Who owns our government?

[SHRED]

Big Oil
Big Pharma
Big Insurance
Big Defense Industry
ES&S and Diebold


Did I miss anyone?

[BeHereNow]

1. The Federal Reserve. n/t

bhn

[IChing]

11. The banking industry and the Catholic Church

[BeHereNow]

13. And let's not forget that the MIC is owned by all of them.

And yet people foolishly continue to believe that
a knight in shining armor is on the way to save us?
NOT.

BHN

[IChing]

15. I can back up my claim on the Catholic Church's holdings

into the Federal Reserve.

[Selatius]

36. Thomas Jefferson said banking institutions are more dangerous to liberty than standing armies.

Behind every corporate machination is a creditor institution(s) bankrolling it all. He argued the right to create money should only be the realm of the state.

[BeHereNow]

42. And it all goes back to the FR, Warburg, Harriman and the BFEE.

Those who do not take the time to study it have no idea
what has happened and how it relates to what we are witnessing
today. Therefore, it is sometimes rather frustrating to
discuss our collective situation; it is hard to reach a consensus
on what to do when so many only have small pieces of the
puzzle from which they base their beliefs and subsequently
their solutions.
I figure the elite just sit back and laugh at it all.

BHN

[tularetom]

2. Israel and Saudi Arabia

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ret5hd]

4. pfffft...hardly.

[Jim Sagle]

5. Take a remedial reading course, or something.

[ret5hd]

9. I'll pick "or something"...like annoying those "anyone criticising Israel is a bigot" jerks.

[Jim Sagle]

18. "anyone criticising Israel is a bigot"?

Not my position at all.

But anyone who says Israel owns America is spewing raw antisemitism.

And everybody goddamn well knows it.

[BeHereNow]

6. Who is CVB? On your sig line.

That seems vaguely familiar to me.
In advance, thanks
BHN

[ret5hd]

7. Camper Van Bethoven

[BeHereNow]

8. Indeed, Thank you kindly.

BHN

[tyedyeto]

10. How can it be anti-sematic when both sides of the issue are there? n/t

[AntiFascist]

14. Here I'll be anti-"Semantic" and just name names....

King Abdullah, the Likud, and the Government of China.

[Behind the Aegis]

20. Please impart your wisdom as to how Israel controls the US?

Saudia Arabia? Hardly. Their ties to big oil, yes, but the nation itself, not quite. And Israel, exactly how does she control the US?

[AntiFascist]

21. Here's my answer, I hope you appreciate it without labelling me...

anti-Semitic. See post 14 above, the entities I name: the head of the Saudi monarchy, the far right-wing influence of the Israeli government, and the Chinese government all have something in common - at one time or another they fear being overthrown. The Saudis have the most to fear by "al Qaeda" or extremist Muslims who feel that the monarchy, who has close ties to the United States, should not be the guardian of the holiest sites of Islam - Mecca and Medina. I'm not too familiar with the history of the Likud, but I know that they have been in and out of power and that the people of Israel were close to a "civil war" in the recent past over right-wing controlling issues. The Chinese government is authoritarian and has had to deal with riots and threatened uprisings in the past. How are all these governments going to function if they face gas shortages? In the last couple of weeks Iran faced riots because of gas shortages and Ahmadinejad is in a similar position of facing a popular uprising. Now, with threats of impeachment, the Bush Administration may be joining this crowd.

My answer is simply that all these parties may have a vested interest in war. What better way to keep the people occupied so that the leaders can maintain their power? It doesn't matter if they are all allied or considered enemies of each other, they can all agree that increasing the threat of war will keep them in power, while they profit in the meantime.

[Behind the Aegis]

23. While eloquent, it doesn't answer the question:

How do Israel and Saudi Arabia own our government. While I didn't label you, please refrain from labeling me through innuendo.

Edit: Corrected question to match premise.

[AntiFascist]

25. Sorry....peace...

the answer I would give is through "aristocratic collusion" if I might create the term. Again its not the entire nations of Israel, Saudi Arabia or China that I'm concerned about, its where they're "all tied together at top" which is a phrase Rumsfeld once used in talking about the Middle East.

On edit: the means of control is through our debt. The only way to keep the dollar afloat is to answer to our debtors.

[Behind the Aegis]

26. I can agree to to that conclusion.

They all have vested interests in the US and our "doings." However, the OP was talking about "control" of our government and I do not believe any foreign government is powerful enough to control the US. Often, when people say "Israel controls the US," there is something more insidious behind the remark, which is why I asked the question I did.

[AntiFascist]

28. I understand and I agree that it is all too easy for people...

to revert to anti-Semitism (AIPAC-Franklin), anti-Muslim(Dubai ports), or just plain xenophobia(H1 Visas) when they see foreign influences in our government or economy. Hopefully by analyzing exactly what is going on the cloud of racism can be lifted.

[AdHocSolver]

29. Your assessment of the reality of the situation is in error.

The Saudis are not afraid of being overthrown by Al Qaeda since they sponsored it, support it, and maintain it. The Saudi royal family belongs to one of the most right-wing sects of Islam. Rival Muslim groups have been trying to overthrow the Saudi royal family for years, and have been ruthlessly suppressed each time. Information about it has also been suppressed.

Saudi Arabia is the chief sponsor of many terrorist groups and has been for years. They gave huge amounts of money to the PLO and paid the families of many suicide bombers.

As to how they influence United States policy? They "own" the Bush family and Cheney. Much of the Bush family wealth comes from the Saudis, sometimes funneled through third parties. However, it all goes back to the Saudis. When you think of Saudi influence, you have to include Dubai and Kuwait in that cabal.

Many Congress persons own stock in companies in which the Saudis own considerable amounts of stock, including many military contractors. The Saudis have enough money to invest in each of these companies to effectively control these companies. (It is the money we paid them for our oil.)

The predominant influence on U.S. foreign policy comes from Saudi Arabia. Daddy Bush drove Saddam out of Kuwait to protect Saudi Arabia because Saddam had notions of taking that over also. In any event, Saddam's control of Kuwaiti oil would give him leverage to set crude oil prices, taking that power away from Saudi Arabia. Junior went into Iraq because Saddam was working on a scheme to circumvent the U.S. imposed oil embargo by making deals to sell oil to other countries such as China for payment in other than U.S. dollars. This would have opened up world oil markets to real competition, and taken price setting capabilities away from Saudi Arabia and Big Oil.

The push to invade Iran is coming from the fact that Iran has agreed to sell oil to China and accept payment in other than U.S. dollars. This would give Iran the kind of control over oil prices that Iraq would have had had it been allowed to complete that kind of deal, and would diminish Saudi and Big Oil's ability to control world petroleum prices.

A bigger threat to China than any threat from internal dissidents comes from the possible collapse of the U.S. economy. Our trade deficit with them is so huge that their economy would collapse if the U.S. defaulted. The Chinese are worried because they can see that stealing America for his wealthy friends is exactly what Bush/Cheney is doing. The model for understanding Bush/Cheney vis-a-vis the U.S. is Ken Lay vis-a-vis Enron.

[AntiFascist]

32. Thank you for your point of view....

is it possible that the Saudis have been using Al Qaeda to trap dissidents? I believe that many Al Qaeda members are captured and killed within Saudi Arabia. This wouldn't seem to make sense if Saudis were supporting everyone who joins the group? Also, my understanding is that Poppy Bush originally helped setup the Saudis' air force and intelligence to defend against rivals.

I've always been concerned whether many Congress members are also unduly influenced by the "cabal". I know that the Saudis must have amassed tremendous wealth after decades of oil production.

Saudis may "own" Bush and Cheney, but you can't deny the influence of neoconservatives who also have sided with the far right-wing of Likud via officials such as Richard Pearl (now resigned). There are also joint ventures between neocons and Saudis, such as the venture firm Trireme Partners which invest in defense technology, goods and services. China has been a major manufacturer of weapons for the mujahadeen in the past and notice that Pearl was pimping Global Crossing for the Chinese which got him in trouble with the NSA. This is all indicative of the world players being tied together in the war industry and other global ventures.

http://archive.democrats.com/preview.cfm?term=Richard+Perle

Its not that these foreign players "control" the US policy, but rather that their offers are too good to refuse, no matter how they may affect US security.

Since the Chinese remnimbi is no longer pegged to the US dollar, but to a basket of currencies, and since the Chinese have a huge surplus, wouldn't this act to buffer against any collapse in trade with the US?

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

12. Japan and China have a large chunk too. All they have to do is call in their loans and

we're up shit's creek.

[stillcool]

16. The Pentagon? n/t

[IChing]

17. The Pentagon has more land holdings in the US than

the State of South Carolina and Rhode Island combined.

[kineneb]

19. not to mention all those foreign bases

which may be "owned" by the country in question, but is run by the US Gov/Pentagon...

[Nutmegger]

22. This is a list of those who own our government:

http://www.treas.gov/tic/mfh.txt

[Auntie Bush]

24. You forgot Big Media and Big Corporations

[Blue Belle]

27. Amway...

Oh wait... that's the business model the Neocons are basing our Foreign Policy on. My bad...

[farmboxer]

30. Amerika is a plutocracy

owned and operated by the extremely rich!

The "only" way "We the people" can get our country back is to get real campaign finance reform, finance elections with taxpayer's money, we will save trillions!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[CrispyQ]

40. But, but, but,

I don't want to pay any taxes!!! Whhaaaaaaa!!! I want to live in a great country with roads, bridges, hospitals, schools, safe food & water, clean air, but I don't want to pay anything for it. Too many have fallen for the lie that private industry can do it better. Our elected officials are auctioning off our Commons, at great benefit to their personal bank accounts, & before we know it, everything, including our government, will be privatized & We the People will be left with no recourse & no resources.


To everyone: BUY THIS BOOK. You can read it in about 90 minutes. Then give it to your kids to read. And then to your friends.

We the People: A Call to Take Back America
by Thom Hartmann
http://www.we-the-people-book.com/index.htm

There are free excerpts here:
http://www.we-the-people-book.com/main/free_excerpt.htm

[conspirator]

31. Half a dozen families than own the Federal Reserve, hence everything else n/t

[Philosoraptor]

33. WE DO--but you'd never know it.

[Swamp Rat]

34. What a radical concept dude.

Sadly, America ate the Brown Acid. :(

[Philosoraptor]

35. bush in Bosch hell, I love it!

[elehhhhna]

37. Carlyle Group. They RUN the Office of Personnel & Management.!!1!!1

OFFICIALLY!

Yes, its contracted out. To them.

[malaise]

38. Add the Chamber of Commerce n/t

[Hubert Flottz]

39. George Bush says it's his government.

And I think he believes it.

[bananarepublican]

41. THE FEDERAL RESERVE! IT IS NOT OWNED BY THE AMERICAN PEOPLE/GOVERNMENT! n/t