Has Conyers Pulled A Fast One???

[KharmaTrain]

I found this interesting post at that evil, awful, orange satan website. Check out this hate speech:

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/7/26/01945/0694

Rep. John Conyers is methodically setting up the legal elements for Congress to pursue statutory and/or inherent contempt proceedings against executive branch officials in a manner that essentially wipes out any claim to executive privilege to shield the truth. A few weeks ago, I wrote a diary on Impeachment by Frog-Marching Congressional Oversight, which suggested that Congress had a better chance -- according to US Supreme Court precedent -- to obtain evidence and testimony from the Bush gang if it conducted a "criminal proceeding" to investigate potential criminal or unlawful conduct by executive branch officials. The beauty of the "criminal proceeding" is that Bush is not likely to prevail on executive privilege claims. Well, it looks like the US Attorney probe has now been officially transformed into a "criminal proceeding" to determine whether Bush officials have violated specific laws.

Here's hoping there's some truth in this...and why Inherent Contempt is the best weapon we have to call this regime into account. I suspected Gonzo, willingly, walked into a perjury trap thinking he'd skate away, but did he?

Stay tuned...

Discuss...

[IChing]

1. worth a kick before bed

[bigtree]

2. why would anyone assume he'd telegraph every move he's going to make

by blabbing to blogs and strangers in the hall . . . ?

Of course he's prepared to pursue every option, including . . .

[babylonsister]

3. why would you think he'd say something like, 'we only need 3 more',

and then discount the contingent that were in DC, without one comment? We had to hear they got arrested? I know he's busy, but come on.

I'm to the point where it's 'Mr. Conyers, get off the pot! What's your opinion? Where are we going with this?'

And I think it's REALLY interesting that his wife is a force in his town for supporting impeachment; he's got to be getting it from all sides.
All that said, I love the guy, I love Cindy Sheehan, and I love Ray McGovern; they're on the same page but approaching the end result differently.

[KharmaTrain]

4. Neither Is Inclusive

If anyone knows the Constitution, Impeachment and the law, it's John Conyers Jr. He sat on both the Nixon and Clinton impeachments and has been a champion of civil and human rights for over 30 years. Some people here should do a little reasearch into this man's career before they question his heart or gut.

Right now, this regime's Executive Privilidge sham needs to be shut down...or nothing rolls. Inherent contempt is the best weapon to achieve that...and with it comes the evidence that leads to impeachment. Conyers needs a solid criminal case to base impeachment on...just like Nixon and Clinton were. He needs direct charges and evidence again people...not statements, but real proof of criminal wrongdoing. This isn't done in committee meeting or in press conferences.

The articles are writing themselves every day this regime shits on the Constitution...but the votes to convict aren't. Impeachment is the end result, not the starting point in bringing this regime into account. Also, right now, the people Conyers and others need to go after are ones that can't be impeached...like Rove, Goodling, Taylor, Sampson and others that will provide the rope and evidence to hang the rest.

Time is the avenger...I know I won't rest until all these criminals are brought to justice for the past 6 years plus of crimes.

[babylonsister]

6. I just hope you aren't too optimistic. I'm running out of patience, as

horrible as that might be for some people. :evilgrin:

[KharmaTrain]

7. We All Gotta Have Something To Believe In...

I'm with there with you on the patience...words don't even describe the anger and frustration now. Thank goodness there's a DU to vent some of that angst and find some sanity.

The truth wills out and it sets you free. It may take the rest of our lives to bring this ugly chapter to an end, but I am determined that the crimes of this regime are never forgotten and those who committed them are given their proper due.

Let's just stand tough and not let the frustration turn inward.

:toast:

[Jackpine Radical]

23. ...and as for me, I believe I'll have another beer.

All the popcorn is making my mouth dry.

[Silver Gaia]

13. K & R.

"Impeachment is the end result, not the starting point in bringing this regime into account."

Well-said. And thank you.

[loudsue]

28. I agree w/ you, KT. Conyers is moving along, no matter what he has to tell

the press, or the people who appear at his office.

But I will tell you this: Those protesters at his office, and ALL of the pressure WE, THE PEOPLE are putting on members of congress are supporting ANY efforts that the Dems are making at bringing this mafia to justice.

I keep trying to YELL the message to everyone: KEEP CALLING YOUR REPUBLICAN REPS, TOO!!! Don't just hammer the Dems! Our calls, e-mails, letters and faxes to republicans are SHOWING the republicans that THEY should be pushing for impeachment, and it only makes them more timid when they try to stand up for the mafia. It lets them know they don't have the support of ANYBODY, except the lobbyists. We need to show the simple-minded republicans in congress that they are doing the WRONG thing if they support bush or his policies.

The pressure from the people is what the Dems originally called for. And we have to ramp it up to the REPUBLICAN members. The Dems already know how much we hate this criminal cabal.

:kick::kick::kick:

[rodeodance]

5. conyers says here that the matter will go to DC US attorney (july 25)

http://judiciary.house.gov/newscenter.aspx?A=837

For Immediate Release Contact: Jonathan Godfrey
July 25, 2007 Melanie Roussell

(Washington, DC) - Today, the House Judiciary Committee sent a report and resolution to the House of Representatives finding former White House Counsel Harriet Miers and White House Chief of Staff Joshua Bolten in statutory contempt of Congress for failing to respond to the Committee's subpoenas in the U.S. Attorney investigation. The report passed by a vote of 22-17.

"In order to pursue this investigation, we have done what committees in the Congress have always done – we have sought out documents and testimony, initially on a voluntary basis, and through compulsory process only as a last resort," said Committee Chairman John Conyers, (D-MI). "I began this investigation with a simple question – who put the list of fired US Attorneys together and why. I would think it would be in everyone’s interest to get the facts on the table, so we could reassure the American people that the nation’s laws are being fully and faithfully enforced."

Following the vote, Conyers sent a letter to White House Counsel Fred Fielding alerting him of today's actions and urging him to reconsider negotiating terms to resolve the document and testimony issues without further confrontation. "As I explained before the Committee’s vote, I regret that the Committee has had to take this step, and continue to hope that we can resolve with you the Committee’s need for information from the White House in our investigation," he wrote.

The full House of Representatives is now required to vote on a contempt resolution before the matter is sent to the District of Columbia's U.S. Attorney for action. The full text of Conyers' letter to Fielding and the Committee's report is attached.

Letter to Fielding and committee report.

[madrchsod]

8. gonzo fell into the well yesterday

if he was you or i in front of a judge we`d be toast. we all know it takes a mountain of evidence to bury these guys and i think conyers is going to do it.

[KharmaTrain]

9. The Shame Of It All...

This is the supposed "Highest Law Enforcement Official" in the country. :argh:

[puebloknot]

10. K&R Thank you, and help me understand, if you can...

... the statutory and/or inherent contempt proceedings. Must one precede the other? If the statutory method fails, can inherent contempt still be done?

I'll forgive Conyers on failure to impeach if he can pull this off. I'll mea culpa until 11/08, if he really puts some teeth into this and doesn't back down. I'm not holding my breath, but I am staying tuned.

[KharmaTrain]

11. It's Procedure

From my reading of this...a lot of great info is at Talking Points Memo...this is a formality...a "college try" as it were to do things by the book here and see where it goes.

Actually this will set up a showdown as to if the US Prosecutor in the First District court will persue this case or follow boooshie's directive not to? If he doesn't, Conyers then has more ammo on abuse charges...along with a major PR fallout for booshie. The showdown is then set to blast away at "Executive Privildge"...and the best tool...the only one is for Inherent contempt.

We've seen how scared these shitstains are of going to jail...and maybe the real threat of an orange jump suit will loosen some lips.

My concern right now is the delay in getting the entire House to vote on this contempt citation. I hope it's before they go home rather than after.

Give Conyers and the Judiciary Committee the chance to build their case here. Be assured folks like Maxine Waters, Shiela Jackson-Lee, Rob Wexler and others on that committee would love to send out articles. Let's just stay tuned...what else can we do???

[puebloknot]

12. Thanks! This is a help.

I was fearful that not going immediately for inherent contempt was another piece of hand waving, a way to string things out and then say we're too close to the election to do anything. This makes me feel more hopeful.

[aquart]

14. Six years he put up with their disrespect. Six years.

Knowing what they were doing but powerless to investigate. Six years.

[malaise]

15. As I posted way back when

watching the system work is more like preparing a seven course meal. The feast is worth the wait. The fast food generation can no longer appreciate the beauty of this process.

[GeorgeGist]

16. And just how many human corpses ...

will it take to satisfy your beautiful appetite?

[Control-Z]

20. Nice analogy

It would be a shame to make the shitty cheeseburger grab rather than wait for the seven course feast.

[KoKo]

17. Good Diary over there at Kos...worth the read...

That Conyers is using "criminality" is a way of getting them to notice that behind this "contempt" is a body of law...and congress will be using it.

Hopeful!

[lonestarnot]

18. Ack methodology of the trap will run out the clock.

[rosesaylavee]

19. Hope this is what is happening...

Conyers has always acted honorably and with great intelligence and patience. I would think they all would be vastly aware of what's at stake if a plan does not succeed. It would make sense to me to go the most conservative route possible to stop these criminals.

Hoping this is true.

[KharmaTrain]

22. Dotting I's, Crossing T's

Conyers has seen both the good and bad of this process and wants it to be above board and by "the books". It's frustrating for all of us as there are so many layers of procedure, but then he's seen the pitfalls of cutting corners. Following Watergate, none of us thought we'd see the same impeachment proceeding used again like it was abused in the Clinton fiasco. The bar was lowered and twisted and this has distorted many people's view of what impeachment is and what it can achieve. It's not supposed to be the start of the checks and balance process but the end result.

This onion has to be pealed away thoroughly and carefully...and I think in the long-run this will help in documenting more crimes and criminals and bring a more comprehensive justice. The Constitution isn't defended if there's an impeachment without a conviction...Conyers knows that and wants to build a compelling case just like Rodino did in '74.

:hi:

BTW...are you going to YKos? We're trying to see if we can have a Chicago DUers conclave.

Cheers...

[rosesaylavee]

24. I am hoping to be there

on Friday but not for Dkos - just to meet other DUers if we can that to happen.

Thanks for the upbeat post on the big "I". Needed to read this today.

[mmonk]

21. It's what I'm hoping.

[creeksneakers2]

25. At least orange satan got one point right

There is a rumor floating around the net that impeachment procedures would bar any claims of executive privilege. That's misleading. Executive privilege is presumed by the courts. The requester of information, in this case Congress, must demonstrate a need for the information that is more important to the public than Bush's needs for confidentiality. Investigating criminal conduct, as opposed to just plain checking things out, demonstrates a stronger need.

I've monitored orange satan for weeks now and I don't remember him suggesting that Conyers take his latest action. I think orange satan wants to get credit for anything good that happens, whether he deserves it or not. Its entirely predictable that if this all ends up with Bush in jail that orange satan will claim personal victory.

Orange Satan is inaccurate in describing what Congress is doing as a criminal proceeding. Congress has no power to prosecute, other than the inherent contempt power. What Conyers is doing is conducting an investigation into criminal activity.

It is true that executive privilege can be overcome by the needs of a criminal prosecutor. (US v Nixon) However, that's a prosecution in court, not in Congress.

[mzmolly]

26. Ahhhh thanks!

K and R.

[waldo_evans]

27. are you people insane?

this will lead to NOTHING. What makes you think Rove will testify?

And Bush will pardon everyone anyway, so just cut this fucking crap.

IMPEACH, fools.