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I just watched Discovery Channels Battle of Chernobyl It shows what really killed the USSR!

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sce56 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-04-07 10:45 PM
Original message
I just watched Discovery Channels Battle of Chernobyl It shows what really killed the USSR!
http://www.discoverychannel.co.uk/battle_of_chernobyl/index.shtml

WOW what a show must see for all who care about our planet!
And the problem is still there. Half a million people were involved in the initial cleanup and containment! The cost was so staggering it put the nails in the coffin for the USSR they could never recover from that nightmare imagine if it happened here! The Shrub admin wants to build more of these monster killers around the USA we can't let them do it! If at all possible watch this documentary.

Chernobyl

Thursday 26th April 1986 became a momentous date in modern history, when one of the reactors at the Chernobyl nuclear power station in northern Ukraine, exploded. It was the most significant reactor failure in the history of nuclear power, a Maximum Credible Accident (MCA).

The plant, just 20 km away from the town centre, was made up of four reactor units each generating an output of 1,000 megawatts. The reactor in question exploded due to operational errors and inadequate safety measures and the meltdown was directly linked to routine testing on the reactor unit’s turbine generators.

The test required reactor activity and the thermal reactor output to be run down to a lower level. During the procedure, however, the reactor plummeted to an unexpectedly low and unstable level of activity. At this point, it should have been shut down; as the operators chose to continue with the test, the events subsequently proved to be catastrophic.

More than 200 people died or were seriously injured by radiation exposure immediately after the explosion. 161,000 people had to be evacuated from a 30 kilometre radius of the reactor and 25,000 square km of land was contaminated. As time went on millions of people suffered radiation related health problems such as leukaemia and thyroid cancer and around 4,000 people have died as a result of the long-term effects of the accident.

The Chernobyl disaster brought the ongoing discussion of the pros and cons of nuclear power to the forefront of public attention. Critics saw the reactor failure as dramatic and alarming evidence to support their anti-nuclear stance. Advocates of nuclear power insisted that the fragile Chernobyl reactor was an outdated model, and that the plants of Western Europe and the US demonstrated a vastly improved safety culture thanks to their more advanced technology. These conflicting assessments of the accident have led to extensive research into nuclear safety standards and the disposal of radioactive fuel elements.

Today, the fundamental issues surrounding the benefits and risks of nuclear energy and its future role in power generation continue to be hotly debated.




The Consequences

It took three days to evactuate the people living in the area surrounding the power station; 161,000 people had to abandon their homes. Food was immediately screened for radiation, uncontaminated food had to be imported, and agricultural production methods were rapidly modified.

At the time of the accident, 273,000 people were living in the immediate vicinity of the power plant. Some towns in the area, such as Zaborye in the Russian district of Bryansk, displayed caesium-137 contamination levels of up to 4 million Becquerel per square metre.

Immediately following the explosion and the ensuing fire fighting and rescue efforts, 203 people were admitted to hospital; 31 of these died. The UN later announced that 56 people had died from exposure to radiation caused by the explosion and related incidents.

The fatalities primarily included fire fighters and rescue workers; the people who fought to contain the blaze. It seems that neither they, nor the many other helpers, had been made aware of the acute danger of the radiation they were being exposed to. Most of these people were deployed in the area right next to the ruptured reactor without any protective gear; many were ordered to the site by the army, others were attracted by financial and other rewards. 210,000 so-called liquidators (approximately half of these were soldiers) plus another 400-600,000 helpers were later involved in the extensive clean-up of the accident.

The public was not informed of the radiation levels measured during the recovery work; the figures that were published were falsified. The radioactive materials released, particularly the nuclides iodine-131 and caesium-137, formed aerosols that deeply infiltrated the atmosphere. A cloud of radioactivity moved to the northwest, initially heading towards Scandinavia. The wind changed when the cloud was above the Baltic Sea, and headed southwest in a semi-circular motion, crossing the regions of Poland, Saxony, the Czech Republic and southern Germany. The wind then changed back to a north-westerly direction and blew the cloud towards the North Sea, over the Netherlands.

On its journey, the radioactive cloud moved through several areas of rain. The radioactive material was washed out of the air, and much like the fallout of a nuclear explosion, it covered and permeated the soil beneath. Many crops were directly contaminated; cows’ and goats’ milk was polluted indirectly through the food chain, as were fish and game (such as reindeer in Finland and elk in Sweden). The radioactive contamination of food, therefore, was spread far beyond northern Ukraine. The public became alarmed and intense debates over the effects of radiation contamination in food followed. In some areas, such as Bavaria, excessive traces of radiation can still be found in mushrooms today.

In heavily polluted areas, whey had to be extracted from locally produced milk and withdrawn from sale. The whey was put in storage, and entire convoys transporting the contaminated powder were shuffled from one location to the next as nobody could properly dispose of the spoilt product. The problem was discussed in the media and by the authorities for years, but no action was taken. Finally, the whey powder was incinerated – a course of action that not only cost millions but also provoked wide-spread protest.

Radioactive particles are easily bound and form residue very quickly. This meant that standing waters, such as reservoirs, were contaminated in the short term. At some points, local authorities even closed down communal playgrounds. Around 10,300 square km surrounding the accident site, the level of caesium-137 was in excess of 555,000 Becquerel per square metre (15 Curie per square kilometre).

Unnaturally high radiation was also measured in regions further a field; 7,900 square km in Russia, 4,700 square km in Ukraine and 16,000 square km in Belarus displayed radiation levels exceeding 185,000 Becquerel per square metre (5 Curie per square kilometre). Belarus fared the worst, collecting 70 percent of the fallout. In many areas, up to 22 percent of the soil was contaminated with caesium-137. In German regions where the radioactive cloud had been passed through rain, peak caesium-137 levels of up to 100,000 Becquerel per square metre were measured.









Now imagine Shrub attacks Iran with nuclear bunker busters on underground nuclear facilities! Where will the fallout from that attack go to? Look at the map I don't think the Chinese will like it very much as well as Pakistan and India! Where do we go to stop this madness? Chernobyl is still a problem the sarcophagus placed over it was designed to last thirty years, it has been twenty one years since it was done, it needs to be sealed permanently the estimated cost is over a billion dollars!
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-04-07 10:51 PM
Response to Original message
1. America has 106 nuclear plants now -- it "terrorism" wasn't a lie, we'd be closing them down --- and
. . . . it takes 6 months to properly close down a nuclear plant ---

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ruiner4u Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-04-07 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. Yes it does....
It takes months to cool down those rods..
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NickB79 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 05:39 AM
Response to Reply #1
7. If we closed down all of our nuclear power plants, which supply 20% of our electricity
We'd be looking a lot like Germany, which is also planning a nuclear phase-out of it's reactors.

Germany is building 26 new coal-fired plants to replace those nuclear ones. But what's a few gigatons of CO2 per year between friends?
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ruiner4u Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-04-07 10:53 PM
Response to Original message
2. Hmm Scary stuff...
My aunt was downwind in Germany at the time the fallout was circulating. She had breast cancer some years ago and blamed Chernobyl.

we cant be certain that is to blame, but my family and I tend to agree with her..
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jwirr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-04-07 10:57 PM
Response to Original message
4. I have a friend who was one of the chemists who was called in to
help clean up. She is living in the US now.
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MattSh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 02:31 AM
Response to Original message
5. Did Discovery Channel actually say Chernobyl killed the USSR??
I haven't had the time to read the transcripts, but if they did it seems to be a nice bit of revisionist history. Most accounts I've seen pin the downfall of the USSR to the Cold War and the arms race, a race they could not win, with the final nail being the Afghan War, a war they couldn't win either.

In addition, I doubt if Chernobyl can be sealed "permanently", since few things are permanent, especially man-made structures. And a contract has been recently awarded to build a new structure for well under a billion dollars. Still a lot of money, though.



French Novarka To Repair Shelter At Ukraine's Chernobyl

KIEV, Ukraine -- The French construction company Novarka will repair an ageing protective shelter built over the radioactive remains of Ukraine's Chernobyl nuclear power station, a senior Ukrainian official said on Tuesday.

A legacy of Communism - Chernobyl reactor #4
The European Bank for Reconstruction and Development (EBRD) will fund the project for a planned 472 million dollars, said Nestor Shufrich, head of Ukraine's Ministry of Emergency Situations, at a Kiev press conference.

The EBRD awarded Novarka the contract after a competitive tender, Shufrich said. A construction contract between Novarka and the Ukrainian government will be signed 'within a week after September 17...if everything goes to schedule,' he added.

The EBRD opened the tender in 2004. A competing joint bid from US CH2M Hill and Ukrainian Interbudmontazh lost out as its offer to to the job cost 584 million dollars, according to the report.

http://blog.kievukraine.info/2007_08_01_archive.html


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KillCapitalism Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 03:01 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Chernobyl will haunt us for many millenia to come.
"In addition, I doubt if Chernobyl can be sealed "permanently", since few things are permanent, especially man-made structures. And a contract has been recently awarded to build a new structure for well under a billion dollars. Still a lot of money, though."

They'll have to maintain or replace that sarcophagus that contains the radioactive material for a LONG time. I've heard the area near Chernobyl will be completely uninhabitable for tens of thousands of years.
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hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 04:27 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. Climate change caused by fossil fuels will haunt us even more.
Coastal areas taken by the sea will be uninhabitable by humans for tens of thousands of years.

Chernobyl was bad, but nuclear power isn't nearly so great a threat as fossil fuels are. Coal kills a lot of people now, and it's going to kill entire cities and populations as we base more and more of the world economy upon it.
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diane in sf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 08:37 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. False choice. We also can get more efficient and use wind and solar. This can happen quickly.
From a paper I wrote:

Regions that have changed to renewable energy sources and rewarded efficiency, such as the Sacramento Municipal Utility District (SMUD), have found that creating power from these sources may have cost more upfront, but paid for themselves in a few years. Additionally, the net effect on the region has been to free up more capital for reinvestment in other things. The residents of the SMUD were not only able to improve the region’s economy, they did it while paying the costs of decommissioning the Rancho Seco nuclear power plant—costs that should have been paid for by the stock holders. This plant was never desired by the local consumers, but was forced upon them by the former provider, PG&E. Amory and Hunter Lovins cite R. Fountain’s article “Economic Impact of SMUD Energy Efficiency Programs,” in describing the benefits of his nuclear power plant shutdown:

"After a referendum shut down the troubled nuclear plant that had provided nearly half Sacramento’s power, investments in efficiency and new, diverse, and often decentralized and renewable supplies replaced it reliably at lower cost. Moreover, university analysts found that five years’ investments in electric efficiency had boosted county economic output by $185 million and added 2,946 employee-years of net jobs."6

Being efficient creates more jobs and energy and frees up natural resources. According to Jonathan Rowe of Redefining Progress:

"Investment in energy-saving technologies produces four times as many jobs as building new power plants. Recycling employs 10 times as many people as dumping or incinerating the same amount of trash. Mini-mills are the stars of the US steel industry today and they use mainly scrap."7


6. Lovins, Amory B. and L. Hunter Lovins. “Energy Forever.” The American Prospect 13(3):30–34 11 February 2002. www.prospect.org. Quoting Fountain, R. “Economic Impact of SMUD Energy Efficiency Programs,” Real Estate & Land Use Institute, California State University, Sacramento, March 29, 2000 report to Sacramento Municipal Utility District. www.smud.org/info/reports/econ_impact/report2000.html.
7. Rowe, Jonathan “Honey, We Shrunk the Economy,” Yes! A Journal of Positive Futures, Spring/Summer, 1996, p. 28.
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hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Lovins is a twit and an energy hog living in a big fat house on the road to Aspen.
Every gallon of oil my wife and I save by not commuting he burns up on joyrides of self-promotion.

I'm not pro nuclear, by the way, so much as I am anti-coal.

I'd much prefer we'd avoided both nuclear power and fossil fuels, but the direct consequence of 'seventies anti-nuclear activism was a rapid expansion of coal fired generating capacity that is directly destroying the earth's natural productivity.

We'd have been much better off if we'd stopped building coal fired power plants thirty years ago, even if we'd expanded our use of nuclear power instead. France doesn't worry much about electricity. We must.

In my perfect world I would ban the use of coal as quickly as possible, and at most, within fifteen years. To do that we would have to use every tool at our disposal, including conservation, solar, wind, geothermal, and yes, nuclear power.
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NickB79 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 05:42 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. One of the big reasons the USSR collapsed was it peaked in oil production
Oil was the cash cow of their economy at the time (early/mid 1980's). Also, the Saudis "opened the spigot" and caused the price of oil to tumble. The only way for the USSR to maintain their oil revenue was to pump more oil, which they couldn't do. Less than a decade later, the system came off the rails.
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sce56 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 02:51 PM
Response to Reply #5
11. They said something like
after it was all done the soviet union was at the end of it's time. But when you look at all they had to do to just stop the disaster from becoming worse than it was, it was the worse accident ever already, and a lot of people died or are seriuosly disabled now because of this event! I can't say for sure that this was the straw that broke the camels back but it sure looks like it could have been and three years later the Berlin wall fell. Chernobyl is still a major risk to the planet as a whole if it starts to go active again due to failure of the shaky containment it would start spewing out radioactive emmissions into the air again. I will just say if you get the opportunity to see this then by all means watch it!
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hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 10:19 AM
Response to Original message
9. A corrupt centrally planned economy killed the USSR.
Come to think of it, the U.S. has a corrupt centrally planned economy too...

Every morning we wake up to the stench of our own crumbling infrastructure and empire, and a political process rotten to the core.

Chernobyl was a symptom, not the disease. In terms of human suffering it was very similar to the wreckage of New Orleans and the Gulf Coast by hurricanes Katrina and Rita. In both cases systemic diseases of the political process were the root causes of the disaster. You can't blame the human suffering that resulted from the Chernobyl accident on nuclear power any more than you can blame the continuing and unresolved Gulf Coast disaster on the weather.

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underpants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 02:58 PM
Response to Reply #9
12. Natural disasters tend to take down empires and power structures
I read a great article on it a few years ago but the details escape me now. Basically there have been several "natural" or not so natural disasters that have got the ball rolling or gave it a push.

Chernobyl and Afghanistan are two of the main factors. As you state their economic model was bound to go tits-up and they knew that. There was real discussion about changing after Stalin died but the Cold War fueled military build up by the Americans made that impossible (the Soviet Generals saw that as a defeat without even firing a shot) so we both poured good money after bad. The Poles (Welesa and JohnPaulII) as well as the rock n roll were other significant factors.
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Selatius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 09:51 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. In the Soviet Union, they called it the Politburo. In the US, we call it the Federal Reserve
They set monetary policy and can thus control the economy by expanding or contracting the money supply.
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hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-06-07 11:31 AM
Response to Reply #16
18. The U.S. is an oligarchy of large corporations.
Big money controls our political system.

The Federal Reserve is just a tool.
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Selatius Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-06-07 11:34 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. It's a tool of the shareholders who run the Fed, and they're probably industrialists who run corps.
Edited on Thu Sep-06-07 11:35 AM by Selatius
It's the same deal. I say probably because the shareholder list is private information, since it's a private, for-profit corporation. It's not a public entity at all, which belies its name.
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lebkuchen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 11:51 AM
Response to Original message
10. In the states I worked with Jewish immigrants from this area
Their hair was falling out, teeth going bad, thyroid problems, aching bones, and on and on.

I heard from an American visiting as close as was allowed to Chernobyl that a large number of firemen died in this disaster, and it went largely unreported. They had only their fire coats for protection. They came from all over the USSR. I wonder how well records were kept, or continue to be kept.
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Disturbed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Sep-05-07 09:54 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. Nuclear Energy: China Leaps Forward

Nuclear Energy: China Leaps Forward - Newsweek: International ...

"I think the Americans will be buying nuclear plants from China within five years," he ... What makes the pebblebed technology so important is its fail-safe ...


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11080908/site/newsweek/
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Lydia Leftcoast Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-06-07 11:39 AM
Response to Reply #10
20. The Soviet Union was notorious for not reporting disasters or even
massive accidents.

People would just go missing or fail to return from trips, and only desperate searches by relatives would reveal that the missing person had actually died in an unreported plane crash or a natural disaster.
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hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Sep-06-07 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. Look how news of Chernobyl broke...
The first news in the press was all speculation about some kind of nuclear accident in the Soviet Union, and that the radioactive plume was being detected in Western Europe, but there was no official Soviet confirmation until the scope of the accident was utterly undeniable.
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