"Cindy Should Run in the Democratic Primary"

[ludwigb]

I don't necessarily disagree with this...part of me wishes she would. However, I take issue that her running as an Independent means to argue her candidacy damages the progressive movement in America. I understand Dailykos and DU have a policy of supporting Dems only....fair enough I suppose. But it's not smart politics. And it's not likely to appeal to independents.

When did progressives stop supporting measures that promote real 3rd parties, such as instant runoff voting or (gasp) proportional systems as they exist in Europe? Why the impassioned defense of the 2-party system, especially at a time when a Democratic congressional majority is failing to do what they were elected to do. Since when is anyone that doesn't identify themselves as a Democrat an enemy?

Take a look at Pelosi' last congressional run...

Democratic Nancy Pelosi 101,707 80.4 -4.3
Republican Mike DeNunzio 13,208 10.4 -1.3
Green Krissy Keefer 9,666 7.6
Libertarian Philip Berg 1,896 1.5


As you can see, the GOP is not going to challenge for the seat. Indeed, with numbers like this, one wonders why Pelosi pays attention to what the public thinks about anything. She's virtually elected for life, and a serious primary challenge is hard to imagine. This is healthy democracy?

Another thing the numbers tell us is Cindy Sheehan is not a serious electoral threat to Nancy Pelosi. I'd be very surprised if she gets 25%. What she is proposing is igniting discussion on the war in Iraq, arguments for impeachment, and other issues every citizen ought to be debating. Why does this prospect ignite such visceral dissent? I suppose it's possible that the MMM would turn the contest into a circus--but do realize the implications of the argument that we shouldn't have debates on key issues because GOP propaganda might twist some of the responses?

Some say a Pelosi-Sheehan battle would hurt the Democrats nationwide. I believe it's just as likely, indeed more likely, that Pelosi would benefit from the media exposure and looking like a 'moderate' on the issues.

All I'm asking is for Democrats to step back and start asking "What is best for democracy in America?" rather than "What is best for conquering the presidency in 2008?". The cynical Tomasky logic that puts electoral success ahead of everything is simply additional fodder for the GOP spin machine that Dems are corrupt and unprincipled.

[saltpoint]

1. Pelosi's huge margins of victory reflect accurately the

esteem, respect and affection her constituents feel her and for the job she's doing.

Those are actual votes by actual people. And it's a damned astute district, by the way.

I have been a Pelosi voter in the past and would vote for her again in a heartbeat.

Nancy rules.

[ronnykmarshall]

2. I'm with ya ..

I'm a former San Franciscan and voted for Nancy in almost every election. The only time I didn't was in 1987 and I voted for Harry Brit. But I was proud to have Nancy as my congresswoman.

[saltpoint]

3. Hiya, ronnykmarshall.

You are one of those astute people in the Bay Area. Some of the most engaging and well-informed voters the nation has to offer.

Could you possibly do some workshops in Texas and Indiana?

Nice to see you on DU.

[ronnykmarshall]

9. No longer a Bay Area res.

I live in West Hollywood now. Constantly on the look out of drunk, drugged up celbs on the streets!

I loved my years in San Francisco.

[saltpoint]

10. !! L.A. should be a garden for celebrity-hunting.

Good luck, and have lots of fun.

We're gonna whip the Republicans somethin' fierce in 2008.

I can FEEL it.

[ronnykmarshall]

11. It really is!

I have to say I've seen LOTS since I moved here in 2000.

My two favorite, Shelly Winters ... just about 6 months before she died .... she was SO funny and sweet) and Queen Latifah ...... probably one of the most stunning women I've ever seen.

[saltpoint]

12. Keep at it. Maybe take notes and pen a book. Hell, I'd read it.

[lazer47]

4. If I made the same statement about "slavery" on here

that Cindy did I would be banned for life, She needs to deal with her grief some other way than bashing Dems. I for one am tired of seeing anything about her, and tired of her basing Dems. Nobody else on DU has that right,, why does she have that right,,,If I need to be bashed let the freepers on here they do a better job of it,,

[philosophie_en_rose]

6. She's not on DU. She can say what she wants elsewhere.

But she and her fan club should expect skepticism here, at the very least.

And, since she's not a DUer and a public figure, she's not protected by the rules either.

But, you're right. If any DUer made those comments, they'd be banned. Like certain banned royalty and voting machine investigators, she would be better served on the nameless site or Free Republic.

[Cameron27]

13. If her rant was posted without her signature,

I wonder how many of her supporters would have jumped up to defend it.

[ludwigb]

7. Well the statement on 'slavery' was stupid

But I think the Dems deserve to be bashed for continuing to fund the war in Iraq.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

19. Democrats were the party of slavery. And segregation.

Can we drop the historical revisionism please? There's nothing wrong with acknowledging the parties former faults.

The problem is ignoring the party's current problems.

[philosophie_en_rose]

5. Cindy Sheehan has burned her bridges in the Democratic Party.

I support the idea of running to promote awareness and dialogue, but Sheehan doesn't have the skills to preach beyond her choir. She's certainly not an orator like Al Sharpton or an educator like Kucinich.

[sandnsea]

8. Ran against Wally Berger

District 2 isn't far from Vacaville. Go run where she can do some good.

http://www.house.gov/herger/map.shtml

[mzmolly]

14. It's all about the name of this board. We support Democrats here.

Joe Lieberman was not supported by Democrats, either.

However if someone wants start "Democracy Underground" Gawd Bless em'. Just remember Republicans are part of the "Democracy" big picture so welcome them in your zeal to hear all sides. :hi:

[rinsd]

15. If Cindy's campaign depends on her supporters being able to promote here at DU & Kos.

Then she has no chance.

"I understand Dailykos and DU have a policy of supporting Dems only....fair enough I suppose. But it's not smart politics. And it's not likely to appeal to independents."

But these are partisan boards affiliated specifically with the Democratic party.

"
Since when is anyone that doesn't identify themselves as a Democrat an enemy?"

When they call the Democratic party the party of slavery, accuse them of starting every war in the 20th century and even roast up the old rw chestnut of Democrats being the party of taxes while they annouce to run against a Democratic party leader is when that person becomes an enemy.

[Norquist Nemesis]

16. If Cindy Sheehan were serious about running for Congress she'd be smart about it

Challenging the seat of the Speaker of the House on a one-issue platform is not smart. There is no way in hell that a Rep. Cindy Sheehan is going to have any impact to change things to the extent believers think she would.

Impeach Bush/Cheney? Wow...it's January 2009 and a new Congress AND new President are taking the Oath of Office. I'm betting that none of them are named George W. Bush or Richard B. Cheney.

End the war? FABULOUS!!! It's what we all want! And then what??? Is she going to request the Armed Services Committee so she can five minutes of "Who are you planning to bomb today, General?" It would be a joke.

Sorry...but I'm just damned sick of Cindy Cindy Cindy being the be all end all hope for all that ails us and then watching people getting kicked in the teeth for injecting a dose of reality into the picture. Cindy brought attention...make that World Attention for standing up and trying to take the fight to George Bush's doorstep. Like a child, he ran and hid from her. And what did she decide to do? Throw threats and bring public specticles on the very people she could have influence WITH rather that against.

[lazer47]

18. I wish I had your talent to make that very point,,, Goodonya

[hfojvt]

17. to me 'real 3rd parties' are a moot point

I do not see how that would help progressives, nor why it should be a key progressive plank. Here in Kansas, it does not even seem like we have a viable 2nd party, let alone a 3rd. Same thing in Pelosi's district. The thread about Edwards' poverty tour, shows that issues can be discussed in primaries too.

"Since when is anyone that doesn't identify themselves as a Democrat an enemy?"

Since Nader declared war on the Democratic Party and worked to elect Bush. Cindy did the same thing. She, or the press reports, have said, not that she was running for Congress, but specifically, running AGAINST Pelosi.

[ludwigb]

20. The 2-party system

tends to enforce excessive comformity in my view. Political divisions become calcified and fewer ideas come to the fore. I prefer the muliti-party systems in European nations where the political landscape is more colorful. I'm mostly thinking of Germany (which I'm familiar with) which currently has 2 big parties and 3 smaller (5-10% of the vote) parties. As I understand it, pretty much all of continental Europe has the same landscape. It's harder to squelch good ideas in a system like this, because the party running on a popular but underrepresented idea will steal the base of the other party, forcing that party to also move on the issue.

That's not to say the 2-party system doesn't have its advantages, but in general I don't think any reading of American history would suggest a permanent two party system is either constitutional or commendable--the existence in our political process for new parties to emerge is a part of democracy.

Many Americans seem to have learned the wrong lesson from the Nader campaign. This was one of the most predictable consequences of his run, and one of the reasons it was so foolish from a strategic perspective. However, Nader's substantive criticisms on the convergence of the two parties were right on, if often exaggerated.