A PeTA Question

[Dr. Strange]

Yeah, I know, another PeTA thread. Sorry.

I have a question, though. Is it true that someone in the organization took advantage of animal testing products for a life-threatening illness? I heard about it from a guy at work, but of course he had no specifics. :eyes: He said it was a woman, so I tried looking up Ingrid Newkirk, but I didn't find anything. And I couldn't find anything on snopes. And I can't do a search here on DU because I'm not an organ donor. :silly:

So is this an urban legend or what?

P.S. The first person to post "people eating tasty animals" will be hauled off to have medical experiments performed on them!

[blondeatlast]

1. I'm willing to bet anything that a few PETA members might have taken beef/pork derived insulin

at one time. I did and though I'm no PETA fan, I couldn't blame them a bit.

Big effin' deal. If hypocrisy were prosecutable, only the innocent would be in prison.

I call flamebait...

[jobycom]

2. WooHooo!!! PETA thread!!!

Never trust anything you hear from a guy at work. Beyond that, i don't know. But it's a PETA thread, so...

:evilfrown: :bounce: :mad: :smoke: :puke: :eyes: :think: :wtf: :silly: :crazy: :think: :toast: :evilgrin: :argh: :wtf: :wtf: :freak: :freak: :argh: :wtf: :hurts: :hurts: :hurts: :hurts: :wow: :wow: :scared: :nuke: :scared: :grr: :grr: :shrug: :shrug: :cry: :cry: :headbang: :headbang: :cry: :cry: :yourock: :yourock: :cry: :cry: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
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:yoiks:

[Geoff R. Casavant]

3. I can confirm I saw the same story

One of the PETA bigwigs used insulin made from pigs, IIRC.

[blondeatlast]

4. There was a time when that was all that was available. Now it's derived from synthesized DNA.

As I say above, BFD.

And I'm NOT a PETA fan at all.

[blondeatlast]

12. Virtually no insulin is animal derived anymore--perhaps literally 1%

and that is made for people who have reactions to synthesized DNA insulin. "I can confirm I saw the same story"--so did I when I did a Google search--and it's all on blogs and message boards.

I can't find a single reputable source for the story.

[DS1]

5. and why is the e for ethical in lowercase? is it not as important?

:yoiks:

[SteveM]

11. Actually, it's People Euthanizing Tame Animals.

[blondeatlast]

22. That's how it's done in their logo. I'm no fan of PETA or the OP,

but he isn't really off-base here.

[DS1]

23. I was just wondering if anyone knew

[flvegan]

6. A Senior VP is a diabetic, dependent on insulin, yes.

Can't think of her name.

On edit: Mary Beth Sweetland is the Sr VP.

[blondeatlast]

9. Mary Beth Sweetland--and yes. synthesized DNA insulin

was tested on animals--in Sweden (where DNA derived insulin was first synthesized). I know you can probably fill me in on this--doesn't Sweden have some pretty tough ethical standards for animal testing?

[flvegan]

14. I don't know when synthesized DNA insulin was tested in Sweden, but

Sweden has for, I think, around 30 years had mandatory ethical reviews of any animal testing, and their welfare act is pretty good and has been in place for around 20 years, off the top of my head.

[blondeatlast]

16. This Wiki entry is not quite correct (Novo Nordisk was the first as I understand it)

but it's been available in the US since 1982.

Novo Nordisk (a Swedish pharmaceutical company--and the kind I use if possible) definitely was the first to synthesize the DNA and the first to market in Europe so the arguments we are going to hear against Sweetland are going to be mostly BS.

Human insulin is now manufactured for widespread clinical use using genetic engineering techniques, which significantly reduces the presence of impurities.... Humulin was the first medication produced using modern genetic engineering techniques in which actual human DNA is inserted into a host cell (E. coli in this case). The host cells are then allowed to grow and reproduce normally, and due to the inserted human DNA, they produce actual human insulin.

Novo Nordisk has also developed a genetically engineered insulin independently My note--nope--they did it FIRST). Most insulins used clinically today are produced this way, as they are less likely to produce an allergic reaction.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin

[Dr. Strange]

10. Could be...

I'll check. Thanks!

[blondeatlast]

15. The answer is directly above and my post was there before you replied.

You aren't looking for a real discussion on this matter--your oh-so-precious OP makes that clear.

[Dr. Strange]

17. Well that's kinda true...

I didn't want a discussion so much as an answer. So, uh, thanks.

[blondeatlast]

19. No, it's not an urban legend. There ya go.

That's the only question you asked--unless you edit.

[Dr. Strange]

20. That's too bad.

The guy's kind of a butt-head, so I was hoping it WAS an urban legend. Rats.

[blondeatlast]

21. It would be nice if you'd straighten him out.

Plenty of ammunition here--and maybe she is a hypocrite (I see no evidence she's bothered to make a statement on this) but it's a tough reality for her. I've been insulin-dependent my whole life and even in her position, I wouldn't hesitate to save my own life.

BTW, the testing was completed 2 decades ago. I've been taking DNA derived insulin since 1984.

[flvegan]

26. She gave an interview a while back

where she justified it. Basically one of those "I won't not take it and die as I'm no good to the animals dead" type of thing.

Also, here:
http://www.goveg.com/diabetes_controlled.asp

I don't think she's a hypocrite. It gives me a chuckle when, because PETA is soooo disliked by so many, people like the person the OP works with lash out at them like 4 year olds. PETA is an organization with a Mission Statementt, and MB works for them. Not every person at PETA is vegan, nor even vegetarian. The expectation that an organization be pure down through their employees is idiotic. I'm sure there are many Christian organizations that employ non-Christians.

[China_cat]

42. Yes, there are christian organizations that employ

non-christians. However, the 'we are the only way' evangelical, fundamentalists are NOT among that group. They are more like the Borg...you must comply.

[Dr. Strange]

43. Okay, I straightened him out.

He says Sweetland is the one he was thinking of. So I guess he was right, ALTHOUGH he made it sound like this person was relying on CURRENT animal testing.

Oh well, he's still a butt-head.

[blondeatlast]

44. There's been no animal testing on insulin for over 20 years.

Research is being done (mostly in Europe--insulin isn't a bankable med) but nothing close to the testing stage yet.

[YOY]

7. ...

:popcorn:

[Dr. Strange]

13. Were any animals harmed...

in the making of that popcorn?

[YOY]

18. Five were.

All died horrible blood curdling deaths.

They were worth it.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

8. If they take any sort of medicine...

it's something that's been tested on animals.

[China_cat]

24. Sweetland's own words.

PETA Senior Vice President MaryBeth Sweetland on her use of insulin, which was tested on animals:

"I'm an insulin-dependent diabetic. Twice a day I take synthetically manufactured insulin that still contains some animal products -- and I have no qualms about it ... I'm not going to take the chance of killing myself by not taking insulin. I don't see myself as a hypocrite. I need my life to fight for the rights of animals."
--Glamour, January 1990

[blondeatlast]

25. As a lifelong insulin dependent diabetic--good for her. I don't care for PETA

but had I been in the same position facing the same choice, you can bet I would choose my own health and survival.

The animal testing ended about 25 years ago, the DNA has been synthesized to a point that the animal product in insulin is infinitesimally small, and I see nothing for which she should apologize nor answer for.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

28. She should apologize for being against animal testing.

Especially since she exploits it.

[blondeatlast]

33. In retrospect, I think you are right. I've had the "luxury" of needing insulin

long before I knew where the first generation came from, so I never had any ethical dilemma. When I realized it at age 8, i still had no problem; heck, I ate meat.

But now that I consider it, her position does absolutely hinder science--and HER hypocrisy has an effect on anyone with a chronic illness.

I can't blame her for the conscious choice she made--but she ought to resign her position. I'd make the same choice to save myself--but I would most definitely resign.

[China_cat]

29. Except the statement that if the death of one rat would cure

AIDS, it wouldn't be acceptable?

[blondeatlast]

31. I'm confused--did she say that? I'm not aware of that. If she did,

then she certainly is a hypocrite, but again, none of us is perfect.

[flvegan]

32. No, I believe Newkirk said that.

[China_cat]

36. No, but Ingrid Newkirk did.

What is so distasteful to me is that the whole organization condones and applauds Sweetland's use of insulin tested on animals (and I have no objection to that, she'd be stupid not to take care of herself) while trying to deny lifesaving treatments and medications to everyone else on the grounds that animals were used in the development.

Even if animal research resulted in a cure for AIDS, we'd be against it. -- Ingrid Newkirk, President, PETA (Vogue, September, 1989).

To those people who say, `My father is alive because of animal experimentation,' I say `Yeah, well, good for you. This dog died so your father could live.' Sorry, but I am just not behind that kind of trade off. -- Bill Maher, PETA celebrity spokesman.

On the consequences of stopping animal research: "Don't get the diseases in the first place, schmo." -- PETA's David Mathews (USA Today, July 27, 1994).

An animal experiment cannot be justifiable unless the experiment is so important that the use of a brain-damaged human would be justifiable. -- Peter Singer, godfather of the animal rights movement, Animal Liberation: A New Ethic for Our Treatment of Animals, 2nd. edition, 1990.

When it comes to cosmetics, I agree completely with the premise that they can be tested on tissue cultures, etc and not on living animals. But when it comes to medications, no tissue culture will ever react the way a living body will when it comes to the safety and efficacy of those meds. But that day hasn't come yet and until it does, I'll honor the animals who make it possible for my son with MS to continue to work and be a father to his kids as well as all the ones that have helped keep innumerable people alive and well.

Without the animals there would be no organ transplants, especially hearts...first heart transplants were an exchange between 2 German Shepherds. A monument needs to be built to those 2 dogs. Do I wish more labs were more humane to their animal subjects? Of course I do. And if there were ever another way to obtain equally important information I'd be on the front lines promoting it.

[blondeatlast]

38. After the evidence is presented, I tend to agree with you.

And--Newkirk is a Falwell-esque loon. If it's possible, PETA might well be rid of her.

[China_cat]

40. Hard to do since she's the founder.

[jmowreader]

41. Not really. Habitat for Humanity ditched ITS founder

Course, that fine old Christian man was busted for sexual harassment, but still...it IS possible to get rid of founders.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

27. Wow. That Hypocrisy Is So Beyond Hilarious It's Almost Sad.

I pray for her health and all, and am glad she not so over the edge extreme that she wouldn't have taken anything, but the hypocrisy is still jawdropping.

But then, most of us know how kooky Peta is anyway, and not too many take anything they say seriously. They are good for comic relief every now and again though LOL

[blondeatlast]

30. Is it? No one on this board would accuse me of being a PETA fan--but this is

the ugly reality of nearly any issue.

Eventually, it hits at the very essence and seriously, faced with the same choice, would you choose to die? FWIW, dying from ketoacidosis is a long and paingul death. If you are lucky, you go into a coma. Otherwise, you are conscious of your demise. First the kidneys fail, then the liver (sometimes), then the brain. It takes days, weeks, even months.

For Type 1 diabetics, there is NO alternative but to take insulin. Not diet, not pills, nothing.

[winter999]

34. I can sympathize with what she's having to deal with, BUT...

if you only practice what you preach when it's convenient for you... isn't that the definition of hypocrasy? As for her excuse, "I have to live to fight.." bs, I bet she'd have a much stronger message if she stuck to her "belief" and died for refusing to harm an animal. Now THAT would mean something.

[blondeatlast]

37. Yes--and I think she either needs to stop taking insulin or resign. nt

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

35. I'm Not Disagreeing.

But when they try so hard with their extremism to keep scientific and medical progress like that from happening, which made such things available to them to begin with, then it is beyond hypocritical and hilarious when they realize when faced with a medical emergency, they need to rely on that which they rail against.

It's easy to be an extremist wacko that tries to hinder progress when that progress isn't something that affects them. Once it does affect them, then it is always interesting to see what they think then. Looks like she had no problem with the animal tested product once it became relevant to HER.

[blondeatlast]

39. After some consideration on my part, she ought to resign.

I've never supported an all-out ban on animal testing. I absolutely support stringent standards (as Sweden--who actaully is the first to synthesize DNA derived insulin), has.

If she were fighting the good fight of strictly regulated and enforced abiumal testing (as Sweden, again, the first, regardless of Eli Lilly's claims) has, hell, I'd join up with that organization. But, she, like so many others, slavishly follows the Falwell-esque Ms. Newkirk, batshit loon that she is.

I've no hypocrisy to answer for; I support lifesaving medical research but would like to see it made as ethical as possible and enforceable when it isn't.

Ms. Sweetland, OTOH, is the worst kind of hypocrite. She should resign or quit taking that lifesaving medicine for which there is no alternative whatsoever beyond a slow, painful death.