Which Group Will Do The Democrats More Harm: The Impeach Nows, Or The Wait 'Til 2008's ???

[WillyT]

So far, it appears that the Bush Administration is checking, and possibly checkmating, all investigations that could lead to Impeachment. They seem to have the Democrats stymied and appearing ineffectual. If we don't AT LEAST set the groundwork for Inherent Contempt, let alone Impeachment, then all roads lead to the courts. And after a lovely couple of decades stacking the courts with Federalist Society hacks, those decisions may not be pleasing to our notions of fairness and Democracy. And... those decisions will be FINAL, and will set precedent.

So to me, the Wait 'Til 2008 option is the low road. It's also the immoral road, and will, even if we win, set our party back. History I fear, will not look kindly on this party, in this era.

But maybe that's just me.

:shrug:

[proud2BlibKansan]

1. I'm holding out for Feingold's censure!

:)

[WillyT]

3. But, But... We Don't Have 60 Votes !!!

How's THAT gonna happen?

:shrug:

[proud2BlibKansan]

17. Darn you Willy, you are stealing my thunder here!

I was really looking forward to that censure. :rofl:

[WillyT]

19. LOL !!!

:bounce::hi::bounce:

[ellisonz]

27. Actually, you need 67 Senate votes to convict.

:P

[Just-plain-Kathy]

2. Americans know that we have criminals in the White House.

If we don't do anything until 2008, we'll look week and passive. ...Dems have to look stronger. We have to stop letting these thugs walk all over us!

[WillyT]

4. EXACTLY !!! - Spot On !!!

:yourock:

[DURHAM D]

5. American citizens can hold two thoughts -

1) We have a criminal in the WH.

2) The senate can not successfully prosecute an impeachment.

[Lerkfish]

7. and what is the synthesis of those two thoughts?

therefore, we are powerless to stop dictatorship

[Individualist]

9. Precisely. The party needs to wake up and realize Americans don't vote for weakness.

[Phredicles]

20. Exactly - people see what's happening and say, Same old wussy Dems;

what WILL they stand up for?

[AndyTiedye]

25. But We Cannot Stop Them From Walking All Over Us. We Don't Have the Votes

[Lerkfish]

6. I am in agreement that history will not look kindly on turning a blind eye

assuming there is a history to be able to look back.

[Dollface]

8. Impeach now. It will be an occasion to state the crimes

and to perhaps get some candidates to vow to not just do no more harm but to fix the damage that has been done to the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.
Then we can start on the Supreme Court.

[LittleClarkie]

10. Conyers is immoral?

?

[WillyT]

15. I Wasn't Aware That Conyers Was Waiting Until 2008

:shrug:

[LittleClarkie]

16. That's the answer he gave Cindy

in one of the Cindy threads. Elections are the answer.

[WillyT]

21. He Also Said He Just Needed 3 More Congresscritters To Sign HR 333

Do you think Pelosi told him to cool it???

:shrug:

[babylonsister]

11. High road here; let's get it done ASAP! Sheehan, and McGovern, and all those

people got arrested today for fighting for us; it's past time for US to fight for us!
Are you listening, Mr. Conyers and Ms. Pelosi?

[proud2BlibKansan]

18. No they're not

unfortunately.

[babylonsister]

22. Sad coming from you, but I read your post earlier. I sent Conyers

an e-mail to his 'personal' site.
"You had Cindy Sheehan and Roy McGovern arrested?"
What's it going to take, Rep. Conyers, to do the right thing? When will enough be enough?"
I did, and I'm glad.

[L. Coyote]

12. Neither. The do nothing and despair crowd is the problem.

The people out on the sidewalk registering voters are the ones doing some good, irrespective of their views on impeachment. Shoe leather wins elections.

[PA Democrat]

29. Only 64% of Americans eligible to vote, voted in the 2004 presidential election.

More than a third of the country didn't care enough to make the effort. That's just sad considering how much was, and still, is a stake.

[luckyleftyme2]

13. actually-both-except

The wait is to gather information -the latter is to IMPEACH all those involved with criminal acts. We move slow but steadily toward IMPEACHMENT.
The mood of the country is to rid this administration from power,I think it may take a little time,and don't forget sometimes it pays to lose a little ground while your agenda
is to lull the enemy into false security with out realizing the final attack is gaining
strength and will be forth coming when the time is right.

[mmonk]

14. Impeachment inquiry raises the stakes.

Right now, until such a threat is apparent, we will see a power game with bush acting on theories about presidential power and congress threatening this or that.

[earthlover]

23. Those who want to defeat the Reps in a transformational election....

..that could lead to a generation of Democratic rule....along with the opportunity to enact the programs we harp about and reshape the supreme court.....OH...I get it.....that's immoral?

How about having some respect for your fellow Democrats who may disagree with you on tactics?

Up yours back....

[WillyT]

24. Oh, I Get It, Thanks !!! - Damn... The Permanent DEMOCRATIC Majority, I See !!!

Man, we've got disciples of Karl Rove in our party too! Kewl!

And better than that, we get to keep all the powers Bush is ascribing to himself right now. Signing statements, no habeas corpus, extrodinary rendition, secret courts, heck... we might even get to torture a Republican or two.

And all we have to do, is sit back and let the Republicans wipe their asses with the constitution, dismantle the federal government, fuck up the environment, threaten war around the globe, and kill or maim several thousand more of our soldiers, and a couple of hundred thousand more Iraqis... or Iranians... or Pakistanis... or Venezualans... or... NOT!

It is comments like yours that make me secretly root for a draft. Put every mother fucker's skin in the game, and THEN let's see how you feel about TACTICS!

:wtf:

[earthlover]

26. No, I was arguing that electing a Democratic government would be a repudiation of everything yu said

I find it insulting that when I mention even the IDEA of the Democrats actually WINNING you find that IDEA repulsive. You seem to have bought into the idea that the only way to win is to get rid of habeas corpus, the constitution, destroy the environment, and wage war.

There is a better way. Take back Washington. Work for Democratic control of the presidency and Congress so we can actually do something about our lofty goals.

Impeachment would be ok, but it is small potatoes compared to really changing things.

Also, considering the makeup of the Senate and the House and the media, it won't remove anyone from office and it could very well backfire, leading to a backlash of public opinion.

What a pity too, if somehow we find a way to blow it in 08.

Time is on our side.

What is disconcerting about your post is that you are mocking the idea of winning in 08. Which, is precisely how the Rovians would want us to feel.

[ThomWV]

28. Wait 'till '08 assumes there will be an election in '08 - only a fool assumes that one will be held