It is really a little too quiet up north right now -

[Joe for Clark]

As noted there were "attacks" going on against kurd officials over the weekend. Killed some of them.

I question the effectivness - but that isn't really the question.

They may or may not be effective initially - no way of knowing - but we should be able to see that they are coordinated - cause it starts from there.

This is from today in iraq -

Kirkuk:
#1: A series of shootings also killed four people in the disputed northern city of Kirkuk and nearby Hawija. The victims included a female official with the Kurdistan Democratic Party, which is pressing for oil-rich Kirkuk to be incorporated into the autonomous Kurdish region despite opposition by Arabs and Turkomen.

I don't know what they mean by series - and there is no way of knowing the level of coordination from this report. But that is what I look for, coordination - cause when they do manage to coordinate - they can repeat it over and over.

Turkey is looking over our shoulder - as they should - and I am glad the US has managed to put a banaid on this right now - but it is a bandid afterall - and this is all connected.

There are so many interest groups up north right now with so many guns all looking at those same oil fields - so much money on the table.

Anyway - I watch the north.

Joe

[Joe for Clark]

1. I managed to misspell bandaid twice -

In the same sentence - I get an "F" in spelling. Opps.

Joe

[John Q. Citizen]

45. It's hard to look north and type at the same time.

:)

But I think you are correct. That's one of the heavy friction zones for sure.

[seemslikeadream]

2. kick

[BlooInBloo]

3. Another 72 hours? You guarantee it? LOLOL!

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

4. Yes, it's not like what you said would happen.

In fact, it's a little too not what like you said would happen...

[Joe for Clark]

5. If that was true - I'd be the happiest guy here .

Is it??

I cannot - will not - predict armagedon - just that the conflict would start - in a way recognizable - in attacks that were clearly planned.

I cannot judge - will not judge the effectivness.

IT DOESN'T MATTER!!

Are they CLEARLY PLANNED ATTACKS - cause when they are - they will be repeated - over and over.

I make guesses about the timing - I do. And to me - I still don't know if they started.

DO you??

Joe

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

6. I predict something somewhere will happen.

A voice told me it will, although I can't say who, or why, becuase a mysterious force I can't tell you about will do something I can't say, and I'm the only one who knows about it.

[madokie]

7. And

your point other than to give 'em a hard time :shrug:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

9. My whole point is..

If you didn't thump manuscripts, the J-cloths wouldn't go to the market to buy you.

[madokie]

10. I suppose so

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

11. Indeed.

My wizard is full of fractured Chinese meals! Please broil my sofa.

[Tsiyu]

48. Your ass is already hot enough

Isn't it?

And your 1/5th Egg Fu Yung sez:

"If you don't do anything with your life except sit on your sofa brulee and wait for someone somewhere to speculate about something so you can mock them....Wizard thinks you are a blank page."



Turkey is banging the war drums at the border; it is the thoughtful person who considers what is happening in the region.

If you are not interested in this topic, for whatever reason, it certainly does no one any good for you to tell others they should not care either.

[Joe for Clark]

8. Oh shit - why in gods name do you think those deployments

were going on - I sure ain't the only one dude.

I really think our army got it just fine - question is - in reaction or proaction??

Isn't it??

I guess you still trust CNN - I do not. They have been wrong so many damn times - they sure aren't "trustworthy" to me.

It is like - who do you trust - you or your lieing eyes - Isn't it??

Joe

[butterfly77]

12. If you know the clip I am talking about...

There is always this clip that they have been using for years now everytime that they want us to think that it is going good in Iraq. This clip shows Iraqis sipping tea or latte's or whatever they are drinking, and they show Internet cafe's. Is this the Northern part of Iraq or the area near the Iranian border.

[slackmaster]

13. I thought "up north" referred to Canada

They're just waiting for a chance to catch us with our pants down.

[Joe for Clark]

14. That is funny.

[Joe for Clark]

15. I think there may be indication now -

Those people are prepared to step off. 20 divisions.

Now -

I thought we put a bandaid on this - didn't they say that??

I thought - maybe I still hope - we have a fight to keep a lid on the Kurd territories.

Is it still there - that hope??

Are they really stepping of now?? This would be really bad.

Joe

[amandabeech]

16. Can you be more specific?

It seems generally hot, but is there something that you've seen or heard?

[Joe for Clark]

20. ARE there indications that the Turks are going south NOW -

That they lost faith in us.

I saw something that made me think so - and that is a lot worse than anything I thought might happen.

Not artillery - infantry - moving south. Immeninently.

What do you see????

Joe

[amandabeech]

26. I know that my Turkish roommate has been upset since the elections,

and hates the Kurds with even more passion than the Jews (or most Americans).

AKP might have to do this to stave off a coup by the secular/Kemalist army that has been quiet since '97.

Frankly, I thought that things might settle after the election.

Do you have any info on what the Kurdish Peshmerga Iraqi Army units are doing?

[peace13]

17. Joe, thanks for this.

It really is such a huge mess. It seems impossible to make sense of even a piece. Thank you for reminding us that all fronts are fraught with despair. May those in command of our troops be brave and do the right thing, orders or not. Kind thoughts and energy your way this evening. Peace, Kim

[Lerkfish]

18. forgive a nonmilitary person...can you define your jargon a bit?

thanks. or tell me what his is in refernce to? not near a tv at the moment

[MissB]

21. .

I think what he means is that we're apparently sending 20 more divisions to Iraq.

[Lerkfish]

23. thanks. I was afraid that was what he meant.

damn.

[madokie]

22. I think the massing of the turks on the border with Iraq

and the seems to be imminent battle to be

[Joe for Clark]

24. No - cause if I am wrong you don't want to know what I think.

Joe

[Lerkfish]

25. yes, I am afraid, very afraid I know what you meant

I was hoping I was misunderstanding you.

[Joe for Clark]

30. US ARMY- take all reserves and stick them north RIGHT NOW!

What the fuck is wrong with you people?

You prove with every step that you need to be replaced.

Faster the Jr officers replace you the better.

This is on you right now!!

Stop it!!

Joe

[Joe for Clark]

50. That there was some clash happening - it was just a raid -

It was that there were some Turkish soldiers engaging in Kurdistan.

But it turned out just a raid - just a handful of people got killed - was not a general engagement.

But you really couldn't tell til today the scope of it.

Cause one day it will just be prelude. ANd we won't really know the scope till long after it is too late.

Joe

[seemslikeadream]

19. TURKEY

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=1474571&mesg_id=1474571

[malta blue]

27. Thank you Joe, My friend's son up and joined the Marines

last month and left yesterday....
:cry:

We are all concerned about the kids.
Peace.
MB

[Joe for Clark]

38. Oh -I am sure.-

I didn't mean anything. Odds are it will be ok.

Tell you one thing - if I could have taken my kid out back and broken his arm =- this sounds reasonable to me right now.

Joe

[malta blue]

39. I know Joe. Let's just keep hoping that this will all

be over soon and the kids will be coming home.
Peace
MB

[Joe for Clark]

40. You understand - not if there is a threat to those fields.

There can't be.

I agree with the sentiment -

Joe

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[seemslikeadream]

29. Just read the news about Turkey PKK and the Kurds

[Joe for Clark]

33. No - if I saw it already started.

Did they really break south - Is It??

If I am wrong I would be happy to eat crap all over the internet.

Joe

[Joe for Clark]

42. I am sure.

[seemslikeadream]

31. "If you don't take a step, we'll go into Iraq"

http://english.sabah.com.tr/782C83DB1AEC446CB85C26D4406D6723.html

Two important messages

1. "Gül will make a wonderful prime minister:" The AKP MP Egemen Bağış has claimed that they may announce Abdullah Gül as the prime minister and that he will make a wonderful one.

2. "We could go into Iraq at the expense of a fight against US:" He also said that Turkey might go into Iraq despite the probability of fighting against the USA. He asserted that they will not hesitate nor will ask permission from anybody in any case.




"If you don't take a step, we'll go into Iraq"


The AK Party MP Egemen Bağış has stated that if the USA does not take the necessary precautions, we will enter Iraq in spite of the probability of strife against Washington. He also asserted that they will not ask permission from anybody.

The AKP MP Egemen Bağış claimed that if the USA does not take the necessary precautions, we will enter Iraq despite the probability of strife against Washington. He also asserted that they will neither ask permission from anybody nor will they hesitate for a moment.

Bağış said that they are ready for an operation for the PKK in Iraq if the USA does not do something. He claimed that they hope not to have to do that but that the PKK is an open threat for Turkey.

Bağış also stated that he thinks we may declare Abdullah Gül as the prime minister. He said that Gül would make a wonderful prime minister.

[Blackhatjack]

32. Novak is reporting Congress has been briefed --we are assisting Turkey LINK

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1475084

Novak says that Congress has already been briefed that we are sending Special Forces to assist Turkey in wiping out the Kurdish PKK, and that our participation will be concealed and deniable.

Right! LOL

Another fine mess we are about to get into.

[Joe for Clark]

36. I sure hope the son of a bitch is right.

Cause if what I just saw was true - It could be so much worse.

We better back the NATO ally -

ANd I think they are moving - the Turks - against the Kurds - at least against some targets.

And he is a son of a bitch.

Joe

[seemslikeadream]

34. U.S. says working with Turkey to solve PKK "problem"

http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSN3040889020070730

By David Morgan

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The Pentagon said on Monday it is working with Turkey to resolve a "serious problem" posed by the separatist Kurdistan Workers Party, but declined comment on a media report of secret plans to stop rebel violence.

The Kurdistan Workers Party (PKK), which the U.S. State Department lists as a terrorist organization, has escalated attacks on soldiers and civilians in Turkey in recent months, prompting Turkish calls for a cross-border operation against rebels based in northern Iraq.

"We recognize that the PKK is a serious problem and we're working closely with both the government of Iraq and the government of Turkey to resolve this," Pentagon spokesman Bryan Whitman told reporters.

But he declined to comment on a U.S. report on Monday that said the Pentagon briefed Congress last week on secret plans for a joint U.S.-Turkish military operation to suppress the rebel movement and capture its leaders.

The PKK, which consists mainly of Turkish Kurds, launched a separatist campaign in 1984. The Turkish government blames PKK violence for more than 30,000 deaths.

The group's goal is to establish an independent, democratic Kurdish state in southeast Turkey, northern Iraq, and parts of Iran and Syria, according to the State Department.

[OzarkDem]

35. Remember when

the US used to deal with these problems without having to invade a country or send in troops?

[amandabeech]

37. Back when we were pumping enough oil for ourselves,

we didn't even have to think about this.

We would've sided with the Turks for Incirlik and help against the Russkies.

Before the 1970s, it would have been, "Kurdistan? What Kurdistan?"

[DemReadingDU]

41. Thanks for finding these Turkery threads

and keeping us updated, and Joe too

[Joe for Clark]

43. Understand me - I don't care about anyone other then the kids.

I really don't.

I care about the things that could get in the way of getting them out - that is all it is.

To me.

And I respect all life - I just want them out more.

Joe

[Joe for Clark]

44. I think there may be indication now -

This thread has been combined with another thread.

Click here to read this message in its new location.

[AJ9000]

46. Clark said recently the US is involved in ops w/ Turkey to kill key Kurd leaders. nm

[Bluebear]

47. Everytime I see this thread I think something is brewing in Canada

"quiet up north now" :)

[blondeatlast]

49. The stealthy evils of back bacon and universal healthcare are coming to Minneapolis, eh? nt