Hey Conyers, Dean, and Feingold!

[LittleClarkie]

You're good men. I can have a different of opinion from you, and still you are good men. You come from a position of honesty and integrity most of the time (hey, nobody's perfect)

I will not turn on you, call you cowards or DLC or worse because of one issue.

I have your backs.

[HughMoran]

1. This is different

I was about to post a wise crack about this being post number 13879137361 calling out Dems for not doing one particular thing.

A pleasant surprise! :D

[LittleClarkie]

10. Well, that's it, isn't it

One thing not done, and three previously hailed Dems getting attacked. Doesn't seem right.

But then this place has always been a rollercoaster. "He's GREAT... He SUCKS... He's GREAT... He SUCKS!"

Bleck.

[Jed Dilligan]

2. Do you think they give a shit what you think?

Can you really be that gullible?

They do not give a shit about the support or the accusations. All of DU seems to have a swollen head today.

[MonkeyFunk]

3. Did you read the whole OP?

[Jed Dilligan]

11. Yes

it was short.

[LittleClarkie]

17. So am I

oddly enough.

5 foot nuthin'

[Jed Dilligan]

22. Six foot seven

That explains our different perspectives. I don't look up to anyone...

:rofl:

[LittleClarkie]

4. They don't have to. I see good men being attacked, and I am defending them

If nothing else, my fellow DUers will see that there is someone standing up for these men.

And my buddy Kerry, whom I respect greatly, said that if I saw Dems being attacked, I should defend them. This is me, defending them.

[Jed Dilligan]

13. I have no respect for any politician,

especially in regard to their emotions. That's where we differ.

[LittleClarkie]

15. I said nothing about their emotions. You mistakenly assume I actually think they're reading here.

Nah. It was just the way I put my feeling out there, is all.

Nevertheless, politicians are still people. Some get respect, some don't, just like real people.

[PeaceNikki]

16. I question whether you have respect for people in general terms.

[Jed Dilligan]

20. If by "people in general" you mean yourself,

which is what people usually mean by "people in general," you're probably right.

[PeaceNikki]

25. I meant the community of which you include yourself. Fellow Democrats. People as a whole.

Sure, I am in the collective group. But, specifically I was referring to the fact that you clicked on this thread and taking time out of your day to insult the OP...

you didn't have to tell us all how little you respect people. It shows.

[Jed Dilligan]

26. I have no respect for gullible fools

who think that politicians are on their side. They are more loyal across the aisle than down the block.

D or R, we the people have to hold their feet to the fire ALL THE TIME or they will just rape the shit out of us.

[PeaceNikki]

8. And somehow anyone should give a shit what YOU think?

I bet if you look in the mirror, you'll find a slightly "bulgy" head.

[Jed Dilligan]

12. There is no reason for you to

In fact, I do not give a shit if you do not give a shit. You can go on deluding yourself that these people are your buddies are whatever.

The idea that what people say about them at DU has ANY effect on these politicians, politically or emotionally, is ludicrous.

[LittleClarkie]

14. And I do not give a shit that you don't give a shit that she doesn't give a shit

They're not my buddies.

I'm taking a stand, one opposite to some who think that these men are sellouts or whatever based on one issue.

So I put it in the form of a shout out. It's not like I think they actually read here. But it was one way to get all their names in the heading and let DUers know where I stand.

Most probably don't give a shit either, but some might, those that feel the same or similar.

What people say negatively about these people does affect them in the form of less support for them and their efforts, including writing letters, donating (esp. since Dean is the DNC Chairman), and phone calls.

[Jed Dilligan]

18. For someone who doesn't give a shit

you sure write a lot.

I doubt that the effect of negative or positive comments here is at all significant. For every bit of support lost to a negative comment, there is an equal amount of retrenchment of support (see your own OP). For every bit of support gained from a positive comment, there is an equal amount of alienation of people who are repulsed by the apparent hero worship (that would be me).

The only thing that will affect anything is the dissemination of actual information. I haven't seen any information that makes me feel more supportive of the particular individuals you name.

[LittleClarkie]

21. never mind

saw ya smile.

[Jed Dilligan]

23. I usually don't bring it to a serious conversation.

See above for example of my sense of humor. :)

[LittleClarkie]

24. Saw it

that's why I edited.

As for seeing things that would make one more supportive of each of these men, I guess what I'm talking about is more the things I can remember they've done in the past that took some guts. I don't think such things should be forgotten because they don't support impeachment, as if their past deeds no longer count.

[GeorgeGist]

5. I'm sure the they will be pleased.

Be careful though, the ground behind them is mighty slippery; you might just find yourself face down in chickenshit .

[LittleClarkie]

6. Not with these men I won't

Perhaps you are thinking of someone else.

[madrchsod]

7. we are a minority

any commenting about not impeaching is meant with a thousand razor cuts

[LittleClarkie]

9. Indeed. But Feingold wasn't afraid to be a minority of one against the Patriot Act

so I reckon the least I can do is stand up even if it's just me.

[Bongo Prophet]

27. I will stand with you, LC. A few comments

I am not sure what shit Dean may be getting now, so I will focus on Conyers, Leahy, Waxman, and others on committees that are doing the often tedious work that needs to be done in oversight. By asking the right questions (not always perfect, and within legal and procedural constraints that are extremely frustrating) they are trapping Gonzales with his own web of lies into either censure, the appointment of a Special Prosecutor, maybe even impeachment and or perjury charges -perhaps driving Gonzo out of office. Many things could happen.

Whatever happens, if anything good comes of this it will be because of hundreds of hours of work put in by committee members and staff. Their work should be acknowledged even if they do not produce the results I would like.
Some here will say "Well Damn, about time!!" like a spoiled kid who finally gets his dinner without a clue as to the sweat that went into its preparation.

For the record, I think Gonzo, and others on DOJ are front lines - from torture, politicization, habeus, Hatch act, vote caging and much more. This is the crux of all of that. This can lead to Rove, Cheney, and finally Bush. It is too complex and too important to go off "half-cocked" or to blow this.

I am all for calm cold strategic maneuvering, ninja style.
Not wild and emotional threats or fools-rush-in saloon fighting.
That is really more due to personal style, and I recognize people will disagree with any given strategy.
What I DON'T appreciate is the attitude of people having a different strategy or style accusing others of enabling or equivalency with these war criminals in power. I just don't think it is helpful to smack the people on the front lines next to you, or bickering in the foxhole.

The Pink ones might be serving these ends by protesting Conyers or the hearings themselves, but I think they could do better by harassing the evil ones directly, like US Army did to Noriega, In Waco and Guatanamo. Ceaseless noise and haunting them to where they cannot sleep or function. Then they are more likely to slip up. Bug the living shit out of them. Let's give them bullhorns in the night to haunt their dreams...

[ClassWarrior]

19. I agree LC... Sometimes the wheels of justice grind wayyy too slow...

...for this impatient soul. But there's comfort in knowing that they grind exceedingly fine.

NGU, LC. NGU.

[Zomby Woof]

28. There's a persistent rumor...

GD will be renamed the "Sheehan/Impeachment Forum".

[madrchsod]

29. seems like a good rename...

this whole thing should blow over soon....