Should the Atlanta Falcons forfeit some of their TV money?

[taterguy]

Yes, I know, Michael Vick isn't guilty yet but for the sake of this discussion let's assume that he is. I'm also assuming that his employers knew he was doing some very questionable things in his spare time. They tolerated it because they knew that people paid money to watch Vick play.

Suppose leagues started levying severe financial penalties on teams that enabled thugs.

Would that be a good thing or a bad thing?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

1. Do falcons eat endangered chilean sea bass?

This is relevant to my interests.

[taterguy]

14. I don't know enough about birds to know

I'm guessing Seahawks eat fish but that's just a guess

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

16. That does it.

I say we charge Buffalo Bill fans with the murder of Nicole Brown Simpson.

[msongs]

2. only if he was acting on behalf of the falcons INC nt

[marmar]

3. I don't know that you can assume the Falcons knew about the dogfighting....

To say that they enabled him, if all of this is true, seems like a bit of a leap to me.

[jobycom]

4. If they are complicit and get indicted, maybe. Otherwise

that would be like your boss having to pay your parking tickets. :shrug:

[karlrschneider]

5. I think you are assuming facts not even close to in evidence...

...

[taterguy]

7. Of course, what else is the Internet good for :)

Just trying to have a lively discussion without letting pesky facts get in the way

[karlrschneider]

12. I see...I think...

I'm inclined to think he is guilty but it's not up to me.

[onenote]

6. how exactly did the falcons "enable" vick?

You say you are "assuming" this to be the case. Any basis for your assumption or just totally baseless speculation?

[taterguy]

10. Pro teams know a lot about their players, they have a big investment in them

[onenote]

18. actually, they probably don't

if they did know, they'd do more to stop them precisely because they have a big investment in them. Teams put clauses in contracts trying to limit players from doing high risk things that could result in them hurting themselves or otherwise becoming unavailable. If the Falcons knew that Vick was engaging in behavior that could result in his ending up in jail they'd have taken him (or his agent) aside and told him to cut it out.

[LiberalFighter]

8. If anyone from the Atlanta Falcon's or NFL organization knew about

and possibly participated they could and should be prosecuted. And if anyone in the top organization was involved they should be removed. Other than that I'm not sure.

[Kagemusha]

9. Teams cannot levy discipline for suspected crimes, only the league can

and the league has never done that either, it has punished one person who kept getting arrested even though charges at the time were not sticking, but who dragged the league into such disrepute (such as things done by his entourage) that the league had enough.

Having said that, NFL players have a union and there is absolutely no way the union - this is DU, people like unions here, right? - would tolerate a team breaking the collective bargaining agreement and disciplining Vick for something they can't prove and that the feds haven't proven in a court of law yet. (Edit; And I expect that they'd fight any effort by the league itself to do so instead, but AFAIK, disciplining for non directly team related off-field acts by the teams is explicitly not permitted.)

[atreides1]

11. Why???

Why do you assume that the Falcons management knew anything about his off-season activities? The man lied to the NFL Commissioner about his possible involvement, and if the team management assisted in that lie the Falcons as a franchise will be paying some very hefty fines to the NFL.

It's not like the players, the coaching staff, and the team management actually spend a lot of time together in the off-season, that they would know what goes on with each other. Unless there is some kind of evidence that they knew what was going on, then any fines should be paid by Vick himself, if he's found guilty.

[MousePlayingDaffodil]

13. Why would the NFL even think about imposing such penalties . . .

. . . on teams? The NFL, in essence, is comprised of, and ultimately run by, the owners of the teams in the league. Why would the team owners call in the artillery on their own position in such a fashion?

[pitohui]

15. everyone who ever watched vick play is an enabler and should be shot at dawn

come on, this is just ridiculous, you know?

they gave the guy an honest job, it isn't like they told him, well, dude, we're tight on money this year, you need to take a big cut in pay and maybe raise a little extra $$$ betting dogfights on the side

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

17. Saints fan, huh? (n/m)

[taterguy]

19. That snark is part of the problem

It's all about winning and losing. Vick helped his team win, therefore some of his other flaws were probably ignored.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

21. You're making a huge leap in judgement about the Falcons

It sounds like the same garbage I hear from Red Sox fans about the Yankees and vice versa whenever one of their players gets into trouble. "How can we pin it on the team I hate......"

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

20. No Way. And I Think It's A Bit Ridiculous To Have An Assumption That They Knew.

You're getting this from where? Your supporting evidence is what?

I find the idea of holding the Falcons responsible to be highly laughable.

[MrSlayer]

22. No. But he should be suspended.

The team should do it if the league won't. And if he is convicted he should be banned from the sport and thrown into a cage with a couple of those pit bulls to see how he can do against them.

[JVS]

23. No way! If you have rules like that, then employers have grounds...

to fire people just on the suspicion that something that the person is doing is bad. Fuck that, more freedom!

[DrDan]

24. well - perhaps once convicted your argument may be credible

After all, isn't a real "conviction" one of the several arguments we bring re Gitmo?