rejecting the idea of gay marriage while not showing where Leonard Pitts actually fudged his data.

First, while liberal journalists may outnumber conservative ones, it is the editors, publishers and producers that decide what is published or what is aired. Based on presidential endorsements in both 2000 and 2004, it is pretty clear that a majority of the “deciders” in the newspaper business favored President Bush. And, the mega-corporations like General Electric that own the television news are not exactly known for their progressive views, while several studies have shown that conservative pundits dominate the airwaves on the influential Sunday morning talk shows.

Second, the Pew survey that Polito sites surveyed only a selected sample of the media. Left out of the survey were several high circulation ultra-conservative newspapers like the Washington Times, New York Post, New York Daily News and the Boston Herald, while influential religious networks like TBN and CBN were also not included, which like the also neglected talk radio, has been a right-wing basiton for decades.

Third, while Americans may have rejected gay marriage in 44 states, bans were voted down in 2006, and polls show that the majority of the young are in favor of gay marriage, while those mostly strongly against are the oldest in our society. Pure demographics indicate that acceptance of gay marriage is going to happen eventually.

As Bill Kristol, one of the “intellectual” godfathers of the modern conservative movement, once said, “"The liberal media were never that powerful, and the whole thing was often used as an excuse by conservatives for conservative failures." So, any claims to a liberal bias in the media can be compared to Jim Calhoun working the refs at the typical UConn game.

[Gabi Hayes]

31. excellent. don't forget that Coulter has said almost the same thing

as Kristol WRT lib media.

[JerseygirlCT]

35. One typo

Third para: you want to say "cites", not "sites".

Good letter!

[JerseygirlCT]

32. I loved the way he jumped from statistics to the states where gay marriage

has been banned as an indication of popular support for gay rights.

And that 38% who will accept limits? They're still in support of abortion rights. That means 77% in favor of abortion rights -- spin it however he'd like.

And yes, I wondered too where he got his figures about journalists. Wonder if anyone has some stats on this?

[NewJeffCT]

38. I found the survey

it was a pew research center study that had 34% liberal, 7% conservative and the rest as moderates. You can get more detail in my posts above.

[yella_dawg]

36. I think this estimate is probably accurate.

Very few of the "conservatives" in the mainstream media are journalists.

[0rganism]

37. I remember seeing a similar stat quoted back in 2001 or thereabouts

There was a mail-back survey of journalists and editorial staff regarding their political affiliation and preference in the 2000 elections, it came back that 80% of respondents were registered Democrats and a majority preferred Gore to Bush in the 2000 election.

The first problem was in poll response. IIRC, there was an extremely high level of non-response to the mail survey; one could just as easily extract that the Democrats were simply more likely to return the form.

Next, there is the sticky question of whether one who is a registered Democrat, and even by the criteria of preferring Gore to Bush in 2000, is necessarily "liberal". Even if the respondents were to explicitly classify themselves as "liberal" or "conservative", that would hardly be any kind of objective measurement. I could call myself a "conservative" all I like, and it wouldn't be true.

Also, such a poll would naturally include people reporting on subjects other than those influenced directly by politics. Do I really care if the local sports reporter is a registered Republican? How much difference does it make to coverage if the fashion copy writer is a registered Democrat? What really matters when it comes to national politics is the editorial staff and their relationship with one of the dozen or so media oligarchs who own over 90% of "mainstream" media outlets.

I don't know if this is the survey on which Mr. Polito is basing his statistics, but I suspect whatever his source, it is subject to the same sorts of critique -- or worse. He may have simply heard Limbaugh pull yet another ad-hoc number out of his ass, and decided on that basis that it was the Truth.

[blogslut]

39. Journalist's politics simply aren't a discernable factor

They don't decide what is and isn't provided to the public as news. The editors, program directors, publishers and station owners decide. Nobody bothers to statistically determine the politics of the folks in charge of what these journalists cover.

[NewJeffCT]

41. However

From the fact that a fairly large majority of newspapers endorsed Bush in 2000 and a smaller majority endorsed him in 2004, we can tell from that.