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CONGRESSMAN JOHN OLVER BELIEVES BUSH TO CANCEL 2008 ELECTIONS, STILL REFUSES TO SUPPORT IMPEACHMENT

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redacted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:10 PM
Original message
CONGRESSMAN JOHN OLVER BELIEVES BUSH TO CANCEL 2008 ELECTIONS, STILL REFUSES TO SUPPORT IMPEACHMENT
Edited on Sun Jul-22-07 03:30 PM by redacted
EXCERPT:

He is deeply concerned whether we will actually have an election in Nov. '08, as he believes this administration will likely strike Iran from the air, declare a national emergency, and cancel the '08 elections.

He sees ending the war as his primary goal, and he believes the brilliant Nancy Pelosi has a strategy more potent than impeachment. He thinks impeachment is a futile waste of legislative energy, will be harmful of democratic '08 victories, and further tighten the "gridlock" he has complained of for the past few decades.

(DU comment: What does Congressman John Olver know that we don't? --RD)

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0707/S00085.htm
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MsRedacted Donating Member (263 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:21 PM
Response to Original message
1. What is this "plan" of Pelosi's. If there are no elections -- then we impeach him?
Edited on Sun Jul-22-07 03:21 PM by MsRedacted
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OzarkDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #1
32. I guess in their world it makes sense
Dems in DC seem to be either less and less in touch with reality or getting really sloppy about trying to feed the Dem masses as good line of bs. :shrug:
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
2. radio traffic "extraordinary" because of the unprecedented length of messages.
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MsRedacted Donating Member (263 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:25 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. I'm confused. What does this have to do with the OP?
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:32 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. IRAN
Edited on Sun Jul-22-07 03:33 PM by seemslikeadream
http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070706/NATION04/107060076

Iranian terrorism

Army Brig. Gen. Kevin J. Bergner, chief spokesman for Multi-National Force-Iraq, revealed this week the extensive Iranian government involvement in arming terrorists in Iraq through Lebanese Hezbollah proxies.

"The reality of this is they're not only killing American forces, they're killing Iraqis, they're killing Iraqi security forces, and they are disrupting the stability in Iraq, and it's a concern for the government of Iraq, for the Iraqi forces and the Iraqi people, that they would expect their neighbor to play a more helpful and less damaging role in their country," Gen. Bergner told reporters.

The Iranians and Lebanese Hezbollah terrorists train groups of 20 to 60 Iraqi terrorists in Iran, he said.

An Iranian opposition group in Paris provided additional information from its sources on the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC) Qods Force activities in Iraq.


http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070706/NATION04/107060076&template=nextpage

The opposition group also has identified Qods Force bases near the Iran-Iraq border, and said the Iranian Embassy and Qods Force terrorists are linked to the Shi'ite Badr Brigade death squads in Iraq. The Qods Force leaders are using diplomatic cover to work with pro-Iranian political parties in Iraq.


Gen. Bergner said Monday that the Iranian paramilitary Qods Force has been supporting terrorists engaged in bombings, kidnappings, extortion, sectarian slayings, illegal arms trafficking and other attacks against Iraqi citizens, police, army and coalition forces and that Iranians are spending $750,000 to $3 million a month to back the insurgents.

....


A U.S. military official said the radio traffic was monitored from the Air Force Global High Frequency System (GHFS) that some observers regarded as "extraordinary" because of the unprecedented length of messages. They were sent to Air Force commanders at Andrews Air Force Base; Wideawake Airfield on Ascension Island; Elmendorf Air Force Base, Alaska; Andersen Air Force Base, Guam; Hickam Air Force Base, Hawaii; Lajes Field in the Azores; Offutt Air Force Base, Nebraska; Salinas Air Base, Puerto Rico; Thule Air Base, Greenland; and Yokota Air Base, Japan. All are sites of GHFS ground stations.


A retired Air Force general said the strategic nuclear forces also dispatch command action messages that are part of a nuclear command system that requires force commanders to respond within two minutes.


Navy training to raid Iran

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1401003




Bush's Inconceivable Interest in Iran Sat Apr-01-06

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=819437

Senior U.S. Officials “Want to Hit Iran”Tue Apr-04-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=844418
Larisa Alexandrovna: CHENEY TAPS IRANIAN ARMS DEALER FOR IRAN TALKS Thu Apr-20-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=977234
Seymour Hersh said something startling about Rumsfeld on Democracy Now Fri Aug-18-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=1936421
So former DLC, PNAC member Abram Shulsky feeding Cheney info on Iran?Sat Aug-19-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=1944614

Fuck. Iran has started "war games." Escalation may only be expected.Sun Aug-20-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=1949812

Attack on Iran is ComingSun Aug-27-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=1993284

"Grave threat". Yes, it's deja vu all over again.Thu Aug-31-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2022620

UN attacks US nuclear report on Iran erroneous misleading unsubstantiatedSun Sep-17-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2159951

We Are Conducting Military Operations Inside Iran Right NowTue Sep-19-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2168218

Navy told: Prepare to blockade Iran by Oct 1Mon Sep-18-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2161779

Pentagon Iran Office Mimics Former Iraq OfficeWed Sep-20-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2179484

“This is the largest massing of military power in the region, and it is gathering for a reason.”Sat Nov-18-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2753952

Seymour Hersh: Cheney Says 'Whether Or Not Dems Win-NO STOPPING Military Option With Iran'Sun Nov-19-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2757350

Does anyone still believe the US will launch a full scale invasion of Iran?Mon Dec-04-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2856177

Saudi clerics rally support for Sunnis and Saudi ambassador Abruptly ResignsTue Dec-12-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2902643

Act III in a Tragedy of Many Parts - The US Occupation of IraqSun Dec-17-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2935498

Century Foundation Iran White Paper Series Fundamentalists, Pragmatists and the Rights of the NationTue Dec-19-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2948146

Oh shitTue Dec-19-06
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=2944423


I've been waiting for something to happen
For a week or a month or a year
With the blood in the ink of the headlines
And the sound of the crowd in my ear
You might ask what it takes to remember
When you know that youve seen it before
Where a government lies to a people
And a country is drifting to war

And theres a shadow on the faces
Of the men who send the guns
To the wars that are fought in places
Where their business interest runs

On the radio talk shows and the t.v.
You hear one thing again and again
How the u.s.a. stands for freedom
And we come to the aid of a friend
But who are the ones that we call our friends--
These governments killing their own?
Or the people who finally can't take any more
And they pick up a gun or a brick or a stone
There are lives in the balance
There are people under fire
There are children at the cannons
And there is blood on the wire

Theres a shadow on the faces
Of the men who fan the flames
Of the wars that are fought in places
Where we cant even say the names

They sell us the president the same way
They sell us our clothes and our cars
They sell us every thing from youth to religion
The same time they sell us our wars
I want to know who the men in the shadows are
I want to hear somebody asking them why
They can be counted on to tell us who our enemies are
But they're never the ones to fight or to die
And there are lives in the balance
There are people under fire
There are children at the cannons
And there is blood on the wire
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redacted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. So SLD, you're saying that Olver's remarks are his conclusions from the info in your posts?
Is that what you're pointing out?
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #6
12. US keeps 'all options' open concerning Iran
http://rawstory.com/news/afp/US_keeps_all_options_open_concernin_02232007.html

US keeps 'all options' open concerning Iran: Cheney AFP
Published: Friday February 23, 2007



US Vice President Dick Cheney vowed the United States would "do everything" it can to deprive Iran of nuclear weapons, and refused to rule out military action in a US television interview Friday.

"We haven't taken any options off the table," Cheney said in an interview with the US ABC News network from Australia, where he is traveling.

"A nuclear-armed Iran is not a very pleasant prospect for anybody to think about," Cheney said. "We need to continue to do everything we can to make sure they don't achieve that objective."


............


Dick Cheney is still the Vice President, he has been the driving force for EVERYTHING (neo cons) that has happened. Until HE is GONE I will be concerned about "all options"
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connecticut yankee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:35 PM
Response to Original message
5. And, of course
the Supreme Court will back him.
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acmavm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:39 PM
Response to Original message
7. So, does what does that make this guy? Didn't he promise to uphold the
Constitution? Does he not think this is his duty to protect the interests of his country and the people he represents? What the f**k is he doing in Washington?
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-23-07 12:25 AM
Response to Reply #7
54. ah, hahaha. the consti--what?
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:41 PM
Response to Original message
8. There is no procedure for "cancelling the elections."
The president cannot cancel them.

One of the beauties of the separation of powers is the federal/state division of power. Cleverly enough, the states intitiate the presidential elections. So they can be held, whether Cheney or Chimp want them held or not.

The idea of cancelling them must be from experience in much more unstable countries that haven't had the rule of law for 200+ years.
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redacted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. Oh come on. There are thousands of things this administration "can't" do that they've done
like wiretapping American citizens without warrants. Forgive me if I'm misunderstanding an intelligent post by a good fellow DUer. But you mean to tell me that you seriously think there's going to be an election under martial law?

Here's an MP3 for you:

http://a1135.g.akamai.net/f/1135/18227/1h/cchannel.download.akamai.com/18227/podcast/PORTLAND-OR/KPOJ-AM/Nat%20Show%20hr%201%207-19-07.mp3?CPROG=PCAST&MARKET=PORTLAND-OR&NG_FORMAT=newstalk&SITE_ID=674&STATION_ID=KPOJ-AM&PCAST_AUTHOR=AM620_KPOJ&PCAST_CAT=News_%26_Politics&PCAST_TITLE=Thom_Hartmann_Nationwide


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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #11
14. YES
Edited on Sun Jul-22-07 03:55 PM by seemslikeadream
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Hippo_Tron Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:15 PM
Response to Reply #11
30. Illegal wiretapping didn't start with this administration
It has been done before. Suspending elections is a different story.
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-23-07 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #11
57. How is he going to get all fifty states to go along?
Some of them at least won't cooperate. I hope you're not that hopeless. Every state has its own set of bureaucrats who love their power as much as any other bureaucrat does.

That could work against the federal government have the powers of martial law for any appreciable period of time.

I hope I am misinterpreting an intelligent DUer not knowing there are states and they have powers. They won't just give them up.

Maybe the South and its "states rights" could be useful for once and they are the ones who would be in the lead.

Right wingnut states could even be in on that - many right wingnuts are all about state power - do you ever talk to those? In fact, fundies and freepers might oppose this martial law more than you'd think.
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SoonerPride Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:56 PM
Response to Reply #8
17. Isn't there an Executive Order which says he may indeed "suspend" elections?
"My fellow Amurkins, due to the state of emergency and chaos following event X, Y or Z, I am temproarily postponing the elections. Don't you worry, when things calm down, we'll re-schedule them and everything will be just fine. Meanwhile, please watch the new season of American Idle and forget about what I'm doing here in DC. Thank you and good night."
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-23-07 05:29 PM
Response to Reply #17
58. American Idle, I love it
I'm hoping the People would not be so weak as to fall for the idea of suspending the elections. I'm even optimistic about freepers. Only a very few people are so out of it they'd not realize something was wrong. There's been an election every two years since 1788!
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dkofos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:10 PM
Response to Reply #8
28. That won't stop them. They will make something up, hand it off to the media
and all will be well with the sheeple.
And if that doesn't work, they will send in the Blackwater goons a la NO
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treestar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-23-07 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #28
59. The Second Amendment types will be tested
Would they put their ammunition where their mouth is?

This is one of the reasons they claim they have the individual right to bear arms.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
9. that WILL NOT happen- the PEOPLE will NOT allow it.
don't worry.
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SoonerPride Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. And what, pray tell, will the people do about it?
I would really like to know.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #13
52. whatever it takes.
congress- both parties- wouldn't let it happen.

it's not going to happen, and i think it's utterly moranic to worry about it.
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redacted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:56 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. Which People? The People who've let everything go with no outcry for SIX YEARS, or
or the 3 or 4 so far that plan a general strike by calling in sick to work for a day or two?

I mean, I'm flabbergasted to actually see a comment like that here at DU. Surely you must be joking.
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SoonerPride Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:57 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. He's not joking and stop calling him Shirley
n/t
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redacted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:59 PM
Response to Reply #18
22. LOL! Thanks SoonerPride!
Which movie was that famous line from? "Airplane," right?
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SoonerPride Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #22
26. Bingo
:)
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 10:50 PM
Response to Reply #16
53. well...congress for starters.
it just won't happen, and it makes zero sense to fret about it.
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mmonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:50 PM
Response to Original message
10. That makes no sense whatsoever.
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Initech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:54 PM
Response to Original message
15. If Bush cancels the elections, I'm betting all hell breaks loose.
Seriously. I'm betting on riots the likes of which we've never seen, all over the country. People are really fucking pissed off at this administration and if he finds a way to remain in power because of this bullshit war that's going nowhere, the masses will go crazy.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:58 PM
Response to Reply #15
20. As has been pointed out
the Federal Government doesn't run any elections, so there's nothing for Bush to cancel.
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redacted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:01 PM
Response to Reply #20
23. MonkeyFunk, I knew you'd chime in sooner or later!
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:21 PM
Response to Reply #23
31. do you have
anything to say regarding the discussion?
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redacted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:29 PM
Response to Reply #31
34. I started this discussion and already said quite a bit.
Too bad you didn't bring your sense of humor to the thread like some of us. Sorry if you're having a bad day.
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:30 PM
Response to Reply #34
35. I'm having a fine day
I was asking if you had something regarding the discussion to say in response to me, beyond your cryptic observation.

It just seemed like a pointless post to me.
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redacted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:41 PM
Response to Reply #35
36. And the purpose of YOUR remarks is. . .what?
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MonkeyFunk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:50 PM
Response to Reply #36
39. To disagree with your premise.
This is a discussion board, wherein people are free to disagree.

I pointed out that the Federal Government doesn't run any elections, therefore has no power to cancel any elections.
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Initech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #20
25. Good point.
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SoonerPride Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:59 PM
Response to Reply #15
21. Dream on.
Riots?

pffft.

People will only riot if American Idle is pre-empted. And Fox would go on as if nothing had happened, because in reality, nothing unusual had happenend. The cabal responsible for the bloodless coup in 2000 decided that elections were inconvenient and unnecessary. Back to our regularly scheduled programming.
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Initech Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:06 PM
Response to Reply #21
27. Also a good point.
Yeah, this is why I hate television. If people would turn off that shit (or the Celebrity News Network) and start paying attention to what's really going on, they would probably be pissed off.
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burythehatchet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #15
48. well that's why there's cots with our names on them at a prison camp in
Edited on Sun Jul-22-07 06:13 PM by burythehatchet
some remote southwestern desert.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 03:57 PM
Response to Original message
19. “Nemesis: The Last Days of the American Republic.”
Edited on Sun Jul-22-07 03:58 PM by seemslikeadream
“Nemesis: The Last Days of the American Republic.”

She's present in our country right now, just waiting to make her - to carry out her divine mission




http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid...

CHALMERS JOHNSON: Nemesis was the ancient Greek goddess of revenge, the punisher of hubris and arrogance in human beings. You may recall she is the one that led Narcissus to the pond and showed him his reflection, and he dove in and drowned. I chose the title, because it seems to me that she's present in our country right now, just waiting to make her -- to carry out her divine mission.

By the subtitle, I really do mean it. This is not just hype to sell books -- “The Last Days of the American Republic.” I’m here concerned with a very real, concrete problem in political analysis, namely that the political system of the United States today, history tells us, is one of the most unstable combinations there is -- that is, domestic democracy and foreign empire -- that the choices are stark. A nation can be one or the other, a democracy or an imperialist, but it can't be both. If it sticks to imperialism, it will, like the old Roman Republic, on which so much of our system was modeled, like the old Roman Republic, it will lose its democracy to a domestic dictatorship.

I’ve spent some time in the book talking about an alternative, namely that of the British Empire after World War II, in which it made the decision, not perfectly executed by any manner of means, but nonetheless made the decision to give up its empire in order to keep its democracy. It became apparent to the British quite late in the game that they could keep the jewel in their crown, India, only at the expense of administrative massacres, of which they had carried them out often in India. In the wake of the war against Nazism, which had just ended, it became, I think, obvious to the British that in order to retain their empire, they would have to become a tyranny, and they, therefore, I believe, properly chose, admirably chose to give up their empire.

As I say, they didn't do it perfectly. There were tremendous atavistic fallbacks in the 1950s in the Anglo, French, Israeli attack on Egypt; in the repression of the Kikuyu -- savage repression, really -- in Kenya; and then, of course, the most obvious and weird atavism of them all, Tony Blair and his enthusiasm for renewed British imperialism in Iraq. But nonetheless, it seems to me that the history of Britain is clear that it gave up its empire in order to remain a democracy. I believe this is something we should be discussing very hard in the United States.

......



Over the ashes of blood marched the civilized soldiers,

Over the ruins of the french fortress of a failure

Over the silent screams of the dead and the dying

Saying please be reassured, we seek no wider war.



The treaties were signed, the country was split into sections

But growing numbers of prisons were built for protection

Rapidly filling with people who called for elections

But please be reassured, we seek no wider war.



Ngo dinh diem was the puppet who danced for the power

The hero of hate who gambled on hell for his hour

Father of his country was stamped on the medals we showered

But please be reassured, we seek no wider war.



Machine gun bullets became the bloody baptizers

And the falcon copters dont care if someones the wiser

But the boy in the swamp didnt know he was killed by advisers

So please be reassured, we seek no wider war.



And fires were spitting at forests in defoliation

While the people were pressed into camps not called concentration

And the greater the victory the greater the shame of the nation

But please be reassured, we seek no wider war.



While we were watching the prisoners were tested by torture

And vicious and violent gasses maintained the order

As the finest washington minds found slogans for slaughter

But please be reassured, we seek no wider war.



Then over the border came the bay of pigs planes of persuasion

All remaining honor went up in flames of invasion

But the shattered schools never learned that its not escalation

But please be reassured, we seek no wider war.



Were teaching freedom for which they are yearning

While were dragging them down to the path of never returning

But, well condescend to talk while the cities are burning

But please be reassured, we seek no wider war.



And the evil is done in hopes that evil surrenders

But the deeds of the devil are burned too deep in the embers

And a world of hunger in vengeance will always remember

So please be reassured, we seek no wider war,

We seek no wider war.

phil ochs
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
24. War and Globalization - Hijacking Catastrophe
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MsRedacted Donating Member (263 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #24
38. seemslikeadream STOP! BY posting all this crap, you are going to get this OP tossed in the 911 forum
Edited on Sun Jul-22-07 04:46 PM by MsRedacted
I don't get what you are trying to do.

I've never seen ANYONE hijack some else's post like this. Frankly I think it's really rude -- especially given the rules of DU. You know this reply of yours will get this OP tossed into the 911 forum. WHERE NO ONE WILL SEE IT.

Stop.

I mean most of this makes little sense in light of the OP.

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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #38
40. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
MsRedacted Donating Member (263 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:58 PM
Response to Reply #40
42. Yeah I'm serious -- I do not see what the OP has to do with 911 theories.
And if you do you've been spending a little too much time with your tin foil hat on. Yes I can see how vaguely you can draw some conclusions, but I really take offense by your attempt to get this OP tossed into the 911 forum.

Maybe if you stopped posting random crap and explained yourself, I'd understand better.

Frankly it looks to me like you are hijacking this post. Possibly because if you started a post on Iran and 911 -- it'd get jettisoned to some obscure forum and never seem again.

Looked to me that this post of was Rep Olver's belief that the admin has Iran plans, that they will cancel the election and that he still supports Pelosi.

NOT 911.

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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 05:07 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. MY POSTS HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH 9/11 CONSPIRACY THEORIES
Edited on Sun Jul-22-07 05:22 PM by seemslikeadream
AND I HAVE POSTED THOSE SAME LINKS IN THESE THREADS

AND THEY HAVE NEVER BEEN MOVED TO THE 9/11 FORUM
SO YOU BETTER READ UP ON WHAT THE HELL YOU'RE TALLKING ABOUT BEFORE YOU GO SPEWING CRAP


AND MAYBE TAKE A MOMENT AND READ SOME OF THE REPLIES, NO ONE HAS EVER HAD A PROBLEM WITH THE LINKS.

Now I just saw that you are new here so maybe you are a bit confused.


Do you even know who CHALMERS JOHNSON is?

or Michel Chossudovsky?

If you don't have time to watch the video, which I think would be a good idea before you go criticizing them here read this:
Summary:
"By helping us understand how fear is being actively cultivated and manipulated by the current administration, Hijacking Catastrophe stands to become an explosive and empowering information weapon in this decisive year in U.S. history."
Naomi Klein | Author, No Logo

"The Media Education Foundation has been carrying out vitally important work on major issues of the day, in a highly meritorious effort to raise public awareness and understanding, work that is particularly crucial in advance of the coming election, which may well cast a long shadow over the country's future."
Noam Chomsky | Professor of Linguistics, MIT



"The next Presidential election will be a watershed mark in our history and the urgency of producing and distributing materials that show exactly what is at stake has never been higher. Hijacking Catastrophe will be a vital tool in the campaign to rescue American democracy from its internal enemies. It will enrage and empower as it enlightens and explains."
Robert McChesney | Author, Rich Media, Poor Democracy



�What it really comes down to is this: Are the American voters going to sit still for this? Are we going to treat our democracy like some sort of spectator sport, like watching the Super Bowl, or are we going to ask a little more of ourselves this time? Are we going to explore the Bush Administration�s claims? Are we going to look at the details of what this administration has actually done?�
William Hartung | Senior Fellow, World Policy Institute



The 9/11 terror attacks continue to send shock waves through the American political system. Continuing fears about American vulnerability alternate with images of American military prowess and patriotic bravado in a transformed media landscape charged with emotion and starved for information. The result is that we have had little detailed debate about the radical turn US policy has taken since 9/11.



Hijacking Catastrophe: 9/11, Fear & the Selling of American Empire examines how a radical fringe of the Republican Party has used the trauma of the 9/11 terror attacks to advance a pre-existing agenda to radically transform American foreign policy while rolling back civil liberties and social programs at home.



The documentary places the Bush Administration's false justifications for war in Iraq within the larger context of a two-decade struggle by neoconservatives to dramatically increase military spending in the wake of the Cold War, and to expand American power globally by means of military force.



At the same time, the documentary argues that the Bush Administration has sold this radical and controversial plan for aggressive American military intervention by deliberately manipulating intelligence, political imagery, and the fears of the American people after 9/11.



Narrated by Julian Bond, Hijacking Catastrophe features interviews with more than twenty prominent political observers, including Pentagon whistleblower Lt. Colonel Karen Kwiatkowski, who witnessed first-hand how the Bush Administration set up a sophisticated propaganda operation to link the anxieties generated by 9/11 to a pre-existing foreign policy agenda that included a preemptive war on Iraq.



Joining Kwiatkowski in a wide-ranging, accessible, and ultimately empowering analysis of American foreign policy, media manipulation, and their global and domestic implications, are former Chief UN Weapons Inspector Scott Ritter, former Pentagon analyst Daniel Ellsberg, Nobel Peace Prize Laureate Jody Williams, author Norman Mailer, MIT professor Noam Chomsky, Code Pink founder Medea Benjamin, defense policy analyst William Hartung, author Chalmers Johnson, and Army Special Forces Master Sergeant Stan Goff (Ret.).



At its core, the film places the deceptions of the Bush Administration within the larger frame of questions seldom posed in the mainstream: What, exactly, is the agenda that drove the administration's pre-war deceptions? How is 9/11 being used to sell this agenda? And what are the stakes for America, Americans, and the world if this agenda succeeds in being fully implemented during a second Bush term?

INTERVIEWS INCLUDE
Tariq Ali | Benjamin Barber | Medea Benjamin | Noam Chomsky | Kevin Danaher | Mark Danner | Shadia Drury | Michael Dyson | Daniel Ellsberg | Michael Franti | Stan Goff | William Hartung
Robert Jensen | Chalmers Johnson | Jackson Katz | Michael T. Klare | Lt. Col. Karen Kwiatkowski (Ret.) | Norman Mailer | Zia Mian | Mark Crispin Miller | Scott Ritter | Vandana Shiva | Norman Solomon | Greg Speeter | Fernando Suarez del Solar | Immanuel Wallerstein | Jody Williams | Max Wolff


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1403693
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1403125
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1384733
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1391586
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1382952
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1382884
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1183255
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1172650
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1122026
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1109892
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1110324
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1111353
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=1061548
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1122026&mesg_id=1126554
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MsRedacted Donating Member (263 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 05:40 PM
Response to Reply #43
46. Ahem . . .then why is the full title "War and Globalization: the Truth Behind September 11"
Edited on Sun Jul-22-07 05:42 PM by MsRedacted
Just a thought.

And I don't have a problem with the links. Just their pertinence to this thread.

And the fact htat you've posted it so many other times -- makes me wonder if my whole theory isn't true.


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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 05:48 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. air strike Iran from the air
That's in the OP, is it not? I'm just trying to posts links that will show "air strikes on Iran" are a real possibility, A REAL POSSIBILITY, for anyone that may not understand. (PERTINENCE)


Michel Chossudovsky may not be to your liking but it might be a good idea to not judge a video by it's title, just a thought :)

If you do have time maybe you should at least watch Hijacking Catastrophe.
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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:54 PM
Response to Reply #38
41. OP tossed into the 911 forum. WHERE NO ONE WILL SEE IT
Bullshit you don't know what you're talking about
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-23-07 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #24
55. thank you. bookmarking. and watching now. n/t
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MalloyLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
29. Twisted logic
If they cancel the elections, there won't be any Democratic victories, dumbass.

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seemslikeadream Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:26 PM
Response to Original message
33. What We Wanted to Tell You About Iran
http://www.nytimes.com/glogin?URI=http://gk.nytimes.com/mem/gatekeeper.html&OQ=_rQ3D1Q26URIQ3DhttpQ3AQ2FQ2Fwww.nytimes.comQ2F2006Q2F12Q2F22Q2FopinionQ2F22leverett.htmlQ26OQ51Q3D_rQ513D4Q5126orefQ513DsloginQ5126orefQ513DsloginQ5126orefQ513DsloginQ26OPQ3D6fd2584fQ512F4pjq4-kQ517EzakkgV4VFFQ515D4Q512BV4VV4k2hQ513DhkQ513D4VV3jXjajggv_g)3&OP=6c994323Q2FHQ2FQ2BEH.NQ20Q2Bsl6H)Q20bsQ3FQ3F.dHQ3Fa1Q20Q2B)Q20Q2BlHrsQ20Q2BhQ2BQ2BQ3FQ2Bae)Q20b


Op-Ed Contributors
Redacted Version of Original Op-Ed

By FLYNT LEVERETT and HILLARY MANN
Published: December 22, 2006
The Iraq Study Group has added its voice to a burgeoning chorus of commentators, politicians, and former officials calling for a limited, tactical dialogue with Iran regarding Iraq. The Bush administration has indicated a conditional willingness to pursue a similarly compartmented dialogue with Tehran over Iran’s nuclear activities.


Related
What We Wanted to Tell You About Iran
Unfortunately, advocates of limited engagement — either for short-term gains on specific issues or to “test” Iran regarding broader rapprochement — do not seem to understand the 20-year history of United States-Iranian cooperation on discrete issues or appreciate the impact of that history on Iran’s strategic outlook. In the current regional context, issue-specific engagement with Iran is bound to fail. The only diplomatic approach that might succeed is a comprehensive one aimed at a “grand bargain” between the United States and the Islamic Republic.

Since the 1980s, cooperation with Iran on specific issues has been tried by successive administrations, but United States policymakers have consistently allowed domestic politics or other foreign policy interests to torpedo such cooperation and any chance for a broader opening. The Reagan administration’s engagement with Iran to secure the release of American hostages in Lebanon came to grief in the Iran-contra scandal. The first Bush administration resumed contacts with Tehran to secure release of the last American hostages in Lebanon, but postponed pursuit of broader rapprochement until after the 1992 presidential election.

In 1994, the Clinton administration acquiesced to the shipment of Iranian arms to Bosnian Muslims, but the leak of this activity in 1996 and criticism from presumptive Republican presidential nominee Robert Dole shut down possibilities for further United States-Iranian cooperation for several years.

These episodes reinforced already considerable suspicion among Iranian leaders about United States intentions toward the Islamic Republic. But, in the wake of the 9/11 attacks, senior Iranian diplomats told us that Tehran believed it had a historic opportunity to improve relations with Washington. Iranian leaders offered to help the United States in responding to the attacks without making that help contingent on changes in America’s Iran policy — a condition stipulated in the late 1990s when Tehran rejected the Clinton administration’s offer of dialogue — calculating that cooperation would ultimately prompt fundamental shifts in United States policy.

The argument that Iran helped America in Afghanistan because it was in Tehran’s interest to get rid of the Taliban is misplaced. Iran could have let America remove the Taliban without getting its own hands dirty, as it remained neutral during the 1991 gulf war. Tehran cooperated with United States efforts in Afghanistan primarily because it wanted a better relationship with Washington.

But Tehran was profoundly disappointed with the United States response. After the 9/11 attacks, xxx xxx xx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxx xxxxxxx xx set the stage for a November 2001 meeting between Secretary of State Colin Powell and the foreign ministers of Afghanistan’s six neighbors and Russia. xxxx xxxxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxx xxxx xx xxxxxx xxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxx xxx xxxxxx xxxxxx xxxxxx xxxx xxxxx xxxxx xx xxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxx xxxxx Iran went along, working with the United States to eliminate the Taliban and establish a post-Taliban political order in Afghanistan.

In December 2001, xxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx x Tehran to keep Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, the brutal pro-Al Qaeda warlord, from returning to Afghanistan to lead jihadist resistance there. xxxxx xxxxxxx so long as the Bush administration did not criticize it for harboring terrorists. But, in his January 2002 State of the Union address, President Bush did just that in labeling Iran part of the “axis of evil.” Unsurprisingly, Mr. Hekmatyar managed to leave Iran in short order after the speech. xxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxx xxxxxx xxxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxx xxxx xxxx xxx the Islamic Republic could not be seen to be harboring terrorists.

xxx xxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxx xxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxx xxxx xxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxx xxxx xxx xxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxx xxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxxxxx xxxx xxxxxxxx xxxx xxxxxxxx xxxx xx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxx xxxxx xxxx xxxxx xxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxx xxxxx xxxxx xxxxxx xx xxxxx xxx xx xxxxxxx This demonstrated to Afghan warlords that they could not play America and Iran off one another and prompted Tehran to deport hundreds of suspected Al Qaeda and Taliban operatives who had fled Afghanistan.

Those who argue that Iran did not cause Iraq’s problems and therefore can be of only limited help in dealing with Iraq’s current instability must also acknowledge that Iran did not “cause” Afghanistan’s deterioration into a terrorist-harboring failed state. But, when America and Iran worked together, Afghanistan was much more stable than it is today, Al Qaeda was on the run, the Islamic Republic’s Hezbollah protégé was comparatively restrained, and Tehran was not spinning centrifuges. Still, the Bush administration conveyed no interest in building on these positive trends.

xxx xxxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxx xxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx x xxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxx xxxxxxxxx xxx xxxxxx xx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxx xxx xxxxxxxx x xx x x xxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxxx xx xxxx xxxxx xxxxx xx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxx xxxx xxx xxxxxxx xxxxx xx xxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxx xxxxx xxxx xxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxx xxxxx xxxxxxxx xxxxxxxxx xxxxx xxxxxxxx xx

From an Iranian perspective, this record shows that Washington will take what it can get from talking to Iran on specific issues but is not prepared for real rapprochement. Yet American proponents of limited engagement anticipate that Tehran will play this fruitless game once more — even after numerous statements by senior administration figures targeting the Islamic Republic for prospective “regime change” and by President Bush himself that attacking Iran’s nuclear and national security infrastructure is “on the table.”


(Page 2 of 2)



Our experience dealing with xxxx xxxx Iranian diplomats over Afghanistan and in more recent private conversations in Europe and elsewhere convince us that Iran will not go down such a dead-end road again. Iran will not help the United States in Iraq because it wants to avoid chaos there; Tehran is well positioned to defend its interests in Iraq unilaterally as America flounders. Similarly, Iran will not accept strategically meaningful limits on its nuclear capabilities for a package of economic and technological goodies.


Iran will only cooperate with the United States, whether in Iraq or on the nuclear issue, as part of a broader rapprochement addressing its core security concerns. This requires extension of a United States security guarantee — effectively, an American commitment not to use force to change the borders or form of government of the Islamic Republic — bolstered by the prospect of lifting United States unilateral sanctions and normalizing bilateral relations. This is something no United States administration has ever offered, and that the Bush administration has explicitly refused to consider.

Indeed, no administration would be able to provide a security guarantee unless United States concerns about Iran’s nuclear activities, regional role and support for terrorist organizations were definitively addressed. That is why, at this juncture, resolving any of the significant bilateral differences between the United States and Iran inevitably requires resolving all of them. Implementing the reciprocal commitments entailed in a “grand bargain” would almost certainly play out over time and in phases, but all of the commitments would be agreed up front as a package, so that both sides would know what they were getting.

Unfortunately, the window for pursuing a comprehensive settlement with Iran will not be open indefinitely. The Iranian leadership is more radicalized today, with Mahmoud Ahmadinejad as president, than it was three years ago, and could become more radicalized in the future, depending on who ultimately succeeds Ayatollah Ali Khamenei as supreme leader. If President Bush does not move decisively toward strategic engagement with Tehran during his remaining two years in office, his successor will not have the same opportunities that he will have so blithely squandered.






Flynt Leverett Blasts WhiteHouse National Security Council Censorship of Former WhiteHouse Official


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/steve-clemons/flynt-leverett-blasts-whi_b_36523.html

John Bolton when he served as Under Secretary of State for Arms Control and International Security was famous for pounding intelligence officials hard until they coughed up intel reports and "frames" that fit the political objectives he had in mind.

The practice of politicizing intelligence in the Bush White House seems to be continuing with "friends lists" and "enemies lists" determining who should be rewarded or punished in the "secrets-clearing process" in cases where former goverment officials publish materials on U.S. foreign policy debates.

In an unprecedented case, the White House National Security Council staff has insinuated itself into a "secrets-clearing" process normally overseen by the CIA Publications Review Board which screens the written work of former government officials to make sure that state secrets don't find their way into the op-ed pages of the New York Times, Washington Post, or in other of the nation's leading papers, journals, and books.

Flynt Leverett, a former government official who worked at the Central Intelligence Agency, the Department of State, and on the National Security Council staff of the George W. Bush administration, is now a senior fellow and Director of the Geopolitics of Energy Initiative at the New America Foundation.

He has written numerous books, manuscripts, working papers, and many dozens upon dozens of some of the most important public policy op-ed commentary on American engagement in the Middle East and has always dutifully submitted his materials to the CIA's review process. Never -- not even once -- has been a word or item changed in anything submitted.


My understanding is that the White House staffers who have injected themselves into this process are working for Elliott Abrams and Megan O'Sullivan, both politically appointed deputies to President Bush's National Security Adviser, Stephen Hadley.

Their conduct in this matter is despicable and un-American in the profoundest sense of that term


Flynt Leverett Calls Ken Pollack 'Flat-Out Wrong'

Kenneth M. Pollack, Director of Research, Saban Center for Middle East Policy and Senior Fellow, Foreign Policy Studies, Brookings Institution at Washington Foreign Press Center Briefing on The Case for Invading Iraq."
http://www.brookings.edu/scholars/kpollack.htm
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/08/opinion/08pollack.html?ex=1323234000&en=e85a63d102419a90&ei=5090&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss
Don’t Count on Iran to Pick Up the Pieces


http://mondoweiss.observer.com/2006/12/flynt-leverett-calls-ken-pollack-flatout-wrong.html

A few minutes ago in a speech before the New America Foundation, Flynt Leverett, a former CIA and NSC official, attacked Kenneth Pollack, the "thinker" at Saban/Brookings who served up the Iraq war on a silver platter for liberals. Leverett said Pollack had made a "deeply-flawed and flat-out wrong case regarding WMD," which led him to assert in his book The Threatening Storm that invading Iraq was "the conservative option."

The speech was remarkable because Leverett once worked alongside Pollack at Brookings. Sort of like Anatol Lieven, who had to parachute out of Carnegie when they didn't want to hear what he had to say about Israel. "People at the thinktanks have courage somewhere between a seaslug and sheep-guts," Lieven told me earlier this year. What a pleasure to watch the war-party delaminate.

But how amazing is it that Pollack maintains credibility? "Now he's doing it on Iran," Leverett notes, pointing to a Dec. 8 Op-Ed in the Times. And at a CFR event not long ago, Pollack was all-but-praising neocon Reuel Marc Gerecht's burn-down-the-house option for Iran.




http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2006/12/18/18338378.php
Here is an excerpt of Leverett's statement on the affair.



' Until last week, the Publication Review Board had never sought to remove or change a single word in any of my drafts, including in all of my publications about the Bush administration's handling of Iran policy. However, last week, the White House inserted itself into the prepublication review process for an op-ed on the administration's bungling of the Iran portfolio that I had prepared for the New York Times, blocking publication of the piece on the grounds that it would reveal classified information.

This claim is false and, I have come to believe, fabricated by White House officials to silence an established critic of the administration's foreign policy incompetence at a moment when the White House is working hard to fend off political pressure to take a different approach to Iran and the Middle East more generally.

The op-ed is based on the longer paper I just published with The Century Foundation -- which was cleared by the CIA without modifying a single word of the draft. Officials with the CIA's Publication Review Board have told me that, in their judgment, the draft op-ed does not contain classified material, but that they must bow to the preferences of the White House.

The White House is demanding, before it will consider clearing the op-ed for publication, that I excise entire paragraphs dealing with matters that I have written about (and received clearance from the CIA to do so) in several other pieces, that have been publicly acknowledged by Secretary Rice, former Secretary of State Colin Powell, and former Deputy Secretary of State Richard Armitage, and that have been extensively covered in the media.

These matters include Iran's dialogue and cooperation with the United States concerning Afghanistan in the aftermath of the 9/11 attacks and Iran's offer to negotiate a comprehensive "grand bargain" with the United States in the spring of 2003.

There is no basis for claiming that these issues are classified and not already in the public domain.

For the White House to make this claim, with regard to my op-ed and at this particular moment, is nothing more than a crass effort to politicize a prepublication review process -- a process that is supposed to be about the protection of classified information, and nothing else -- to limit the dissemination of views critical of administration policy.

Within the last two week, the CIA found the wherewithal to approve an op-ed -- published in the New York Times on December 8, 2006 -- by Kenneth Pollack, another former CIA employee. This op-ed includes the statement that “Iran provided us with extensive assistance on intelligence, logistics, diplomacy, and Afghan internal politics."

Similar statements by me have been deleted from my draft op-ed by the White House. But Kenneth Pollack is someone who presented unfounded assessments of the Iraqi WMD threat -- the same assessments expounded by the Bush White House -- to make a high-profile public case for going to war in Iraq.

Mr. Pollack also supports the administration's reluctance to engage with Iran, in contrast to my consistent and sharp criticism of that position. It would seem that, if one is expounding views congenial to the White House, it does not intervene in prepublication censorship, but, if one is a critic, White House officials will use fraudulent charges of revealing classified information to keep critical views from being heard.

My understanding is that the White House staffers who have injected themselves into this process are working for Elliott Abrams and Megan O'Sullivan, both politically appointed deputies to President Bush's National Security Adviser, Stephen Hadley.

Their conduct in this matter is despicable and un-American in the profoundest sense of that term. '




http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Slaughter_asks_Bush_why_he_censored_1220.html
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 04:41 PM
Response to Original message
37. So Pelosi Has A Secret Plan ??? - Now Where Have I Heard That Before ???
<snip>

The Nixon Years

The secret negotiations began in the spring of 1968 in Paris and soon it was made public that Americans and Vietnamese were meeting to discuss an end to the long and costly war. Despite the progress in Paris, the Democratic Party could not rescue the presidency from Republican challenger Richard Nixon who claimed he had a secret plan to end the war.

Nixon's secret plan, it turned out, was borrowing from a strategic move from Lyndon Johnson's last year in office. The new president continued a process called "Vietnamization", an awful term that implied that Vietnamese were not fighting and dying in the jungles of Southeast Asia. This strategy brought American troops home while increasing the air war over the DRV and relying more on the ARVN for ground attacks. The Nixon years also saw the expansion of the war into neighboring Laos and Cambodia, violating the international rights of these countries in secret campaigns, as the White House tried desperately to rout out Communist sanctuaries and supply routes. The intense bombing campaigns and intervention in Cambodia in late April 1970 sparked intense campus protests all across America. At Kent State in Ohio, four students were killed by National Guardsmen who were called out to preserve order on campus after days of anti-Nixon protest. Shock waves crossed the nation as students at Jackson State in Mississippi were also shot and killed for political reasons, prompting one mother to cry, "They are killing our babies in Vietnam and in our own backyard."


The expanded air war did not deter the Communist Party, however, and it continued to make hard demands in Paris. Nixon's Vietnamization plan temporarily quieted domestic critics, but his continued reliance on an expanded air war to provide cover for an American retreat angered U.S. citizens. By the early fall 1972, U.S. Secretary of State Henry Kissinger and DRV representatives Xuan Thuy and Le Duc Tho had hammered out a preliminary peace draft. Washington and Hanoi assumed that its southern allies would naturally accept any agreement drawn up in Paris, but this was not to pass. The leaders in Saigon, especially President Nguyen van Thieu and Vice President Nguyen Cao Ky, rejected the Kissinger-Tho peace draft, demanding that no concessions be made. The conflict intensified in December 1972, when the Nixon administration unleashed a series of deadly bombing raids against targets in the DRV's largest cities, Hanoi and Haiphong. These attacks, now known as the Christmas bombings, brought immediate condemnation from the international community and forced the Nixon administration to reconsider its tactics and negotiation strategy.

<snip>

Link: http://www.pbs.org/battlefieldvietnam/history/index.html

Yeah... Right...

:banghead:
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CGowen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 05:10 PM
Response to Original message
44. Isn't it "doublethink" from 1984
Doublethink is an integral concept in George Orwell's dystopian novel Nineteen Eighty-Four, and is the act of holding two contradictory beliefs simultaneously, fervently believing both.

His mind slid away into the labyrinthine world of doublethink. To know and not to know, to be conscious of complete truthfulness while telling carefully-constructed lies, to hold simultaneously two opinions which cancelled out, knowing them to be contradictory and believing in both of them; to use logic against logic, to repudiate morality while laying claim to it, to believe that democracy was impossible and that the Party was the guardian of democracy; to forget whatever it was necessary to forget, then to draw it back at the moment when it was needed, and then promptly to forget it again: and above all, to apply the same process to the process itself. That was the ultimate subtlety: consciously to induce unconsciousness, and then, once again, to become unconscious of the act of hypnosis you had just performed. Even to understand the word 'doublethink' involved using doublethink

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublethink
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AndyTiedye Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 05:27 PM
Response to Original message
45. What Does it Matter if Impeachment Would Hurt us in the Elections if There Aren't Going to Be Any?
He is deeply concerned whether we will actually have an election in Nov. '08, as he believes this administration will likely strike Iran from the air, declare a national emergency, and cancel the '08 elections.

He sees ending the war as his primary goal, and he believes the brilliant Nancy Pelosi has a strategy more potent than impeachment. He thinks impeachment is a futile waste of legislative energy, will be harmful of democratic '08 victories,


I'm missing something here.

If Bush** cancels the elections, there won't be any '08 Democratic victories to worry about being harmful to.


Is he really trying to say that it's too late, and Congress no longer has the power to remove Bush** even if they DO impeach him?


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brettdale Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 06:17 PM
Response to Original message
49. kick
kick
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DeSwiss Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 06:22 PM
Response to Original message
50. The USA held election during all its wars....
...even a civil war. So I don't see why any election should or could be cancelled. If its insurrection he wants, that'd do it for me!

:mad:
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Lerkfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jul-22-07 06:27 PM
Response to Reply #50
51. If you're waiting for that to do it, it'll be too late by then.
:shrug:

"oh, once they kill me, THEN I'll start defending myself!"
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orleans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-23-07 12:50 AM
Response to Original message
56. the video from seemslikeadream (post 24)
google video link:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3320922145165829917&q=Hijacking+Catastrophe&total=59&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

quote at hijacking catastrophe opening:

"THE PEOPLE CAN ALWAYS BE BROUGHT TO THE BIDDING OF THE LEADERS. THAT IS EASY. ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS TELL THEM THEY ARE BEING ATTACKED AND DENOUNCE THE PEACEMAKERS FOR LACK OF PATRIOTISM AND EXPOSING THE COUNTRY TO DANGER. IT WORKS THE SAME IN ANY COUNTRY."
--Nazi Reich Marshall Hermann Goering at the Nuremberg War Trials
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Junkdrawer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-23-07 05:31 PM
Response to Original message
60. Remember this from 2004 (Bush tried to get legislative authority to cancel elections)....
Edited on Mon Jul-23-07 05:35 PM by Junkdrawer
July 19 issue - American counterterrorism officials, citing what they call "alarming" intelligence about a possible Qaeda strike inside the United States this fall, are reviewing a proposal that could allow for the postponement of the November presidential election in the event of such an attack, NEWSWEEK has learned.

The prospect that Al Qaeda might seek to disrupt the U.S. election was a major factor behind last week's terror warning by Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge. Ridge and other counterterrorism officials concede they have no intel about any specific plots. But the success of March's Madrid railway bombings in influencing the Spanish elections—as well as intercepted "chatter" among Qaeda operatives—has led analysts to conclude "they want to interfere with the elections," says one official.

As a result, sources tell NEWSWEEK, Ridge's department last week asked the Justice Department's Office of Legal Counsel to analyze what legal steps would be needed to permit the postponement of the election were an attack to take place. Justice was specifically asked to review a recent letter to Ridge from DeForest B. Soaries Jr., chairman of the newly created U.S. Election Assistance Commission. Soaries noted that, while a primary election in New York on September 11, 2001, was quickly suspended by that state's Board of Elections after the attacks that morning, "the federal government has no agency that has the statutory authority to cancel and reschedule a federal election." Soaries, a Bush appointee who two years ago was an unsuccessful GOP candidate for Congress, wants Ridge to seek emergency legislation from Congress empowering his agency to make such a call. Homeland officials say that as drastic as such proposals sound, they are taking them seriously—along with other possible contingency plans in the event of an election-eve or Election Day attack. "We are reviewing the issue to determine what steps need to be taken to secure the election," says Brian Roehrkasse, a Homeland spokesman.


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5411741/site/newsweek/
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Rosemary2205 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jul-23-07 05:31 PM
Response to Original message
61. Who is John Olver and why is he so stupid?
Elections are run by States and locals. There is no such thing as a federal election and Bush CAN'T cancel them. There's not a governor in this country who'll let Bush tell them to cancel all elections. That's just ignorant.
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