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Anyone else here think the situation in Iraq is intentional?

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Phrogman Donating Member (940 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:20 PM
Original message
Anyone else here think the situation in Iraq is intentional?
With what I've read about the armed Iraqi army being sent home and the amount of explosives and ammo that was allowed to be looted I have no doubts.

This is not incompetence, thats only the excuse they're hiding behind, this war was planned from the very start to be a quagmire.

Somebody's making a ton of money on this "mistake".




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The_Casual_Observer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:24 PM
Response to Original message
1. You show them waaaay to much respect!
Honest to god, they REALLY did believe that they would be looked at as liberators, flowers and all. Not that they wouldn't have still done it anyway, but it none of this is intentional.
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Double T Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:38 PM
Response to Original message
2. caveman dick is making certain his former employer continues to be...........
filthy rich on 'his mistake'.
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MadMaddie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
3. I am reading "Fiasco"....and I can only read 20 pages at a time
because I become enraged at these criminals....

This war failed before it even started......Wolfowitz and his band of thieves should be prosecuted for Crimes against humanity.....at the Hague.
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WilliamPitt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
4. Incompetent Design
http://www.truthout.org/cgi-bin/artman/exec/view.cgi/58/18650

(snip)

Here's the deal, in case anyone is wondering: none of this, not one bit of it, can be or should be chalked up to "incompetence" on the part of Bush or anyone else within his administration. This was not a mishandled situation. Bush and the boys have gotten exactly, precisely what they wanted out of Iraq, and are now looking forward to fobbing it off on the next poor dupe who staggers into the Oval Office. They got what they came for, and have quit.

Consider the facts. For two elections in a row, 2002 and 2004, the GOP was able to successfully demagogue the rafters off the roof about supporting the troops and being patriotic, placing anyone who questioned the merits of the invasion squarely into the category of "traitor." Meanwhile, military contractors with umbilical ties to the administration have cashed in to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars.

The same goes for the petroleum industries; did you know there are gas lines today in oil-rich Iraq? It's true. The oil infrastructure is fine; indeed, it is the most well-guarded point of pressure in Iraq. There are gas lines because companies like Halliburton are not pumping the oil. They are sitting on it, keeping it as a nice little nest egg.

One would think this administration would be worried about the violence and chaos in Iraq. They aren't, because the violence has become the justification for "staying the course." Bush will mouth platitudes about bringing democracy to the region, but that is merely the billboard. What he and his friends from the Project for the New American Century wanted in the first place, and what they have now, is a permanent military presence over there. There was never any consideration of a timetable for withdrawal, because there was never any intention to withdraw. The violence today is a self-perpetuating justification, a perfect circle lubricated by blood, oil and currency.

Keeping our attention on Iraq has allowed this administration to do what it came to do under cover of darkness. They have managed to eviscerate dozens of federal regulations designed to make sure our children aren't born with gills or seventeen eyes thanks to the pollution in the air, water and food. The Clean Air Act is pretty much gone now, as are requirements for food safety labeling. GOP "pension reform" means growing old in America amounts to growing poor, just like in the good old days of the Depression. Millions of elderly people have been fed to the wolves by way of the new Medicare Plan D calamity. There are now tens of millions more poor people in America, the middle class is evaporating, but top incomes are up 497% according to the Federal Reserve.

The administration has also used Iraq to accomplish a goal the GOP has been pining for since 1934. Since the advent of FDR and the creation of federally-funded safety nets for the neediest Americans, the Goldwater wing of the Republican party has been lusting after an opportunity to savage the government's ability to serve its citizens in this fashion. Their argument has been that it cost too much to do this, required too much taxation, and was harmful to business interests.

This fight raged until the very end of the 20th century. When Bill Clinton stood up during his 1998 State of the Union speech and said "Save Social Security first!" he was actually firing a directed salvo at this wing of the GOP. Look, Clinton was saying, we have trillions of dollars in the bank and the economy is going great guns. We can provide for the neediest among us without bankrupting the government or killing business. In short, he was rendering fiscal conservatives obsolete. He won the argument. Remember this, by the way, the next time someone asks you why he was attacked so viciously.

The Grover Norquist drown-the-government-in-the-bathtub crew, however, had no interest in going gently into that good night. One busted election gave them the chance to do exactly what they have done with Iraq. They have rendered it almost completely impossible for the federal government to pay for programs designed to care for the poor, the sick, the elderly and the needy. The war, the war, we have to pay for the war, to the tune of what will be one to two trillion dollars before all is said and done. Oh, and tax cuts that go to families making more than $200,000 a year, of course.

Bush has also, in the process, managed to put himself even farther above the rule of law. Not long ago, he signed the reauthorization of the Patriot Act. Getting the document to his desk had been a laborious process for Congress; arguments and debates raged across the ideological spectrum as to exactly what kind of firewalls against executive abuse should be put into the bill to protect civil liberties.

Among these additions were a number of oversight provisions to keep the FBI from abusing their power to search homes and seize papers without notifying the resident or presenting a warrant. Other provisions required that officials within the Justice Department maintain tight scrutiny over where, when and how the FBI put these powers to use. One new part of the bill required the administration brief Congress now and again on these specific matters. Congress finally came to an agreement, and on March 9th, Bush signed the Patriot Act reauthorization into law with much fanfare.

After all the worthies had left the room, however, and after all the cameras had gone, Bush quietly put his signature to a "signing statement" that, basically, says anything in the aforementioned law which applies to the president shall be considered null and void. The Boston Globe reported on March 24 that, "In the statement, Bush said that he did not consider himself bound to tell Congress how the Patriot Act powers were being used. Bush wrote: 'The executive branch shall construe the provisions ... that call for furnishing information to entities outside the executive branch ... in a manner consistent with the president's constitutional authority to supervise the unitary executive branch and to withhold information.'"

This was the third time Bush dropped a "signing statement" into an issue of signal importance. When it was revealed that the administration had bypassed the FISA laws in order to conduct surveillance on American citizens, Bush claimed his "wartime powers" gave him the ability to ignore the laws of the land. When Congress passed a law forbidding the torture of any detainee in US custody, Bush issued a signing statement stating that he could bypass the law at his pleasure and torture anyone he damned well pleased.

So, to recap, the "incompetence" thing is nonsense. The Bush boys got paid, got an issue to run on in two elections, put themselves completely and totally above the law on picayune issues like torture and the unauthorized surveillance of American citizens, obliterated the central function of the federal government, and ripped up any and all regulations that would keep their corporate friends from dumping mercury into the river so as to save a few precious pennies on the dollar.

Can anyone still think this was all by accident?

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frogcycle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. absolutely
it is a smokescreen for dismantling the Constitution, and a money machine for cronies in the bargain
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movonne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:44 PM
Response to Original message
5. I agree...and I believe every mistake calculated to stay in Iraq...
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blues90 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:45 PM
Response to Original message
6.  I think they designed it to fail from the start
First as you know they lied us into this disaster , left ammo dumps and headed to secure the oil . They did their shock and awe as a way to show their military might as if don't even think about screwing with america . They went in without any plans for with drawl and never provided the troops with the proper equipment and still don't .

Rummy laid it out telling us you go in with the army you have not the one you wish you had .
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parasim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:49 PM
Response to Original message
7. Absolutely. Same as Vietnam.
Edited on Sun Jul-08-07 08:53 PM by parasim
and every other war... "It's a profit game!" as Steve Martin would put it in The Jerk.

Watch "Why We Fight".

on edit: excellent article, WilliamPitt!
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Dem_Wit Donating Member (20 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:56 PM
Response to Original message
8. That lunitic doesn't care about human lives!
Only about his beloved oil buddies.

What a creep.

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Bluzmann57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 08:59 PM
Response to Original message
10. no
n/t
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 09:04 PM
Response to Original message
11. Read PNAC's original "Statement of Principles" of June 3, 1997.
Edited on Sun Jul-08-07 09:09 PM by Swamp Rat
It seems they planned this chaos... though, maybe it's not going exactly they way they planned. The PNACers didn't count on large-scale resistance on the part of the American People... nor the Iraqis nor the whole world.


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mitchum Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-08-07 09:20 PM
Response to Original message
12. Yes, I have been saying that since before the invasion started...
Edited on Sun Jul-08-07 10:00 PM by mitchum
it was intended to be a quagmire into which our tax $$$$$$$$$ are poured (and shifted into the hands of connected cronies)
It was never about ideology or oil.
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